31746 replies to this topic

[luffyq1]

Happy ending within life or after life, it doesn't matter. In the 'end' that was depicted in the manga Obito was happy.

Jiraiya went to Pein on his own accord. Tsunade stopped him. But let's blame the woman because she wasn't stopping him 'enough'

With your logic, Naruto also got a happy ending. He got what he wanted since he loved Hinata all along. But I don't think you really believe that.

lol i can't believe he actually blamed tsunade for jiraiya's death lol.

[Change]

Oh, and I forgot to say: I also saw a grown man running like Naruto.

Ew

[NarutoUzumaki01]

You're not making any sense. Obito is not happy because only we readers could see? Huh? Obito's spirit was shown to live a happily ever after with Rin. I don't know how else you can twist that. Are you saying that only a physical manifestation of thy's self can be happy and not the spirit?

Jiraiya doesn't think Tsunade sent him on a suicide mission so you cannot talk about Jiraiya's feelings based on how YOU feel. Jiraiya loved her, and he thought it an honor to protect the woman he loves and her village. If he is happy with that, he is happy.
I'll stick to the canon facts. And I don't consider the LAST as canon.

1. Obito's ending. I mean death, is not something that could be considered "happy ending" for any character, does it? Not taking anything that was shown after that, than it's same "techincal" happy ending as others, by canon, that Sakura got.

2. Again, dying isn't something that coudl be described as "happy ending" does it?

3. That's a hard part, because The Last is "canon" by Kishimoto's words. By manga - 2 last chapter is complete clusterkitten of whole story, and judgidng OOC characters are not a good idea.

 

lol i can't believe he actually blamed tsunade for jiraiya's death lol.

You can't read, or smth? 

[sushi.]

Oh, and I forgot to say: I also saw a grown man running like Naruto.

 

 

What's the argument is "what he wanted"? 

Sakura wanted Sasuke, so she got him.

Ino wanted Sai or Sasuke, she got Sai.

Double standards.

Ah... what's my point. Talking about "sexism" in Kishimoto's writing, and mentioning only girls feelings and their issues, doesn't do much good. If their feelings, became major or even whole object of their characters, on other hand - not even single men in a service got justice in this part of their character at all. That's all. Not trying to justify Obito's doings or blaming Tsunade. 

 

You sound like an MRA. The boys weren't treated fairly either, but you don't need to be sexist to be cruel to your characters. You can write two characters as horribly, and only be sexist to one because sexism is a social structure that doesn't affect everyone the same way, and not an incident/act/opinion. Anyway, I'm just sayin that word is not to be thrown around. :/

Edited by sushi., 01 March 2015 - 11:29 PM.

[NaruSaku fan in Kentucky]

If part 3 comes on my birthday then Kishi hates me.

[Khaleesi]

Ew

EWS.

 

1. Obito's ending. I mean death, is not something that could be considered "happy ending" for any character, does it? Not taking anything that was shown after that, than it's same "techincal" happy ending as others, by canon, that Sakura got.

2. Again, dying isn't something that coudl be described as "happy ending" does it?

3. That's a hard part, because The Last is "canon" by Kishimoto's words. By manga - 2 last chapter is complete clusterkitten of whole story, and judgidng OOC characters are not a good idea.

 

You can't read, or smth? 

1. It was a happy ending because all he wanted was Rin, by the canon manga. What Sakura got doesn't fit with the character we've seen for all these years, that's why that final it is "technical", Naruto's and Sasuke's finals as well. To be a "happy ending" for the character it needs to follow certain line.
2. Who are you to say that? Isn't that your subjective opinion? Don't you think there are people who will be happy by dying?
3. It's just canon by wors, it's not canon by story.

And I thought Luffy was refering to Naruto Uzumaki, the character, not you.

 

 

YES. Like that, I said it out loud and my friends laughed. I can't believe what I saw, omg.

[TouKen4Life3g]

What's new?

[NarutoUzumaki01]

 

You sound like an MRA. The boys weren't treated fairly either, but you don't need to be sexist to be cruel to your characters. You can write two characters as horribly, and only be sexist to one because sexism is a social structure that doesn't affect everyone the same way, and not an incident/act/opinion.

Lol, I need to google that "MRA" to know what's that  ,

I just pointed that out, because Luffy tend to use that "sexism" in one way, when it clearly wasn't.

