19964 replies to this topic

[TouKen4Life3g]

I didn't have a problem with Pain Arc (minus revive all moment). Hinata's character was the same for so long, so it's time to get her out of the way. It will be random to show her confidence in a middle of a different arc, like war arc. So, if anything, the timing was right. Pain Arc was the arc that Naruto will finally get the acknowledgement from his own village. Everyone presented that Naruto has motivated them and changed them. It is the same arc with Shikamaru wanting to walk with him because Naruto is a great guy. At the end, it was resolution from everyone, as well as ones who Naruto cares about the most. Kakashi carried him, saying that he has grown and became liked by the village who once hated him. Next up, Sakura; she showed that she was worried and hugged him, something that he didn't see it coming, which is a sign for things to come between them. Lastly, Iruka watched him being cheered and smiled at him, like a father who watched his son graduating. All in all, I'm very fine with it. Again, who ends on the higher note in terms of pairing?

@Don-Kun: Agreed. Like I said in the other forum, I'll be surprised to see a kiss scene all visible. The best I can see for a Shounen is shadow figures of them but you know they're kissing or shift camera behind Naruto, since he's the tallest, implying that they're kissing but you can see their faces. The least we get is a hug scene with a epilogue, similar to FMA.

[Don-kun]

@Don-kun

Well I'll be, that was picture perfect. Literally.

That's precisely the approach that Sakura should take next time she addresses her feelings for Naruto. And as you said, it goes perfectly with the atmosphere of an action shonen manga and it's tsundere heroine.

It's like that second comic said, it's not that Naruto became someone Sakura desires, Naruto became part of Sakura's life. If Naruto wasn't with her then it would be the same as part of her being cut out, so she'll fight to remain by his side.

P.S. Could you tell where you found those images?

Here
http://natsumi33.dev...rt.com/gallery/

I like her works. She is currently writing a new doujin named Terrace, I haven't start reading it yet but I will eventually do that at some point.

[Lucky Star]

Dear friend, I think you have just given the perfect answer for when Sakura brings up her feelings for Naruto once again.

As said before, the reason Sakura's confession went wrong was because she gave a logical spin to it. She tried to find understandable reasons for loving Naruto so that he wouldn't doubt her when she said it.

Sakura should take the illogical approach this time. Maybe make a comment that despite being a hero he's still a reckless idiot, but that she loves that reckless idiotic side of his. Naruto just being who he is fills her with happiness.

I agree with this especially the bolded part. During the confession she made it seem like she was making a pro and con list with Naruto and Sasuke rather than saying how Naruto makes her feel because of who he is.

@Don-kun

I like the first one a lot!

[PhenixElite]

I didn't have a problem with Pain Arc (minus revive all moment). Hinata's character was the same for so long, so it's time to get her out of the way. It will be random to show her confidence in a middle of a different arc, like war arc. So, if anything, the timing was right. Pain Arc was the arc that Naruto will finally get the acknowledgement from his own village. Everyone presented that Naruto has motivated them and changed them. It is the same arc with Shikamaru wanting to walk with him because Naruto is a great guy. At the end, it was resolution from everyone, as well as ones who Naruto cares about the most. Kakashi carried him, saying that he has grown and became liked by the village who once hated him. Next up, Sakura; she showed that she was worried and hugged him, something that he didn't see it coming, which is a sign for things to come between them. Lastly, Iruka watched him being cheered and smiled at him, like a father who watched his son graduating. All in all, I'm very fine with it. Again, who ends on the higher note in terms of pairing?

@Don-Kun: Agreed. Like I said in the other forum, I'll be surprised to see a kiss scene all visible. The best I can see for a Shounen is shadow figures of them but you know they're kissing or shift camera behind Naruto, since he's the tallest, implying that they're kissing but you can see their faces. The least we get is a hug scene with a epilogue, similar to FMA.

Well, i agree with you about the pain arc. All we got was a small Naruto Hinata interaction and a big NS interaction. And in the end we all know how its going to end right.
I would sure like a kissing scene but i also doubt it. But one thing is for sure, it will be a huge romantic and very great scene. I think everyone will be satisfied from it.

[sushi.]

Here
http://natsumi33.dev...rt.com/gallery/

I like her works. She is currently writing a new doujin named Terrace, I haven't start reading it yet but I will eventually do that at some point.

I read this yesterday It got me thinking back when Neji seriously attempted to kill Hinata. (I think he did)
Does that increase the chance of couples like SasuKarin Don't mention SasuSaku it was destroyed from part 1.

