1649 replies to this topic

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

By your logic then even NaruGaara is similar to MK and almost everybody that Naruto has changed indirectly and directly , what makes someone relationship similar is by the way they interact with each other an do for one another .

If we go by "Saving someome relates to MK" i would agree however which it indeed a similarity NaruGaara, is a friend bond, and inclued on Naruto's love towards his "nakama" he loves all his friends but not romantically obvious.
It's the same love he has for Sasuke as an example.

If you are trying to say that every relationship is love  i agree but i was arguing from the aspect of the nature of that love that NH it's not a romantic one or represents one "true love"  if you want me to be precise and i will say it again admiration love doesn't equal romantic love or true love . And i don't know how did you came to the conclusion that true love means no flaws  you thinking its bull that's another thing .

That was i said however, the nature of the love doesnt diminish or state it as a false, true or whatever love, i was specifically pointing out the aspects of it.
Despite admiration or not, she was willing to sacrifice her life for Naruto twice, she was willing to sacrifice her dream to be with Naruto for his wellbeing and that's noble.
While she has flaws because she only thinks of Naruto.

[TouKen4Life3g]

I'm just saying it can get ugly and we probably won't be the one to cause it. Makes it funnier but hey, who to say it's our fault.

 

*coughs* Here perhaps?Of course combined with how different she is in part 2 (so everything that's happened so far). Just a guess. 

A lot of people are wondering if it all began in part 2. You know, I'll do my research. Also, I remember a databook or a volume that said the same as the anime. I feel like we got careless. It's like if we were against this one boss, only to find out he doesn't kill people, he saves them with milk and cookies.

[Gojira]

So basically the raw is gonna a week late?

That just rustles jimmies.

@Qia

yeah I was wondering how Kakashi was going to finish that sentence....also how do you pause in a monologue? Isn't that when a character's thinking? Did he go braindead for a split second or something?

Edited by Pepsi, 10 May 2014 - 01:48 AM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

The funny thing is that all this would have been final answer if it wasn't about the opposing force of NS. If it was NS, honestly, I can see panic attack more so than "OBJECTION!!!" I mean man, this is really a pain. I have never see a fake script AFTER the release in my life. I...man...

[Hiraishin]

Then why people only brings up that NS is true love, and forget about Obito/Rin and hiswill to see her happy(inst somewhat similar to NS) what about Hinata's love for Naruto(her admiration and even people criticizing the fact she only thinks about Naruto which is valid to me and is negative on my view, she indeed was willing to sacrifice her life to Naruto not once but twice), inst true love aswell?
Minato and Kushina and etc...

I only take out any pairings that start with Sasuke from the list.

Either it has no flaws or accept that there's many true loves on the manga, this whole false love doesnt make sense to me.

I think when they do that they mean in the context of the Big 3. I've seen plenty of people believe that Obito->Rin is true love, and Minato and Kushina just goes without saying.

People label Hinata's love as not "true" because she doesn't know him. Personally, I think you have to really know someone to truly love them, and Hinata doesn't.

[Inferno180]

I think the whole aspects of the love situations from one generation to the next is just an instance of well, you know parallelism, they are similar but not entirely the same. Just the deal with Narutos generation is well, yeah it succeeds because he is the hero but otherwise kishi kinda hinted NS as possible from how he set up MK, I mean its really just too similar for that early dynamic between Minato and Kushina to not be like what we saw years ago with naruto and sakura given how both girls hated the guy who happened to like them and some physical feature the girls didnt like. Literally because of that whole find a girl like her speech, that invoaked this whole aspect of paralleism support for a pairing and well, its just an added bonus on the NS side.

[Gojira]

I wonder if Kushina had a crush on someone at the time as well

Never really noticed before but she even looks sort of like Sakura (ofcourse its easier to tell in the manga where everything's black and white)

[咲耶姫]

 

sorry for the late response, it took forever to load the pages..

 

and wtf in one of the chinese scan sakura told sasuke to stop bothering naruto when she asked about kakashi's eye

 

the group dynamic completely changed lolll

maybe i shouldn't say pro or anti, it's just that one of the chinese group wrote sakura's feelings in the past tense (like panda) which felt like more anti-ss than the other group's translation.

 

[[ and you, sakura... compared to that time, your feelings for sasuke must have changed

 

you still like him, but the feelings behind that affection must be completely different

 

until now you're still thinking about this person who almost killed you....

