72 replies to this topic

[TheFirstEvil100]

That was a while ago. He never intended to make Taka a thing either, or introduce Naruto's parents.

That is a good point but you know Kishi we have no idea what goes on in his head, we just have to wait and see what he does.

[shisui]

Well I understand now, but it's unfair to not ship something that is from the other love battle, which this case is Sasuke.

How is it unfair? Sasuke's character was never about romance. What's unfair is to pair him off with someone he reacts negative to and who doesn't bring him any benefit. Much like many NaruHina fans who only care about Hinata's feelings while disregarding Naruto, many SasuKarin fans only care about Karin's feelings while disregarding Sasuke's.
 

All I'm saying is people are entitled their own opinions and not all for NS ego boost.

I never said otherwise.

Edited by GoogleIsMyFriend, 11 March 2014 - 10:28 PM.

[TheFirstEvil100]

Much like many NaruHina fans who only care about Hinata's feelings while disregarding Hinata,

 Very true words I mean the reason many want NaruHina to happen is because they want Hinata Happy and that is all. 

[KeikoxYusuke]

But sasuke has shown care for Karin, it's not just her that would be happy, remember that chapter where tobito said Karin was sasuke's favorite?

And his only time of really being harsh to her was his descent into darkness...he overall favors her, other members on team Taka have even complained about this..(to each other, and not in his hearing range)

I like sasukarin because I can see a couple that could happen.

It has nothing to do with Narusaku :/

Forcing another pairing in there seems ...well...forced. :/

[TheFirstEvil100]

All I can say is that we wait we still have no idea what Sasuke will do once this War is over I mean we know that he wants to Kill Naruto and I might be wrong about that as it could have change by now.

[TouKen4Life3g]

How is it unfair? Sasuke's character was never about romance. What's unfair is to pair him off with someone he reacts negative to and who doesn't bring him any benefit. Much like many NaruHina fans who only care about Hinata's feelings while disregarding Hinata, many SasuKarin fans only care about Karin's feelings while disregarding Sasuke's.


I never said otherwise.

In their defense, while you said it's true about Sasuke, they do regard both. Sasuke is like a coin to them because of how ambiguous he is in terms of Karin. You can say it's clear but others not too sure. I can't really explain. I wish someone who is SK shipper will elaborate more for you. I got to go back to work. In the end, to each of their own. No grudges.

[shisui]

But sasuke has shown care for Karin, it's not just her that would be happy, remember that chapter where tobito said Karin was sasuke's favorite?

And his only time of really being harsh to her was his descent into darkness...he overall favors her, other members on team Taka have even complained about this..(to each other, and not in his hearing range)

Obito said one of his chosen. It's about her sensor and medic abilities nothing more. He says this while Karin is giving him chakra, not when they are having a bonding moment. The story framing is clear.

I'd go on about the rest, but I'll since there are too many SK fans in here that won't like what I have to say, I'll leave it like this. Nevertheless, nothing of that counters the issues I brought before.

I like sasukarin because I can see a couple that could happen. It has nothing to do with Narusaku :/

That's nice for you, but that has nothing to do with what I said.
 

In their defense, while you said it's true about Sasuke, they do regard both. Sasuke is like a coin to them because of how ambiguous he is in terms of Karin.

There's nothing ambiguous about Sasuke's reaction in 627, nor about his complete indifference once Taka reached the battlefield.

Edited by GoogleIsMyFriend, 11 March 2014 - 10:35 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Obito said one of his chosen. It's about her sensor and medic abilities nothing more. He says this while Karin is giving him chakra, not when they are having a bonding moment. The story framing is clear.

I'd go on about the rest, but I'll since there are too many SK fans in here that won't like what I have to say, I'll leave it like this. Nevertheless, nothing of that counters the issues I brought before.


That's nice for you, but that has nothing to do with what I said.
 

There's nothing ambiguous about Sasuke's reaction in 627, nor about his complete indifference once Taka reached the battlefield.

I meant before but that's ok.

[Gojira]

Was Karin there when Sasuke was willing to let everyone except him Jugo and Naruto die?

[Nate River]

Obito said one of his chosen. It's about her sensor and medic abilities nothing more. He says this while Karin is giving him chakra, not when they are having a bonding moment. The story framing is clear.

