19964 replies to this topic

[Gravenimage]

dovakim@ you sig is epic

[Hiraishin]

Hey guys. I don't know what we're currently talking about here, so I guess you can ignore this if you want, but I found a post by a SasuSaku shipper and wanted to know your thoughts on it.

Idk why people want Sakura to ‘get over Sasuke’ at this point in the manga now. I mean if she still loves the guy 600 chapters later I’m pretty sure that’s never going to change, and why should it? This late in the game, her feelings changing would just seem so… sad. I always thought that her feelings for Sasuke were the best part of her, that after all this time and everything he’s done, it’s amazing she can still be capable of loving him. For her to give up now… Idk it would just be incredibly sad. It’s why I think she won’t ever stop loving this kid. It would make no sense for her to, not after all of this time. Very unsatisfying storytelling, that would be.

(Personally, I don't believe she's still in love with Sasuke, but going by that interpretation...) It's funny because I always thought her feelings for Sasuke were the worst part of her, precisely for the reasons she stated — after so many years, after he hasn't shown an inkling of romantic or non-platonic care for her, after three murder attempts, she still loves him? That's sorta demented. Also, they were part of the reason she didn't recognise Naruto or his strength in the beginning, she focused way too much time on her appearance and not enough time on her ninja studies because she wanted Sasuke to see her — hell, she even changed her personality around him!

I don't think it would be "sad" if she gave up or moved on from her feelings for Sasuke (that is, if she still has them) — on the contrary, I'd think, "It's about damn time!" This person's favourite character is Sakura, too, so I find it weird that she thinks her feelings for Sasuke are "the best part of her," because they're simply not. And, what about her courage? Determination? They don't measure up to her feelings for Sasuke?

Anyway, I just wanted to hear your thoughts on this. ^^ Looking forward to your comments.

[Tsubaki]

Thanks Paptala and KnS for these great posts (also thanks for clarifying this thing about the Byakugan) ... as Don-kun already said, your posts are really insightful and unbiased.

I have faith in NaruSaku . I just can't see another pairing being canon after all their development throughout the series , but sometimes I have my doubts .. probably cuz here where I live ...NaruHina is very popular ( I can't even blame them after what the anime team did with the episode 167 :/ since I think most people watch the anime instead of reading the manga!)

[redragon88]

@mydearbeloved

I think it would be even more sad for Naruto to give up on Sakura by the end of the series. Naruto's selfless feelings are the most powerful out of everyone. Maybe people just don't see it because they focus too much on the pain that Sakura's love for Sasuke causes her. Therefore, they misinterpret Sakura's painful feelings as the most powerful ones, hence the reason they want her love for Sasuke to be reciprocated. I think it's even more powerful how Naruto is always aware that the girl he loves is in love with someone else but that regardless of that he only wants to make her happy.

In my opinion, Naruto dropping her feelings for Sakura after being shown the extent of his love for her and how much he cares for her happiness would be the true sad story telling.

I don't know how Kishi would do it, but if he can properly show Sakura understanding the differences between caring for someone and loving them, and understanding that her true feelings of love are actually with Naruto then I'm sure Sakura could definitely come out as a better person. Sasuke would still be precious to her but she would understand that Naruto is the man she wants to share her life with.

P.S. In my previous post I talked more about how Sakura's love for Sasuke and Hinata's love for Naruto are different from Naruto's love for Sakura. Please feel free to give me a reply. I would appreciate it.

Edited by redragon88, 26 November 2012 - 05:02 AM.

[Don-kun]

@mydearbeloved

I think it would be even more sad for Naruto to give up on Sakura by the end of the series. Naruto's selfless feelings are the most powerful out of everyone. Maybe people just don't see it because they focus too much on the pain that Sakura's love for Sasuke causes her. Therefore, they misinterpret Sakura's painful feelings as the most powerful ones, hence the reason they want her love for Sasuke to be reciprocated. I think it's even more powerful how Naruto is always aware that the girl he loves is in love with someone else but that regardless of that he only wants to make her happy.

In my opinion, Naruto dropping her feelings for Sakura after being shown the extent of his love for her and how much he cares for her happiness would be the true sad story telling.

