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Slug Sage Mode: Is Sakura a likely candidate?

Sakura Haruno Slug Sage Mode

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#61 Chatte

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Posted 19 September 2013 - 06:12 AM

 

It was stated during Naruto's training that only a few people could obtain Sage Mode, if you could just add Natural Energy to already formed chakra then how could it be so rare?, I'm pretty sure somewhere down the line someone would have tried something like that, it's not to like Fuinjutsu is something new or anything it's been around since at least the Sage of Six Paths sealed the Jubi.

 

If you could add Natural Energy to pre-formed chakra then anybody could do it with enough time and the same Fuinjutsu Kakashi used on Sasuke's curse mark back in Part I.

 

Well, as Fukasaku said, the balance is the problem here. If you can't balance it, it's for nothing. So that's why is considered to be so rare. Plus, as we've seen, till now, only 2 of the animal trinity are able to teach SM. So it's quite exclusive to those who have a contract with the said animals. And since Shikkotsurin is the third place, it only fits the trinity, thus the possibility of a SM for her too.


Edited by Chatte, 19 September 2013 - 06:12 AM.

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#62 Atheck

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Posted 19 September 2013 - 11:53 AM

It was stated during Naruto's training that only a few people could obtain Sage Mode, if you could just add Natural Energy to already formed chakra then how could it be so rare?, I'm pretty sure somewhere down the line someone would have tried something like that, it's not to like Fuinjutsu is something new or anything it's been around since at least the Sage of Six Paths sealed the Jubi.
 
If you could add Natural Energy to pre-formed chakra then anybody could do it with enough time and the same Fuinjutsu Kakashi used on Sasuke's curse mark back in Part I.


Exactly, this fact has been restated so many times now that I've lost count. Why is it so difficult to believe that there isn't too much justification or purpose to this theory? Sakura already has the tools necessary to make herself into a top notch medical shinobi. She can surpass Tsunade now which has been a staple of her character since becoming an apprentice. What more needs to be done for her ranking there? Overcoming her Sannin predecessor is her established hurdle. Sage Mode would just be an inessential power up that would likely see very little use because of Kishi's inherent leaning towards the male characters having greater importance than the females.

To the person who suggested that Fukasaku was referring to balance as the quality that makes Sage Mode so difficult to master and unique, he actually gave no mention to how scarce the ability was in that portion of the explanation. He said it when the prerequisite of large chakra reserves was brought up.

 

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#63 Jake

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Posted 19 September 2013 - 11:57 AM

 

Well, as Fukasaku said, the balance is the problem here. If you can't balance it, it's for nothing. So that's why is considered to be so rare. Plus, as we've seen, till now, only 2 of the animal trinity are able to teach SM. So it's quite exclusive to those who have a contract with the said animals. And since Shikkotsurin is the third place, it only fits the trinity, thus the possibility of a SM for her too.

 

If you cannot add an element to chakra then why should you be able to add Natural Energy to chakra, especially since the Kishi has been extremely consistent with how Chakra works, what you are wanting is for Kishi to change these rules just so Sakua can have a power up when she just got one that she hasn't even shown the full extent of the power it gives her, not ever Sasuke got power ups that fast.

 

Also with what you are claiming it doesn't make Sakura look better it make those who legitimately obtained a perfect Sage Mode look worse, the only two people who have obtained a Perfect Sage Mode (without having to cheat to obtain it) and both of these people were the strongest shinobi of their time, Naruto's Sage Mode shows that his power level is close to that of Hashirama's how would it be good story telling for Sakura to magically rise to that level?


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#64 Sakamaki Izayoi

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Posted 19 September 2013 - 12:12 PM

 

If you cannot add an element to chakra then why should you be able to add Natural Energy to chakra, especially since the Kishi has been extremely consistent with how Chakra works, what you are wanting is for Kishi to change these rules just so Sakua can have a power up when she just got one that she hasn't even shown the full extent of the power it gives her, not ever Sasuke got power ups that fast.

 

Also with what you are claiming it doesn't make Sakura look better it make those who legitimately obtained a perfect Sage Mode look worse, the only two people who have obtained a Perfect Sage Mode (without having to cheat to obtain it) and both of these people were the strongest shinobi of their time, Naruto's Sage Mode shows that his power level is close to that of Hashirama's how would it be good story telling for Sakura to magically rise to that level?

