99 replies to this topic

[Transformers03]

Is kissing someone on the forehead suppose to mean something 'special' in Japan? Does it imply intense intimacy when couples do it together, and if done to other people means a deep bond or closeness?

[Hiraishin]

Aww... This chapter gave me feels, just like the last one. It's nice seeing affection even in times of war. Tsunade looked so cute when Dan was talking with her.
And now, I have no doubt in my mind that the bench scene will be revisited. Even before, with all the hints and whatnot, it seemed likely, but Kishi disappoints us often, so maybe it wouldn't happen. But Kishi obviously likes the forehead kiss, so it's only a matter of time before we see it one more time, after waiting for so long. <3

The rest of the chapter was alright. I wonder what Sasuke will say/do, and what Madara's going to do.

[Nate River]

agree.... --Click here to view--

I'm glad Tsunade got to reunite with Dan. I was really, really, really afraid that was not going to happen, and that Dan was going to disappear without making that connection. The rest of the ET'd ninjas have been somewhat disappointing in that way: Asuma didn't get to see Kurenai, Chiyo didn't get to see Sakura. (I know, Sai did get to see his brother and Sakura was recognized by Zabuza.) So I'd pretty much given up hope for Dan/Tsunade.

But how sweet! "My Tsunade." And "You are my dream." Really lovely and romantic.

And now I'm totally hoping for a good NS scene centered on the forehead kiss. It just seems to be pointing toward that with Sakura's self-conciousness on that spot, and the significance of the forehead kiss in the manga.

I didn't mind the reunion so much as I minded the plot device used to make it happen. When he used the jutsu, all I could say was "Oh Good God." It's a pretty convenient jutsu (that didn't exist before this chapter) and was more convenient that Dan just happened to be one of the guys who knew it.

Them meeting would have felt less contrived if they had just stumbled across each other.


And I wish I could have found out if Edo Tensei Chiyo could be used like the Dragon Balls. If she used the resurrection jutsu does she come back?

EDIT: One thing I wasn't clear on is Madara's words at the end of the chapter? Nothing more troublesome that that...troublesome for who? The summoner individual or the person who summoned them?

[Dragunov]

Madara is too kittening beast. Its just too much.

As for the Dan/Tsu scene, it killed me and mah JiraTsu feels T-T.

"I'll be waiting for you on the other side...."

Jiraya forever alone in heaven T-T

[redragon88]

I guess people got bothered about the possibility of Tsunade never loving Jiraiya back because of Dan more than I imagined. Why are people forgetting that comment Tsunade said while Jiraiya was away in the Ame infiltration mission?

If I remember detail by detail Shizune came in and Tsunade commented that she was betting on Jiraiya to die because she had terrible luck so the opposite (him living) would surely happen, then she remembered how Jiraiya talked about how men became stronger when women rejected them and that men weren't supposed to look for happiness anyway. She then said that he always tried to act cool but that when he came back he wouldn't have to put on a tough front for her anymore.

That was clearly stating that when Jiraiya came back she would gladly open her heart to him as she should've done many years ago but couldn't thanks to Dan's death.

By the way, while making this post I found the chapter in which she said that, it's 380. Try to read the chapter and tell me that was just a platonic comment, you won't be able to.

There were some people who commented that maybe she could love them both romantically in the afterlife... no, just no. If you want to say that she cares a great deal about both of them and will be glad to be reunited with them when she dies, I can completely agree with that. But I'm pretty sure Kishi isn't interested in supporting threesomes in this manga. It's about how love changes and can go from one person to another, which I'm sure was Tsunade's case.

To anyone who's ever being in love, if you love a person but that person also wants to love another besides you, that will only cause you pain (I don't think anyone could truly be OK with that kind of decision) and make that person look extremely selfish for not having the resolve of choosing.

Tsunade truly loved Dan but as she moved on from his death she came to slowly give her heart to Jiraiya, at least that's how I see it. Dan will always mean a great deal to Tsunade because of their history and will be happy to see him again but I believe that her romantic feelings now belong to Jiraiya.

Edited by redragon88, 27 June 2012 - 08:27 PM.

[Jake]

Wow this thread really exploded while away.