I agree, I don't see how people can look at that and distinguish it from the same kind of care one might show for a useful tool. His subsequent treatment of her verifies this. I see nothing in that scene that would allow anyone to make that kind of distinction.

It's treatment by Kishimoto is horrid and making it happen is almost indefensible.
 
 
 

We can't really do anything about it nor can we change Karin's mind about it. She loves Sasuke unconditionally and we have to accept that. I do. I don't like it, but I do accept that she does.

No we can't, but Kishimoto could give her some self-respect. That'd be a nice change of pace or he could treat the pairing as the tragedy that it is. That is about the only direction in which I can take it seriously and it's not the direction it's going. It's comic fodder.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Was Karin there when Sasuke was willing to let everyone except him Jugo and Naruto die?

No.

[James S Cassidy]

What you're doing there is sideshipping. Since NaruSaku has to happen, then Sasuke needs to be paired off with someone else. You choose Karin because it so happens to be the most convenient for you. However, this pairing off the spares you're doing is in no way, shape or form, supported by canon.

Sasuke is not holding any bridges for Karin to walk on. His reaction to Karin's physical closeness is clear, he doesn't want her anywhere close to him. Yet you accept his negative reaction as something that can change, while you dismiss Naruto's acceptance of Hinata's handhold (no matter how platonic it is, he still reacted to it positively) or Sasuke's mild acceptance of Sakura's physical closeness (no matter how platonic or how weak it is, still positive as well...).

At the end of things, you're guilty of sideshipping. As a NaruSaku fan, you take that pairing for granted, and then you complement it with other things.

However, there's no reason to complement. Sasuke may as well end up dead, alone, with Ino (whom he has never reacted as negativelly as Karin), or the cat lady's grandchild.

It's a story, dude. People need to learn to give up the idea of control in this manga. You also have to look at many situations that are very similar to this in other manga that has couples getting together like this like Tohru and Kyo from Fruits Basket. A coupling I despise, but happened anyway.

The writer can do whatever they want and they can tell the story however they want. If Kishimoto wants SK to happen, then he will. You have to accept the fact that it is the possibility. The manga shows all the focus of these two characters getting together because Kishimoto has set it up that way. Sasuke could have easily left Karin in Orochimaru's place, but he didn't. Sakura could have been the one standing next to Sasuke the whole time, but she is not.

Like I said in the podcast. we need to stop this idea of us keep saying "It is a possibility." Yeah, everything is a possibility, but the real idea is how much chance this possibility has to becoming true and, for the most part, all the evidence of all the manga focus, SK has has high chance of happening just like NS. It has nothing to do with supporting or "liking" said coupling. It has to do with the facts that have occurred through out the manga. Facts are facts regardless of what one "believes."

Chapters 662-663 have been huge moments in the pairing wars. The whole focus of those several chapters was about the girls and the guys they care about. It showed side by side Sakura and Karin doing everything they could for Naruto and Sasuke respectfully. Hinata is seen on the ground and Ino is nowhere to be found. Rock Lee doesn't show up til later and that's it.

People keep telling you that they don't support or like SK, but realize that its possibilities are high. When they tell you this, you keep saying to people "That's doesn't matter, you still support SK for NS sake." You are absolutely mistaken and are jumping to conclusions all because someone wants to be analytical in their research. This thread is not about "what pairings you like most," but "what pairings are likely to happen" and the idea that "Unlike what some claim, no matter what pairing occurs, someone is going to lose."

Well, what you keep saying doesn't matter anyway. You can like or hate SK all you want, but it is Kishimoto's choice and I am willing to accept that choice on the grounds that I have no control over this manga.

PS. No, I didn't "deny" 615 at all. I just don't take it as seriously as other members who scream "It's canon" just because of it. Naruto has always been supportive of Hinata, but then again he has been supportive of all his friends. It would be stupid to assume that Naruto is in love with everyone because he supports them or has "references" to them.

 

 

I'm not misunderstanding anything. I know very well what's been happening here, because I've seen it over and over again. KoHina, KibaHina, NejiHina, SasuIno, SasuKarin. It's all the same, with the latter two being the worse of them all. The NH / SS fandoms are also guilty of this.

You are being double faced about it. Hinata and Sakura's love have been highlighted even more than Karin's, yet none of that stops you from saying NS will be canon. SasuKarin isn't going to happen just because it has shown up lately. SasuIno showed up lately. LeeSaku showed up lately. Hell, NaruHina and SasuSaku showed up lately.
 

