8493 replies to this topic

[Codus N]

It's possible of course that because it's only a limited genjutsu, that explains Madara/Obito's limited control over it, but as Namaenash pointed out, the injuries remaining over into the real world suggest that it is more than just a genjutsu (Kakashi did not have any injuries after Itachi's Tsukiyomi - none of the sword stab wounds, nor did any of Naruto's wounds from Itachi's genjutsu carry over when they face him in part 2 on the way to the sand).

Especially since we know now that Kamui accesses another dimension -- so perhaps maybe Madara/Obito dumped them in another dimension entirely to without meaning to -- or he created another universe entirely with the eye that took on a life of its own after its creation.

Yes, he does say clearly that its a limited moons eye plan genjutsu, but what is said is different from what is shown. AU!Sakura interacted with characters in the real universe physically - how can an illusion loose memories and hug real people? How would Naruto and Sakura's injuries remain when they fade back to their real world? Those two facts especially contradict it just being a normal genjutsu - idk, it could just be plot holes. Or it could be that this genjutsu is so much more powerful that it can do things normal genjutsu (even Tsukiyomi) cannot.

I've actually theorized several months ago that the limited Tsukuyomi could very well be a mix of Ninjutsu & Genjutsu (NinGenjutsu). Limited Tsukuyomi is essentially a mix of Kamui & and Mugen Tsukuyomi. And not only that, Madara recently revealed that the only way he could use the Genjutsu is with the Mazou. So Obito would have to constantly be connected to the Mazou to maintain the jutsu.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Let me make you hate me even more --Click here to view--

Lol. That's right, Sakura was very fierce and did a good job as a heroine --fighting alongside the hero and keep him in the line. Both made an equally good contribution that you can safely say, without Sakura, Naruto would never be able to survive and vice versa. The so called speech fits into the situation and it was nicely done. It brings Naruto back to the fact that they dont really belong to this place -- that, plus a flashback of the real Minato when Naruto first met him in manga canon.

Speaking of the AU universe. It's difficult to conclude whether Naruto and Sakura were trapped in genjutsu (it was only in their mind), or they were 'transported' to another universe (the universe physically exists). My personal opinion leaning towards the later -- that the AU physically exists. Madara keep mentioning that he created the universe, but he cant fully control it. I think they left it there for the audience to have their own idea.

Some of the facts that the AU physically exists:

- After the final battle, both Naruto and Sakura were back in Konoha to the same exact place they met Madara. There was no significant time difference. Naruto was still wearing the hokage robe Sakura gave him. Their body was also battered with scratches and all those --which was a proof that they physically fought and get injured. After a while, Sakura pointed out that the robe began fading away. The whole scene from farewell with AU Minato & AU Kushina was very touching. This scene (where the robe slowly fading away), gives a deeper meaning and symbolism in my opinion. It's difficult for me to describe, sorry, but the whole Naruto's speech was very touching. Oh, and every now and then we see Kishi shifted the focus from Naruto to Sakura, as if trying to say that Sakura is indeed THE witness of Naruto's journey (as a comparison, you can think of the chapter where Sakura learns from Chiyo that if Bijuu is removed from Jinchuuriki, the host will die). They can exclude that portion and the story would still flow, but the fact that they include it almost in every important scenes (e.g. when Naruto first met his AU Parent, when Kushina hugged Naruto, when Naruto bid farewell, etc) gives you an impression that shifting focus to Sakura is intentional. Then again, it's difficult to be unbiased

- The filler 'Road to Sakura' also supports that the AU does physically exist. AU Sakura was present in Konoha with literally everyone else interacting with her.

Timing wise... --Click here to view--

... is not necessarily before the scene. But I think it is reasonably comparable. It doesn't take a genius to see the parallel intention

Ok, now I do hate you more. Lol. Amazing. It's no doubt that they needed each other to get out of AU! Now I can see why people really have second thought on the pairing because of this movie. I still one blogger who is neutral in terms of pairing didn't think Kishi would go this far to show NaruSaku and she was wrong about certain ones like SasuSaku, NaruHina, and even LeeSaku. It's amazing how much effect Kishi has done to the people. If he were to show this movie all over the world, I think people would have second thought right now. As of now, we only gain haters, but more believers. Thank you for sharing and glad that you had a great time. I think this place will be pack with new gifs, sig, and avatars, once the movie is out.