Because I don't get the difference. Hinata was not even a hostage.

[Tendo Ryuken]

I read this yesterday It got me thinking back when Neji seriously attempted to kill Hinata. (I think he did)
Does that increase the chance of couples like SasuKarin Don't mention SasuSaku it was destroyed from part 1.

Because I don't get the difference. Hinata was not even a hostage.

is it necessary for you to do this?

on topic. let me show you one of my way on using logic.

lets take the assumptions:

assumption #1 naruto held no special feeling for hinata
assumption #2 the one naruto cared the most is sakura

now. lets pick a scene to test our assumption

Naruto : Granny. as im able to master the sage mode, i can now sense everyone's chakra. is kakashi sensei on a misson away from the village?
Tsunade : ..........
Naruto : i see
---note--- naruto said everyone. this means including iruka, konohamaru, sakura, etc ..
time skip
naruto : whats that? isnt it supposed to be the village? whats happened?
katsuyu : yes, naruto kun. you did that in kyubi mode.
naruto : anxiety.. did i hurt hinata and the other?

you know that scene really well right?
============================================================================

so. lets test our assumption #1 first.
............&*%$$&&^_____765656---------&^%&*$&* ghd .....;,'/.
ting tong !!!

RESULT: SUCCESS. even naruto held no special feeling for hinata, her previous action and condition and position could make naruto checked her first. simply said, this evidence is not strong enough to say that naruto love hinata.

now, lets test our second assumption
............&*%$$&&^_____765656---------&^%&*$&* ghd .....;,'/.
ting tong !!!

RESULT: FAIL. if something huge and dangerous happened. the one you cared the most has to be the one you checked first. in other word, tough situation is a perfect time to see anything deep inside someone's heart. in 2004, when the huge earthquake that caused great tsunami strike aceh, the first person that come to my mind was my little brother. this is my personal experience, but i think i can take this as a valid evidence to consider.

side note : i havent seen paptala for a while. i really want to know his opinion

edit : you shouldnt try to test both assumption at one. it would make your head ache lol

Edited by Ryuken, 19 November 2012 - 12:41 PM.

[Tendo Ryuken]

@ Konan sama

ok. its something like this, i took the assumptions separately :

result #1
i took the assumption that naruto hold no special feeling for hinata. then put aside the assumption that naruto care sakura the most. the scene is still make sense. in othe word, you guys can say that this scene is not strong enough to support NH.

result #2
i took the assumption that naruto care for sakura the most. then put aside hinata completely. i really cant imagine how came naruto naruto didnt check sakura's condition first. in other words, assuming that naruto cares for sakura the most doesnt fit the scene

mmm. simply said that even the scene is not strong enough to support NH, it hurt NS really badly (well, for you guys who has strong faith in NS, this scene may be reasonable thought)

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

I dont know why those assumptions, i think it's pretty obvious that to NS work it depend on Sakura and what she decided to do.
Everyone knows that naruto loves sakura minus hinata, but it's obvious that if hinata shows off and tries to make a speech naruto will tell hinata that he loves sakura, because he said that " he hates people who lies to themselves" if NH should work naruto has to LOVE hinata, but naruto proved until now that he likes her as a friend on the same level as neji lee and the others, the fact is all the things happened and the fandom labbeled as NH it wasnt NH at all it was just Hinata, hinata this and that there wasnt any response from naruto regarding hinata.

[Tendo Ryuken]

I dont know why those assumptions, i think it's pretty obvious that to NS work it depend on Sakura and what she decided to do.
Everyone knows that naruto loves sakura minus hinata, but it's obvious that if hinata shows off and tries to make a speech naruto will tell hinata that he loves sakura, because he said that " he hates people who lies to themselves" if NH should work naruto has to LOVE hinata, but naruto proved until now that he likes her as a friend on the same level as neji lee and the others, the fact is all the things happened and the fandom labbeled as NH it wasnt NH at all it was just Hinata, hinata this and that there wasnt any response from naruto regarding hinata.

mm? ok. you are telling that naruto loves sakura right? can you explain why didnt he check her condition first? (we cant even see naruto checked her. honestly)

edit: i also thought the bolded one (i think you can tell from my previous posts) . but my own experiment shows different result. ive found that naruto's feeling for sakura is questionable

Edited by Ryuken, 19 November 2012 - 02:47 PM.

