898 replies to this topic

[Gojira]

The anime is also part of the problem 

 

Part 2 Sakura is still portrayed with fangirl tendencies even when Sasuke isn't around (mostly in omakes)

[TouKen4Life3g]

Well anime has gap the plot holes, so you can't take them serious. I can only wish for a remake.

[Gojira]

Well anime has gap the plot holes, so you can't take them serious. I can only wish for a remake.

Dunno why but the animation really plummeted when the Sasuke Retrieval arc ended and all the filler started up....I thought it would make a comeback in Shippuden but....it actually somehow got worse.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Dunno why but the animation really plummeted when the Sasuke Retrieval arc ended and all the filler started up....I thought it would make a comeback in Shippuden but....it actually somehow got worse.

Well sadly, that's when I noticed that I can only fantasize an insane budget quality. Lol. My head always imagine a crazy facial animation. Lol. Sigh. If only money wasn't involved.

[Otaru]

Agree to disagree to agree ok?

The problem is not the fact that she couldn't kill Sasuke. The problem is the way it ended. After all the determination she showed, Kishi reduced all that in order to have Naruto save the damsel in distress. Again I say this, not going to lie loved that moment when Naruto saved her. But it could've been done better.

Have Naruto save her while not discarding Sakura's resolve.

 

This is actually a problem with Kishi's writing style. He can't make a character shine without making another character look pathetic in order to do that. In order to show us how great a character is, he needs to take a kitten on another character. Bad writer.

 

I still don't agree lol

So yes maybe I'll agree to disagree LOL

 

I don't think Sakura looked pathetic. And I don't think that's how Kishimoto wanted her to appear.

[James S Cassidy]

Well sadly, that's when I noticed that I can only fantasize an insane budget quality. Lol. My head always imagine a crazy facial animation. Lol. Sigh. If only money wasn't involved.

You mean like the Pein fight? lol. God, that was the worst ever.

[Tsuki Hoshino]

Actually i've been focusing mostly on this arc because it's the conclusion of the story and for all the characters aswell, Sakura is reaching conclusion and what's being focused on this aspect is her feelings.
Mostly connected to romance subplot.
I think the most problem is that i understand that some people doesnt like critics but srsly there's need to label others as bashers just cuz they criticizes Sakura, one user told me i'm no better than Forneverworld a guy who has videos on youtube known by some posts here as someome who's constantly bashing Sakura.

There's a not a single post that can be labelled as Sakura bashing on my history otherwise i would've banned already but some users already labelled as that.
 
It depends, if you're going to give Sakura a free pass because it's Kishimoto then it should be applied to other's aswell reaching the conclusion he's a bad writter and messed with his characters.
In my opinion is all about planning, i dont think he had something great planned for Sakura on this arc.
I feel like he wasnt kidding when he said he doesnt know how to make heroines.
I think that putting Sasuke as the center of everything was a hidrance to his characters overall because it blocked all the plot points he could explore.
Naruto can only achieve his goals if he save Sasuke, Sakura can only be finished if Sasuke is saved.
 
We're all mad because of it, no here even threated to stop reading the manga, aside from people telling me, and others to drop the manga because we're criticizing Sakura and other characters.

Given what I've seen of your posts, you've just got "THAT" tone when you talk about Sakura. You tend to hark on her negatives constantly. It could be that sentiment doesn't carry over the internet, but you've got to be careful with how you phrase things. You consistently come down hard on Sakura--and often and maybe you're not meaning to but its something plenty of people here have noticed. 

The fact of the matter is you CAN apply the "kishimoto" syndrome to all the characters but Sakura consistently gets the shaft more so than others. She has the absolute worst treatment out of the three of them from her creator and from the fandom at large. Sasuke and Naruto have redeeming fights to bounce them back from whatever character flaws they have ( and they have a crap ton.) but only a small minority of people are willing to be as harsh on them as they are on Sakura. 

Also, plenty of people have threatened to stop reading if X happens or Y DOESN'T happen. We just had a thread about why someone was done with the manga open a few days ago.

In short, people are free to criticize all they like but then ought to be prepared to be given the same treatment they're giving out. You can say anything you like, but here on the internet someone is always going to call a foul. 

[TouKen4Life3g]

You mean like the Pein fight? lol. God, that was the worst ever.

NOT LIKE THAT! Think as Halo 4 Mocap they had. It was really impressive.

[Nate River]

It's kind of funny to me that everyone thinks that Sakura is weak or say "she is not as strong as should be" when really Sakura is not the problem. The problem is Sasuke's character. It always has been and it always will be. Notice that when the story wasn't focused on the whole Sasuke business every character seemed strong willed? When Sasuke wasn't around, Team 7 wasn't a big chunk of mess that was a hung over of feelings and emotions. Even Naruto fell victim to it several times.

