9679 replies to this topic

[Fenris]

1. I see no point in being here if your not a fan.

Well all people are allowed here nevertheless...

Edited by iamfenris, 21 October 2011 - 06:54 PM.

[Anguyen92]

1. I see no point in being here if your not a fan. just come out and say your NH fan. stop fukkin about.

Ehhh, its all right. We let anyone here as long as they act in a cordial manner. Besides, do you want this thread to be somewhat dead, until the next moment happens? At least, we can try to somewhat rejuvenate on the reasons why we like the pairing in the first place, but making reasonable points to those with questions.

Edited by Anguyen92, 21 October 2011 - 06:51 PM.

[Fenris]

Ehhh, its all right. We let anyone here as long as they act in a cordial manner. Besides, do you want this thread to be somewhat dead, until the next moment happens? At least, we can try to somewhat rejuvenate on the reasons why we like the pairing in the first place, but making reasonable points to those with questions.

I agree. I think it's cool that we have someone on the other side to debate with, sort of like a war, as much as we disagree, or agree, or so on.

[Living Lavish]

Ehhh, its all right. We let anyone here as long as they act in a cordial manner. Besides, do you want this thread to be somewhat dead, until the next moment happens? At least, we can try to somewhat rejuvenate on the reasons why we like the pairing in the first place, but making reasonable points to those with questions.

Well mybe not NH fan but i think he just a supporter in NS some way

[LegendaryArcanine42]

Well mybe not NH fan but i think he just a supporter in NS some way

And now to reply to 1... 2... 3... EVERYBODY O.O

@merryGOflava Kishimoto is famed for bad writing, and it wouldn't surprise me if he did change direction in his own "spectacular" way... but it isn't too late in the game, Naruto isn't over yet... Who knows, Kishi might pull off another arc or another timeskip that's dedicated to the relationships of the Naruto Characters.

We could call it the pairing arc or something like that, and maybe Kishimoto could throw in another enemy that wants to mess up Naruto's Clan Restoration Act or something, I don't know DX

@iamfenris Sakura does not love Naruto, yet... Naruto says so himself after her confession... I don't wanna say that anyone's opinion is Null and Void, but...

@TheOmegaMan I know that I abuse the "Kishi's the writer" argument, but that's what it ultimately boils down too, there have been many theories in Naruto and what happens? Kishimoto pulls out all the stops to be COMPLETELY different, kinda like his step-brother Tite Kubo.

Also, I apologize if I come across as sardonic or condescending, I honestly don't mean to be... But I will inject my own piteous humour into my counter-argument to make it more entertaining, because that's my style

@LivingLavish My good man, how many times must I tell you... I AM NOT A NARUHINA FAN!!! I'm defending NaruHina because no one else seems too, I actually support NaruSaku and write stories about them, but I like to vary and keep an open mind, which is why I'm debating, to hear your views

I never once said that Naruto didn't love Sakura, but I'm saying that NaruSaku isn't canon because Naruto loves Sakura but it doesn't mention ANYWHERE that Sakura loves Naruto...

And you might need to read my post again... Because I never said you didn't understand he concept of the story, I was talking about the concept of a Story Writer trolling his fans...

Furthermore, the manga has not been stated as over yet, we could go into another arc! Kishimoto might wanna milk the cash cow some more, so these aren't the "final" stages yet (GOT MILK)...

And my comments fail, why? Is it because I'm breaking the fourth wall?

I'm not even arguing for NH anymore, I'm arguing for the fact that NaruSaku isn't canon until Kishi says so and if you honestly think otherwise then you sir...

ARE THE ONE THAT FAILS!!! (No animosity meant, but he's saying I fail and is being really aggressive now...).

But I'll be the first to admit, that I can be a complete prick sometimes

[Don-kun]

My view on the Big 3

I really do not understand why people persist with Sasuke when Naruto is the most obvious choice.
I really have to start ignoring some comments.

they say Sakura love him and Sasuke deep, deep, deep down care for her
So because Sakura is "the only" female that he's been shown to care for, it automatically means he's going to end up in a relationship with her?

They do realize that it's entirely possible for Sasuke to end up with nobody in the end.

Not only that, but Sasuke actually showed much more care for Karin (he actually verbally acknowledged the fact that Karin saved him, he expressed clear concern for her, asking her if she was okay, and never insulted her to her face, as he did with Sakura.). We all know how that turned out.

Sasuke has never shown any romantic feelings for Sakura before, even when their relationship was at its peak (sometime during the chuunin exam and the Konoha farewell). So Sasuke falling in love with/having hidden romantic feelings for Sakura now, after he tried to kill her multiple times, would be completely and horribly out of character for him.