No, I am not being double faced about it. Yes, you are misunderstanding everything and putting words in people's mouth and then when you get caught you either say "It doesn't matter" or you try to accuse the other person of being worse.

Remember, you are NOT the only one reading this manga and we can read just fine. You are assuming way too much and then claim us being blind. Should I be like you and say "Wow, you forgot about SasuNaru/NaruIno/SasuKiba/etc. pairing. You are just like every other pairing fanboy who neglects every other possibility cause you support your own. They had moments."

 

I didn't, since I put Karin in there with the others.

 

 
But you did. You called her a "minor character." Why are you backpedaling?

 

If you think anything Karin has done is evidence, then Ino has had plenty of evidence as well. Asuma's last words for Ino were about her not losing to Sakura in love. Her father's last words for Ino also touched upon her feelings for Sasuke. Two people, on their death beds, have spoke about Sasuke to Ino.

Karin and Sasuke have been together since near the beginning of Part 2. We all know about Karin's love with Sasuke and all the moments they have together. We have moments of Sasuke protecting Karin with one moment where he treated her like a tool. We all know it is that one scene with him stabbing her and yadda yadda yadda. We ALSO have the fact that you seem to have forgotten where Sasuke was the only one to APOLOGIZE to Karin and was still willing to be with him despite what he did.

NOW, in chapter 662 to 667 we have Karin doing EVERYTHING in her power to be next Sasuke and try to save him. She tackled the giant wood statue by herself with tears in her eyes that Sasuke was dying.

THESE ARE ALL FACTS. Not made up ideal moments that we wanted to happen.

You want to bring SasuIno? Where was Ino during all this? Why wasn't she the one tackling the giant wooden statue or making her way to Sasuke's location? Hell, HINATA tried to go by Naruto's side before tripping and falling, so there is NO EXCUSE for Ino to not be there for Sasuke as well. How about Sakura being next to Sasuke as well?

You want to point out these "references" and bullcrap like that, yet forget the most important moments that are happening at this VERY MOMENT. Don't you think that if I thought any other pairing was possible I would have mentioned them in more posts? Don't you think that I would have said something? Hell, I did say something about Kiba and Hinata when the alliance showed up to support Naruto's battle with Obito, but you never saw those posts. You assume too effing much that we can outright deny the existence of other couples when really we have mentioned them in several others posts and looked at them just as much realizing that they are NOT the MAIN FOCUS of the manga.

 

Yeah, but neither does Sasuke blush or think about Karin. They're all in the same boat.

 

Oh, are you saying that Sasuke can NEVER love Karin? Now who is ignoring all other possibilities? "The references, man, the references. You are so blind."

Besides, Sakura never blushed around Rock Lee, but has blushed around Naruto. Ino never blushed around Naruto, but has blushed around Sai and Sasuke. Sasuke never blushed around Ino either. Take that as you will.
 

Yeah and NaruHina got a volume cover reference. You're selectively chosing what references count and what references don't count.

 

...............Really? You are going to bring that petty argument? Go listen to the podcasts and you will see that we talked about this extensively. Volume 6 has Naruto, Sakura, Sasuke, and Ino on the cover. It means nothing. We also have characters using weapons on said covers and they never use them either.
 

I have no idea how you're concluding this, when what I've said was that none of them have any chances.

 

I have no idea how you are concluding a lot of things in the posts you have made. So I guess we are even that aspect.

 

"None of them have chances." Then why are you here? Maybe you are just a troll trying to start trouble. Why do you think that one reference trumps an entire mangas worth of development? Have you ever read other manga with pairings or is this your first one?
 

I said so many are sideshipping, I certainly did not say all.

 

And yet, noone is side-shipping, but of course maybe our definition of "side-shipping" is different. I guess you never thought that people have different definitions and take things a little differently.
 

To me, "sideshipping" is when you support or like another shipping possibility as well as your main. Your definition seems to be that anyone who suggest another pairing whether they like it or not is considered sideshipping. I personally see it as this because even neutral fans who have no pairing affiliation can look at comics and think "Oh, this pairing could happen."

You are basically filing people who do not want to be filed or at best just want to give an honest opinion on how things are.

