9679 replies to this topic

[Dalton.T.R]

NaruSaku- Thus far, we've seen that Naruto is romantically interested in Sakura. However, his refusal to confess to her on the grounds that he hadn't brought back Sasuke yet kind of leave this ship anchored to the sea floor. There have been a few hints at Sakura feeling similarly to Naruto, but since so many people are arguing they're completely platonic, it does lead the mind to wonder how Kishimoto intended it to come across as. Issues to be resolved? Well, I guess 483 resolved the 469/470 debacle, or same pretty close to it. Still, I'm holding out for some resolution on Naruto-as-Sasuke telling Sakura her forehead was pretty. (shush, i don't care if it happened forever ago. how many of you expected to see inari again after the zabuza arc?) Also, parallels to the past with the Sannin (and possibly with Minato and Kushina, although I guess it's really up to the eye of the shipper. Me, I see it as a NaruSaku parallel, but to each their own.)


NaruHina- Well, I suppose the latest chapter still confirms that Hinata is romantically interested in Naruto, but it's not really like anyone in the fandom ever doubted that. However, Naruto, as far as we can tell, sees Hinata simply as a comrade and a friend, like pretty much everyone else in the Konoha 11. Issues to be resolved? Hey, Naruto! Remember how, like, 110 chapters ago, Hinata confessed to you? Do you remember ever thanking her for sorta-kinda-in a not very well thought out way saving your life? No? How about the confession? Also, I guess depending on your point of view you could think that they would parallel Kushina and Minato.


SasuSaku- Dead. In. The. Water. Need I say more? Well, all right. Generally, ships are pretty nearly sunk when a character, after having already rejected another character's romantic feelings, tries to kill them. Three times. And then tries to destroy everyone and everything they love. (For a similar reason, I think pretty much EVERY Sasuke ship is toast by now.) Issues to resolve? Uh, well, if it happened at all, which is very unlikely by now, Sasuke would need to drop the whole revenge shtick. But since that's pretty much what his part two characterization was based on, I don't think that'll be working very well.

[ramenanmitsu]

NaruHina- Well, I suppose the latest chapter still confirms that Hinata is romantically interested in Naruto, but it's not really like anyone in the fandom ever doubted that. However, Naruto, as far as we can tell, sees Hinata simply as a comrade and a friend, like pretty much everyone else in the Konoha 11. Issues to be resolved? Hey, Naruto! Remember how, like, 110 chapters ago, Hinata confessed to you? Do you remember ever thanking her for sorta-kinda-in a not very well thought out way saving your life? No? How about the confession? Also, I guess depending on your point of view you could think that they would parallel Kushina and Minato.

How? What part of MinaKushi parallels NaruHina? I'm sorry but I'm a Kushina fan and it is an insult were you to say Hinata is like Kushina. They are both very different characters, in fact I would say they are the opposite!
-Kushina was more like a tomboy when she was young and she would beat any boys that would dare make fun of her. Do you think that is anything like Hinata?
-Kushina is very energetic and loud with a really big dream. Hinata is shy and quiet and her dream is to be acknowledged by Naruto, nothing like Kushina.
-Kushina said that she always win the fight with Minato. Do you think that Hinata could win or even think of fighting Naruto?
-As seen with the above sentence, Kushina has the ability to stand on equal grounds with Minato. And as seen above, Hinata would probably do whatever Naruto wants, which is not an equal type of relationship.

Sorry if I sounded like a jerk, but Kushina=Hinata is a big no-no for me.

Edited by narunarunaru, 22 February 2012 - 02:27 AM.

[Dalton.T.R]

How? What part of MinaKushi parallels NaruHina? I'm sorry but I'm a Kushina fan and it is an insult were you to say Hinata is like Kushina. They are both very different characters, in fact I would say they are the opposite!
-Kushina was more like a tomboy when she was young and she would beat any boys that would dare make fun of her. Do you think that is anything like Hinata?
-Kushina is very energetic and loud with a really big dream. Hinata is shy and quiet and her dream is to be acknowledged by Naruto, nothing like Kushina.
-Kushina said that she always win the fight with Minato. Do you think that Hinata could win or even think of fighting Naruto?
-As seen with the above sentence, Kushina has the ability to stand on equal grounds with Minato. And as seen above, Hinata would probably do whatever Naruto wants, which is not an equal type of relationship.