NaruSaku, on the other hand, has multiple hints throughout the entire manga, especially in part two, that Sakura's feelings for Naruto go beyond friendship. Sakura falling in love with Naruto, or having unrealized romantic feelings for him now wouldn't be out of the blue or out of character for her at all.

So not only does it make the more sense story wise, Naruto and Sakura have laughed together, cried together, bickered, and bantered together. They have seen each other at their worst and at their best. They've proven after the events of the summit that even a rather serious argument won't prevent them from trying to protect each other.

Hinata loves Naruto but he doesn’t love her. It’s obvious to see that he cares about her and respects her but I don’t see it ever changing into love the way. Why in the world would Naruto just say “Oh after all this time I just realized I loved Hinata”. It makes no sense and would be extremely poor writing. Love needs development and as much as one could argue, there is no real romantic development between the two. And just because she confessed he wont automatically love her back. If someone came up to you and confessed when you loved someone else, u wouldn’t automatically jump in there bed. If he decides that he’ll never have Sakura than I can see him getting to know Hinata better but I don’t see how that is an automatic “oh he‘ll love her”. Naruto may decide he has no romantic feelings for her and then it’s done. Hinata seems to have already done all she can and if Naruto still doesnt love her back then there is not point to still pursue him.

No offense, NS,>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> NH have a greater chance than the>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> SS.
I think they are exaggerating the taste of a 12 year old girl that felt love for a boy. the same Kishimoto said it was a selfish and childish love,(and why 12 years girl and not the Sakura we know right now, because they have not lived together at this age to compare it) and yes, most of the SS engages only Sakura's feelings but not the Uchiha feelings, he himself never felt love for Sakura, never saw her as a woman, for that, yes yes Sakura wants to save Sasuke that is pure love, but if she does the same for Naruto Sakura is strictly platonic best friends -.-, I swore that the best friends were Sasuke and Naruto and Sakura and Ino.

Between SS and NS: NaruSaku is by far a better ending for this manga.

Edited by donjoseph19, 21 October 2011 - 08:04 PM.

[Phantom_999]

>Implying that I'm a NaruHina fan...

But I'm going to defend them just this once (although I don't believe that NaruHina will be canon)

There are moments (canon and non-canon) where Kishimoto hints to the fact that NaruHina could be canon, for example Hinata's fight against Pain (in which Naruto shows genuine concern for her, but that's not enough to go on...).

However, the NaruSaku moments in Naruto don't seem to be flooding in either, the point I'm making is that although both girls have "confessed" there isn't enough evidence to state which one Naruto will end up with... There's only baseless assumptions and opinions that are flying around...

What's stopping Naruto from ending up with both girls, or Temari... or even Gaara?

My point exactly... Kishimoto can do what he wants! He could set up LeeSaku just from what happened in the Chuunin Exam Arc. He could set up GaaraTemari on the basis that IncestFTW, and "Kishimoto makes a point narratively" is irrelevant at this point...

Have you not seen the amount of contradictions there are in Naruto? Do I even need to mention them?

I swear, there are more contradictions in one chapter of Naruto than there are in the entirety of the Bible. True chiz bro...

And have you seen the amount of NaruSasu shippers there are? If Kishimoto gives into public pressure then NaruSasu will no longer be a genjutsu... it will be a KINJUTSU!!! ZOMGWTFEPIC!!!

So then, still think that NaruSaku is canon or even certain to be? I agree that it's the most likely thing to happen... but you know what they say about predictable storytelling? IT DOES NOT HAPPEN OUTSIDE OF FAIRY TAIL!!! I mean... FAIRY TALES!!!

>.>

<.<

No one saw that, right?

THEN NH will not happen outside of fairy tales either remember that any anti NaruSaku can be used against NaruHina onehundredfold. YES I KNOW Kishi can always flip the switch and make NH canon cause its his manga and it stresses me out so DON'T bring it up again

Edited by Phantom_999, 21 October 2011 - 08:05 PM.

[LegendaryArcanine42]

THEN NH will not happen outside of fairy tales either remember that YES I KNOW Kishi can always flip the switch and make NH canon cause its his manga and it stresses me out so DON'T bring it up again

Funny that you bring up NH... because I think I've made it clear that I'm not a NaruHina fan multiple times...

And why would Kishi trolling all of us stress you out? NaruSaku would be WAY too expected for the mastermind of all unnecessary plot-twists, that is Masashi Kishimoto!

I still think it'd be canon, because I'm counting on either his predictability or his counter-predictability to make it happen...


SO GET TO WORK KISHI!!!

[Amy-chan]

Funny that you bring up NH... because I think I've made it clear that I'm not a NaruHina fan multiple times...

