814 replies to this topic

[swagosaurus]

at any rate, whether he knew she lied or not, he was going to kill her nonetheless.

She's a part of Konoha. She's one of his enemies now. You can't get around that.

I don't even know what we're debating. Sasuke literally does not care about Sakura. Maybe enough to want to kill her, but that's it.

Edited by swagosaurus, 21 December 2012 - 11:18 PM.

[AzureWaters]

at any rate, whether he knew she lied or not, he was going to kill her nonetheless.

She's a part of Konoha. She's one of his enemies now. You can't get around that.

I don't even know what we're debating. Sasuke literally does not care about Sakura.

What are you talking about? I think we all understand he was going to kill her twice.

[Poison_In_Your_Coffee]

Sakura is an extremely bad liar, I must say. He saw through it immediately. lol

And Sasuke is massively insecure. Just watch him being baffled every time someone claims to love him or does something kind towards him. When Naruto arrives a few chapters later Sasuke is like "why the hell do you like me?!". Or maybe he's a realist: a wanted criminal isn't exactly a catch.

[swagosaurus]

And Sasuke is massively insecure. Just watch him being baffled every time someone claims to love him or does something kind towards him. When Naruto arrives a few chapters later Sasuke is like "why the hell do you like me?!". Or maybe he's a realist: a wanted criminal isn't exactly a catch.

Baffled="You're annoying."? lolwat

Edited by swagosaurus, 21 December 2012 - 11:23 PM.

[Zatheko]

This has gone way off topic haha, no one is even talking about chapter 614 anymore.

[Poison_In_Your_Coffee]

Baffled="You're annoying."? lolwat

He doesn't get why anyone would like him and doesn't ever seem convinced that Naruto would really consider him a friend. Hence his continuing questions about why Naruto is still running after him.

Also, the "you're annoying" part 2 and knocking her our when Sasuke leaves are about the best thing Sasuke has ever done to Sakura. It was his jerk way of telling her that she was better off without him and thanks for everything, anyway.

Edit. Well, if you want something on-topic, I'm still sad about Neji.

Edited by Poison_In_Your_Coffee, 21 December 2012 - 11:27 PM.

[swagosaurus]

Neji shouldn't have died. I'm so rustled.

Naruto should have rolled out of the way or something >_>

Oh, and it might seem like beating a dead horse, but I recently read the mangapanda translation; Sakura actually did dodge the needle. The action was a 'skip', as in, she skipped out of the way and Kakashi grabbed her.

Edited by swagosaurus, 21 December 2012 - 11:30 PM.

[Poison_In_Your_Coffee]

Oh, and it might seem like beating a dead horse, but I recently read the mangapanda translation; Sakura actually did dodge the needle. The action was a 'skip', as in, she skipped out of the way and Kakashi grabbed her.

I read it as Sakura pushing Kakashi out of the way and because of that making the "uwah" sound (or some sound like that). Kakashi just seems so lifeless that I think Sakura pushing him out of the way fits better. Hard to say from one panel, though.

[Chucky-kun]

Ok, back to 614, dat parallel of Neji/Obito Naruto/Kakashi Hinata/Rin Are you saying that Naruto is going to kill HINATA??? YES YES YES! And Neji's not actually dead? but is being trained to become the next bringer of despair? OH MY GOD YES!

Anyways, Do you guys honestly see Hinata ANYWHERE near the final confrontation between Sasuke and Naruto?
Sasuke: So I see you're finally here, and who is that weirdo next to you?
Naruto: Uhm this is Hinata......
Sasuke: wheres Sakura?
Cue awkward moments.

[PhenixElite]

Neji shouldn't have died. I'm so rustled.

Naruto should have rolled out of the way or something >_>

Oh, and it might seem like beating a dead horse, but I recently read the mangapanda translation; Sakura actually did dodge the needle. The action was a 'skip', as in, she skipped out of the way and Kakashi grabbed her.

Hahaha pls not that scene again, or we have 10 pages again only debating about that one pic

@chucky-kun: In some kind i would like to see that because it would be sooo unfitting that i would burst in tears of laughing

Edited by PhenixElite, 21 December 2012 - 11:37 PM.