[PhenixElite]

@ Konan sama

ok. its something like this, i took the assumptions separately :

result #1
i took the assumption that naruto hold no special feeling for hinata. then put aside the assumption that naruto care sakura the most. the scene is still make sense. in othe word, you guys can say that this scene is not strong enough to support NH.

result #2
i took the assumption that naruto care for sakura the most. then put aside hinata completely. i really cant imagine how came naruto naruto didnt check sakura's condition first. in other words, assuming that naruto cares for sakura the most doesnt fit the scene

mmm. simply said that even the scene is not strong enough to support NH, it hurt NS really badly (well, for you guys who has strong faith in NS, this scene may be reasonable thought)

Well, if its like this, i have to dissagree with you.
I think this is just again a case of overthinking things too much.
Its clear that naruto thought of hinata when he became normal again, because the last thing naruto became to see was hinata nearly getting killed by pain.
It would come over total anti social if he instantly asks for sakura when there is a much, much bigger chance that hinata is already dead.

I really dont see any problem with that scene. Also there have been much better moments for kishi to develope NH, but he didnt.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

mm? ok. you are telling that naruto loves sakura right? can you explain why didnt he check her condition first? (we cant even see naruto checked her. honestly)

I think he already told this implicity he wants to win her love and not makes her love him just because sasuke is a bad guy,i think you would understand, he already knew that she was hiding something when she bring up sasuke on that conversation.
It's not a matter of chicking her condition, i think she must realize that the one she really loves is naruto not sasuke.
tsundere always tries to deny it, she tried to find reasons to fall in love with naruto but her feelings are too deep in her hearth only on critical situations those feelings are bought up there was one at the bridge and you know that when she "crossed" the line of friendship and captain yamato realized that but she didnt realized that.

Abou that fight with pain.
Naruto was already angry because of what he did with the village it could be everyone on hinata's place that he would awake the tails, but since there are no if's naruto was worried about his friends and what makes him a bit sad when he become normal again was : he thought he had killed hinata and the others because when he transform he has no control at all so he was worried because he thought he killed his friends, but katsui told him that he did not hurt any of his friends so he recovered up;

Edited by dovahkiin, 19 November 2012 - 02:39 PM.

[Tendo Ryuken]

I think this is just again a case of overthinking things too much.

I really dont see any problem with that scene. Also there have been much better moments for kishi to develope NH, but he didnt.

hmm. you may be right about overthinking. but i have to disagree with you for saying that kishimoto didnt develop NH

I think he already told this implicity he wants to win her love and not makes her love him just because sasuke is a bad guy,i think you would understand, he already knew that she was hiding something when she bring up sasuke on that conversation.
It's not a matter of chicking her condition, i think she must realize that the one she really loves is naruto not sasuke.
tsundere always tries to deny it, she tried to find reasons to fall in love with naruto but her feelings are too deep in her hearth only on critical situations those feelings are bought up there was one at the bridge and you know that when she "crossed" the line of friendship and captain yamato realized that but she didnt realized that.

i thought we agreed that love is not about winning or losing
and about yamato, dont for get that he was the one who mad at sakura for asking naruto to stop chasing sasuke

[PhenixElite]

hmm. you may be right about overthinking. but i have to disagree with you for saying that kishimoto didnt develop NH

If you see it like this, tell me a moment where we get to see NH development and i mean NaruHina development not just Hinata development.

[redragon88]

@ Konan sama

ok. its something like this, i took the assumptions separately :

result #1
i took the assumption that naruto hold no special feeling for hinata. then put aside the assumption that naruto care sakura the most. the scene is still make sense. in othe word, you guys can say that this scene is not strong enough to support NH.

result #2
i took the assumption that naruto care for sakura the most. then put aside hinata completely. i really cant imagine how came naruto naruto didnt check sakura's condition first. in other words, assuming that naruto cares for sakura the most doesnt fit the scene

mmm. simply said that even the scene is not strong enough to support NH, it hurt NS really badly (well, for you guys who has strong faith in NS, this scene may be reasonable thought)

I'm pretty sure that scene isn't supposed to support or hurt either NH or NS in any shape or form. It's kind of a neutral scene.

The reason Naruto mentioned Hinata first was because she was the closest to him when he became kyuubi. If it had been Iruka then Naruto would've said "Are Iruka and the rest alright?". So yeah, this scene was never meant to either help or hurt NH. It was a pretty generic scene which you could apply to any character.