[Nar123]

 

Eh... happy ending, after live is something that no one else apart of reader would see. Obito was happy? Okay. Died after ~15 years of suffering. And went into oblivion with a ghost of his beloved one, not really "definition" of "happy end".
Tsunade could stop him but didn't, that's a plot issue, but hey! Living 50 years and loving one women that didn't even once answeread it and dying on mission, can't in generaly considered as happy ending. 
By canon, Naruto - idiot, and I doubt that even his "true luv" after genjutsu can be considered anything around that red herring we read about Naruto's feelings to Sakura for 15 years. But that's Kishimoto's writing.
Because that's not an argument? I'm not blaming Tsunade for sending him in there. Read my message again 

LOL you are blaming Tsunade for sending and not stopping him from going
The mission was important and the idea to send someone there was from Jiraya, it was their only lead on the akatsuki leader after all , jiraya was the only one suited for it and even so tsunade wanted him to take reinforcements , I dont really know what are you trying to point out here since the fact that jiraya died is his fault only is obvious for any reader.

Obviously Tsunade is blaming herself , but i really dont know in which way she could help if he refused reinforcements

Edited by Nar123, 01 March 2015 - 11:38 PM.

[NarutoUzumaki01]

1. It was a happy ending because all he wanted was Rin, by the canon manga. What Sakura got doesn't fit with the character we've seen for all these years, that's why that final it is "technical", Naruto's and Sasuke's finals as well. To be a "happy ending" for the character it needs to follow certain line.

2. Who are you to say that? Isn't that your subjective opinion? Don't you think there are people who will be happy by dying?
3. It's just canon by wors, it's not canon by story.

And I thought Luffy was refering to Naruto Uzumaki, the character, not you.

 

 

YES. Like that, I said it out loud and my friends laughed. I can't believe what I saw, omg.

1. ok 

2. I doubt that Jiraiya was willing to die. He was just happy, that he at least, died for something worthy enough, not happy to die as samurai's by their bushido.

3. Wors?

 

LOL you are blaming Tsunade for sending and not stopping him rom going
The mission was important and the idea to send someone there was from Jiraya, it was their only lead on the akatsuki leader after all , jiraya was the only one suited for it and even so tsunade wanted him to take reinforcements , I dont really know what are you trying to point out here since the fact that jiraya died is his only blame is obvious for any reader.

Obviously Tsunade is blaming herself , but i really dont know in which way she could help if he refused reinforcements

For f**cks sake, I already wrote that, it was plot moment, and I'm not judging Tsunade for anything. Character's can't go against authors will on their own.

I can only assume that by her character, she feel bad for his death, that all. 

So, what's ya problem apart of not reading my message correctly?

 

What's new?

Nothing at all.

Edited by NarutoUzumaki01, 01 March 2015 - 11:41 PM.

[Nar123]

 

1. ok 

2. I doubt that Jiraiya was willing to die. He was just happy, that he at least, died for something worthy enough, not happy to die as samurai's by their bushido.

3. Wors?

 

For f**cks sake, I already wrote that, it was plot moment, and I'm not judging Tsunade for anything. Character's can't go against authors will on their own.

I can only assume that by her character, she feeled bad for his death, that all. 

So, what's ya problem apart of not reading my message correctly?

 

I'm sorry but maybe you didn't write your message correctly since not only me but several forum members are interpreting that you are blaming Tsunade for Jiraya's death

 

Let me highlight it

 

 

I'm being pragmatic. lol. Obito didn't even know if there will be anything. So enough about what he wanted afterlife.

Techniacaly she is to blame, but that's not the subject. That's another intresting thing, Obito too died with a smile on a face...

So literally, Jiraiya not only didn't succed in a love (even moving on), but he even was sent by his beloved one on that suicide mission (clearly, he could reject it, but that's not what Jiraiya was able to do as a man). So... that's picture him as someone who coudn't move on from his first love, and didn't god happy end.

Now that you saying it, Naruto's feelings was dismised to nothing, talking about sexism and picturing love, surely will not do even a little good thing in terms of boys in this manga, lol.

 

 

Yep, canon-vise, now, Naruto never loved her (15 years of fillers, lol) and Lee stayed single (?) that means, not moved on.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Eh... happy ending, after live is something that no one else apart of reader would see. Obito was happy? Okay. Died after ~15 years of suffering. And went into oblivion with a ghost of his beloved one, not really "definition" of "happy end".

Tsunade could stop him but didn't, that's a plot issue, but hey! Living 50 years and loving one women that didn't even once answeread it and dying on mission, can't in generaly considered as happy ending. 

By canon, Naruto - idiot, and I doubt that even his "true luv" after genjutsu can be considered anything around that red herring we read about Naruto's feelings to Sakura for 15 years. But that's Kishimoto's writing.

Because that's not an argument? I'm not blaming Tsunade for sending him in there. Read my message again  

 

Edited by Nar123, 01 March 2015 - 11:44 PM.