I don't know how Kishi would do it, but if he can properly show Sakura understanding the differences between caring for someone and loving them, and understanding that her true feelings of love are actually with Naruto then I'm sure Sakura could definitely come out as a better person. Sasuke would still be precious to her but she would understand that Naruto is the man she wants to share her life with.

P.S. In my previous post I talked more about how Sakura's love for Sasuke and Hinata's love for Naruto are different from Naruto's love for Sakura. Please feel free to give me a reply. I would appreciate it.

In contrast to what you said I don't believe Naruto gating over Sakura would be sad it depends on how it happens, example if Naruto hears/witness Sakura confessing her feeling to Sasuke again, witness Sakura been happy because Sasuke wants to be with her then she start crying of happiness, that would be sad along with Naruto witnessing another hospital scene where once he saves Sasuke, Sakura completely forget about his existence.

Why only this way would be sad?
Is because despite everything they went through together Naruto will have to accept the hard way that Sakura will never love him and he will have to move on.
This is why I cannot see SS happening, looking on the Manga this way SS die a long time ago.
Sasuke walk away from her love, he try to kill her, he knows Naruto loves Sakura, he witness Sakura calling Naruto's name out of worry and more importantly Sakura knows Naruto deeply loves her.

Unless Naruto move on this way.
BY him telling Sakura that he doesn't want to continue pursuing a future with her because (insert Kishi silly explanation) them we see him flashing back on his mothers word and goes to Hinata, this will be sad for NS shippers not for the Manga in general.
Also this is the only way we might not see NS at the end, with Naruto been the one who declines the chance of being with Sakura in the end, not the other way.

Edited by Don-kun, 26 November 2012 - 01:24 PM.

[PhenixElite]

In contrast to what you said I don't believe Naruto gating over Sakura would be sad it depends on how it happens, example if Naruto hears/witness Sakura confessing her feeling to Sasuke again, witness Sakura been happy because Sasuke wants to be with her then she start crying of happiness, that would be sad along with Naruto witnessing another hospital scene where once he saves Sasuke, Sakura completely forget about his existence.

Why only this way would be sad?
Is because despite everything they went through together Naruto will have to accept the hard way that Sakura will never love him and he will have to move on.
This is why I cannot see SS happening, looking on the Manga this way SS die a long time ago.
Sasuke walk away from her love, he try to kill her, he knows Naruto loves Sakura, he witness Sakura calling Naruto's name out of worry and more importantly Sakura knows Naruto deeply loves her.

Unless Naruto move on this way.
BY him telling Sakura that he doesn't want to continue pursuing a future with her because (insert Kishi silly explanation) them we see him flashing back on his mothers word and goes to Hinata, this will be sad for NS shippers not for the Manga in general.
Also this is the only way we might not see NS at the end, with Naruto been the one who declines the chance of being with Sakura in the end, not the other way.

I dont get what you mean with flashing back to his mothers words. That wouldnt make sence cause his mother told him to find someone like her and hinata isnt like her. So i think it would be sad for the manga too because he couldnt keep his mothers words.

Beside, after all the time we can be very sure that narutos not going to change.

Edit:
If narutos where going to change it would be very sad for the manga because it would completly destroy his character.

Edited by PhenixElite, 26 November 2012 - 01:53 PM.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

In contrast to what you said I don't believe Naruto gating over Sakura would be sad it depends on how it happens, example if Naruto hears/witness Sakura confessing her feeling to Sasuke again, witness Sakura been happy because Sasuke wants to be with her then she start crying of happiness, that would be sad along with Naruto witnessing another hospital scene where once he saves Sasuke, Sakura completely forget about his existence.

Why only this way would be sad?
Is because despite everything they went through together Naruto will have to accept the hard way that Sakura will never love him and he will have to move on.
This is why I cannot see SS happening, looking on the Manga this way SS die a long time ago.
Sasuke walk away from her love, he try to kill her, he knows Naruto loves Sakura, he witness Sakura calling Naruto's name out of worry and more importantly Sakura knows Naruto deeply loves her.