Sorry if I sounded like a jerk, but Kushina=Hinata is a big no-no for me.

Oh, don't worry about it. I found this guy on another site and liked his points of NaruSaku and SasuSaku. I didn't read the NaruHina part. I have a bad enough headach without arguing against that fanbase lol. I just copy and pasted that post. No worries
And I agree. Kushina is FAR more like Sakura than Hinata. Hinata's fanbase is driving me insane by comparing those two.

Edited by Dalton (I stink at names), 22 February 2012 - 02:31 AM.

[Naruhina488]

I'm really sorry, I didn't mean to cause all this commotion. I just wanted to try something different.

I just noticed. I'm outnumbered by quiet a few people...

[Fyuria'sLeo]

I'm really sorry, I didn't mean to cause all this commotion. I just wanted to try something different.

I just noticed. I'm outnumbered by quiet a few people...

Gotcha back gurl dont worry.

[CloudMountainJuror]

I'm really sorry, I didn't mean to cause all this commotion. I just wanted to try something different.

I just noticed. I'm outnumbered by quiet a few people...

Outnumbered, yes. But just try not to stoop to their level. Keep your head up; try not to let some ignorant people get to you, alright?

[Former Captain]

A wild newbie appears!

We have different views on the matter. You think that Naruhina can't become canon. You think that there is no possible way for Naruhina to become canon in any way. Kishimoto is the author of this manga. He can do whatever he wishes.

Of course Kishi can do whatever he wants. And there's a lot of validity to what you say here. This is a serial story - and as such can be influenced by public opinion, unlike most novels - published weekly since before the new millennium. Whatever plot points Kishi originally had in mind could have changed a dozen times over, and his editors/whatever advising people he has (who watch the shipping fandoms closely and exist to make what will sell) could have influenced changes a dozen times more.

The question is whether it can feasibly developed before the end of the manga to make for good (or even decent, to take the cynical fandom's view) writing. Unfortunately, the story is moving toward a Naruto/Sasuke showdown, in which we'd be more likely to see Neji than Hinata (barring fan-service). With that in mind, the Team 7 dynamic (which lacks Hinata) will likely move to the forefront once again.

There are many ways for Naruhina to become canon. Kishimoto can devolp the pairing more. Also, Naruto could (I said could. As in maybe, possible etc.) get over his love for Sakura. He's so blinded with the image of Sakura having feelings for Sasuke.

It depends on when the manga ends. I say that only because this is first, foremost, and far and away a story about action and camaraderie, so romance is relegated to a sideplot at most. As such, there need to be a lot of chapters...for example, Kishi has been developing Naruto and Sakura's relationship (with varying degrees of romance and the occasional setback) for the entire manga (minus certain arcs like the Tsunade search), and there's still a non-trivial question of whether or not this will turn into romance (if we accept as a given that there WILL be a requited love between anyone).

Got sidetracked. The point is, it took Kishi that long to develop a pairing that, frankly, could still be left undone. There's no messing around anymore -- the ultimate climax of the series can't be much farther away than a hundred or so chapters, with the end coming soon after. There's just no time to shift Naruto's love for Sakura to mere friendship, then point him toward Hinata.

If the manga were another five or seven years, Kishi would have a great deal of trouble because it would be freakishly obvious that he intends the ship, which would lose readers no trouble developing NaruHina. It took him around twice that long to bring Naruto and Sakura here (wherever that is), and they've spent more screentime with each other than any other character duo. To make NaruHina canon (and not a butt-pull), Kishi needs to make Hinata super-important to both plot and Naruto himself, and he needs to do it now.