This is where you are going to deny everything I just said or backpedal or try to turn it on me by accusing me of something that I didn't even say or do so why do I even bother replying? Typical responses because you don't understand or refuse to understand our point of view cause you take can't the fact that everyone thinks differently from you. Hey, that's alright. I am just going to say that regardless of whether you do reply or not, I won't because I know now that there is nothing I can say for you to understand.

Agree to disagree, I guess. Just don't accuse me of stuff that I am not even doing. I have talked about other pairings besides the obvious 4 and made analytical posts about them in the past.

I will say this though: You have this stupid double standard that the references can show possibility of a pairing happens, yet references don't mean the pairing can happen. HOWEVER, you keep failing to differentiate the difference between "References" and "main focus."

Watch a Harem sometime. Watch how that set up plays and it is pretty much the same thing with the harem just being the overblown version of it.
 

Edited by James S Cassidy, 12 March 2014 - 01:50 PM.

[Gojira]

So ino's gonna end up with somebody at the end?

 

I guess it makes sense it would be kind of a kitten move for Kishi to have 2 characters last wishes have her be with someone and not end up being with someone. 

[shisui]

I meant before but that's ok.

You sound like a SasuSaku fan ranting about part 1. Stuff happened since the golden days. It happened and there's no way back.
 

Was Karin there when Sasuke was willing to let everyone except him Jugo and Naruto die?

No. She was going to die like everyone else from the alliance.
 

It's comic fodder.

Yes. Last chapter had Karin being angry about the four eyed freak supposedly taking advantage of a knocked out Sasuke, when she's also a four eyed freak who wanted to take advantage of a unconscious Sasuke.
 

It's a story, dude. People need to learn to give up the idea of control in this manga.

Where's the control exactly? I said that SasuKarin's treatment is no different than SasuIno, LeeSaku and all the rest. It's in fact very low on the totem pole compared to NH / SS, let alone NS. That's stating fact, not controlling the manga. What you're doing is attempting to give some depth where there is none. Basically, you're accusing me of the things you're doing.

James S Cassidy: You also have to look at many situations that are very similar to this in other manga that has couples getting together like this like Tohru and Kyo from Fruits Basket. A coupling I despise, but happened anyway.

This is Naruto, not Fruits Basket.

James S Cassidy:The writer can do whatever they want and they can tell the story however they want. If Kishimoto wants SK to happen, then he will. You have to accept the fact that it is the possibility.

Pot calling the kettle black. As it stands, SasuKarin won't happen, and there's no reason to. Yet you're here attempting to make others accept it will happen.

James S Cassidy: The manga shows all the focus of these two characters getting together because Kishimoto has set it up that way. Sasuke could have easily left Karin in Orochimaru's place, but he didn't. Sakura could have been the one standing next to Sasuke the whole time, but she is not.

You sound like a NaruHina fan. Oh Sakura should've been the one throwing herself in front of Pain or giving Naruto hope again in 615, but she was not and he even pointed out Hinata has been by his side all along.

James S Cassidy: Like I said in the podcast. we need to stop this idea of us keep saying "It is a possibility." Yeah, everything is a possibility, but the real idea is how much chance this possibility has to becoming true and for the most part and all the evidence of all the manga focus SK has has high chance of happening just like NS. It has nothing to do with supporting or "liking" said coupling. It has to do with the facts that have occurred through out the manga. Facts are facts regardless of what one "believes."

I'm being talked about in your podcasts? That's fantastic and quite assholeish of you.

Everything is a possibility? Like SasuKarin not happening is a possibility? You forget to acknowledge that then, because you want everyone to accept that it will happen. Like SasuIno and LeeSaku? Oh but you just said before in your replies that such a thing isn't possible. Like SasuSaku and NaruHina happening is a possibility? That's fantastic, I can hardly wait for that acknowledgement then. I'm waiting.

James S Cassidy: Chapters 662-663 have been huge moments in the pairing wars. The whole focus of those several chapters was the girls and the guys they care about. It showed side by side Sakura and Karin doing everything they could for Naruto and Sasuke respectfully. Hinata is scene on the ground and Ino is nowhere to be found. Rock Lee doesn't show up til later and that's it.

What are these huge moments for the pairing wars? Nobody cares but NaruSaku fans. Sakura protecting his dream is something we've seen her do in part 1. This isn't anything new. What it can be is what will happen if she wakes up.