Consistent until now.

I always thought Kurama and Naruto was a special case, due ot the fact Kurama's chakra like the oil for Natural energy is.

I thought that Naruto energy was mixing wiht Kurama's chakra but that's not the case, naruto is adding Natural energy to his attacks different than he did on pain's arc, so he ripped off this concept and for me Sakura can have sage mode aswell.


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#65 Atheck

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Posted 19 September 2013 - 12:24 PM

Consistent until now.

I always thought Kurama and Naruto was a special case, due ot the fact Kurama's chakra like the oil for Natural energy is.

I thought that Naruto energy was mixing wiht Kurama's chakra but that's not the case, naruto is adding Natural energy to his attacks different than he did on pain's arc, so he ripped off this concept and for me Sakura can have sage mode aswell.

 

We discussed this in the chapter thread. The only variations in the chakra gathering process lie in the power Kurama is contributing to the form. He's willfully providing it instead of having it siphoned off to be shifted through from one form to the other. Sage Mode has remained the same. Natural energy is being mixed with physical and spiritual energy to create sage chakra which is being emitted simultaneously beside the bijuu chakra.



#66 Jake

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Posted 19 September 2013 - 12:48 PM

Consistent until now.

I always thought Kurama and Naruto was a special case, due ot the fact Kurama's chakra like the oil for Natural energy is.

I thought that Naruto energy was mixing wiht Kurama's chakra but that's not the case, naruto is adding Natural energy to his attacks different than he did on pain's arc, so he ripped off this concept and for me Sakura can have sage mode aswell.

 

I actually covered this on an earlier post, Naruto and Kurama are doing the same thing that Sasuke and Jugo are doing, they are taking Senjutsu Chakra and mixing it together with their partner's Normal Chakra, Naruto has done something similar to this during his fight with Kurama, when he added Senjutsu chakra to a Rasengan that he had already made before he entered Sage Mode and turned it into his Sage Art: Massive Rasengan.


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#67 Chatte

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 07:15 AM

Ok. So I revisited the training regarding the whole Senjutsu thing. Will come with a post in a short time.
*left here for editing purposes*


Edited by Chatte, 20 September 2013 - 07:19 AM.

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#68 rocci

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 10:26 AM

By releasing the seal sakura will gain the enough chakra pool to absorb nature energy. Thus performing ssm

#69 Jake

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 11:19 AM

By releasing the seal sakura will gain the enough chakra pool to absorb nature energy. Thus performing ssm

 

No because you cannot add Natural Energy to chakra, it is not a matter of how much chakra you have, it about how much chakra you can create that determines whether or not you can enter sage mode, the only three people known to be able to use Sage Mode without cheating, Naruto, Jiraiya and Hashirama are people who have unbelievably large amounts of chakra that replenishes itself daily if not faster, Sakura dose not have the ability to manufacture that much chakra.


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#70 rocci

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 12:21 PM

That's why unlike naruto & hashirama it will be her triumph card because she can only use it once after her seal is release.

#71 TouKen4Life3g

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 12:23 PM

I'm just going to play the waiting game on this one.

#72 Sakamaki Izayoi

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 12:23 PM

 

No because you cannot add Natural Energy to chakra, it is not a matter of how much chakra you have, it about how much chakra you can create that determines whether or not you can enter sage mode, the only three people known to be able to use Sage Mode without cheating, Naruto, Jiraiya and Hashirama are people who have unbelievably large amounts of chakra that replenishes itself daily if not faster, Sakura dose not have the ability to manufacture that much chakra.

Naruto is already doing that and the explanation was "deal with it". :)

 

Sakura can receive the SSM or whatever but if she receive it is because she will have a big fight, giving it just to give is dumb and kishi dont do stuff like that.

Every powerup has a reason, Sakura got theirs as a progression to her character since she hated to be protected all the time and she got that to fullfill her wish on part 1 when they were a team 7, that moment was just for that.


Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 21 September 2013 - 12:25 PM.

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#73 rocci

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 12:43 PM

@darkrest
If kishi really give sakura ssm than the big possible fight for her against juugo or better orochimaru. But I don't put my hope high.

