86 replies to this topic

[catsi563]

wont happen. Kishimoto may use similar themes but he is not one to reuse or rehash already used plot devices.

naruto has already faced a tragic loss ((jiraiya)) and a near tragic loss ((hinata)). the next most likely plost device which hasnt been used is one of two possibilites.

Sakura wins leaveing Sasuke for dead and Karin saves him leading to Madara using Sasuke to synch to Gedo Mazo. Sasuke accepts because the humiliation of losing to Sakura ((useless, annoying)) would just be a killing blow to his ego and pride.

Sakura loses and is left lying injured or is captured and held hostage to draw Naruto into a final confrontation. Its not something thats been done before and in the end may be the more likely scenario.

Also Karin features prominently in that scenario too as she may eb the one to free Sakura and set her and Naruto on the path to save Sasuke who may be used by Madara to further his plan.

[Miss Soupy]

wont happen. Kishimoto may use similar themes but he is not one to reuse or rehash already used plot devices.

What do you mean, kishi loves using parallels, the point is that they are meant to somehow be overcome. And he does rehash things, especially if the point is huge. We have had 3 love confessions so far, which is quite a lot XD

Sakura loses and is left lying injured or is captured and held hostage to draw Naruto into a final confrontation. Its not something thats been done before and in the end may be the more likely scenario.

Sakura doesn't need to be a hostage. The best bait Madara has is Sasuke himself. Naruto is going to Sasuke regardless.

[catsi563]

he loves paralells yes but he doesnt reuse the same story element over and over again.

how can i best describe it.

for example

note the rasenshuriken.

he uses it once

then gives a road bump which makes it unusable or dangerous

then he gives it a power bump ((thrown, and protected by sage mode))

now it is unlikely that Naruto will ne shown to use the rasenshuriken in the same fashion again. Kishi will show an upgrade or different version of it more than likely.

same with whats happening now. Sakura is unlikely to die because shes allready come close once agaisnt Sasori, and given the themes Sakura is shown to follow the most likely outcome is directed confrontation with Sasuke

where like Naruto before her at the valley of the end she will win the battle but lose the fight. or possibly win both the battle and the fight..

Killing Sakura at this point rehashes a device thats allreayd been used not once but twice. Jiraiya and nearly with Hinata. he allready has the tragedy of Jiraiya and the revenge feleinsg that evoked in him.

that themes been done, and he is unlikely to rehash it save as a flashback to his promose to Nagato.

now the theme is to mvoe past that. the key is that hes going to have to confront Sasuke with Sakura at his side.they failed once each separately, and once together because it was too early for him to return.

now the time for sasukes return and redemption is drawing closer. now is the time to confront him together.

[Miss Soupy]

The cycle of hatred is a theme that comes back over and over and over again, which is why it's a cycle. It is rehashed, but it changes so it is acceptable. Sakura almost dying against Sasori was used once, yes, however it was not used in front of Naruto to elicit a reaction. The closest thing that has happened along these lines was with Gaara holding Sakura captive with sand to force Naruto and Sasuke to fight him. Sasuke see's this technique as affective to get Naruto to fight, perhaps he could use it later as well. The situation would change, thus the theme could be re-used. And Sakura and Naruto aren't in harmony with each other right now. It is very possible that something major would have to happen for them to fight as a team again.

[RyrineaHaruno]

Hinata almost dying, in front of Naruto was used once. In other words Sakura wont be killed in front of Naruto. Kishimoto doesn't like using the same thing once, it part of his work. I find it funny that you don't think him seeing a friend die in front of him and the man he felt like a father die is not enough for him to understand Sasuke. He does understand the hate inside him, since he did say it himself.

Edited by RyrineaHaruno, 06 November 2009 - 09:06 PM.

[Miss Soupy]

Hinata = Sakura?? Last time I checked Naruto was in love with Sakura instead XD big difference there.

[RyrineaHaruno]

Heck, I would go vigilantly on a guys butt, if the guy hurt one of my friends. Naruto would to, you saw how Naruto went t six tails with one death on his head, so in other its been done already. Sakura almost dying has already occurred once in the story. I am not saying he in love with Hinata, Naruto wanted to kill the guy for what happen to a Friend.

Edited by RyrineaHaruno, 06 November 2009 - 09:17 PM.

[Miss Soupy]

Naruto wanted to kill Pain for Jiraiya, Kakashi and the whole village. Also, Sakura...and most characters... 'almost die' every time they are in a serious battle ^^ doesn't mean it can't happen again.