As for thinking whether the world is real or not, I guess it's up to us to leave to our imagination. I wouldn't think so hard about it, but perhaps when the movie is released on DVD, I would see what I can get out of it. Until then, just let it be our imagination. Other than that, great posts everyone.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

I've actually theorized several months ago that the limited Tsukuyomi could very well be a mix of Ninjutsu & Genjutsu (NinGenjutsu). Limited Tsukuyomi is essentially a mix of Kamui & and Mugen Tsukuyomi. And not only that, Madara recently revealed that the only way he could use the Genjutsu is with the Mazou. So Obito would have to constantly be connected to the Mazou to maintain the jutsu.

No it's not tsukyomi is a mere genjutsu but a strong one that can alter the perception of time of the target.

[Paptala]

I've actually theorized several months ago that the limited Tsukuyomi could very well be a mix of Ninjutsu & Genjutsu (NinGenjutsu). Limited Tsukuyomi is essentially a mix of Kamui & and Mugen Tsukuyomi. And not only that, Madara recently revealed that the only way he could use the Genjutsu is with the Mazou. So Obito would have to constantly be connected to the Mazou to maintain the jutsu.

That's very interesting - definitely sounds plausible.

Ok, now I do hate you more. Lol. Amazing. It's no doubt that they needed each other to get out of AU! Now I can see why people really have second thought on the pairing because of this movie. I still one blogger who is neutral in terms of pairing didn't think Kishi would go this far to show NaruSaku and she was wrong about certain ones like SasuSaku, NaruHina, and even LeeSaku. It's amazing how much effect Kishi has done to the people. If he were to show this movie all over the world, I think people would have second thought right now. As of now, we only gain haters, but more believers. Thank you for sharing and glad that you had a great time. I think this place will be pack with new gifs, sig, and avatars, once the movie is out.

As for thinking whether the world is real or not, I guess it's up to us to leave to our imagination. I wouldn't think so hard about it, but perhaps when the movie is released on DVD, I would see what I can get out of it. Until then, just let it be our imagination. Other than that, great posts everyone.

I have to say, it was an incredibly pleasant surprise to see how many people's views on NaruSaku and the canon end pairing were affected by Road to Ninja. I've seen people on at least 2 forums, as well as some people from tumblr and pixiv (that one SasuSaku fan artist) have a change of heart.

Funny how the movie went from seemingly NH and SS fan service to brimming with NaruSaku bonding, development, and shipping moments. Actually, it kind of sounds pretty similar to what's going on in the manga now...

I wonder if it will have any sort of equivalent impact once its released on DVD over here?

[TouKen4Life3g]

I have to say, it was an incredibly pleasant surprise to see how many people's views on NaruSaku and the canon end pairing were affected by Road to Ninja. I've seen people on at least 2 forums, as well as some people from tumblr and pixiv (that one SasuSaku fan artist) have a change of heart.

Funny how the movie went from seemingly NH and SS fan service to brimming with NaruSaku bonding, development, and shipping moments. Actually, it kind of sounds pretty similar to what's going on in the manga now...

I wonder if it will have any sort of equivalent impact once its released on DVD over here?

Lol, an evil Paptala. I like it.

If you ask me, that's been happening that way for a while. Chuunin exam was the first one to do that. We got tidbits of NS as the manga progress, but it would seem Sasuke and Hinata has the bigger focus. Then, we get to the end, and what do we get: Sakura learning that Naruto is the one that saves her, smiling at him; Naruto shows the world that he cares for her deeply and place her in his heart as one of main bonds (next to Sasuke, Kakashi, and Iruka); Sasuke continues to push Sakura and finds Naruto as a person that will be stronger than him; lastly, Hinata just got her development in the middle of the arc and that was it. The main one that got that treatment is Pain Invasion arc. Enough said.

We are on a roll, aren't we?

[PhenixElite]

Lol, an evil Paptala. I like it.

If you ask me, that's been happening that way for a while. Chuunin exam was the first one to do that. We got tidbits of NS as the manga progress, but it would seem Sasuke and Hinata has the bigger focus. Then, we get to the end, and what do we get: Sakura learning that Naruto is the one that saves her, smiling at him; Naruto shows the world that he cares for her deeply and place her in his heart as one of main bonds (next to Sasuke, Kakashi, and Iruka); Sasuke continues to push Sakura and finds Naruto as a person that will be stronger than him; lastly, Hinata just got her development in the middle of the arc and that was it. The main one that got that treatment is Pain Invasion arc. Enough said.