[swagosaurus]

Ok, back to 614, dat parallel of Neji/Obito Naruto/Kakashi Hinata/Rin Are you saying that Naruto is going to kill HINATA??? YES YES YES! And Neji's not actually dead? but is being trained to become the next bringer of despair? OH MY GOD YES!

Anyways, Do you guys honestly see Hinata ANYWHERE near the final confrontation between Sasuke and Naruto?
Sasuke: So I see you're finally here, and who is that weirdo next to you?
Naruto: Uhm this is Hinata......
Sasuke: wheres Sakura?
Cue awkward moments.

that moment when hinata kills sasuke.

oh wait, she's a side character

[Poison_In_Your_Coffee]

Anyways, Do you guys honestly see Hinata ANYWHERE near the final confrontation between Sasuke and Naruto?

Nope. Which is pretty much why I think that NH ship has to get resolved sooner rather than later. Maybe even in the next few chapters. Hinata can't really tag along to meet Sasuke.

Edited by Poison_In_Your_Coffee, 21 December 2012 - 11:44 PM.

[Zatheko]

Ok, back to 614, dat parallel of Neji/Obito Naruto/Kakashi Hinata/Rin Are you saying that Naruto is going to kill HINATA??? YES YES YES! And Neji's not actually dead? but is being trained to become the next bringer of despair? OH MY GOD YES!

Anyways, Do you guys honestly see Hinata ANYWHERE near the final confrontation between Sasuke and Naruto?
Sasuke: So I see you're finally here, and who is that weirdo next to you?
Naruto: Uhm this is Hinata......
Sasuke: wheres Sakura?
Cue awkward moments.

Oh god haha I would die laughing if that happened!

[xxRomanceGirlxx]

I truly hate SasuSaku. If I had only two choices of which pairing would happen between NH and SS (No NS, no "No pairings" option), I would chose NaruHina in a heartbeat (And I really dislike NH, mostly because lack of development and Hinata's obsession). It's just IMO, such a terrible pairing choice for an ending. Maybe I wouldn't mind as much if SS wasn't one-sided and Sakura wasn't so restrained around him (In other words, not really herself) but Kishi didn't write it like that. It constantly makes her depressed and meek. That is not my second favorite Naruto character. Naruto respects her and would do absolutely anything for her. I want that for her. A happy relationship with someone who actually cares. Sakura's been implied to have feelings for him so it's not like it's crazy talk. They deserve each other. At one point, I was bit more open in possibly letting go of my SS predjudice but Kage Summit hit and that literally strikes me as impossible now. I despise SasuSaku and I will never accept it as an appropriate canon relationship. Nor will I even believe it "makes sense". It doesn't. Really never did tbh.

NaruHina I hate a lot less because it's not nearly as negative as SS. And at least Naruto & Hinata are on friendship terms. They get along alright, I guess. I just don't really care for Hinata at all unless she develops past "Naruto-kun, Naruto-kun". It's like she has almost no purpose other than being a Naruto fangirl. She just doesn't care about much about anything else ... and it doesn't make any sense either. Naruto has shown zero feelings for her so why would just spring up this late in the series? It makes all the long, enduring development of NaruSaku pointless. It's just not good storytelling. I doubt I'll ever really like NaruHina but I might try and be a bit more open to it if it actually happens. But nothing will convince me it makes complete logical sense and it was obvious from the beginning. Absolutely nothing.

On topic of the Kage Summit, I strongly disagree that Sakura was actually considering killing Karin. She wasn't. Sakura's way too high moralled and kind-hearted to consider cold, blood murder. I'm horrifed that anyone would even suggest that. Yeah, she was extremely rattled by seeing Sasuke again and slightly unsure but it was never about not killing him. She was just to brace herself and work up the strength to kill him. That's why she was hesitant. And gotta say, I give Sakura a lot of credit for getting as close as she did to stabbing him. About an inch more and she would have literally back-stabbed him. For someone who loves Sasuke, that took a lot of strength.