I'm not sure why you assume that Naruto not thinking about Sakura specifically in that scene diminishes his feelings? I think you might be looking to much into it. Naruto cares about Sakura the most, but that doesn't mean he prioritizes her above the rest of the village for no reason. The only reason he did so with Hinata was because she was near him, therefore, the most likely one to get killed by kyuubi Naruto.

It's like Minato said before he died, something like "We're a shinobi family". Minato decided to die and make his child an orphan for the good of the village's future, because they were all his family. And he knew that in the long run Naruto would find happiness in his own way even without his parents there. So just like Minato, Naruto also considers all of the Leaf Village as his family and worries for all of them equally. But just because he worries for all in the same way doesn't mean he can't have special feelings for someone.

Just like in a family, you love your partner and child equally, but you're only in love with your partner. Think about Naruto in the same way.

[Tendo Ryuken]

If you see it like this, tell me a moment where we get to see NH development and i mean NaruHina development not just Hinata development.

first, i have a question for you. there is a chapter titled "proud failure". do you think it was for hinata's character development?

edit:
@redragon88
in case of "consciously", you are right. but theres always someting that happened unconsciously. as i said before, tough situation is the perfect time to see someone's heart, because something unconsciously usually happen at tough situasion

@NaruSaku4Life3g & sushi

offtopic. i really wonder about sasukarin. an uchiha+uzumaki would produce the most baddass ninja ever lol

Edited by Ryuken, 19 November 2012 - 03:12 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

While you guys having a debate, I should answer this person.

I read this yesterday It got me thinking back when Neji seriously attempted to kill Hinata. (I think he did)
Does that increase the chance of couples like SasuKarin Don't mention SasuSaku it was destroyed from part 1.

Because I don't get the difference. Hinata was not even a hostage.

Well, you got to remember one thing about Neji and Hinata. Neji already like her as a friend back in childhood, but it's the family issues that converted him to hate the main branch. He was too cocky for his own good, and when Hinata talk back at him, he got angry because not only it was brought up with the family issues, but he's being told by the one who he calls 'losers'. So yeah, I guess perhaps he was going for the kill in the end because he lost his cool. Case in point, not the same as SS. Neji did turn good early on and stick to the family clan throughout the series.

Now, you're wondering the chance the couples like SasuKarin has. As I mentioned before way back with my LAP, I am giving SK one chance and that chance is the reunion. The only reason I am keeping it alive in me is because of one thing and believe me, it is big to the world of Naruto. She is an Uzumaki. One would question, why have her as an Uzumaki; why have her delayed on meeting with Sasuke; why have her go back to Sasuke. These are questions that are waiting to be answered and honestly, this could be a turning point. To me, this is something that SS fears, but it's hidden as of now. Honestly, I don't see Team Taka going away in the end. It would seem to me that Kishi is making them officially as a team similar to all others: friendship. Well, you did cross out 'that', so best to leave it that way, just for you.

[PhenixElite]

first, i have a question for you. there is a chapter titled "proud failure". do you think it was for hinata's character development?

edit:
@redragon88
in case of "consciously", you are right. but theres always someting that happened unconsciously. as i said before, tough situation is the perfect time to see someone's heart, because something unconsciously usually happen at tough situasion

@NaruSaku4Life3g & sushi

offtopic. i really wonder about sasukarin. an uchiha+uzumaki would produce the most baddass ninja ever lol

Well youre right you found one maybe. But first of all that is about 500 chapters old, second: for me naruto also doenst show more than friendship to hinata. I think that was the first chapter they really had a conversation. The next real conversation is about 200 chapter later i think.

Ok now if we count this as NH development, think of all the NS development we got till now.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

hmm. you may be right about overthinking. but i have to disagree with you for saying that kishimoto didnt develop NH



i thought we agreed that love is not about winning or losing
and about yamato, dont for get that he was the one who mad at sakura for asking naruto to stop chasing sasuke

"i thought we agreed that love is not about winning or losing"
i do think you judged it wrong.

i think he was mad because of her approach, why all of sudden she says naruto i love you and then ask naruto to stop chasing sasuke, he was mad mostly because she used the confession to make naruto give up his chasing.

Why in a love confession you bought up a different person that has nothing to do with this, i think naruto expression after she ask naruto to stop chasing sasuke pretty much described it, naruto was accepting her confession until she asked him to stop chasing sasuke.


told you!

Edited by dovahkiin, 19 November 2012 - 03:41 PM.