 

no matter what happens you are unable to give up the sasuke you liked in the past, you even consider it your responsibility to save sasuke from the darkness

 

you are such a gentle child ]] 

 

^ this is the past tense i'm talking about,

 

and the other chinese group translated it as

 

[[ and sakura... the feelings you held for sasuke must have changed

 

it's the same "like", but it's different now

 

up till now you're still worrying for the foe who attempted to kill you

 

no matter what happens you never give up on the sasuke you love and consider it your duty to save sasuke from the darkness

 

you are such a gentle child ]]

 

^ this translation uses ‘love' in the present tense so i thought it was kinda pro-ss

 

Wow thank you, you're right it's really disturbing because thoses 2 translations are more different than the english ones. There it's really pro SS and anti SS cause the english kept a subtle ambiguity while in the chinese ones, one states that Sakura no longer loves Sasuke, while the other one confirms SS's theory. 

 

And I noticed that the second one (Pro-SS) is the same that SS fans posted in japanese on tumblr. Maybe because the japaneses fans translated it from the chinese and not from the english as we thought. 

 

Anyway, I really hope it's the first translation that is right. I really don't like what the second is implying.

 

LOL and in which one Sakura said to Sasuke to stop bothering Naruto, because it seems so out of place that it gives a hint on which one is more accurate, though I have an idea and I don't like that because it's would be the one I prefer.

 

 

LOL about the @Grave thing 

 

To be fair no matter how they twist it it still doesn't make any sense let me put it this way . What they are saying is that Kakashi is admiring the fact that even though he realizes that her love evolved/grown she still wants to save Sasuke . Now tell me does that makes any sense at all  ? To them that makes more sense then Kakashi admiring of Sakura's compassion the fact that she moved on but still cares enough to save him .

You know they won't i'm not sure if they will ever realize it they are in the delulu land for a very long time now

 

Well, trying to understand their logic, I think they are seperating the two fact in Kakashi's statement: She loves Sasuke even more and she wants to saves him from darkness. To them, there is no link between the 2 I think. But you're still right, there is no sens in that case, to the "you're a kind girl", it has no sens to say "you're a nice girl for wanting to save the one you love". It has more sense to say "you're a nice girl for still caring about the one you liked even though he tried to kill you"

Edited by 咲耶姫, 10 May 2014 - 02:57 AM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

The thing is there's a good amount to bypass the idea of not being as anti. I should get ready to write one down.

[Inferno180]

Wait wait wait....

 

So this problem did in fact arise from 2 different translations because of word past and present tenses?

 

Wow talk about ironic. But Im just saying this on the aspect of character development, characters change, I doubt its still liking him translation.

 

Guess that raw will be an interesting find when it comes out.

[TouKen4Life3g]

The odd thing is that if it is the pro edition, the romance will go to no one wins option. Let's face it, that's the only way. Of course he can pull a fast but Naruto is there. I know he's not an idiot when having his main creation involved. Anyway, I stand by my words.

[Gojira]

How much longer do we have to wait the possibility that SS is still alive and gasping for air is making me anxious, someone get the shovel and finish this off before this corpse comes back to life.

[TouKen4Life3g]

How much longer do we have to wait the possibility that SS is still alive and gasping for air is making me anxious, someone get the shovel and finish this off before this corpse comes back to life.

If only asking those translators would be so simple to ask for raw pages.

[Gojira]

wait why don't we ask the translators at mangareader or mangastream? I'm guessing they have the raws themselves otherwise they wouldn't be able to translate and re-upload them

[Inferno180]

Well its a funny deal again like the difference in dialogue regarding kushinas statement with find a girl like her and dont fall for the first one that comes your way, well given how 631 turned out I think the find a girl like her is more likely.

 

but even as this part is worded:

 

and sakura... the feelings you held for sasuke must have changed

 

it's the same "like", but it's different now

 

Doesnt this statement just contradict itself? How can it be the same but also different? I mean given this is the "pro SS" translation but this is regarding the exact problem I was saying earlier, how exactly could it have increased if its surely not the same and had to change?

 

I mean the anti-ss translation lets call it, that one indicates a clear difference, it indicates that there is in fact a change in feelings

 

but this one, this is the headstracher, just how exactly can it change if its the same but its also different? If its saying its the same love but its different, doesnt that make a paradox conflict that really just makes more questions? I mean dialouge can mean a difference in interpretation but what exactly is it going to lead unto if this one is true, I mean its a double negative statement, it says one thing to mean another but it doesn't mean that. Its again saying that Sakura changed by never changing? Thats the idea I'm getting from this translation...

 

Really its a puzzler if we go by this statement.

[Gojira]

That's why I love the pairing wars because you have NH who wants to take that scene at face value so that it may favor them, and then you have NS who looks underneath the underneath so that it may favor them. It's a never ending cycle of who's right and who's wrong.