Were I shipping something, I'd want to see it done well rather than just done. I'm open to your ideas as to how Kishi could accomplish that without sacrificing the non-romance aspects of his story.

1. SasuSaku is on its deathbed right now.
2. NaruHina is on the edge of a cliff, hanging on, unlikely but still believably possible to an extent.
3. NaruSaku is near the finish line.

1. Sasuke and Sakura have both repeatedly attempted to kill this ship via stabbing each other. I would be happy to argue that it is canonically impossible if we assume good writing.
2. Rather, think of NaruHina as a house. It built up a stellar foundation with the Chuunin Exams, one that I really thought could go somewhere. We're here a decade later, and they still have that foundation. The building itself has yet to be started (oh, alright, they put up one of the walls), but it's not impossible that, given enough time, Kishi could build it.
3. NaruSaku is limping toward the finish line after stumbling recently (notably, Chapter 469). It'll make it if it can handle the pain...and avoid being bowled over by SasuRevenge coming up behind it.

[ramenanmitsu]

Oh, don't worry about it. I found this guy on another site and liked his points of NaruSaku and SasuSaku. I didn't read the NaruHina part. I have a bad enough headach without arguing against that fanbase lol. I just copy and pasted that post. No worries
And I agree. Kushina is FAR more like Sakura than Hinata. Hinata's fanbase is driving me insane by comparing those two.

Oh okay

Yeah, when I was listing down the Kushina parts, I was worried if I actually made a list of Sakura. Sakura and Kushina are also very different people, but they are similar in so many ways. If there is one person who can stand on equal grounds with Naruto, like Kushina was with Minato, then the only person I can think of is Sakura.

[Anguyen92]

I'm really sorry, I didn't mean to cause all this commotion. I just wanted to try something different.

I just noticed. I'm outnumbered by quiet a few people...

Its all right, mate. I'm sure that in the Nh forums that there are bound to be NS fans there, who's going to get their opinions shot down by the Nh fans, its natural. But to let you know that the door is always open if you want to go ahead here and talk about pairings stuff and we'll try to do our best to make very logical arguments so that no one here gets butt-hurt.

[Former Captain]

I just noticed. I'm outnumbered by quiet a few people...

I'll gladly argue for NaruHina if you want backup

[merryGOflava]

I'll gladly argue for NaruHina if you want backup

and ill gladly debate XD

a calm debate XD

[Shadow Wolf]

I'm really sorry, I didn't mean to cause all this commotion. I just wanted to try something different.

I just noticed. I'm outnumbered by quite a few people...

Yet you manage to stand up and give your best when it comes to defending your favorite couple. Believe me, that is something worthy of admiration: to fight behind enemy lines.

Besides, if we didn't have people who could help us learn other theories about rival pairings, then we would not have too many reasons to debate.

And before being fans, we're human beings; so having different opinions should not be a wall when establishing friendships.

Finally, think of this in the positive way: you've stimulated activity.

and ill gladly debate XD

a calm debate XD

I'll join merry here, though.

[4000TMNT]

Can anyone tell me how can Hinata make Naruto fall in love with her at this point. Hinata have to be a big part of Naruto's development and to the plot to make that happen.

Dose Naruto need any more development in his character that Hinata could use in her advantage. Like, does Naruto have confidence issues or does Naruto fell ugly and wants any girl to love him. What can Hinata do at this point to make Naruto love her, the only thing she can do is to defeat Sasuke and bring him back to the village for Naruto(LOL), maybe than Naruto can fall in love with her.

[ramenanmitsu]

Can anyone tell me how can Hinata make Naruto fall in love with her at this point. Hinata have to be a big part of Naruto's development and to the plot to make that happen.

Dose Naruto need any more development in his character that Hinata could use in her advantage. Like, does Naruto have confidence issues or does Naruto fell ugly and wants any girl to love him. What can Hinata do at this point to make Naruto love her, the only thing she can do is to defeat Sasuke and bring him back to the village for Naruto(LOL), maybe than Naruto can fall in love with her.