[Don-kun]

hmm. you may be right about overthinking. but i have to disagree with you for saying that kishimoto didnt develop NH



i thought we agreed that love is not about winning or losing
and about yamato, dont for get that he was the one who mad at sakura for asking naruto to stop chasing sasuke

What Manga have you being reading, the Hinata feelings towards Naruto Manga or the Manga every rational reader reads.

This is my opinion about you on other NH shippers, don't get me wrong is not on you on a personal level is on the way you read the Manga.

I swear the NH ship is overrated as hell, Kishi focus on the rival pairing but the arguments for the pairing are, Sakura hits Naruto, Sakura was very selfish, Sakura likes Sasuke (guess what Naruto likes Sakura), the stuff they have is only comic relief, Brother sister, it's obvious why they are close they are on the same team, they share more panel time because the are the main characters excuses, excuses. But if Naruto and Hinata exchanges few words NH will happen Naruto likes Hinata, Hinata becomes determine NH is inevitable, I mean Naruto doesn't see Hinata anyway different from how he sees his other regular friend plus Naruto never being shown or implied that he has romantic feelings for Hinata, this pairing is still 99.9% Hinata's want/desire, classified as one side love.

With Sakura there is the fact that her feeling for Naruto has not being addressed to finally knows if she feels something beyond platonic love or she really cares for Naruto has a siblings like friendship, it has being imply that they might be some romantic feelings many times, only if you block your mind from it you will ignore it, but the truth is that NH does not have that luxury but nothing is stopping it from being overrated as hell since part one.

About Sakura, she is a Team 7 member, she save a lot of lives, she have bad ass fight, her role weigh much more than Hinata's role, Kill Sakura and Team 7 will never be the same again they might never move on, Kill Hinata everyone will be sad but they will eventually move on, Sakura was the one who discover Tobi's ability, Sakura was the one who ran the news about Zetsu, In the End there is a big different between Sakura and Hinata, story wise, importance to the main character wise and in development with Naruto.
Again Hinata is way, but way too overrated been a very bland and one dimension character.

On Like I mention to others Sakura is the main lead not Hinata, She is the girl the main character loves not Hinata, NS is have the strongest hetero bond in the Manga among the big 3. Nothing you say here will change our opinion, you know why? Because people who don't ship any pairing understand that even if NH is cute because Hinata is very nice, NS has the most focus and seems more likely between the 3 pairing.



Side note: This is the home of pairing discussion, you should try it out sometimes you know.
http://www.narutofor...p...ne=-1&f=168
I even think the NH FC will welcome you with open heart and the anti Sakura FC. would be glad to have you, this is a open debate place but it become annoying when people try to twist Manga fact to fit their opinion.

Also keep in mind that Kishi already said, I just hear Hinata Hinata they are really loud and to make it clear he said Sakura is not Hinata, RTN should give you and idea of the way this guy thinks, Hinata and Sasuke were only used to draw the crowd in the end was all about Naruto's family and his bond with Sakura, I really don't think that will change the only difference might be the addition of Sasuke again. After the War end Sasuke is safe Team 7 will become the focus of the Manga again not Hinata or Hiuga arc.

Edited by Don-kun, 19 November 2012 - 03:52 PM.

[redragon88]

@redragon88
in case of "consciously", you are right. but theres always someting that happened unconsciously. as i said before, tough situation is the perfect time to see someone's heart, because something unconsciously usually happen at tough situasion

This is why I'm saying that you're overthinking it. Remember these aren't real people. Kishi's probably wasn't thinking about that kind of stuff when he wrote that scene.

And even when you're in an unconscious situation you worry about all the people you care for. You wonder what's in Naruto's heart? In his heart Naruto worries for everyone at a same level. Let's say a guy with a wife and child he loves the same suddenly finds his house on fire. Do you think he'll worry about one more than the other? He won't. He'll worry for both the same way.

It might sound unrealistic for Naruto to share concern for everyone at the same level while only loving Sakura, but you have to remember that this is still a work of fiction. Fiction is controlled. No matter how realistic we might think some stories are the reality is that there's always gonna be differences to real situations.

You blur the line between fiction and reality when you try to apply real life experiences as a way to predict how a character should act.

If the story of Naruto was meant to be realistic then Naruto would allow everyone to help him apprehend Sasuke, he would get arrested for his crimes and either be incarcerated or executed, and Sakura would most definitely not be still in love with him. But the story of Naruto is not about how realistic it can be, it's about the messages we can learn from the tale. That what's most important to keep in mind.