It showed what Karin can do for Sasuke? What did she do exactly? She hasn't done anything.

Two characters being put together in the same panel doesn't mean anything for pairings. I thought we had all learned that lesson in 615. Guess not.

James S Cassidy: Well, what you keep saying doesn't matter anyway. You can like or hate SK all you want, but it is Kishimoto's choice and I am willing to accept that choice on the grounds that I have control over this manga.

That's not your tone when NH / SS fans say the exact same thing. Or if you do accept that you have no control and NH / SS can happen if Kishi said so, I can guarantee you'd still yell asspull and give all the reasons to. Which is exactly what I'm doing.

James S Cassidy: PS. No, I didn't "deny" 615 at all. I just don't take it as seriously as other members who scream "It's canon" just because of it. Naruto has always been supportive of Hinata, but then again he has been supportive of all his friends. It would be stupid to assume that Naruto is in love with everyone because he supports them or has "references" to them.

Guess what, dude. I don't take this bulkitten with Karin seriously either. Especially not when Sasuke doesn't even react positively to her advances.

James S Cassidy: Remember, you are NOT the only one reading this manga and we can read just fine.

That's cool, but neither are you.

James S Cassidy: You are assuming way too much and then claim us being blind.

I didn't accuse you of being blind. I accused of you of double standards. Which you have failed to counter btw.

James S Cassidy: Should I be like you and say "Wow, you forgot about SasuNaru/NaruIno/SasuKiba/etc. pairing. You are just like every other pairing fanboy who neglects every other possibility cause you support your own. They had moments."

Actually, that's not me at all. All those pairings are the same to me, which is nothing. There is no difference between SasuKarin and LeeSaku.

James S Cassidy: But you did. You called her a "minor character." Why are you backpedaling?

But Karin is a minor character.

James S Cassidy: Karin and Sasuke have been together since near the beginning of Part 2.

Yeah and Sakura and Sasuke have been together in part 1. Does it make them canon? Nope. You know why? Because kitten happened and Sasuke's not interested. Much like SasuKarin.

James S Cassidy: We all know about Karin's love with Sasuke and all the moments they have together. We have moments of Sasuke protecting Karin with one moment where he treated her like a tool. We all know it is that one scene with him stabbing her and yadda yadda yadda. We ALSO have the fact that you seem to have forgotten where Sasuke was the only one to APOLOGIZE to Karin and was still willing to be with him despite what he did.

SasuKarin is all about Sasuke only acknowledging Karin's strenghts as a sensor / medi and ignoring or even dissing her at everything else. Plus, all those lovely moments where Sasuke tried to kill her. Sasuke's apology might have been sincere, but it was comic relief.

James S Cassidy: NOW, in chapter 662 to 667 we have Karin doing EVERYTHING in her power to be next Sasuke and try to save him. She tackled the giant wood statue by herself with tears in her eyes that Sasuke was dying. THESE ARE ALL FACTS. Not made up ideal moments that we wanted to happen. You want to bring SasuIno? Where was Ino during all this? Why wasn't she the one tackling the giant wooden statue or making her way to Sasuke's location? Hell, HINATA tried to go by Naruto's side before tripping and falling, so there is NO EXCUSE for Ino to not be there for Sasuke as well. How about Sakura being next to Sasuke as well?

Karin accomplished as much as Ino and Hinata, which is nothing.

James S Cassidy: You want to point out these "references" and bullcrap like that, yet forget the most important moments that are happening at this VERY MOMENT. Don't you think that if I thought any other pairing was possible I would have mentioned them in more posts? Don't you think that I would have said something? Hell, I did say something about Kiba and Hinata when the alliance showed up to support Naruto's battle with Obito, but you never saw those posts. You assume too effing much that we can outright deny the existence of other couples when really we have mentioned them in several others posts and looked at them just as much realizing that they are NOT the MAIN FOCUS of the manga.

I'm not speaking of you. I'm speaking of in general. If it doesn't fit you, then let go of the bone.

James S Cassidy: Oh, are you saying that Sasuke can NEVER love Karin? Now who is ignoring all other possibilities? "The references, man, the references. You are so blind."

Are you prepared to accept Naruto can love Hinata or that Sasuke can love Sakura as possibilities then? I very much doubt that.

James S Cassidy: Besides, Sakura never blushed around Rock Lee, but has blushed around Naruto. Ino never blushed around Naruto, but has blushed around Sai and Sasuke. Sasuke never blushed around Ino either. Take that as you will.