And why would Kishi trolling all of us stress you out? NaruSaku would be WAY too expected for the mastermind of all unnecessary plot-twists, that is Masashi Kishimoto!

I still think it'd be canon, because I'm counting on either his predictability or his counter-predictability to make it happen...


SO GET TO WORK KISHI!!!

Kishi's trolling can cause alot of stress for alot of NaruSaku fans just like everyday things can cause stress.

[LegendaryArcanine42]

Kishi's trolling can cause alot of stress for alot of NaruSaku fans just like everyday things can cause stress.

Ah, I see... It must be stressful being a NaruSaku fan O.o

And at least you were nice to me about it too, thanks :3

[Darth Krypt]

@Densetsu-Kun
If you want to support something, you'll have to support it with evidence that has appeared in the manga. That is how you debate. You keep using the argument of "Kishi is the writer hence if he wants to, he can make it happen". That is not evidence. That basically is one generalised statement that can be used to "support" anything. The proper way of debating is to cite or quote moments that happened in the manga. That is called evidence. Personal opinions, anecdotes and "it could happen" arguments are not evidence. So if you want to defend NH properly, show us moments between Naruto and Hinata that happened in the manga and analyse it. There's no point in telling us that Kishi is the writer hence he can make NH happen if he wants. The keyword is debate here. I won't even call that speculation since even that use moments that has happened in the manga.

[FoolishYoungling]

Kishi's trolling can cause alot of stress for alot of NaruSaku fans just like everyday things can cause stress.

The biggest troll is going to be when Pikachu comes out of Tobi's mask... just saying

[Fenris]

To make it also clear, Sakura does love Naruto, even if she's not fully aware of it yet. It is plausble for a person to love than one person at once, or be unsure of your feelings for someone but love another. There was evidence of her loving, or liking, or forming a crush on Naru in even Shippuen chapter 1, where she clutched her chest and started blushing about how attractive Naruto had gotten, and how much he matured. But then again, that's just attractiveness. And then she commented on how she'd miss the "old" naruto, but then he pulled out the sexy no jutsu. Then, there was of coure what Sai said to Naruto, and what Sai said to Sakura. There was a lot more incidents too. Too many to name right off the bat.

[LegendaryArcanine42]

@Densetsu-Kun
If you want to support something, you'll have to support it with evidence that has appeared in the manga. That is how you debate. You keep using the argument of "Kishi is the writer hence if he wants to, he can make it happen". That is not evidence. That basically is one generalised statement that can be used to "support" anything. The proper way of debating is to cite or quote moments that happened in the manga. That is called evidence. Personal opinions, anecdotes and "it could happen" arguments are not evidence. So if you want to defend NH properly, show us moments between Naruto and Hinata that happened in the manga and analyse it. There's no point in telling us that Kishi is the writer hence he can make NH happen if he wants. The keyword is debate here. I won't even call that speculation since even that use moments that has happened in the manga.

I'm just really confused here... Did you just skim through the comments and just come to your own conclusion of what just happened?

Hopefully, that didn't sound too rude but I'll digress regardless, I never said that I was giving evidence or debating anything of the sort, I'm just disproving quotations of the manga being solid evidence for anything...

The manga may say this and that, but anything can change, I know that this is a flimsy counter-argument and that there are many flaws with it but it's the ultimate truth and you cannot change the fact that Kishimoto IS the writer and he CAN change the pairing into anything he wants... Any of the NaruHina moments within the anime/manga alike could be used as the basis of the pairing.

And I also realize that this may not be the proper format of debating, but this is still a point that must be brought up and it is still a rebuttal to what you are saying... No matter what anyone quotes, no matter how many hints there are or implications that have been implied, we can never know for sure where this manga is going. Besides, the mindset of a writer and educated guesswork is more of a philosophical counter-argument, and as with many things in life, we find that Philosophy always seems to be correct.

So saying that "It could happen..." is just as credible a counter-argument as "The manga says, therefore we should assume this...", assumptions are just educated wrong answers, btw...

[FoolishYoungling]

To make it also clear, Sakura does love Naruto, even if she's not fully aware of it yet. It is plausble for a person to love than one person at once, or be unsure of your feelings for someone but love another. There was evidence of her loving, or liking, or forming a crush on Naru in even Shippuen chapter 1, where she clutched her chest and started blushing about how attractive Naruto had gotten, and how much he matured. But then again, that's just attractiveness. And then she commented on how she'd miss the "old" naruto, but then he pulled out the sexy no jutsu. Then, there was of coure what Sai said to Naruto, and what Sai said to Sakura. There was a lot more incidents too. Too many to name right off the bat.