[emilykawaii123]

Forgive me if this has already been mentioned, but am I the only one who thinks one of the reasons Sakura is going after Sasuke is for Naruto and to maybe prove her feelings to Naruto?

[tricksie]

I'm really happy with the way this is going. I thought Sakura's not-backing-down attitude was way more true to her personality than 469 (which I also happen to think was genuine, just awkward and not without a hidden agenda).

I was so happy when she told him to stick it (basically) then moved on with her apparent "Plan B." Yeah, I don't really care that she's got a hidden agenda, the New Team Kakashi has one too - and their agenda is one Sakura is being left out of by Naruto's decision (remember his words to Sai when Karui beat the snot out of him).

So I won't parse any words: she is being manipulative, and she has every right to throw it back at them. To me, it doesn't tarnish her character - it shows she's willing to go the distance for the people she cares about. I am resisting the temptation to throw the double standard on Sakura: What Naruto does out of protection, Sakura does out of some sort of scheming.

She has tied up her loose plot ends: she has let Naruto know unequivocally that she cares for him and that she's not rushing out to save Sasuke for herself. We don't know what Naruto's response is, but right now it doesn't matter. She's on her own journey.

There is an opportunity to turn her into a strong character here. (Pwn Sasuke!) There is also the chance that she will be ultimately reduced to a plot device to draw Naruto out. (Sasuke's Pawn)

Ultimately, no reader wants to see the main hero end up with a shrinking violet, but it does happen. We've seen her get strong, then forgotten, overcome obstacles then underestimated. (Did it rub anyone else the wrong way when, after she pummelled that centipede all by herself, someone shouted to her that she was needed at the hospital? Dude! If 12 guys can't take and one 16yo can, then you guys get to hospital and put her on the front lines!)

So here's hoping Kishimoto chooses the strong female option. She's slated to fill Tsunade's shoes, who is one cookie, so there's hope yet.

Also, it's ironic that Sakura's setting off to find Sasuke who is right this moment mostly dead with whack-a-doo near-nin whose only healing power is to do a reverse-vampire with her chakra. If he ever needed a medic-nin, now's the time. Not saying it's going to go all romantic and fan-ficy, but I could see that her skills come in to play in a way she's not expecting. She may not have to take him on in a fight but may have to make a choice between healing him and letting him die.

Then again....I might be the only one, but I was somewhat surprised the Diedara was killed off because I thought for sure there would be some little skirmish, at least, between him and Sai. The bad guy artist vs. the good guy artist. Eh, apparently not.

Edited by tricksie, 06 November 2009 - 10:23 PM.

[Merger Knight]

I'm really happy with the way this is going. I thought Sakura's not-backing-down attitude was way more true to her personality than 469 (which I also happen to think was genuine, just awkward and not without a hidden agenda).

I was so happy when she told him to stick it (basically) then moved on with her apparent "Plan B." Yeah, I don't really care that she's got a hidden agenda, the New Team Kakashi has one too - and their agenda is one Sakura is being left out of by Naruto's decision (remember his words to Sai when Karui beat the snot out of him).

i likec it too

Then again....I might be the only one, but I was somewhat surprised the Diedara was killed off because I thought for sure there would be some little skirmish, at least, between him and Sai. The bad guy artist vs. the good guy artist. Eh, apparently not.

art vs art lol

[Dattebayo]

Tricksie: My feelings exactly. I don't think this has anything to do with Sakura wanting Sasuke back, she's clearly realized that, however much she wants it to be like the old team 7, Sasuke's just too far gone and it too evil and does nothing but spawn cycles of hatred. She wanted Naruto to see that too, but when she sees that he clearly doesn't agree, she decides to do it on her own...she agrees with Shikamaru.

[RedDelicious]

...she agrees with Shikamaru.

Wasn't there some theory floating around, that Sakura during the confession was actually Shikamaru in disguise (henge). Did that quietly die off, or does it still have legs?

[Merger Knight]

Wasn't there some theory floating around, that Sakura during the confession was actually Shikamaru in disguise (henge). Did that quietly die off, or does it still have legs?

say what?

[Cloud]

Wasn't there some theory floating around, that Sakura during the confession was actually Shikamaru in disguise (henge). Did that quietly die off, or does it still have legs?

I think it's either in the 469 spoiler thread or the 470 one. It died off quietly, I think.

say what?

Are one word replies to long and short posts really necessary? There's a word for that. Spam.