Sakura's reasons for killing Sasuke were the following:

1). Sasuke was an international criminal. And international criminals need to get put down for the sake of the village.
2). Sakura wanted to handle the burden her teammates always weighed on them. She felt like she didn't do enough like them so this was her way of making up for it.
3). Naruto always focused so heavily on bringing him back, so much so that he easily disregarded everything around him. Even his own life. Sakura was trying to protect Naruto from killing himself by returning Sasuke. She feared that so she felt it was neccessary, even if he hated her for it. She bluntly told him that in her confession. I doubt she was lying over that detail, especially given how angry she looked when she said it.
4). Sakura gave up on Sasuke and no longer believed he could be saved. It pained her but all the odds supported it. So she went to kill Sasuke herself by freeing him from darkness because she loves him. Before he sunk any lower than he already was.

Edited by xxRomanceGirlxx, 21 December 2012 - 11:48 PM.

[swagosaurus]

Here's a question: are Hinata's feelings for Naruto a strength or a weakness? Also this ^

Edited by swagosaurus, 21 December 2012 - 11:49 PM.

[redragon88]

@Poison_In_Your_Coffee

I understand how it confuses you as to how Sakura can be established as to being completely over Sasuke. As for scenarios there can be many different ones but if it's meant to happen then it's up to Kishi to decided how it's gonna go down. The only thing we can do is believe it might or not might happen based on how the relationships have progressed during the course of the manga.

Also, I agree that it will be a guarantee that some people will not be satisfied in how Sakura could get over Sasuke, but you have to remember that everyone has a different opinion. For anything and everything there are people that will like and dislike, we can't take it upon ourselves to convince every single person to share our point of view. We'll have to accept that some people will not be satisfied with how some elements of Naruto are developed and concluded.

And as for Sakura's confusion and why does she still has it despite Sakura's darkness, I already explained to you that the best way to portray Sakura finally loving Naruto is to show that she would prefer him over any kind of ideal Sasuke that she wished for. Besides, Sakura loves the Sasuke that can be good, she's sad for what he's become, just like Naruto. That's why I can't accept the reason for Sakura getting over Sasuke being that he's evil. Naruto still considers Sasuke a friend despite everything, so Sakura should still care for him as well.

I can't imagine what kind of scenario Kishi has in mind to make Sakura finally love Naruto, but from what I've seen during the course of the manga this is the only conclusion that makes sense to me. We have:

- Naruto's selfless love for Sakura
- Sakura slowly going from hating him to slowly appreciating him more and more to the point that is implied she might feel something special for him
- We have the parallel tragedies of Jiraiya/Tsunade, Obito/Rin, Minato/Kushina (we already know why they're similar so i won't go into it)
1 - Obito was never able to confess to Rin, so Naruto should have the chance to do so with Sakura
2 - Jiraiya died before Tsunade could return his feelings, so Naruto should live to see Sakura finally return his feelings
3 - Minato and Kushina died without the chance for raising a family, so Naruto and Sakura should have the chance to do so
- Kushina herself tells Naruto to find someone like her and we all know that Sakura is the first person that come to mind when most people think about it
- Despite the girls feelings we never see any build up from Naruto or Sasuke that might imply they could fall in love with them, yet Sakura's relationship with Naruto is the very definition of that build up.

If NS doesn't happen then from my point of view it would feel very strange. Imagine if Naruto suddenly says that he's not interested in making Sasuke change, and he decided to get everyone to help him apprehend Sasuke in order to lock him up. That would make complete sense realistically, but it would go against the message that the manga is trying to convey about not giving up in the face of adversity. Not to mention that it would contradict all of the build up during the manga that has Naruto as the one that will help Sasuke see the light.

To me the build up towards Sakura loving Naruto is not any different from the build up of Naruto saving Sasuke. In my perspective they are both meant to happen given how the manga has chosen to develop.

Edited by redragon88, 21 December 2012 - 11:59 PM.

[Poison_In_Your_Coffee]

Here's a question: are Hinata's feelings for Naruto a strength or a weakness? Also this ^

For her, they are a strength. Naruto gave her inspiration and confidence. If Naruto remains her only source of them, however, they will become a weakness. She can't depend just on someone else. She would have to find some inspiration and confidence in herself. I hope Kishi might make her the one to say something inspiring and comforting to Naruto at some point. It would be a nice change and show that Hinata can be confident even without Naruto as her cheerleader. I can't really see her feelings as a weakness. Her lack of confidence is a weakness that has prevented her from doing things in the past.