Happy, Sad and VERY ANGRY!! --Click here to view--

I was both Happy, sad and very angry at the chapter

Happy because I will see madara uchiha loose to kages hopefully

Sad because it turned out that tsunade did still loved Dan only and Jiraiya was nothing for her more than a friend. I really do feel bad for sometimes he is just completely forgotten after the pain fight. Not even Naruto is shown to remember him. POOR JIRAIYA!

also Naruto vs tobi fight will have to wait

Very Angry because

1) Tsuchikage said whoever ended the edo tensei was a HERO FOR SHINOBI WORLD which is an UCHIHA(why kishi always makes naruto look like fool in front of these UCHIHAS)

2) An UCHIHA(madara) was again able to freed himself from Edo tensei followed by Itachi UCHIHA.

3) Now when kages will defeat Madara they will definitely have to defeat his perfect susanoo meaning they if teamed up will also be able to take down Naruto because Madara said perfect susanoo is as strong as a bijuu.

I am really angry at kishi for putting all the spotlight on UCHIHAS most of the time. I just wish somehow it is shown that the perfect susanoo is not as powerful as a bijuu and 10 tails so that if Naruto fights and defeats the 10 tails he becomes the strongest shinobi on the shinobi world.
OR
Make tobi use perfect susanoo and then Naruto defeats him.

but what am I saying these things will turn out only in my dreams but I will be definitely satisfied if this somehow happened in the manga. ARGGGGGHHHH kishi why u can't make Naruto get all this heroic attention and power. WHY U always equal's Sasuke's power with Naruto's power?????

Why? Because it will make thier final fight more dramatic, will Sasuke die, will Naruto die, with they both die or will they both survive?

it was chapter 530 actually, but no way I would remember such an minor detail from months back. Ok, it was not an ass pull, convenient, but not an ass pull.

Convenient yes, but an ass pull hell no, I mean didn't he have a nickname with the word ghost in it?

Mangareader doesn't work for me. Please post at least 2 other sites to read instead of me having to find other sites to read, and considering I don't read manga besides this and Silver Spoon, I have no idea what other sites are there besides mangafox, and they don't upload licensed manga. I always get a broken picture image with mangareader.

I useually go to MangaHere but you can also try MangaPanda although it might have the same proplem as MangaReader I haven't checked yet.

Yeah! Madara fight round 2! Although, it's heavily stacked against the Kage, considering Madara is in an immortal body and the Kage have been pushed to their breaking point.

SEND IN THE DEUS EX MACHINA.

Can't we call it Deus ex Uchiha by now?

I didn't mind the reunion so much as I minded the plot device used to make it happen. When he used the jutsu, all I could say was "Oh Good God." It's a pretty convenient jutsu (that didn't exist before this chapter) and was more convenient that Dan just happened to be one of the guys who knew it.

Them meeting would have felt less contrived if they had just stumbled across each other.


And I wish I could have found out if Edo Tensei Chiyo could be used like the Dragon Balls. If she used the resurrection jutsu does she come back?

EDIT: One thing I wasn't clear on is Madara's words at the end of the chapter? Nothing more troublesome that that...troublesome for who? The summoner individual or the person who summoned them?

I kinda got the feeling that it was a technique that Dan had invented, or at least a clan's hidden jutsu like the Shadow Posession Jutsu

[ciardha]

Is kissing someone on the forehead suppose to mean something 'special' in Japan? Does it imply intense intimacy when couples do it together, and if done to other people means a deep bond or closeness?

Any skin to skin contact has a more intense meaning in Japan, but a kiss even moreso.

Other Asian cultures are still pretty restained about public physical contact, but Japanese culture, while still more restained about PDA (public displays of affection) than most western cultures, has long had a focus on the intense bond skin to skin contact means in their culture- a word was even coined in the 20th century to explain the concept to the west- "skinship".
And I know everyone is familiar with the 20th century- present focus on the importance- especially to girls of the first romantic kiss. But a kiss on the face, but other than the lips falls under the broad rubric of "skinship" I haven't seen the forehead be a focus point, but the cheek or top of the head definitely. "Skinship" isn't just about romantic love but also parental love, etc...

[Konohakitten]

This chapter was sweet what with Dan and Tsunade, and yes the whole Madera thing being god is getting old. The way I look at it is maybe Madera still being around and not being controlled will not only cause problems for the kages but for Tobi as well.

Edited by Konohakitten, 27 June 2012 - 09:23 PM.