We are on a roll, aren't we?

Your right never recognized that!!!
Really every arc ends with a NS moment. During the buildup it often seems like its going in a SS or NH direction, but the end is always the same.
Same thing with the movie! Why is kishi trolling so hard?

[TouKen4Life3g]

Your right never recognized that!!!
Really every arc ends with a NS moment. During the buildup it often seems like its going in a SS or NH direction, but the end is always the same.
Same thing with the movie! Why is kishi trolling so hard?

Yeah, I started to realize that since the movie was out. When I retraced back the manga, it has been like that for a while. Even in the Kage Summit Arc. People would assume that Sakura was really going to join Sasuke or Sasuke will actually show some kindness to her. Nope, it only open the wound and put salt on it. People thought Naruto was over with her because of her "lies." Quite the opposite. He was sadden that she too given up and willing to make him hate her forever, thus destroying Team 7 completely. Luckily, he did the epic bridal save and even made Sakura happy with hopes for a reunion and happy to see him no longer hold so many burden (when he fell asleep). So yeah, don't be surprised if it happens again.

Why he trolls? No clue. Revenge?

Edited by NaruSaku4Life3g, 23 October 2012 - 07:20 AM.

[PhenixElite]

Yeah, I started to realize that since the movie was out. When I retraced back the manga, it has been like that for a while. Even in the Kage Summit Arc. People would assume that Sakura was really going to join Sasuke or Sasuke will actually show some kindness to her. Nope, it only open the wound and put salt on it. People thought Naruto was over with her because of her "lies." Quite the opposite. He was sadden that she too given up and willing to make him hate her forever, thus destroying Team 7 completely. Luckily, he did the epic bridal save and even made Sakura happy with hopes for a reunion and happy to see him no longer hold so many burden (when he fell asleep). So yeah, don't be surprised if it happens again.

Why he trolls? No clue. Revenge?

Well also not to forget the great parallel with kushina after the summit.

We got the chunin exam, the sasuke leaving arc, the sasuke bring back arc, the gaara rescue arc, the heaven and earth bridgd arc, the immortal arc, the pain arc, the summit, all ending with NS and now the current arc already got the same buildup. Only difference: during the hinata developmet they release a pure NS movie.

Im sure the current arc is also going to end with NS like all the others before.

Edited by PhenixElite, 23 October 2012 - 08:03 AM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Well also not to forget the great parallel with kushina after the summit.

We got the chunin exam, the sasuke leaving arc, the sasuke bring back arc, the gaara rescue arc, the heaven and earth bridgd arc, the immortal arc, the pain arc, the summit, all ending with NS and now the current arc already got the same buildup. Only difference: during the hinata developmet they release a pue NS movie.

Im sure the current arc is also going to end with NS loke all the others before.

Time was against us in this arc. Now that we waited for over 2 years, it's time to shine.

Edited by NaruSaku4Life3g, 23 October 2012 - 08:04 AM.

[PhenixElite]

Time was against us in this arc. Now that we waited for over 2 years, it's time to shine.

Well said!
Thats how it is.

[Torxe]

Don't know if this has been posted already, but thought I'd share:

spoiler --Click here to view--

Edited by Torxe, 23 October 2012 - 12:51 PM.

[Paptala]

Lol, an evil Paptala. I like it.

If you ask me, that's been happening that way for a while. Chuunin exam was the first one to do that. We got tidbits of NS as the manga progress, but it would seem Sasuke and Hinata has the bigger focus. Then, we get to the end, and what do we get: Sakura learning that Naruto is the one that saves her, smiling at him; Naruto shows the world that he cares for her deeply and place her in his heart as one of main bonds (next to Sasuke, Kakashi, and Iruka); Sasuke continues to push Sakura and finds Naruto as a person that will be stronger than him; lastly, Hinata just got her development in the middle of the arc and that was it. The main one that got that treatment is Pain Invasion arc. Enough said.

We are on a roll, aren't we?

Time was against us in this arc. Now that we waited for over 2 years, it's time to shine.

This is actually a very good point - many of the arcs do end on a strong NaruSaku note, as does the entire first part of the series. Given that pattern, this is just one more thing to add to Kishi's writing style that increases the likelihood of NaruSaku becoming canon/having another NaruSaku moment soon.