Unless Naruto move on this way.
BY him telling Sakura that he doesn't want to continue pursuing a future with her because (insert Kishi silly explanation) them we see him flashing back on his mothers word and goes to Hinata, this will be sad for NS shippers not for the Manga in general.
Also this is the only way we might not see NS at the end, with Naruto been the one who declines the chance of being with Sakura in the end, not the other way.

Looks like this thread went on a loop again i dont know but i do think it's the 9234x that the topic "Naruto not getting sakura" is bring again and the answer for it is.

"Sakura already chose naruto, because when she was forced to make a decision on sakura's confession she chose Naruto despite "loving" Sasukemo"
So if naruto says i love you to sakura she will accept without second thoughts, and now she knows that naruto loves her.

Edited by dovahkiin, 26 November 2012 - 02:32 PM.

[Sojobo]

Hi everyone, long time no see. ^^

It's 2013 soon, so we'll have a new Jump Festa Interview of Kishimoto sensei. Maybe he will give us some hints for NaruSaku, like he did for Tobito (I'll write about the one who were dear to Kakashi). NaruSaku was always obvious in my point of view to begin with, so until Naruto wont say a thing, I will always keep that thought.

Obviousily, Naruto will speak, I don't know when, but he definitely will. How can we imagine a second that he will give up on Sakura?
You have to be a NaruHina fan, otherwise, it is impossible to see something like this, there isn't logic at all. You can't forget a girls' love in a few days...
Why would Naruto forget his love for her when Kishimoto himself insist that he loves her so much on showing Sai's flashback ? Sai's even say "he REALLY loves you".
The "really" means everything, that it isn't some superficial love, its real LOVE.

If Naruto showed some ambiguity or some doubt about his feelings, than I would say that he could be falling in love with Hinata. Ya know, like Sakura when she says that she's in love with Sasuke so much but that she can't even tell about her feelings for Naruto.
Zabuza part
Sakura : What is this feeling ? (after looking Naruto fighting Zabuza)
Yamato's part : Sakura, just looking at you, I can tell... you're...
Sakura : ... ?? (like "what the hell, I don't know what to think about it")

WE DON'T HAVE SOMETHING LIKE THIS WITH NARUTO!!
He don't even have second thoughts about his love for Sakura, and he seems to know quiet well what he feels for Hinata.
Conclusion : Naruto doesn't love Hinata at all in a romantic way. He cares about her, like he cares about Shikamaru, but he doesn't have romantic feelings at all, because Kishimoto doesn't show any AMBIGUITY.

That's why Naruto can't say today that he doesn't love Sakura anymore, because Kishimoto never started ambiguity with Naruto feelings to begin with. He did for Sakura, he did not for our hero...

Edited by Sojobo, 26 November 2012 - 06:22 PM.

[Don-kun]

Let me try this again and this time I will highlight all my point.
First of all I trying show a what if scenario.

In contrast to what you said I don't believe Naruto gating over Sakura would be sad it depends on how it happens, example if Naruto hears/witness Sakura confessing her feeling to Sasuke again, witness Sakura been happy because Sasuke wants to be with her then she start crying of happiness, that would be sad along with Naruto witnessing another hospital scene where once he saves Sasuke, Sakura completely forget about his existence.

Why only this way would be sad?
Is because despite everything they went through together Naruto will have to accept the hard way that Sakura will never love him and he will have to move on.
This is why I cannot see SS happening, looking on the Manga this way SS die a long time ago.
Sasuke walk away from her love, he try to kill her, he knows Naruto loves Sakura, he witness Sakura calling Naruto's name out of worry and more importantly Sakura knows Naruto deeply loves her.

Unless Naruto move on this way.
BY him telling Sakura that he doesn't want to continue pursuing a future with her because (insert Kishi silly explanation) them we see him flashing back on his mothers word and goes to Hinata, this will be sad for NS shippers not for the Manga in general.
Also this is the only way we might not see NS at the end, with Naruto been the one who declines the chance of being with Sakura in the end, not the other way.

1- I don't believe if Naruto move on his own free will would be sad for Naruto, am not saying that he will move I'm saying that if he does in no way it would be sad for him.

2- If Naruto is forced to move on by Sakura breaking his heart it will be very sad, this is why I cannot see SS if Naruto still want to pursue Sakura romantically.