I'm not sure either. How can Kishi make NaruHina happen and if he does make it happen, how will he overcome the two points below?
1. Naruto's never giving up personality.
Naruto NEVER gives up. That can be said with romance too, after all, seeing Sakura in love with Sasuke never made him gave up on her. If the girl you love doesn't love you back won't make him give up, I wonder what else will it take for him to give up on her. Heck, he still isn't giving up on Sasuke who tried to kill him! If a guy killing him doesn't make him give up on his friendship with him, what makes anybody think a girl who doesn't love him back, makes him give up on her?

2. He hates people who lies to themselves.
If this can be said for himself, then NaruHina is dead as it can be. He wouldn't date Hinata, as long as he has feelings for Sakura, which I'm sure won't fade anytime soon as I explained above. He wouldn't date Hinata just because he thinks she's cute, or she's a perfect girlfriend material or because she's easy to get. He gets what he wants(which is Sakura) no matter how hard it is. And he's Naruto, he'll get it in the end.

Edited by narunarunaru, 22 February 2012 - 07:02 AM.

[pharix]

2. He hates people who lies to themselves.
If this can be said for himself, then NaruHina is dead as it can be

I don't know why this never crossed my mind o.O

[Former Captain]

I'm not sure either. How can Kishi make NaruHina happen and if he does make it happen, how will he overcome the two points below?
1. Naruto's never giving up personality.
Naruto NEVER gives up. That can be said with romance too, after all, seeing Sakura in love with Sasuke never made him gave up on her. If the girl you love doesn't love you back won't make him give up, I wonder what else will it take for him to give up on her. Heck, he still isn't giving up on Sasuke who tried to kill him! If a guy killing him doesn't make him give up on his friendship with him, what makes anybody think a girl who doesn't love him back, makes him give up on her?

2. He hates people who lies to themselves.
If this can be said for himself, then NaruHina is dead as it can be. He wouldn't date Hinata, as long as he has feelings for Sakura, which I'm sure won't fade anytime soon as I explained above. He wouldn't date Hinata just because he thinks she's cute, or she's a perfect girlfriend material or because she's easy to get. He gets what he wants(which is Sakura) no matter how hard it is. And he's Naruto, he'll get it in the end.

3. Naruto has set himself up for a showdown with Sasuke.
A personal, one on one, winner take all showdown in which he intends to die with his friend. The only people who can even come close to affecting him at that stage will be his fellow Team 7 members, Sakura and Kakashi. Until then, yes, we've got people like Gaara, Tsunade, Killer Bee, among others who could influence his path...but when Sasuke comes knocking down Konoha's walls, the only people who will mean anything to their duel are Sakura and Kakashi.

However, as I've stated I'll argue for NaruHina too, here goes:

1. Naruto's never giving up personality.
I'll admit that certain plot devices will get old after repeated use (not that it's stopped writers before), but we've seen a relatively recent occurrence in which Naruto had, for all intents and purposes, given up. His fighting spirit remained, but if he wasn't drowning in helplessness then I'm a cactus (btw, I'm not). Hinata came in to save him then. In his current War arc, yes, Naruto is set in his purpose to win the battle. But Naruto has given up on something. To some extent...he's resigned himself to his duel with Sasuke. He will not be slain, but he refuses to kill him. If one dies, they die. Is he willing to give up Konoha, his comrades, his friends, his dream of Hokage, to die with his brother? Will dying with him save him from his path, and will killing Sasuke prove that he is unfit to become Hokage? If he doesn't think he can be Hokage if he can't save this friend, and if he believes both will die in the attempt which doesn't seem like saving to me, does he think he can be Hokage? Perhaps he needs to be reminded of his dream, in a way that will remind him not to be content with dying. (And all NH perspective aside, we've already seen that Sakura - and Kakashi for that matter - will not deter him from his path leading to Sasuke)

Naruto is strong inside as well as out, but he is not unshakeable and neither is his spirit. He has grown so strong because he began with loneliness and then built on it with the support, respect, and love of others. It's not unreasonable that he require that support again from those who love him - which includes, and not low on the list, Hinata.