[Derock]

Wasn't there some theory floating around, that Sakura during the confession was actually Shikamaru in disguise (henge). Did that quietly die off, or does it still have legs?

That's just another fan-theory that died off real quick once this chapter was released. It was funny, but we knew it won't happened.

[RedDelicious]

That's just another fan-theory that died off real quick once this chapter was released. It was funny, but we knew it won't happened.

Found it, buried in the middle of the chapter 469 discussion. I only remembered it vaguely (since there were a lot of ideas thrown around).

I was re-reading the 370s (Jiraiya vs Pein). (Those chapters read much better now that I know more of the history, than they did the first time through.) In the flashbacks, Yahiko was the one who felt that wars would only end if all people felt pain. Jiraiya was the one who suggested that those who have felt great pain should use that as motivation to protect others from having to suffer the same way.

I mention this, because I get the feeling that Naruto gets mocked sometimes for trying to save Sasuke. The usual sarcasm is that Sasuke would not just give up his pain and become a happy, fluffy ninja. I get the feeling that Naruto wants to spread the cult of Jiraiya, so to speak. To convince Sasuke not to spread his suffering, but instead to use those memories to prevent another such tragedy from happening again. (If Danzo gets stomped along the way, that wouldn't be so bad. )

Edited by RedDelicious, 08 November 2009 - 05:14 PM.

[Smiter]

Hmm, I'm not sure what to make of this chapter. I guess we need to wait and see.

Sakura's reaction was definitely spot-on; she was annoyed by Naruto's stubbornness. I'm inclined to believe that she does consciously like Naruto, but I'm not sure how fully she feels love towards him. She most likely won't know until she faces Sasuke.

Sakura vs. Sasuke should be good! I'm not sure how she will track him (remember Madara teleported Sasuke to a different timespace, therefore cutting off any scent trail he would have left), but the confrontation could bring up a scene we've been eagerly awaiting.

The bench scene. If Sakura brings it up, and Sasuke says "That wasn't me" or "That was Naruto", a lot of things could start falling into place... I bet that, once she finds out, the first thing Sakura does when she's reunited with Naruto is uppercut him and yell at him for tricking her. Then they start making out.

For now, Sai is the big question. Which one is the real Sai? I'm inclined to believe the real Sai is with Sakura, but it is possible that it was a clone. After all, is the real Sai aware that Sakura plans to hunt Sasuke instead of returning to Konoha? What does Sai want to do? Gather information from eavesdropping on Naruto, knock some sense into Naruto regarding Sakura, or something else?

Kisame vs Killerbee is turning out to be interesting. I wonder if Samehada will mutate further! I wouldn't be surprised if Kisame can fuse with his sword.

[Denim88]

For now, Sai is the big question. Which one is the real Sai? I'm inclined to believe the real Sai is with Sakura, but it is possible that it was a clone. After all, is the real Sai aware that Sakura plans to hunt Sasuke instead of returning to Konoha? What does Sai want to do? Gather information from eavesdropping on Naruto, knock some sense into Naruto regarding Sakura, or something else?

I think Sai is starting to see what it means to have friends, personally. Yeah, he's still a social disaster in terms of people skills, but I think he's honestly trying to help Naruto. The fact that he said Sakura was a major cause of the blond's pain says a lot right there. I don't think Sai would go and try to start a fight or cause problems between Sakura and Naruto intentionally, so I'm feeling that he honestly wants to patch up the old Team Seven.

I think that though he's still questionable in terms of where his loyalties truly lie, it seems he's starting to lean towards helping Konoha, not Danzou. Naruto left an impact on him when he saw what he was going through to get Sasuke back. If anything, I think Sai's going to try even harder now to help get that stubborn Uchiha back, if not for the sake of Konoha, then for Sakura and Naruto's sake.

Kisame vs Killerbee is turning out to be interesting. I wonder if Samehada will mutate further! I wouldn't be surprised if Kisame can fuse with his sword.

Well, I'm sure Kisame has a few tricks up his sleeve. Didn't one of the Kiri-nin at the Kage Summit state that Kisame has the chakra capacity equivalent of a Jinchuuriki? I'm thinking that somehow Samehada's chakra absorption powers would contribute to that factor.

[Froot]

I definitely think Sai is going to want to talk to Naruto. About what? Well... What else is there?

I'm getting a good feeling that Sasuke's going go batsh!t crazy. Characters like Light from Deathnote and Azula from Avatar - You know, the cool, calm, collected ones - both went crazy at the end.

Not much of anything, but it would be fun to see Sasuke go