3- If SS/NH happens it's only because Naruto say no to Sakura, Naruto will not receive any broken heart at the end of the story,
this is why I inserted (kishi adding silly reasons for Naruto to move on, and Kushina's word been the only excuse he has to make Naruto change is mind anything else will be an ass-pull in my eye) Sakura has everything on her favor when it comes to being similar to Kushina, but Hinata said she was not afraid to give up her life for him, something Kushina also did in a heart beat for Naruto.

4- If Naruto says that he only loves Sakura and no one else and will tell her how he feels when everything is said and done, SS and NH are good as dead.

In the end I was replying to what redragon88 said about it been sad if Naruto move on since there is two way for him to move on, a painful way or Naruto being the one who decline Sakura.


A more simplify way
1- Naruto was broken that he had to accept and move on, very unlikely almost impossible.
2- Naruto saying that he will find happiness with someone else, we don't know if this will ever happen, but in no way I think it will make him sad.

[PhenixElite]

Let me try this again and this time I will highlight all my point.
First of all I trying show a what if scenario.



1- I don't believe if Naruto move on his own free will would be sad for Naruto, am not saying that he will move I'm saying that if he does in no way it would be sad for him.

2- If Naruto is forced to move on by Sakura breaking his heart it will be very sad, this is why I cannot see SS if Naruto still want to pursue Sakura romantically.

3- If SS/NH happens it's only because Naruto say no to Sakura, Naruto will not receive any broken heart at the end of the story,
this is why I inserted (kishi adding silly reasons for Naruto to move on, and Kushina's word been the only excuse he has to make Naruto change is mind anything else will be an ass-pull in my eye) Sakura has everything on her favor when it comes to being similar to Kushina, but Hinata said she was not afraid to give up her life for him, something Kushina also did in a heart beat for Naruto.

4- If Naruto says that he only loves Sakura and no one else and will tell her how he feels when everything is said and done, SS and NH are good as dead.

In the end I was replying to what redragon88 said about it been sad if Naruto move on since there is two way for him to move on, a painful way or Naruto being the one who decline Sakura.


A more simplify way
1- Naruto was broken that he had to accept and move on, very unlikely almost impossible.
2- Naruto saying that he will find happiness with someone else, we don't know if this will ever happen, but in no way I think it will make him sad.

As i already stated if naruto moves on from sakura it wont be sad for him, but it would be sad for the whole manga cause his character that was build up till the whole story would be destroyed through that action.
Also kushinas words a defenitly no excuse for naruto to move on, its the opposite of it.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

3- If SS/NH happens it's only because Naruto say no to Sakura, Naruto will not receive any broken heart at the end of the story,
this is why I inserted (kishi adding silly reasons for Naruto to move on, and Kushina's word been the only excuse he has to make Naruto change is mind anything else will be an ass-pull in my eye) Sakura has everything on her favor when it comes to being similar to Kushina, but Hinata said she was not afraid to give up her life for him, something Kushina also did in a heart beat for Naruto.

Kushina meant those words but when he was a baby the only thing he accomplished.

She said have friends and he had
She said pursue a dream and his dream is to become hokage
She said to find someome who looks like his mother and he fall in love with sakura.

[Gravenimage]

Kushina meant those words but when he was a baby the only thing he accomplished.

She said have friends and he had
She said pursue a dream and his dream is to become hokage
She said to find someome who looks like his mother and he fall in love with sakura.

About the last part Kishi made it clear to the reader who's the girl he's talking about to fall in love with fall for someone like his mother and not for a weird one. The only thing he would have made it more obvious is to make Kushina say" don't fall in love with a weird Hyuga find someone with a fiery temper and pink hair lol".

[Don-kun]

You know sometimes I get the vibe that some have us believes that NS is inevitable, honestly I do not share that point of view.
For me it's the most likeable pairing among the big 3, but many things could still happen to stop NS from being the end pairing.
Kishi could make up any excuse and we will just need to accept the direction he takes.

I used the Kushina advise because so far Hinata is the only one who as shown to Naruto that she really loves him and like Kushina she didn't thought if twice to risk her life for Naruto.