Tying it back into the movie, it just goes to show that Kishi is really reflecting the same characterization and messages here as he is trying to go for in the manga. This includes how much he actually favors the NaruSaku bond over others, and how he goes out of his way to show non-platonic feelings on both sides, and have plenty of other characters commenting on how their relationship is perceived by outsiders.

Don't know if this has been posted already, but thought I'd share:

spoiler --Click here to view--

We've seen it, but it's always great to find these things and watch them again - thanks for sharing!

Edited by Paptala, 23 October 2012 - 02:19 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

This is actually a very good point - many of the arcs do end on a strong NaruSaku note, as does the entire first part of the series. Given that pattern, this is just one more thing to add to Kishi's writing style that increases the likelihood of NaruSaku becoming canon/having another NaruSaku moment soon.

Tying it back into the movie, it just goes to show that Kishi is really reflecting the same characterization and messages here as he is trying to go for in the manga. This includes how much he actually favors the NaruSaku bond over others, and how he goes out of his way to show non-platonic feelings on both sides, and have plenty of other characters commenting on how their relationship is perceived by outsiders.

Exactly. I think he once said that this movie is throwing everything he has in mind in terms of fanservices, his intentions, and of course, the story of parental love. Again, he could have only Naruto going to genjutsu and Sakura could have been AU! Sakura. Simple as that. But no, he decided to go with them to expose many things, hence the fans' misinterpretation. Also, Naruto's love for Sakura is exposed in this movie in couple of times, so I guess this is Kishi's way of letting us remember that Naruto is Naruto. Again, the date request at the end wasn't needed at all, but Kishi did it to give us an idea that NaruSaku can happen, but we have to read the manga to find out. Basically, it's like an advertisement to newcomers and I applaud to that. I really can't wait for this movie.

[Paptala]

Exactly. I think he once said that this movie is throwing everything he has in mind in terms of fanservices, his intentions, and of course, the story of parental love. Again, he could have only Naruto going to genjutsu and Sakura could have been AU! Sakura. Simple as that. But no, he decided to go with them to expose many things, hence the fans' misinterpretation. Also, Naruto's love for Sakura is exposed in this movie in couple of times, so I guess this is Kishi's way of letting us remember that Naruto is Naruto. Again, the date request at the end wasn't needed at all, but Kishi did it to give us an idea that NaruSaku can happen, but we have to read the manga to find out. Basically, it's like an advertisement to newcomers and I applaud to that. I really can't wait for this movie.

Exactly - I think that's what hits me too. Kishi did not have to make Sakura come along for the ride with Naruto - he could have had Naruto go through the experience alone. But instead, he did bring Sakura along into this genjutsu, and he gave her a crucial role in the movie - she was the reason Naruto decided that he needed to go back to reality. Its possible that he would ave eventually came to the same conclusion that this Minato and Kushina were not his parents, but who knows how long that would have taken or if it would not have happened at all.

Also, it shows how important Sakura is to Naruto as well, and vice versa. Naruto chose Sakura over the fantasy of being with his parents, a fantasy that gave him "everything he wanted". Sakura chose Naruto's happiness over her own.

It's just an incredibly excellent showcase of Naruto and Sakura's bond, and I still can't get over the fact that Kishi focused on it as much as he did for the one movie that he has a major hand in. It just goes to show that Kishi does consider this a relationship that it important to him, arguably in the realm of importance as Sasuke and Naruto's relationship (given that that relationship for once took a back seat to Naruto and Sakura's completely).

[TouKen4Life3g]

Exactly - I think that's what hits me too. Kishi did not have to make Sakura come along for the ride with Naruto - he could have had Naruto go through the experience alone. But instead, he did bring Sakura along into this genjutsu, and he gave her a crucial role in the movie - she was the reason Naruto decided that he needed to go back to reality. Its possible that he would ave eventually came to the same conclusion that this Minato and Kushina were not his parents, but who knows how long that would have taken or if it would not have happened at all.

Also, it shows how important Sakura is to Naruto as well, and vice versa. Naruto chose Sakura over the fantasy of being with his parents, a fantasy that gave him "everything he wanted". Sakura chose Naruto's happiness over her own.

It's just an incredibly excellent showcase of Naruto and Sakura's bond, and I still can't get over the fact that Kishi focused on it as much as he did for the one movie that he has a major hand in. It just goes to show that Kishi does consider this a relationship that it important to him, arguably in the realm of importance as Sasuke and Naruto's relationship (given that that relationship for once took a back seat to Naruto and Sakura's completely).