[James S Cassidy]

Yeah, it's kinda annoying. But i was actually hoping for it to happen though, since Madara's been showing feats worthy of Final Villain material. Either he'll be defeated here, or retreat after killing some of the Kages. So just this once, I don't mind.

Also, if we think about it, when we go back to the chapter he was revived, he seemed to expect to be revived at some point. I'm pretty sure he also considered ET as a possible alternative for his revival plan, so he studied it and sneaked into the village somehow.... or he got the secrets from Oro somehow....

Isn't that a little too convenient, though? Worthy final villain? I don't want Madara to be a final villain because it feels like a cheap way out. He can't die now, he has unlimited Chakra, the power of the 1st Hokage, he can't be sealed, he can't be turned off, and no matter what jutsu you throw at him he manages to counter it or know the secrets to get around it.

He even seems to know jutsu that never existed until after he died...so what, now he can see into the future? He has become a god now. It would have been better if Tobi was Madara and managed to combine himself with himself to be complete. Literally become alive again...a mortal. A powerful mortal, but mortal none the less. At least then he wouldn't be so hax as he is now. We face another problem on how he is going to be defeated. Who or what can defeat the now immortal over-powered Madara Uchiha that seems to know every jutsu and holds all the keys? I have never once seen a villain like him in any other media where they just have no weakness. And if he does have a weakness, I can't think of what it is.

The Kages? They've been trying to do it and seem to keep failing. I am can't think of anything they can do to defeat him.

Possibilities:

Sasuke? He could use the Izanami and force Madara to leave. Cop-out? I think we passed that line of "ridiculous convenient cop-outs" when Madara summoned himself using the Edo Tensei. He would also be seen as a hero if he does it and once again diminish Naruto's role as the main character

Naruto? Well, if he can defeat Madara, who seems to be more powerful than Tobi and Sasuke combined, then what's to stop him from obliterating them? And what about Tobi? We haven't begun to look into him and yet while he was menacing as the leader of Akatsuki, he is now seen as a chump. I don't know anymore.

The fact that Madara is immortal and unlimited chakra is what makes it such a drag. He has no weakness and he has infinite stamina. What can beat that?

Tsunade and Dan. Look fellas, he was her first love an Tsunade also loved Jiraiya too. As people said about Sakura, just because he was your first love does not mean it is your only love. I think we can say indefinitely that Tsunade loved both, but still has issues to resolve around Dan and she got her closure. I don't see her just ignoring Jiraiya because she was just as sad when he left to die. And no, Sasuke is nothing like Dan.

[FoolishYoungling]

Just noticed something. Tsunade doesn't have to die for Naruto to become the 6th hokage. Just like with how the 3rd was about to pass the title down to Minato when he was still alive, Tsunade can do the same with Naruto.

[Don-kun]

Just noticed something. Tsunade doesn't have to die for Naruto to become the 6th hokage. Just like with how the 3rd was about to pass the title down to Minato when he was still alive, Tsunade can do the same with Naruto.

If I could rep you for that comment.

Edited by NS means logic, 27 June 2012 - 11:17 PM.

[Konohakitten]

Just noticed something. Tsunade doesn't have to die for Naruto to become the 6th hokage. Just like with how the 3rd was about to pass the title down to Minato when he was still alive, Tsunade can do the same with Naruto.

So true I personally see Tsunade just stepping down like the 3rd did

[TerrorKing]

Sasuke seems shocked. Like, this is probably the first time on part two that he seems like he doesn't know what to do. I wonder what the end of his sentence will be. "I'm..."

I'm actually glad that Itachi finally got some recognition. He deserves it. Even if his execution was a little flawed, he still made some great sacrifices for the shinobi world. He is probably my favorite Uchiha, next to Shisui, Mikoto and Fugaku.

As I suspected, it seems we haven't seen the last of Madara just yet. The fact that he can somehow "override" the ED might be a little too convenient, but what the hell, he's an Uchiha. It's kind of expected by now.

The DanTsu scene was really nice. It was nice that Tsunade finally got some closure. Also, the forehead kissing was just cute and it has definetly given me renewed hope that the bench scene will be revisited at some point.

[Transformers03]

Any skin to skin contact has a more intense meaning in Japan, but a kiss even moreso.