Why are you even speaking about NaruIno, I have no idea. Hinata blushed around Naruto and Sakura blushed around Sasuke. That doesn't make those pairings canon. Come to think of it, has Karin blushed around Sasuke? I am fully confident he never blushed around. This blushing argument is hillarious.

James S Cassidy: ...............Really? You are going to bring that petty argument? Go listen to the podcasts and you will see that we talked about this extensively. Volume 6 has Naruto, Sakura, Sasuke, and Ino on the cover. It means nothing. We also have characters using weapons on said covers and they never use them either.

Thanks, but no thanks. I won't go listen to podcasts who trash talk other people.

James S Cassidy: "None of them have chances." Then why are you here? Maybe you are just a troll trying to start trouble. Why do you think that one reference trumps and entire mangas worth of development? Have you ever read other manga with pairings or is this your first one?

I said SasuKarin has no chances, much like the rest of the pairings. I didn't say NaruSaku had no chances. Last time I checked this was narusaku.com, not narusaku&sideship.com.

James S Cassidy: And yet, noone is side-shipping, but of course maybe our definition of "side-shipping" is different. I guess you never thought that people have different definitions and take things a little differently. To me, "sideshipping" is when you support or like another shipping possibility as well as your main. Your definition seems to be that anyone who suggest another pairing whether they like it or not is considered sideshipping. I personally see it as this because even neutral fans who have no pairing affiliation can look at comics and think "Oh, this pairing could happen."

So you don't fit your own definition of sideshipping, but you fit mine. Why should I conform to your definition when you refuse to conform to the widely accepted one?

James S Cassidy: This is where you are going to deny everything I just said or backpedal or try to turn it on me by accusing me of something that I didn't even say or do so why do I even bother replying?

You're right, I've cut most of your rants against me in this post, because I don't care about that. What I'm here to talk about is SasuKarin and how it's the antithesis of everything NaruSaku is and how insulting defending it is like.

James S Cassidy: I will say this though: You have this stupid double standard that the references can show possibility of a pairing happens, yet reference don't mean the pairing can happen. HOWEVER, you keep failing to differentiate the difference between "References" and "main focus."

NaruHina was main focus in 615. Guess what, it still won't happen.

James S Cassidy: Watch a Harem sometime. Watch how that set up plays and it is pretty much the same thing with the harem just being the overblown version of it.

But Naruto isn't an harem manga.
 

So ino's gonna end up with somebody at the end?

I guess it makes sense it would be kind of a kitten move for Kishi to have 2 characters last wishes have her be with someone and not end up being with someone.

SasuIno actually has a possibility due to this, plus because Sasuke remembered Ino along with the same importance as Sakura and Naruto. That's more than it can be said about Karin, whom he never thought about on his own.

Still, I am of the opinion Sasuke is just not going to end up with anyone. There is no reason to. It's not part of his character.

Edited by GoogleIsMyFriend, 12 March 2014 - 08:52 AM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

I wasn't trying to be rude. Sorry if I did come across that way.

[Phantom_999]

Well if this topic is about how some feelings will be unrequited, don't you mean losing "person"?

[James S Cassidy]

Here is the million dollar question.

What is the difference between ignoring a possibility due to a biased look on selective favoritism...and...analyzing said possibilities ranging from extensive research, looking at facts, deductive reasoning, and coming to a conclusion or hypothesis that maybe one side could be tipped in the favor of one and not the other?

 

[shisui]

Here is the million dollar question.

What is the difference between ignoring a possibility due to a biased look on selective favoritism...and...analyzing said possibilities ranging from extensive research, looking at facts, deductive reasoning, and coming to a conclusion or hypothesis that maybe one side could be tipped in the favor of one and not the other?

Yes, you're a master of logic and deductive reasoning. On the other hand, I'm a total dumbass who cannot put two and two together. If you couldn't tell, that's sarcasm.

I've laid out why SK has no chances and you did not give me any reasons against what I've said. This attempt to gauge my intelligence is not the point of this thread nor the argument we were having.

Edited by GoogleIsMyFriend, 12 March 2014 - 08:13 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Hey, come on. Let's not trying to start a fight in here.

[luffyq1]

Hey, come on. Let's not trying to start a fight in here.