2. He hates people who lie to themselves.
So he says, and so his actions indicate. It's a reflection of his Ninja Way, a code he incidentally shares with Hinata. It's worth remembering that he said this point to Sakura - and though it's debatable what she was lying about, we know for sure that she is far too confused and unresolved toward the world (and Sasuke, and Naruto) to be declaring love. No matter what she means and what she's truthful about, she's leading him astray with her words...deception, the antithesis of his Ninja Way. If he hates those who lie to themselves, it would conflict rather sharply with the love he has (or had? Or has temporarily pushed aside for important battles?) for Sakura. Hinata has proven genuine in her thoughts and words.

This point hinges on Naruto still loving Sakura, which until the next panel development can conceivably be considered up in the air due to Sakura's fumbling her Confession and Naruto's response.

3. Naruto has set himself up for a showdown with Sasuke.
...Not as much for this one. Hinata would need to be closely involved in most of the future chapters. I can see Neji serving as a medium between Team 7 drama and Hinata, given that he recognizes Sasuke's path. Hinata's supported Naruto when he sorely needed it, and she would do so again. This one's not for me, I can't argue with myself.

[Namaenash]

3. Naruto has set himself up for a showdown with Sasuke.
A personal, one on one, winner take all showdown in which he intends to die with his friend. The only people who can even come close to affecting him at that stage will be his fellow Team 7 members, Sakura and Kakashi. Until then, yes, we've got people like Gaara, Tsunade, Killer Bee, among others who could influence his path...but when Sasuke comes knocking down Konoha's walls, the only people who will mean anything to their duel are Sakura and Kakashi.

However, as I've stated I'll argue for NaruHina too, here goes:

1. Naruto's never giving up personality.
I'll admit that certain plot devices will get old after repeated use (not that it's stopped writers before), but we've seen a relatively recent occurrence in which Naruto had, for all intents and purposes, given up. His fighting spirit remained, but if he wasn't drowning in helplessness then I'm a cactus (btw, I'm not). Hinata came in to save him then. In his current War arc, yes, Naruto is set in his purpose to win the battle. But Naruto has given up on something. To some extent...he's resigned himself to his duel with Sasuke. He will not be slain, but he refuses to kill him. If one dies, they die. Is he willing to give up Konoha, his comrades, his friends, his dream of Hokage, to die with his brother? Will dying with him save him from his path, and will killing Sasuke prove that he is unfit to become Hokage? If he doesn't think he can be Hokage if he can't save this friend, and if he believes both will die in the attempt which doesn't seem like saving to me, does he think he can be Hokage? Perhaps he needs to be reminded of his dream, in a way that will remind him not to be content with dying. (And all NH perspective aside, we've already seen that Sakura - and Kakashi for that matter - will not deter him from his path leading to Sasuke)

Naruto is strong inside as well as out, but he is not unshakeable and neither is his spirit. He has grown so strong because he began with loneliness and then built on it with the support, respect, and love of others. It's not unreasonable that he require that support again from those who love him - which includes, and not low on the list, Hinata.

2. He hates people who lie to themselves.
So he says, and so his actions indicate. It's a reflection of his Ninja Way, a code he incidentally shares with Hinata. It's worth remembering that he said this point to Sakura - and though it's debatable what she was lying about, we know for sure that she is far too confused and unresolved toward the world (and Sasuke, and Naruto) to be declaring love. No matter what she means and what she's truthful about, she's leading him astray with her words...deception, the antithesis of his Ninja Way. If he hates those who lie to themselves, it would conflict rather sharply with the love he has (or had? Or has temporarily pushed aside for important battles?) for Sakura. Hinata has proven genuine in her thoughts and words.

This point hinges on Naruto still loving Sakura, which until the next panel development can conceivably be considered up in the air due to Sakura's fumbling her Confession and Naruto's response.