[xxRomanceGirlxx]

Here's a question: are Hinata's feelings for Naruto a strength or a weakness? Also this ^

I feel it's both. Hinata's feelings Naruto were initially very much a strength. It caused her to become more confident in herself and not run away, no matter what. Her admiration caused her to become more stubborn and determined. Even after she lost against Neji, she felt better and no longer hated herself. She tried and it gave her hope she could try again and next time succede. In Part 1, it was a very obvious strength. She could have easily directed that strength by building more self confidence into her destined heiress role and her status as a kunoichi overall.

Then Part Two happened. Now this is when her feelings for Naruto really became more of a weakness than a strength. She became a lot more obsessive over him than before (Funny because she used to stalk him lol) and sees being more important than anything else in the world. This is exactly why Hinata isn't developing. She's so Naruto-centric now, it's hard to even remember her other goals anymore. There hasn't been one mentioning of them. Only " This time, I'll hold your hand and walk with you. Naruto-kun, wait for me!" What else is there to her character now besides Naruto? Hate to say it but Hinata more layers in Part 1. Or, at least more potential. Hinata did develop a bit. She's a lot more confident than she used to be and is no longer studdering. The fact that she confessed and now wants to be with Naruto shows this. But it's really much more a libability now than it used to be.

That's my take on it.

[Chatte]

Here's a question: are Hinata's feelings for Naruto a strength or a weakness? Also this ^

She sees them as strength, I see them as weakness.
She's all naruto, Naruto, Naruto that doesn't think at the environement, consequences, stuff like that.

[Poison_In_Your_Coffee]

And as for Sakura's confusion and why does she still has it despite Sakura's darkness, I already explained to you that the best way to portray Sakura finally loving Naruto is to show that she would prefer him over any kind of ideal Sasuke that she wished for.

This is sort of it for me. I just can't see how Kishi plans to do that, which makes me consider that he might not plan to do it at all. Of course, my lack of imagination does not mean that Kishi lacks it, too.

Besides, Sakura loves the Sasuke that can be good, she's sad for what he's become, just like Naruto. That's why I can't accept the reason for Sakura getting over Sasuke being that he's evil. Naruto still considers Sasuke a friend despite everything, so Sakura should still care for him as well.

Does it ever bother you that so many people (well, Itachi, Naruto and Kakashi, anyway) in the series express this unconditional love for Sasuke? I mean does it bother you as a NS shipper, do you see it as a massive block for your pairing? Because I kind of do. If Itachi loves Sasuke no matter what, if Naruto can forgive everything Sasuke has done, why not Sakura, too? If Itachi's and Naruto's brotherly bonds with Sasuke can last forever, why not also Sakura's romantic bond? "Unconditional love for Sasuke" could be the subtitle to Naruto.

Imagine if Naruto suddenly says that he's not interested in making Sasuke change, and he decided to get everyone to help him apprehend Sasuke in order to lock him up. That would make complete sense realistically, but it would go against the message that the manga is trying to convey about not giving up in the face of adversity. Not to mention that it would contradict all of the build up during the manga that has Naruto as the one that will help Sasuke see the light.

To me the build up towards Sakura loving Naruto is not any different from the build up of Naruto saving Sasuke. In my perspective they are both meant to happen given how the manga has chosen to develop.

For me, the difference is in the scale. Rescuing Sasuke is a massive storyline. We all know how much pagetime it has in the series. Romance and NS bond is much more subtle and a smaller affair. Rescuing Sasuke is like Naruto's number one goal in life for most of the series. Even before Sasuke leaves, NaruSasu bond is a huge part of the series. NaruSasu bond is like the emotional core of the series. Naruto giving up on the number one thing in his life (and in his comic) would be like the Bible ending to Jesus's crucifixion and skipping the resurrection (It's Christmas time, people, I had to mention him).

She sees them as strength, I see them as weakness.
She's all naruto, Naruto, Naruto that doesn't think at the environement, consequences, stuff like that.

But what negative things have her feelings for Naruto lead to? She did almost die for them, but in a willing sacrifice.

Edited by Poison_In_Your_Coffee, 22 December 2012 - 12:21 AM.