There is like 25 reasons why Kushina advise/parallel applies to Sakura and only two for Hinata and people still chose to do the same mistake NH/SS fans do, ignore them or see them has irrelevant.

[luffyq1]

You know sometimes I get the vibe that some have us believes that NS is inevitable, honestly I do not share that point of view.
For me it's the most likeable pairing among the big 3, but many things could still happen to stop NS from being the end pairing.
Kishi could make up any excuse and we will just need to accept the direction he takes.

I used the Kushina advise because so far Hinata is the only one who as shown to Naruto that she really loves him and like Kushina she didn't thought if twice to risk her life for Naruto.

There is like 25 reasons why Kushina advise/parallel applies to Sakura and only two for Hinata and people still chose to do the same mistake NH/SS fans do, ignore them or see them has irrelevant.

When Sai told Sakura that Naruto loves her, was that the first time Sai actually expressed anger? If that was, then that scene is even more significant than I thought.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


@Don-kun - So Sakura was willing to sacrifice herself for chiyo, but not for Naruto? Makes sense. That advice being made specifically for Hinata has some holes, especially if you pay attention to the pain invasion arc.

Edited by luffyq1, 27 November 2012 - 12:44 AM.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

You know sometimes I get the vibe that some have us believes that NS is inevitable, honestly I do not share that point of view.
For me it's the most likeable pairing among the big 3, but many things could still happen to stop NS from being the end pairing.
Kishi could make up any excuse and we will just need to accept the direction he takes.

I used the Kushina advise because so far Hinata is the only one who as shown to Naruto that she really loves him and like Kushina she didn't thought if twice to risk her life for Naruto.

There is like 25 reasons why Kushina advise/parallel applies to Sakura and only two for Hinata and people still chose to do the same mistake NH/SS fans do, ignore them or see them has irrelevant.

"I used the Kushina advise because so far Hinata is the only one who as shown to Naruto that she really loves him and like Kushina she didn't thought if twice to risk her life for Naruto."
Kushina is his mom ofc she did not thought twice are you seriously?
everyone is risking their lives to protect naruto, that's not the war main objective protect both naruto and bee?
~40,000 ninjas died in this war to protect both and you are saying that only hinata is risking her life to protect naruto WTF!!!!?

-----
On Pain's Arc people died to protect naruto ( got ressurrected later) but died everyone was there fighting i did not see hinata "special" there that makes her similar to kushina she said "i love you" and then risked at all but she ignored naruto's pledge to not get involved in the fight no matter what she was reckless, that's the word.
After pain's defetead even neji and the others did not wanted to naruto go out by himself.

I really want you to point out what is two things that makes hinata similar to kushina

Edited by dovahkiin, 27 November 2012 - 12:52 AM.

[Gravenimage]

"I used the Kushina advise because so far Hinata is the only one who as shown to Naruto that she really loves him and like Kushina she didn't thought if twice to risk her life for Naruto."
Kushina is his mom ofc she did not thought twice are you seriously?
everyone is risking their lives to protect naruto, that's not the war main objective protect both naruto and bee?
~40,000 ninjas died in this war to protect both and you are saying that only hinata is risking her life to protect naruto WTF!!!!?

-----
On Pain's Arc people died to protect naruto ( got ressurrected later) but died everyone was there fighting i did not see hinata "special" there that makes her similar to kushina she said "i love you" and then risked at all but she ignored naruto's pledge to not get involved in the fight no matter what she was reckless, that's the word.
After pain's defetead even neji and the others did not wanted to naruto go out by himself.

I really want you to point out what is two things that makes hinata similar to kushina

Yeah I already mentioned this many times before. It's clearly the only reason Hinata is fighting in the war is to protect Naruto nothing else. She's not fighting to protect her village, or her friends or her clan, or even the entire ninja world not it just Naruto. I even pin pointed if the war wasn't to protect the jinchurikki I don't think she will even volunteer to be part of it, even if she's supposed to be the heiress of the Hyuga clan.

[swagosaurus]

There's nothing really to debate anymore...and it kind of makes me sad.

It's so clear what Kishi is doing. All of these NH 'hints' are just building suspense, just like with the movie. He's going to throw in hints for all pairings, including a little NaruSaku, then whip some of that at the end out of his magical hat of tricks and tom foolery.