Sakura loves Naruto I must say aswell, but the only way NS has a chance is for Naruto to just swoop Sakura off her feet and surpise her (maybe)! You think he can't surpise her? Then you must not know he is the #1 unpridictable ninja!!!

[Amy-chan]

Sakura loves Naruto I must say aswell, but the only way NS has a chance is for Naruto to just swoop Sakura off her feet and surpise her (maybe)! You think he can't surpise her? Then you must not know he is the #1 unpridictable ninja!!!

He's been very predictable in what he's been doing as of late. Just saying.

[LegendaryArcanine42]

Sakura loves Naruto I must say aswell, but the only way NS has a chance is for Naruto to just swoop Sakura off her feet and surpise her (maybe)! You think he can't surpise her? Then you must not know he is the #1 unpridictable ninja!!!

But I must say, that for an unpredictable ninja, that ending would be quite predictable ¬_¬

I was thinking more of a Naruto acts like Prince Charming moment and Sakura punches him away whilst bellowing "Naruto, you idiot! I love you too!"

NaruSaku is awesome because it has endless possibilities :3

[FoolishYoungling]

But I must say, that for an unpredictable ninja, that ending would be quite predictable ¬_¬

I was thinking more of a Naruto acts like Prince Charming moment and Sakura punches him away whilst bellowing "Naruto, you idiot! I love you too!"

NaruSaku is awesome because it has endless possibilities :3

NH seems impossible to me, I mean, how would Naruto be Naruto without Sakura punching him?

Edited by NaruSaku1, 21 October 2011 - 10:02 PM.

[Fenris]

I'm just really confused here... Did you just skim through the comments and just come to your own conclusion of what just happened?

Hopefully, that didn't sound too rude but I'll digress regardless, I never said that I was giving evidence or debating anything of the sort, I'm just disproving quotations of the manga being solid evidence for anything...

The manga may say this and that, but anything can change, I know that this is a flimsy counter-argument and that there are many flaws with it but it's the ultimate truth and you cannot change the fact that Kishimoto IS the writer and he CAN change the pairing into anything he wants... Any of the NaruHina moments within the anime/manga alike could be used as the basis of the pairing.

And I also realize that this may not be the proper format of debating, but this is still a point that must be brought up and it is still a rebuttal to what you are saying... No matter what anyone quotes, no matter how many hints there are or implications that have been implied, we can never know for sure where this manga is going. Besides, the mindset of a writer and educated guesswork is more of a philosophical counter-argument, and as with many things in life, we find that Philosophy always seems to be correct.

So saying that "It could happen..." is just as credible a counter-argument as "The manga says, therefore we should assume this...", assumptions are just educated wrong answers, btw...

Lets take it from a creepy view of things.
Lets say, we have a murder, the evidence, finger prints, and everything else that points us to the suspect or suspects, is right in front of us. Would the police go by what the clear, hard, concrete evidence says to capture the criminal, or would they go by something else and let the case go cold and wait for something to happen that might not even happen to solve their case. They'd go by the concrete evidence. I understand what you're saying that the manga could go either way, but the MANGA, does point to the "concrete evidence" that NS will be the endgame pairing. Sure, Kishi COULD change this at any time, but why after the build up over the past 500 chapters, would be all a waste? Hinata has barely panel time, she's not a high end character, and why ruin all the NS plot development panels for a pairing that hasn't even had well development in the first place. Lets say, NH. Or LS, for example.

I get what you're saying. But your statement on "what the manga says therefor we should-" kind of contradicts its self. The manga is, all in all, a huge red arrow. What else would we go by except the evidence and concrete moments and solid proof - (Sai being another huge red arrow besides the plot development) and why would we go by something else that seems totally unrelated, to saying: "Kishi could change it at anytime."
He could, but it;s not a very good argument. Sure he could, but would he? Doubt it. This isn't a cliche american batman vs superhero comic where things change all the time.

Edited by iamfenris, 21 October 2011 - 10:07 PM.

[LegendaryArcanine42]

NH seems impossible to me, I mean, how would Naruto be Naruto without Sakura punching him?

Whoa whoa whoa! Now let's not get TOO far ahead of ourselves... NaruHina is still possible, but it would be something like this...

Naruto: Hinata, I realize now how special you are to me... When everyone else held me back, you were one of the few that supported me. you might not have realized it but I was watching you whilst you were watching me, secretly hoping that I would give you some of my strength, but my strength comes from people like you, who want me to do well, who want me to succeed, dattebayo!

Hinata: Naruto...

Naruto: Hinata, with each passing day you mean more and more to me... Not just as my friend, but more than that! I love you Hinata! You may not feel the same way, but--

(Hinata kisses Naruto)

Blahblahblah, etc. Y'know something cheesy like that :3