3. Naruto has set himself up for a showdown with Sasuke.
...Not as much for this one. Hinata would need to be closely involved in most of the future chapters. I can see Neji serving as a medium between Team 7 drama and Hinata, given that he recognizes Sasuke's path. Hinata's supported Naruto when he sorely needed it, and she would do so again. This one's not for me, I can't argue with myself.

All I can say is, a solid and strong relationship goes with trials and tribulations, ups and downs moments. This is something that NaruSaku from both sides (Naruto and Sakura) has over NH/SS.

Sakura supported Naruto way much more than Hinata in the manga. You can list down the panel where Hinata supports Naruto, and I think we can easily show much more panels Sakura supporting Naruto. She has done that so many times before and she will do it again in the future.

[Living Lavish]

3. Naruto has set himself up for a showdown with Sasuke.
A personal, one on one, winner take all showdown in which he intends to die with his friend. The only people who can even come close to affecting him at that stage will be his fellow Team 7 members, Sakura and Kakashi. Until then, yes, we've got people like Gaara, Tsunade, Killer Bee, among others who could influence his path...but when Sasuke comes knocking down Konoha's walls, the only people who will mean anything to their duel are Sakura and Kakashi.

However, as I've stated I'll argue for NaruHina too, here goes:

1. Naruto's never giving up personality.
I'll admit that certain plot devices will get old after repeated use (not that it's stopped writers before), but we've seen a relatively recent occurrence in which Naruto had, for all intents and purposes, given up. His fighting spirit remained, but if he wasn't drowning in helplessness then I'm a cactus (btw, I'm not). Hinata came in to save him then. In his current War arc, yes, Naruto is set in his purpose to win the battle. But Naruto has given up on something. To some extent...he's resigned himself to his duel with Sasuke. He will not be slain, but he refuses to kill him. If one dies, they die. Is he willing to give up Konoha, his comrades, his friends, his dream of Hokage, to die with his brother? Will dying with him save him from his path, and will killing Sasuke prove that he is unfit to become Hokage? If he doesn't think he can be Hokage if he can't save this friend, and if he believes both will die in the attempt which doesn't seem like saving to me, does he think he can be Hokage? Perhaps he needs to be reminded of his dream, in a way that will remind him not to be content with dying. (And all NH perspective aside, we've already seen that Sakura - and Kakashi for that matter - will not deter him from his path leading to Sasuke)

Naruto is strong inside as well as out, but he is not unshakeable and neither is his spirit. He has grown so strong because he began with loneliness and then built on it with the support, respect, and love of others. It's not unreasonable that he require that support again from those who love him - which includes, and not low on the list, Hinata.

2. He hates people who lie to themselves.
So he says, and so his actions indicate. It's a reflection of his Ninja Way, a code he incidentally shares with Hinata. It's worth remembering that he said this point to Sakura - and though it's debatable what she was lying about, we know for sure that she is far too confused and unresolved toward the world (and Sasuke, and Naruto) to be declaring love. No matter what she means and what she's truthful about, she's leading him astray with her words...deception, the antithesis of his Ninja Way. If he hates those who lie to themselves, it would conflict rather sharply with the love he has (or had? Or has temporarily pushed aside for important battles?) for Sakura. Hinata has proven genuine in her thoughts and words.

This point hinges on Naruto still loving Sakura, which until the next panel development can conceivably be considered up in the air due to Sakura's fumbling her Confession and Naruto's response.

3. Naruto has set himself up for a showdown with Sasuke.
...Not as much for this one. Hinata would need to be closely involved in most of the future chapters. I can see Neji serving as a medium between Team 7 drama and Hinata, given that he recognizes Sasuke's path. Hinata's supported Naruto when he sorely needed it, and she would do so again. This one's not for me, I can't argue with myself.

This post is grasping for straws if i ever seen one lol.