[KnS]

Kishi could make up any excuse and we will just need to accept the direction he takes.

Technically speaking, yes, he could. But I bet you $20 right now that he doesn't trash his plot and characterizations and simply "make up any excuse" for doing it.

Kishimoto has his flaws -- occasionally hollow or non-existent explanations, rushed plotting, sidelining important characters, retconning -- but even with those storytelling issues he has maintained consistency with his overall plot. After 12 years or whatever, he's unlikely to take a new, unforeshadowed direction and offer nothing but an excuse.

I used the Kushina advise because so far Hinata is the only one who as shown to Naruto that she really loves him and like Kushina she didn't thought if twice to risk her life for Naruto.

I'm sorry but I must disagree. Hinata did not risk her life for Naruto. She risked her life for the chance to express her feelings to him. She herself admits she went into the fight with Pein for selfish reasons -- with no plan, believing there was nothing she could actually do to help Naruto, knowing she had no hope of beating Pein. Hinata thought she was choosing to die WITH Naruto, not FOR him. Big difference.

Kushina, on the other hand, knew she and Minato were the only chance to save Naruto's life as well as protect the village. They had a plan, and went into it knowing they were going to save his life through their actions. That means their sacrifice was neither vain nor empty. Plus she was his mother, and he was only a few minutes old. At that moment it was her sole responsibility.

There's simply no comparison between a mother sacrificing her life to save the life of her child, and an obscure, hopelessly weak girl making a tragic, uninvited spectacle of herself by dying for her one-sided love. I'm sorry if that sounds harsh, but that's how I see it. Just... no.

I really want you to point out what is two things that makes hinata similar to kushina

As far as I'm concerned there's only one: both were the object of kidnap attempts by Kumo.

[Don-kun]

When Sai told Sakura that Naruto loves her, was that the first time Sai actually expressed anger? If that was, then that scene is even more significant than I thought.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


@Don-kun - So Sakura was willing to sacrifice herself for chiyo, but not for Naruto? Makes sense. That advice being made specifically for Hinata has some holes, especially if you pay attention to the pain invasion arc.

I am not making any argument for NH, I'm saying that the only way I believe NS could not happen if Kishi try to use that has an excuse.
Again Sakura has being shown to be the one who cares about Naruto the most, their development is strong, the pairing makes the most sense, but NS is not set in stone, you like myself knows how annoying it felt to debate with those NH/SS fans who claims that NH/SS are inevitable and NS is dead, My reply to them has always been no one knows only Kishimoto.

TBH I personally feel that those who always claiming that the are 100% sure that there OTP will be the end pairing and the other pairing is dead are tards, desperate fans, delusional, arrogant and a bunch of wannabe Kishimoto.

To think that way about the opposition but been OK with my fandom doing the same will only makes me a biased person.

My believe is that NS is not set on stone and that anything can happen, but in my opinion NS is the most likeable pairing by far.

Finally Naruto will end up with someone while remembering his mother advice, I was only pointing out the only two scenarios that kind of favor Hinata out of maybe 25 scenarios that favors Sakura.


@dovahkiin
I give up.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Wow, it's been a while for me, but I got to say that there are so many great posts in here. A lot of great points about the pairing and what not. Next time, I would be prepare with a response.

I can understand that Kishi would create an excuse to make NH happening but the problem is that he is not like that. Look, he has flaws, no doubt about it, no one is perfect, but when it comes to his characters, especially Naruto himself, he is still intact and nothing has changed. Honestly, at least to me, the movie was the last shot to let us know if he has changed his ways. Turns out that everything remains the same, so I am not worried about him changing so much. The movie was the way to shove our throats with NH and maybe SS. Instead, he remains consistent and even brought up Naruto requesting dates from Sakura.

About Kushina, I think it's clear enough to me that Sakura is the closest one that you'll ever get in terms of similar. Not just the course of events, but her personality as well. Also, it would seem by the color page and the movie, it would seem Kushina is someone Minato is scared of when getting mad. I mean can you blame him. It most likely happen the same to Naruto with Sakura. That's my thoughts on them. Hm, 25 scenarios? Name them. Or at least good amount of them. We got all day.