#74 T XD

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 12:49 PM

Aside from the Naruto vs Sasuke fight, if there will be a battle with the others of Team Taka at the end against Sakura, Sai, Kakahi and possibly Yamato then Sakura will show us something/things new. Whether it would be SSM or other abilities and techniques from her seal.


Edited by T XD, 21 September 2013 - 12:50 PM.


#75 Atheck

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 01:03 PM

By releasing the seal sakura will gain the enough chakra pool to absorb nature energy. Thus performing ssm


Please read the rest of the topic. Better yet, read the original topic (Volume 66 cover) where we go into detail about Sage Mode's developmental steps and the reasons for why the seal can't be used as a supplement. In fact, just move the page back by one to "3" of this topic and you will notice an extract from the manga itself detailing why your suggestion contradicts how sage chakra is forged.
 

Naruto is already doing that and the explanation was "deal with it". :)


I get the distinct impression that you're not even reading our retorts for this which we have already given several times now. Let me reiterate my points again because either you haven't read them or you're just cherry picking certain pieces of information.

~~~

Sure it is, provided you read the entire explanation and then pay close attention to Naruto's chakra usage afterwards as he's fighting beside Minato. The two jutsu that were used both required the implementation of sage chakra after having already been formed. But why would this be necessary if sage chakra and Kurama's own supply were already combined together? It's obvious that despite Naruto having mastered control over simultaneously using the forms that he still needs to coordinate when to use chakra from each source instead of just premixing them together.

~~~

When Naruto first started using Kurama's chakra he needed to insulate it. This was clearly shown in the chapter you referenced. Because of Kurama's malicious nature, simultaneous usage of bijuu and regular chakra was impossible. But when they started to work together and Kurama was released from his prison, that restriction was lifted. Kurama is directly linking his chakra to Naruto now. It doesn't have to be isolated anymore and the bijuu chakra can be used at the same time when Naruto is moulding sage chakra from his own system.

Basically it's two different entities releasing chakra from the same body. Which is unlike before where Naruto was having to counteract the drainage of an actively hostile beast who was eating away at his chakra whilst juggling between two separated sources of power.

~~~

We discussed this in the chapter thread. The only variations in the chakra gathering process lie in the power Kurama is contributing to the form. He's willfully providing it instead of having it siphoned off to be shifted through from one form to the other. Sage Mode has remained the same. Natural energy is being mixed with physical and spiritual energy to create sage chakra which is being emitted simultaneously beside the bijuu chakra.


~~~

Jake will post his own thoughts if he feels it necessary but I presume even he is getting irked with the handwaving of arguments that is happening in this debate. You're not even attempting to defend your point. It's just a blind declaration of it being a "fact".
 

Sakura can receive the SSM or whatever but if she receive it is because she will have a big fight, giving it just to give is dumb and kishi dont do stuff like that.

 
Which is highly unlikely given her track record since the beginning of P2 and the reality of the manga coming to a conclusion very soon. The only battles left to handle after Tobi and Madara is Sasuke and possibly Orochimaru. The latter is up in the air but if he isn't killed by the former then he will likely be hunted by the Kages for his past actions.

Not that "SSM" is a realistic possibility which is the only leg that this portion of the argument has to stand on. For all of the reasons that have gone uncontested so far without any manga based counterpoints addressing how you bypass the fundamentals for creating sage chakra.
 

Every powerup has a reason, Sakura got theirs as a progression to her character since she hated to be protected all the time and she got that to fullfill her wish on part 1 when they were a team 7, that moment was just for that.


You forgot the scene from Sakura's flashback where Tsunade explaining that because of her apprenticeship that she would inherit the power of a Sannin. One of the most prominent reasons for being under Tsunade's tutelage since the timeskip. It's come almost full circle now. If she finally receives an acknowledgement from Tsunade that she has succeeded then that will provide closure to one aspect of Sakura's character.

#76 rocci

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 01:17 PM

@atheck
Yes I read, and I believe sakura will get ssm unless kishi not make it happen.
And I agree with the physical, spiritual, and nature energy kind of thing. BUT IF Kishi intend to make it happen, then he will find a way to make it happen.