Naruto told Gaara he will not die until he becomes hokage, that pretty much confirms he has not given up.
What he actually said was he feels unworthy of being hokage if he can't even save just one friend, not that he gave up his dream completely.
They will understand each other through their fists!! Thats How Naruto will save Sasuke.
Naruto has shown repeatedly he has not given up several times. how can you miss all this. when its clearly laid out for you? even Sakura reacton at the 2nd reunion understood this.

As for those who are concerned that Naruto's feelings for Sakura have changed since Sakura's confession, recently (ch. 569) even the Nine Tails acknowledged that Naruto never changes once he's set his mind on something. He never gives up. It's who he is, and it's true whether he's talking about becoming Hokage, rescuing Sasuke, or being in love with Sakura. His "never give up" attitude doesn't conveniently change just because some people would rather see him (or Sakura) paired with somebody else. Naruto will surpass the last generation.

But it really blows me away. He's the main character, he's had these feelings for the entirety of the manga, Nothing has indicated any change of heart in him, and Kishi has proven that nothing is going to be changing off panel. Naruto's feelings are going to get a resolution, on panel, one way or another. I highly doubt they're going to change, especially given Naruto's character itself.

Also like Namaenash said Sakura has 100% faith in Naruto. knows him better and has been his biggest support emotionally to.

[Deej]

But on the other hand the point of filler is to expand the story using elements that will not contradict the story of the manga in the near future. I know romance is not the main theme of Naruto but is has been an important one in the last couple of years. Do you really think the anime team would actually trouble themselves making an episode to show that Naruto still loved Sakura if it was just going to be suddenly contradicted? I don't think Kishi would allow such an episode to be made if he was going to show Naruto changing his mind later on. If that episode wasn't created the audience would've been left wondering how Naruto truly felt but thanks to airing it the state of Naruto's feeling is once again reaffirmed.

Kishimoto has nothing to do with the anime. He once mentioned that he offered to present ideas for filler after Part 1, but was turned down. Yes, filler does react to what is in canon. That's why we don't see a great love affair between Naruto and Tenten being explored. The bonds remain the same. But filler can be ignored. As it was in the cases of filler characters like Sora and Guren.

Another example. In the anime filler, the jinchūriki Utakata meets and fights with Naruto before Pain attacked Konoha. But in canon, Naruto does not know Utakata when he sees him during the war. Utakata's backstory remained filler.

The best thing that can be said for filler is that Kishi says he watches the anime every Thursday. So it could become an influence. As was the case with Matsuri, Gaara's love interest. The anime filler actually named her and gave her a backstory. Kishi then made it canon in the databook.

Edited by Deej, 23 February 2012 - 01:16 AM.

[Former Captain]

This post is grasping for straws if i ever seen one lol.

Yes, it is. There's a reason I don't think NaruHina could become canon (assuming good writing) with any less than five to seven years of clear manga development, as I said in a post less than 36 hours ago. I suspect you didn't see that post of mine, recent as it was. Page 440, I think. This wouldn't be a problem for NaruHina if NaruSaku didn't exist - but it does, and it's been growing (with its ups and downs, as Namaenash said. Although there aren't many downs once we hit Part 2, which is when the series' romance starts to take off - I'd say even the Confession was both rather than just negative).

how can you miss all this. when its clearly laid out for you?

*sigh* Perhaps I should introduce myself, if you're going to assail me instead of my argument.

I am a major NaruSaku fan, probably since the beginning of Part 2 but I didn't keep track. I don't consider myself a "shipper" because while shipping itself is fine, I am absolutely disgusted by shipping wars due to experiences in other fandoms, and I inevitably get sucked into the most heated of debates (I just <3 a good argument). I chose to argue what I believed a NaruHina argument might be because a NaruHina shipper here felt outnumbered and because, frankly, there aren't many ways to debate at this point without throwing in completely different perspectives. (I'm willing to debate as a fan of any ship except SasuSaku. Can't stand it.)