Everyone questions Kishimoto on why he doesn't give Sakura more, but my biggest question is why Kishimoto have so much focus for Sasuke? It's always Sasuke. It is basically the reason why both Naruto and Sakura come off as weak and stupid. The story hinders on Sasuke's story so much that it reduces everything he comes in contact with to nothing. It is even true for Hinata as well.

(1) The problem isn't really Sasuke. It's message purity. If Kishimoto were willing to portray these decisions as having risks and costs of their own and having those around him behave rationally then Naruto and Sakura wouldn't look so dumb. Instead Naruto is spared having to deal with costs of his decisions either through Deus Ex Machina (Nagato) or by just drawing it away (Obito). People who should asks questions don't and everyone around him largely indulges his quests or forgo obvious counters.

I don't see how anything Sasuke has done demands Naruto and those around him behave this way. If you want a clean redemption without the thorny moral issues on the other hand, then yeah, you've got Part 2. Sasuke's behavior doesn't not demand the response from the characters we've been given.

(2) I also don't understand how what Sasuke has done precludes her from consistent plot involvement nor prevents Kishimoto from living up to his own characterizations. Naruto has kept pace with him just fine (even if the most recent power flew in the face his character portrayal(.

(3) I personally think Naruto's portrayal is the worst of three and it's not even close nor is it limited to his obsession with Sasuke. No character has gone to such great lengths to ignore or just flat out whiff on the voluminous amounts of Grade A bullsh** presented to them than Naruto. It happens with Sasuke, Nagato, Itachi, Obito....and so on. Even when Madara presents the IS all Naruto can say is that it's a lie. That might be the least problematic this about that and that's all he can muster?
 
 

Chapter 615 was such a rubbish chapter that made Naruto look weak and pathetic because he was so willing to give up because Neji died. Some of you diagree with this fact, but then again I disagree on the whole Sakura thing, so we're even in this regards.

I would agree. Naruto has a crisis of faith about every two years. Naruto had already suffered loss and had to deal with it (and it's amazing that in his line of work it took 4 years). It was rehashing old ground. He'd overcome this obstacle long ago.

 

When Kishimoto is writing Naruto, he can make him get stronger and not make the other suffer for it. When it comes to Sasuke and Hinata, he literally has to sacrifice every other character just to raise their bars. Just to make them more important than they really are. Hinata at least is tolerable and the story doesn't always suffer save for her own, but Sasuke just ruins the entire premise for it. This is why I hate Sasuke alot more than ever and this is why I feel all the rage directed at Kishimoto for Sakura is wrongfully placed.

Sasuke even had his own weak and pathethic moments as well when he made the same mistakes that some of you point out against Sakura. Some of you mentioned how her plan sucked because all she did was run in there and yet that basically was Sasuke's last three plans. It was just basically "Speed blitz in and then hit them." Naruto harem no jutsu is alot more creative and was alot more effective then 3 of Sasuke's recent plans. Not only that, but when it came to fighting the invisible limbo clones that only Sasuke could see, he left them to Naruto who could only sense them. Yeah, great plan Sasuke. Great plan. Make Naruto do all the work while you tackle a few rocks and he couldn't even do that effectively unlike Naruto who took out several at a time.

I see people say a lot and give these reasons, but never once make notice that these kind of things only occured when Sasuke was on the scene and taking charge. I don't see many criticizing his actions, but are immediatly going after Sakura like it was no big deal. You have to be fair about this. If you are going to criticize one character for making a mistake, then you have to charge them all for it. Sasuke's plans were no better than Sakura's and in fact they were worse and failed even harder despite Naruto being in perfect sinc with him.

I don't personally take issue with Sakura's move there, but the best I can gather from this argument is that they are both dumbasses. I don't see it as much of a defense that Sasuke did it too (and he's better equipped) unless you want to argue Sasuke's doing the right thing and that him doing the right has nothing to do with his superpowers Sakura doesn't possess at the moment.


 

If we want to go into real detail, at least Sakura is accepting of facts instead of just being in denial like Naruto is with some of it. "Yeah, we are great friends" Yeah, I am not buying that, Naruto. How is Sasuke a great friend and how is noone else a great friend to you especially considering so many did alot more and sacrificed alot more for you?

I don't know about this. Sasuke has told them both to screw off about every chance he has had except for the war arc and even then has made it clear his motivations are all self-serving, and, yet she is only now coming to grips that maybe, just maybe, he doesn't give a damn. I'm still not sure she is there yet. It's starting to trickle in a little bit, I suppose. I will definitely give her this, she's light years ahead of Naruto. I'd not put it past him to say water under the bridge if Sasuke turned around and decapitate Sakura next week. Of course, in the end, guess who is going to have it right: Naruto. Bah.