Other Asian cultures are still pretty restained about public physical contact, but Japanese culture, while still more restained about PDA (public displays of affection) than most western cultures, has long had a focus on the intense bond skin to skin contact means in their culture- a word was even coined in the 20th century to explain the concept to the west- "skinship".
And I know everyone is familiar with the 20th century- present focus on the importance- especially to girls of the first romantic kiss. But a kiss on the face, but other than the lips falls under the broad rubric of "skinship" I haven't seen the forehead be a focus point, but the cheek or top of the head definitely. "Skinship" isn't just about romantic love but also parental love, etc...

Thanks, I was only asking because kissing seem to be recurring thing, but it mostly had to do with Tsundes(?), so it will make sense for Dan to do it to her. But that bench scene had me thinking.....

[shadow_Uzumaki]

Isn't that a little too convenient, though? Worthy final villain? I don't want Madara to be a final villain because it feels like a cheap way out. He can't die now, he has unlimited Chakra, the power of the 1st Hokage, he can't be sealed, he can't be turned off, and no matter what jutsu you throw at him he manages to counter it or know the secrets to get around it.

He even seems to know jutsu that never existed until after he died...so what, now he can see into the future? He has become a god now. It would have been better if Tobi was Madara and managed to combine himself with himself to be complete. Literally become alive again...a mortal. A powerful mortal, but mortal none the less. At least then he wouldn't be so hax as he is now. We face another problem on how he is going to be defeated. Who or what can defeat the now immortal over-powered Madara Uchiha that seems to know every jutsu and holds all the keys? I have never once seen a villain like him in any other media where they just have no weakness. And if he does have a weakness, I can't think of what it is.

The Kages? They've been trying to do it and seem to keep failing. I am can't think of anything they can do to defeat him.

Possibilities:

Sasuke? He could use the Izanami and force Madara to leave. Cop-out? I think we passed that line of "ridiculous convenient cop-outs" when Madara summoned himself using the Edo Tensei. He would also be seen as a hero if he does it and once again diminish Naruto's role as the main character

Naruto? Well, if he can defeat Madara, who seems to be more powerful than Tobi and Sasuke combined, then what's to stop him from obliterating them? And what about Tobi? We haven't begun to look into him and yet while he was menacing as the leader of Akatsuki, he is now seen as a chump. I don't know anymore.

The fact that Madara is immortal and unlimited chakra is what makes it such a drag. He has no weakness and he has infinite stamina. What can beat that?

Tsunade and Dan. Look fellas, he was her first love an Tsunade also loved Jiraiya too. As people said about Sakura, just because he was your first love does not mean it is your only love. I think we can say indefinitely that Tsunade loved both, but still has issues to resolve around Dan and she got her closure. I don't see her just ignoring Jiraiya because she was just as sad when he left to die. And no, Sasuke is nothing like Dan.

I don't think it was quite clear what Tsunade's true feelings for Jiraiya is. It's implied that she may have had deeper feelings for Jiraiya, but considering that Tsunade lost her first love and the three Sannin didn't seem to keep in contact all that much when they separated, and of course, Jiraiya's death, it may've stunted any romantic feelings Tsunade may have had towards Jiraiya.


Also, I don't get the vibe that Madara will be the final villain. He's just simply an incredibly hard opponent to beat, maybe bordering nigh impossible. Tobi and Sasuke are better candidates for final villain, considering their actions drive quite a bit of the story.

Though, if this was a video game, I consider Madara as one of those incredibly hard, optional boss to beat, for some reason.....

Can't we call it Deus ex Uchiha by now?

Well, I'm pretty sure Kishimoto has a separate bag of Deus ex Uchiha to distinguish them from actual Deus ex Machina.... XD

Edited by shadow_Uzumaki, 28 June 2012 - 12:27 AM.

[Super Boom]

I don't know if anyone's still trying to find pairing comparisons, but I'd say Dan/Tsu has more in common with Naru/Saku than Sasu/Saku does. Maybe not to the same level as Jira/Tsu, but I don't think that suddenly makes it a Past Version of Sasu/Saku. Sasuke probably has the most in common with Orochimaru in the Sannin's age group, and even that's not a perfect parallel.

Anyways...random thought while I was reading this chapter. Seeing Tsunade get a resolution with Dan was nice, but I feel like Nawaki should have been mentioned too, if Kishi was trying to resolve that part of Tsunade's past. I know he was too young when he died to be of use in the Edo Tensei army, but has it ever really been debunked why he can't be Tobi? Instead of being an Uchiha that absorbed Senju DNA, maybe he's actually a Senju that took an Uchiha's eyes.