You said that his telling Gaara pretty much confirms it. I'm a firm believer that if one piece of evidence is enough to make a point, use six pieces. Make it impossible to defeat. Make it unquestionable canon. Let me prove to you that I haven't missed your point by adding a couple to your counter:
- In the early 500s chapters, he told Kushina that he will be Hokage. You can add to this the fact this his Ninja Way is to stick to his word, but really it's more than enough that he's telling his mother, whom I'll claim he loves more than anyone else in the show, that he will fulfill her and Minato's dreams. Thus, one of the most meaningful things he's ever going to say. Using this as an example has the added benefit of drawing the Kushina/Minato <--> Sakura/Naruto parallel, from the growing respect on her side/initial attraction on his to their Tsundere relationship.
- "If my arms get ripped off, I'll just kick him to death! If my legs get ripped off, I'll just bite him to death! If my head gets ripped off, I'll just stare him to death!": not related to Hokage, necessarily, but enough said.
- Probably ~half the times we've seen Iruka's thoughts, and more recently when we saw the Kyuubi's.
- Search for Tsunade, Chuunin Exams, his reaction upon learning that Gaara was Kazekage...
- The list goes on.

Even with that, consider for a moment. Naruto's great dream is to become Hokage (initially for acknowledgement, now primarily to protect). He cannot become Hokage if he is dead first. He won't feel worthy of Hokage if he can't save his friend Sasuke, which requires mutual understanding via their fists...and the next they fight, Naruto thinks, they're both going to die. It doesn't mean he's given up though I'm quite interested in seeing reactions to that spin, but it presents an interesting conundrum. Naruto is going to have to solve this if he ever wants to be at peace with himself.

I'm straying from topic. Sakura also has her own resolution to make. She needs to resolve her feelings toward both boys, but particularly Sasuke (which is why it'd be nice to see the bench scene brought back). I think she knows she's close to Naruto. Right now, it's not enough, because Sasuke's there.

As for those who are concerned that Naruto's feelings for Sakura have changed since Sakura's confession, recently (ch. 569) even the Nine Tails acknowledged that Naruto never changes once he's set his mind on something. He never gives up. It's who he is, and it's true whether he's talking about becoming Hokage, rescuing Sasuke, or being in love with Sakura. His "never give up" attitude doesn't conveniently change just because some people would rather see him (or Sakura) paired with somebody else. Naruto will surpass the last generation.

But it really blows me away. He's the main character, he's had these feelings for the entirety of the manga, Nothing has indicated any change of heart in him, and Kishi has proven that nothing is going to be changing off panel. Naruto's feelings are going to get a resolution, on panel, one way or another. I highly doubt they're going to change, especially given Naruto's character itself.

Also like Namaenash said Sakura has 100% faith in Naruto. knows him better and has been his biggest support emotionally to.

No, I don't disagree with the NaruSaku bits, but there's one part I disagree with.

His "never give up" attitude doesn't change, conveniently or inconveniently. Nonetheless, there's a very noticeable difference between letting his words do the talking and his actions. And this isn't my sentiment, it's the Kyuubi's. How does this relate to being captured by Deva Pain? It's the difference between cursing him out...and going 6-Tails, which itself is the "culmination of all his negative emotions"...and returning to form after Minato appears. There's not giving up no matter what the cost, and then there's not giving up no matter what I have to do, no matter what stands in my way, but I'll still be me. He gave up. Hinata jumped in and aided him, but it wasn't enough. He gave in to the Kyuubi. Gave in to feeling like he was defeated, like he had to surrender himself to evil to win. Then Minato boosted him back to his normal self.

So, yes, he can "give up" if driven to the brink - because the entire comparison to Sasuke revolves around relying on one's own will, power, and comrades versus doing whatever one can to attain greater strength at any cost. And in this scene, he started to pull a Sasuke, whether he wanted to or not.

He needs others to reach his full potential (his signature jutsu, Kage Bunshin, is pretty strong evidence of that). He provides the fuel, their presences provide the spark. Sakura has done this plenty - but Hinata hasn't exactly been idle, either. Hardly definitive proof, but hardly to be ignored either.