 

Imagine if this manga had no Sasuke at all. Alot of the problems some of you complain about wouldn't even exist. So my beef is that Sasuke just ruins this manga with his presence and that Kishi is trying so hard to make Sasuke seem that important that it is just ruining the other things that make this manga great.

Neither would much of the story. 80% of the plot is tied up in Naruto-Sasuke. It's hard to say it be great because it wouldn't closely resemble what we have. I'd venture to say it'd still have major issues if he insisted on the moral dodging and weaving, which is really at the heart of Part 2's problems.

[Gojira]

Well sadly, that's when I noticed that I can only fantasize an insane budget quality. Lol. My head always imagine a crazy facial animation. Lol. Sigh. If only money wasn't involved.

I don't think money is really the issue considering Naruto's popularity, it should have more than enough for atleast some decent animation.

 

Look at the volution in animation in the DB to DBZ series it was pretty old-timey animation when Dragonball was around but holy crap by the Majin Buu saga the animation and how well drawn everything was better than Naruto and Bleach ever was in animation.....than GT happened. I don't even dislike GT but there is alot of problems it has, I will say that it gave a way better ending to the series than AT gave it, first time I ever cried for a show.

[only Naruto]

I pointed this out too.
That's the biggest mistake of his story.
 
The issue with Sakura is that there's nothing to expect from her because she has no goals neither background.
But Kishimoto give her some objective which is "being equal to Naruto and Sasuke" and doesnt deliver and keeps putting her on damsel and distress.
She being supportive is part of her heroine role, he doesnt deliver something unique to her character or doesnt make her shine on her own.
 
I agree, the problem with 615 is solely the fact Naruto was willing to give up because Neji died when he faced similar situations before like when Jiraiya died.
 
The whole problem is that Sasuke creating stupid plans doesnt spare Sakura because it's stated as canon that Sakura is "smarter" than Naruto and Sasuke and her plans sucks aswell.
 
We do, the fact is when we do this with Sakura it becomes a big deal.
 
Last time i checked she was like "he doesnt care".
 
Imagine if Sasuke wasnt the main plot of the manga, it would be 1000x better because we would actually have the main character moving the plot instead of chasing the antagonist and ignoring his own problems.

Like on the fight against Pain, remember how suddenly Pain said Naruto was a failure because he could not save Sasuke, that was ridkittenulous.

hey again .sometimes i feel that  the people should re read the manga .cause they are simply lost in all of this .]and people really forgot that this story about naruto .and only naruto. (thats why my name is only naruto cause i see what kishi is doing.) so what are narutos goals . the child of the prophecy.  1 to save sasuke no matter what cause its the key for a peaceful world . how ? cause the hate and revenge  what made sasuke leave the team . and he was  naruto first bond  thats why he will never let go  of him if naruto cant save the friend who was with him how can he save a strange people from hatred. ..'.when jiraya told naruto that this world is full of hatred .and i entrust you for the answer he wasnt joking. and naruto told him that sasuke told me that i will never understand him .jiraya told him that orichimaru said the same .and jiraya said that maybe he is right ,cause i didnt feel his pain.  naruto kept this in his mind .until he faced pain .and pain told him you cant change anything if  you dont feel others pain. and pain was right naruto failed cause he didnt know sasukes pain .he said  it him self after pains  arc. and am ok with is  cause this is really deep and kishi trying to send a message you guys dont like it because we live in this selfish world .cause no one of us would do it cause we are selfish.and we give up right a way . the message is that the right side should never give up . no matter what .cause once he did .evil will rise for ever .thats a reality thing..

 

and you know why we see the whole sasuke saving story is the main and covering the war and  everything cause kishi writting it from narutos point of view thats why the manga name is naruto . naruto is selfless he doesnt care if he will die if that means it will save sasuke or any of his friends .but sasuke is the one in the dark. and am ok with this too cause i understand kishis point.