Just a thought. Probably one that's been mentioned here before, but I don't come on these chapter threads too much anymore.

EDIT: One thing I wasn't clear on is Madara's words at the end of the chapter? Nothing more troublesome that that...troublesome for who? The summoner individual or the person who summoned them?

I also thought that was odd. I think he meant troublesome for everyone, since he's basically an immortal now, and it's gonna be close to impossible to stop him. He might have also meant troublesome for himself, though, which would imply that he doesn't want to remain in the Human World, and that his body is just acting out of self-preservation at this point, regardless of his input.
*shrug* I guess I don't know how the Edo Tensei works...

[CloudMountainJuror]

Just noticed something. Tsunade doesn't have to die for Naruto to become the 6th hokage. Just like with how the 3rd was about to pass the title down to Minato when he was still alive, Tsunade can do the same with Naruto.

Hey, she lives? Ok. Fine with me...as long as someone else important dies/is killed by Madara.

[K9ofChaos]

Yesh, Madara's not out of the picture yet.



So does this mean Madara knows the Impure World Resurrection?



Or does it simply mean that he knows the seal, but not the technique?



This looks like a job for Narutopedia.

[Fenris]

Madara is too kittening beast. Its just too much.

As for the Dan/Tsu scene, it killed me and mah JiraTsu feels T-T.

"I'll be waiting for you on the other side...."

Jiraya forever alone in heaven T-T

Well that's not always true...

For example, in Wolf's Rain, when Hige died, he imagined being surrounded by a bunch of "babes" as he called it when he finally got to the other side, (Similar to Jiraya's perverted/lady loving personality) and that'd be his paradise.
Jiraya could be perfectly happy up there with a bunch of ladies for all we know ahaha

Edited by Fenris, 28 June 2012 - 04:23 AM.

[ciardha]

I guess people got bothered about the possibility of Tsunade never loving Jiraiya back because of Dan more than I imagined. Why are people forgetting that comment Tsunade said while Jiraiya was away in the Ame infiltration mission?

If I remember detail by detail Shizune came in and Tsunade commented that she was betting on Jiraiya to die because she had terrible luck so the opposite (him living) would surely happen, then she remembered how Jiraiya talked about how men became stronger when women rejected them and that men weren't supposed to look for happiness anyway. She then said that he always tried to act cool but that when he came back he wouldn't have to put on a tough front for her anymore.

That was clearly stating that when Jiraiya came back she would gladly open her heart to him as she should've done many years ago but couldn't thanks to Dan's death.

By the way, while making this post I found the chapter in which she said that, it's 380. Try to read the chapter and tell me that was just a platonic comment, you won't be able to.

I pretty much agree with this.

There were some people who commented that maybe she could love them both romantically in the afterlife... no, just no. If you want to say that she cares a great deal about both of them and will be glad to be reunited with them when she dies, I can completely agree with that. But I'm pretty sure Kishi isn't interested in supporting threesomes in this manga. It's about how love changes and can go from one person to another, which I'm sure was Tsunade's case.

To anyone who's ever being in love, if you love a person but that person also wants to love another besides you, that will only cause you pain (I don't think anyone could truly be OK with that kind of decision) and make that person look extremely selfish for not having the resolve of choosing.

Tsunade truly loved Dan but as she moved on from his death she came to slowly give her heart to Jiraiya, at least that's how I see it. Dan will always mean a great deal to Tsunade because of their history and will be happy to see him again but I believe that her romantic feelings now belong to Jiraiya.

Look at the chapter about Konan as she's dying after she fights Madara. There's a three way bond there, Konan loved both Yahiko and Nagato, and the implication is the three of them will be together after death. Not in a sexual sense, but a friendship with romantic tinges bond.

As people have said, both Dan and Jiraiya had a connection to Naruto in Tsunade's eyes, and the feelings were mutual between Dan and Tsunade and Tsunade and Jiraiya at the end. I could see an afterlife image of Tsunade sitting between Jiraiya and Dan under a shade tree by a river. Jiraiya is content because Tsunade loved him too. Tsunade is content because both men she loved are beside her. Dan is content because he's been reunited with Tsunade.