This.

I agree with you about the whole thing. Let's not forget the fact Sakura protected Naruto from Menma/Madara. So it goes to show how much they need each other to overcome the odds. This movie makes me happy and wish for Kishi to do another movie for next year. We'll see in the upcoming months. We are on a roll here.

[Codus N]

Apparently, a member here named swagosaurus "stole" my idea about the Limited Tsukuyomi being a mix of Kamui & Tsukuyomi.

http://www.fanfictio...525/1/Tsukuyomi

Of course, I don't have any particular beef with him and am glad someone agrees with me . And besides, he put his own spin into it.

Just wanted to share this fic worth mentioning.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Apparently, a member here named swagosaurus "stole" my idea about the Limited Tsukuyomi being a mix of Kamui & Tsukuyomi.

http://www.fanfictio...525/1/Tsukuyomi

Of course, I don't have any particular beef with him and am glad someone agrees with me . And besides, he put his own spin into it.

Just wanted to share this fic worth mentioning.

You snooze, you lose.

Just kidding. Thanks for sharing with us.

[Don-kun]

Exactly - I think that's what hits me too. Kishi did not have to make Sakura come along for the ride with Naruto - he could have had Naruto go through the experience alone. But instead, he did bring Sakura along into this genjutsu, and he gave her a crucial role in the movie - she was the reason Naruto decided that he needed to go back to reality. Its possible that he would ave eventually came to the same conclusion that this Minato and Kushina were not his parents, but who knows how long that would have taken or if it would not have happened at all.

Also, it shows how important Sakura is to Naruto as well, and vice versa. Naruto chose Sakura over the fantasy of being with his parents, a fantasy that gave him "everything he wanted". Sakura chose Naruto's happiness over her own.

It's just an incredibly excellent showcase of Naruto and Sakura's bond, and I still can't get over the fact that Kishi focused on it as much as he did for the one movie that he has a major hand in. It just goes to show that Kishi does consider this a relationship that it important to him, arguably in the realm of importance as Sasuke and Naruto's relationship (given that that relationship for once took a back seat to Naruto and Sakura's completely).

Hey stop it you are making me
I completely agree with your post Paptala I think that the day Kishi stop throwing curves balls and finally come straight, most fans will finally understand why Kishi focus so much on the NS bond and the moment he had a change to show the readers which heterosexual bond he liked most, we saw that it was the Naruto and Sakura bond. It's also Natural to see it that way since Naruto is the character he choose as the main character and the person he made Naruto fall in love with was Sakura.

Also I want to tell you that I went back to the debate threads from 09, 10, 11 until this date and your post along with Kakugo's and some other NS fans that are currently away from the forums were great and are the same view you people have these days.

Thanks for the good reads.

Edited by Don-kun, 26 October 2012 - 01:46 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Hey stop it you are making me
I completely agree with your post Paptala I think that the day Kishi stop throwing curves balls and finally come straight, most fans will finally understand why Kishi focus so much on the NS bond and the moment he had a change to show the readers which heterosexual bond he liked most, we saw that it was the Naruto and Sakura bond. It's also Natural to see it that way since Naruto is the character he choose as the main character and the person he made Naruto fall in love with was Sakura.

Also I want to tell you that I went back to the debate threads from 09, 10, 11 until this date and your post along with Kakugo's and some other NS fans that are currently away from the forums were great and are the same view you people have these days.

Thanks for the good reads.

Couldn't agree more. It's as this movie is to address the audience that you don't believe she's a heroine or don't believe she and Naruto got strong connection, think again. The fact that they will be loss without each other shows how much they mean to each other and yet, Kishi managed to escape it by not letting them think over and realized how much he means to her a lot. Naruto already knows this, but I think he was sidetracked by the love of his parents. Thankfully, whatever she said got him back to reality. Curses, we got to wait for another 6 months. You did check other review who saw this movie too, right?

[swagosaurus]

Apparently, a member here named swagosaurus "stole" my idea about the Limited Tsukuyomi being a mix of Kamui & Tsukuyomi.

http://www.fanfictio...525/1/Tsukuyomi

Of course, I don't have any particular beef with him and am glad someone agrees with me . And besides, he put his own spin into it.

Just wanted to share this fic worth mentioning.

My sincerest apologies if I unknowingly hijacked your idea. D:!