 

and about sakura . i dont even care if sakura couldnt do  even a one punch .and i will still like her  why . cause kishi made sakura for emotional 1st and the fighting abilities 2nd  .and i know sakura said she wants to be as strong as they are .but thats her dream kishi never said it will happen and it wont . .i mean naruto said he will bring sasuke back .has he done that ?  and he is the main character on your logic .i should give up the manga cause naruto didnt save sauke till now and he didnt  .and i got so bored cause i didnt think it would take so long  i mean 14 years and keep going .but i believe in the end kishi will do something... BTW u said ino development is more than sakura     . ? yes you are right not just ino even hinata . why ? simple cause the 3 main characters should have the slowest development cause they have the most screen time specially naruto and sakura ,and also . specially if  u want to make along manga .if you look at it naruto sasuke and sakura .are the slowest development in the manga .and am ok with this too .cause it makes sense.. and sakura will surpass tsunade.and you know it .in the end. here is why i tell you are bashing sakura . cause when u said that why sakura asks about if sasuke cares or not .its pointless .because we know sasuke will be redeemed .  then why are u so annoyed with her not surpassing tsunade even though we all know she will surpass her  in the end  thats why u r not fair with sakura and u deserve to be accused by bashing.? caught you 

 

.

you are smart but not wise and you have the eyes but you  dont have the sight  which means that you are not patience.  you  fell into a  traps made by genius writer like kishi so easily .

 

btw .when the member asked you that did u know that jutsu naruto and sakue talked about .in the end of the chapter ./ u answered when naruto said that he trained for it more than the rasengan . u knew it . i mean we all knew something  not right was going to happen when naruto said this ..but your answer mean that befor naruto say this u really thought that he had a new jutsu .. which mean the member was right  that u dont know what kishi can do in the near future   and narutos 2nd goal is to end the hatred .and the 3rd is sakuras heart and because of the 2 first goals he will win her heart..  .have a good day.

Edited by only Naruto, 01 July 2014 - 06:48 AM.

[only Naruto]

here is my answer for all the members . who  run out of patience and so annoyed for waiting for so long .

Edited by only Naruto, 01 July 2014 - 06:56 AM.

[六道仙人]

I find a bit odd asking to a naruto's clone where are his original one and sasuke.... It should be "what about Sasuke-kun, Naruto?"

[Chatte]

I find a bit odd asking to a naruto's clone where are his original one and sasuke.... It should be "what about Sasuke-kun, Naruto?"

Exactly.. it's like... "Where's Naruto, Naruto?!"... doesn't make sense.

[narusaku256]

Eh? The clone Naruto is there with Sakura and Kakashi, right? Imagine it like this.

 

Sakura is asking clone Naruto right? So here it goes

 

Sakura to Naruto: Naruto, Where is Sasuke kun and you? :/

 

OR

 

Sakura to Naruto: Naruto, Where is Sasuke kun and Naruto? :/

 

I think this would really portray Sakura as being a dumbkitten :/

 

Another way.....

 

Naruto has caught Sakura and Kakashi. Sakura knows Naruto is behind her and she questions Kakashi sensei this time.

 

Sakura to Kakashi sensei: Sensei, where's Sasuke kun and Naruto? :/

 

I think I have made it clear as to why Sakura chan asked only about Sasuke's whereabouts! I hope that is...

Edited by narusaku256, 01 July 2014 - 12:23 PM.

[Chatte]

I think I have made it clear as to why Sakura chan asked only about Sasuke's whereabouts! 

 

Is Sakura really that big of an idiot? 

We go again with this?!

[narusaku256]

We go again with this?!

No...I guess I was explaining Sakura's response since some of the posts I read above were pertaining to this thing.

 

'Is Sakura really that big of an idiot?' was supposed to mean that she is not that big of an idiot to ask Naruto himself about his own whereabouts when she can clearly see him in front of her! And since she had Naruto with him she only enquired about Sasuke. That was my take on things

Edited by narusaku256, 01 July 2014 - 11:57 AM.

[Chatte]

No...I guess I was explaining Sakura's response since some of the posts I read above were pertaining to this thing.

 

'Is Sakura really that big of an idiot?' was supposed to mean that she is not that big of an idiot to ask Naruto himself about his own whereabouts when she can clearly see him in front of her! And since she had Naruto with him she only enquired about Sasuke. That was my take on things

Oh...my bad. And yeah, makes more sense to ask only about Sasuke...

[tekopi]

Well, every week there must be an issue to raise regarding Sakura. And that issue will be dragged on until next Wednesday. I understand that everyone is with their standing, but do we need to keep on bringing it up when the matters has been made clear? I wonder whether next week will be the same  .

[TouKen4Life3g]

Well, every week there must be an issue to raise regarding Sakura. And that issue will be dragged on until next Wednesday. I understand that everyone is with their standing, but do we need to keep on bringing it up when the matters has been made clear? I wonder whether next week will be the same  .

You can have a chapter full of Naruto picking his nose, yet we managed to bring a topic that has nothing to relate to this. Quite honestly, the reaction for this chapter seems like a very late one as if we forgot to react it 2 chapters ago. I actually thought I got the wrong thread but nope. At least I'll be on the alert when Sakura dies in a goofy fashion, I have to wait two chapters for this one to be reacted, so I should expect "I wonder how she going to go through with this."