#77 Codus N

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 01:24 PM

Jake, from your example with the Rasenshuriken, wouldn't it be possible for Sakura to use SM if she has someone to help her gather Natural Energy? if Katsuyu can function similarly to Fukasaku and Shima, then I could see this happening.

 

I could see her releasing the seal to make up for the lack of chakra and have Katsuyu absorb Natural Energy at the same time to mold it into Senjutsu Chakra. It's just like Naruto using the Rasenshuriken, he can't just add Wind Chakra to the Rasengan because it's premade chakra from the start, but solved it by using another clone to add the Wind Chakra. 

 

For Sakura's case, she uses the seal to make up for the lack of chakra needed to mold with Natural Energy, but as adding Natural Energy to the seal's chakra is impossible by herself she needs someone to gather and add it to her chakra.  


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#78 Atheck

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 01:27 PM

@atheck
Yes I read, and I believe sakura will get ssm unless kishi not make it happen.
And I agree with the physical, spiritual, and nature energy kind of thing. BUT IF Kishi intend to make it happen, then he will find a way to make it happen.


So what this argument comes down to is Kishi turning the mode into a usable technique for Sakura just because he can? That's an outlandish hope... I'm not gonna bother that. Believe what you want. I'm betting that her jutsu will be revealed as Byakugou.

#79 Jake

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 01:40 PM

That's why unlike naruto & hashirama it will be her triumph card because she can only use it once after her seal is release.

Naruto is already doing that and the explanation was "deal with it". :)

 

Sakura can receive the SSM or whatever but if she receive it is because she will have a big fight, giving it just to give is dumb and kishi dont do stuff like that.

Every powerup has a reason, Sakura got theirs as a progression to her character since she hated to be protected all the time and she got that to fullfill her wish on part 1 when they were a team 7, that moment was just for that.

 

But Sakura can not manufacture Senjutsu Chakra because it is impossible to add Natural Energy to Chakra that has already been made.

 

What Naruto and Kurama are doing is combining their chakras, they are mixing Naruto's Senjutsu chakra together with Kurama's regular chakra.

 

@atheck
Yes I read, and I believe sakura will get ssm unless kishi not make it happen.
And I agree with the physical, spiritual, and nature energy kind of thing. BUT IF Kishi intend to make it happen, then he will find a way to make it happen.

 

Kishi could also make NaruHina canon but why would he go against all the foreshadowing and build-up toward NaruSaku to do so.

 

Jake, from your example with the Rasenshuriken, wouldn't it be possible for Sakura to use SM if she has someone to help her gather Natural Energy? if Katsuyu can function similarly to Fukasaku and Shima, then I could see this happening.

 

I could see her releasing the seal to make up for the lack of chakra and have Katsuyu absorb Natural Energy at the same time to mold it into Senjutsu Chakra. It's just like Naruto using the Rasenshuriken, he can't just add Wind Chakra to the Rasengan because it's premade chakra from the start, but solved it by using another clone to add the Wind Chakra. 

 

For Sakura's case, she uses the seal to make up for the lack of chakra needed to mold with Natural Energy, but as adding Natural Energy to the seal's chakra is impossible by herself she needs someone to gather and add it to her chakra.  

 

No because with the Enton: Rasenshuriken, Sasuke is adding his Enton Chakra to Naruto's Rasenshuriken, it no different then the collab jutsu Naruto and Yamato used back during the Hiden and Kukaku arc.

 

While it maybe possible for Katsuyu to manufacture Senjutsu chakra like Fukusaku and Shiima it won't be Sakura entering Sage Mode it will be Katuyu, it would be no different then Jugo adding Senjutsu chakra to Sasuke's Susanoo, but it would only work if the Senjutsu chakra is added to the Jutsu otherwise Sakura could end up like the Pain body that absorbed chakra when it sucked up Naruto's Senjutsu chakra.


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#80 rocci

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 01:48 PM

@atheck
Of course it can, and yes I believe she will perform byakugo or any variation of it in this arc, and maybe in the next arc by using her seal she will gain ssm

@kudos
I believe sakura will gain nature energy first than she will use katsuyu part to make it eternal just like what jiraiya did. And you give an ecchi idea where katsuyu attach to sakura. :fu:





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