Its not really looking underneath the underneath, I just think its possible that people just misinterpret what Kishi's point yet again much like the confession who knows maybe we'll get lucky and someone will bring that moment up in an interview or something. Even after hearing how the raw is translated I think its still about 50/50 if she was referring to Sauce it would be Kishi contradicting himself.

[TouKen4Life3g]

The thing is that we all could misinterpret his intentions until the ending. Not saying this chapter only but for many things. Don't worry, NS is straightforward. That said this could apply to NH, especially as of late. Now, SS could feel the same.

[咲耶姫]

wait why don't we ask the translators at mangareader or mangastream? I'm guessing they have the raws themselves otherwise they wouldn't be able to translate and re-upload them

I'm gonna quote what 六道仙人 said yesterday about that: 

they use a raw japanese of course. They have a their own raw provider (with payments of course). Of course they wouldn't share their raws with web for 2 reasons at least: 1)they need to protect the status of thei raw provider 2)it's just a their netiquette. We must to respect their choices. If they don't want to share their jap raw, it's fine. We should consider us as lucky people if each week we can read earlier the chapters.

Edited by 咲耶姫, 10 May 2014 - 03:36 AM.

[Gojira]

Fair enough.

so since there is atleast 4 different translations which one are we going with for now until the raw comes out in god knows how long

[narusaku256]

Be that as it may, Ino has only been shown in the series to have feelings for Sasuke. Not Shikamaru or Choji, so it's not illogical to direct that general statement towards the feelings she has for Sasuke.

image

 
 

 
Yep. But I wasn't arguing whether or not the love is positive or negative.
 

That wasn't directed to you but NS256. Admiration or not, the sincerity of their love is real and just because I loathe Hinata doesn't mean it will cloud my judgement into questioning whether her love is fake and not genuine. Your argument is valid. But like I said, until it's been addressed in the manga instead of outside the manga, I'm going to tread carefully.

Even I despise Hinata. IMO, her love is something like its not a crush but its not true love either. Its something between that. Something like 'Admiration disguised as love'. You can deduce what she really feels for Naruto from the words she speaks. Its always 'I' for Hinata. Its kinda sad on her part but she doesn't take Naruto's feelings under consideration. But, I agree more with you on your last sentence, 'Until its been addressed in the manga instead of outside the manga, I am going to tread carefully'. As far as Ino and Sasuke is concerned, I have no clue about that now. What Asuma said has really put me into doubt!

 

It's pretty funny when all considered that the most worked up ones are NH/SS yet we just like "Oh the Heat game is on." It's like they need one edge to win but always backfire. Though to be fair, SS got the worst among both of them. It feels like that trip is "You lose" situation because well, where is she?

As one pointed out here, now we're in main event: NS vs. SS. NS is being like Daniel Bryan, fighting two matches of his life yet overcoming all odds. The latter is the toughest of them all especially coming back not yet recovered completely. We won that battle. Now here we are. Want to know the sad part? If Sakura keeps the same feeling, it's a no contest. Not a win, a no freaking contest. Sasuke isn't changing. Sakura isn't talking to him without resorting to be about "what is your plan?!" This is as obvious as it can get. Good god, can it get any worse than this for SS? Something tells me I just jinx it. You know what? I'm not sorry.

So, we're closing in to victory. Hell, we can argue now but let's just have NS moment to say, "See? You lose." I don't get it. Did people forgot 662 and up ordeal? I don't care if it's in the past, even though it's barely, that stuff isn't made for fun. Why? Because you can do many ways than what we have and you all know that. I hope people in here didnt forget. Please people.

So to end this, I ask all of you: what are we doing?

NS is sure closing in to victory. What's more interesting is to see how things unfold! Endless possibilities yet it can turn out to be the one which no one can anticipate. Much like 675. 

 

How did this spark a "Is Hinata's love real" speculation/convo/debate? :?

 

...

 

Anyway, about Kakashi's whole Sakura thing, what I'm getting from that it is Sakura doesn't want to lose someone important to her. Hence Kakashi saying she's a "kind" girl. Not so much that she still likes him likes him

That's the main gist of Kakashi's words. SS fans don't seem to understand that. The blow is too hard for them to digest. I must admit though I get irritated by their twisting and turning but its really tough to admit that the ship they have supported has sunk. I can't help but think sometimes 'What if it was NS over here?'.

 

If you say SS because you see the word "like"... I'm sorry for you

 

Oh they seem just fine and not as obliging... besides, we gotta worry about ourselves, a lot of fans here don't seem like fans recently. 

Were you referring to our discussion/debate, whatever you may call?