[luffyq1]

Lol, I need to google that "MRA" to know what's that  ,

I just pointed that out, because Luffy tend to use that "sexism" in one way, when it clearly wasn't.

i said the men's feelings were ignored, nice of you to ignore that. sexism goes both ways in this series, but it's more apparent with the women. what woman isn't allowed to leave their abusive love? what woman thought of nothing but love since part 2? don't answer, it's a rhetorical question. 

Edited by luffyq1, 01 March 2015 - 11:47 PM.

[Khaleesi]

1. ok 

2. I doubt that Jiraiya was willing to die.

3. Wors?

2. I've pointed that death doesn't necessarily means sad ending for the character itself. You don't need to "desire it" to not be a sad ending for the character. Maybe Jiraiya's intention wasn't to die that day, but if he did it with a smile in his face, who are we to say anything about it? It may be sad for the people who loved him, but he died in peace.
3. Words, lmao. I often type in darkness and I make typos a lot because of that.

[TouKen4Life3g]

I see. Well, here's my LAP for anyone who's interested.

http://sparda3g.tumb...pter-3-pairings

Next one is coming tonight.

[Khaleesi]

 

PERSONAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA. I haven't watch the anime. Do you play the games? Lmao.

[Narufan85]

Real Talk: I have no problem with Sakura bashing at this point. Just like I have no problem with Naruto bashing. Or Hinata bashing. Or every single character post 693 bashing. They're all awful.

 

 

 

 

What's the argument is "what he wanted"? 

Sakura wanted Sasuke, so she got him.

Ino wanted Sai or Sasuke, she got Sai.

Double standards.

Ah... what's my point. Talking about "sexism" in Kishimoto's writing, and mentioning only girls feelings and their issues, doesn't do much good. If their feelings, became major or even whole object of their characters, on other hand - not even single men in a service got justice in this part of their character at all. That's all. Not trying to justify Obito's doings or blaming Tsunade. 

 

My Men's Rights Spidey Sense is going off...

[ramenanmitsu]

1. Obito's ending. I mean death, is not something that could be considered "happy ending" for any character, does it? Not taking anything that was shown after that, than it's same "techincal" happy ending as others, by canon, that Sakura got.
2. Again, dying isn't something that coudl be described as "happy ending" does it?
3. That's a hard part, because The Last is "canon" by Kishimoto's words. By manga - 2 last chapter is complete clusterkitten of whole story, and judgidng OOC characters are not a good idea.
 
You can't read, or smth? 

1. and 2. So if a character dies they're not happy? Then every single character-except for Hidan-aren't happy because they will all die.

Tell me. What is your biggest reason for declaring a character isn't happy?
Is it because they died? Or is it because they said so? Or is it your subjective opinion?

Unless I understand the reason of your claim this debate will be meaningless.

3. If a movie contradicts the manga then it's natural to take the manga facts > movie.
Going by the manga facts, nobody got what they really wanted in the end.

[Narufan85]

I see. Well, here's my LAP for anyone who's interested.

http://sparda3g.tumb...pter-3-pairings

Next one is coming tonight.

 

Your LAP has been pretty awesome/

[Nar123]

PERSONAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA. I haven't watch the anime. Do you play the games? Lmao.

 

I do indeed! I played Persona 2 ( Innocent sin), 3 and 4

 The Persona 5 game had its trailer finally announced and it promises to be so awesome    , I just can't handle the hype 

 

 

I see. Well, here's my LAP for anyone who's interested.

http://sparda3g.tumb...pter-3-pairings

Next one is coming tonight.

 

 

Your LAP has been pretty awesome/

 

Indeed NS4L

Your LAPS just have been getting better and better, this pairing one was awesome and exactly on point

Edited by Nar123, 01 March 2015 - 11:54 PM.

[NarutoUzumaki01]

i said the men's feelings were ignored, nice of you to ignore that. sexism goes both ways in this series, but it's more apparent with the women, especially since hinata and sakura are the poster child for this mistreatment. 

And you said it how many time? Oh yes, one time after I pointed that you ignored it every time when mention sexism 

 

I'm sorry but maybe you didn't write your message correctly since not only me but several forum members are interpreting that you are blaming Tsunade for Jiraya's death

 

Let me highlight it

Alright, guess it's my bad. Tsunade indeed sent him of, technicaly, but all of us saw that it was Jiraiya's suggestion, and he only came to Tsunade to confirm it.

And I didn't wrote that as blaming her, that was suicide mission for anyone, who would try it, guess I just didn't wrote that good enough.