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H&E's NaruSaku Debate Thread!


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#5141 Paptala

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Posted 21 October 2012 - 10:18 PM

QUOTE (redragon88 @ Oct 21 2012, 04:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I don't really care if Sasuke ends up alone. But if he had to be with someone my money is on Karin. As to why, well, because she seems to be the only girl who can back talk to Sasuke. Any other girl would be way too meek around him, but Karin knows how to stand her ground when she believes he's in the wrong.

I remember how she scolded him for almost getting killed by Deidara and even called him a weakling. Then she got mad at him for trying to keep searching for Itachi even though he hadn't recovered from his fight with Deidara. And I think there were other instances in which she questioned the validity of his plans.

I guess I prefer her because she doesn't mind giving Sasuke attitude regardless of her feelings. It seems she might have some traits of a tsundere when it comes to Sasuke.

Exactly - I initially thought that SK was SS 2.0, and dismissed it, but my thoughts were seriously changed after reading the LAPs at the SK FC at NF (which can also be found on tumblr too). They really lay out the stark differences between SS and SK, and Karin is the only girl I can see Sasuke ending up with, if he gets together with anyone.

Sakura, as far as we know, fell in love with Sasuke because he was cool and attractive, and later she became attached to him during their time together as a team. Karin fell in love with Sasuke after he saved her and showed her kindness.

Sasuke clearly respects (or maybe rather respected before he went over the deep end) Karin's abilities - he said that he needed her, and acknowledged straight that she saved him in the fight against Kirabi. Sasuke never gave any such acknowledgment after Sakura helped him in the FoD or at the hospital after Itachi attacked. The fact that he was willing to risk not only his, but Juugo and Suigetsu's lives to try and save Karin from amateratsu's flames and his desperation in doing so confirms that he truly cared about Karin as more than a tool (I could be recalling incorrectly, but I don't think that I've ever seen him frantic when Sakura was in danger).

Then of course there is the fact that Karin doesn't take Sasuke's crap - she calls him out on stuff when he's being stupid, and she had the self respect to distance herself from Sasuke after he tried to kill her. We'll see how their next confrontation goes.
QUOTE (redragon88 @ Oct 21 2012, 05:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Well, if this was a shoujo manga with Sakura as the protagonist, and maybe Sasuke wasn't as unstable as he is now, then it would've had a high possibility of happening. But this is a shonen with Naruto as the protagonist, so from a storytelling point of view he's the one most likely to get the girl he loves.

Maybe it's because of the influence of other genres, be it shoujo itself or maybe from western influence, combined with a lack of understanding how storytelling can be different according to what genre is used, that some people are particularly adamant about not believing that Naruto and Sakura could get together.

Fiction is not real life, that meaning that fiction can be controlled as seen fit in order to deliver the message that the author wants to communicate. So when I see potential development I try not to see it from the point of view of the characters, but from the perspective of the author. I try to think what would motivate an author to draw a certain conclusion. And given the development, parallels and themes that Kishi has deliberately chosen to portray in the manga, in addition to the type of genre that this story belongs to, that's how I make the conclusion that Kishi wants Naruto and Sakura to get together by the end.

Exactly - this is a shounen story, and so you have to look at this from the point of "why is the author doing this?" - especially if you are a busy mangaka with a weekly deadline and you are especially eager to move on to your next project.

Everything literary wise makes NaruSaku the most logical choice at this point.

Edited by Paptala, 21 October 2012 - 10:19 PM.

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#5142 TouKen4Life3g

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 12:02 AM

Ok I'm still writing my LAP. I just want to leave some comments. First of all, my LAP is going to be 3 parts. That's right, it's pretty dang long. I just want to get my point and see any comments that I would like to respond.

Funny that you mentioned, Paptala. I was in the same position as you were. I will talk more on that when I'm finally done. I think that the pairing is overlook for reasons that people over think on. Anyway, I'll address a lot in my LAP.

Great posts, you guys. smile.gif

Edited by NaruSaku4Life3g, 22 October 2012 - 12:03 AM.


#5143 Nostradamus

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 01:38 AM

QUOTE (NaruSaku4Life3g @ Oct 22 2012, 03:02 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Ok I'm still writing my LAP. I just want to leave some comments. First of all, my LAP is going to be 3 parts. That's right, it's pretty dang long. I just want to get my point and see any comments that I would like to respond.

Funny that you mentioned, Paptala. I was in the same position as you were. I will talk more on that when I'm finally done. I think that the pairing is overlook for reasons that people over think on. Anyway, I'll address a lot in my LAP.

Great posts, you guys. smile.gif


Only 3 parts mine was a lot bigger. th_tongue.gif

I want to ask you guys/girls something. In 559 when Naruto talked to Hinata what exactly did he say to her? The whole "you saved me twice" or something like that. What exactly is the correct translation?

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Which I've told you - time and time again - is dangerous! There will never be consensus, son, among those you have helped to ascend. They will all differ in their views of what it means to be free. The peace you so desperately seek does not exist.
 
These men are united now by a common cause. But when this battle is finished they will fall to fighting amongst themselves about how best to ensure control. In time it will lead to war. You will see.


#5144 Lady_duckish

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 01:38 AM

QUOTE (Paptala @ Oct 21 2012, 03:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Exactly - I initially thought that SK was SS 2.0, and dismissed it, but my thoughts were seriously changed after reading the LAPs at the SK FC at NF (which can also be found on tumblr too). They really lay out the stark differences between SS and SK, and Karin is the only girl I can see Sasuke ending up with, if he gets together with anyone.

Sakura, as far as we know, fell in love with Sasuke because he was cool and attractive, and later she became attached to him during their time together as a team. Karin fell in love with Sasuke after he saved her and showed her kindness.

Sasuke clearly respects (or maybe rather respected before he went over the deep end) Karin's abilities - he said that he needed her, and acknowledged straight that she saved him in the fight against Kirabi. Sasuke never gave any such acknowledgment after Sakura helped him in the FoD or at the hospital after Itachi attacked. The fact that he was willing to risk not only his, but Juugo and Suigetsu's lives to try and save Karin from amateratsu's flames and his desperation in doing so confirms that he truly cared about Karin as more than a tool (I could be recalling incorrectly, but I don't think that I've ever seen him frantic when Sakura was in danger).

Then of course there is the fact that Karin doesn't take Sasuke's crap - she calls him out on stuff when he's being stupid, and she had the self respect to distance herself from Sasuke after he tried to kill her. We'll see how their next confrontation goes.

Exactly - this is a shounen story, and so you have to look at this from the point of "why is the author doing this?" - especially if you are a busy mangaka with a weekly deadline and you are especially eager to move on to your next project.

Everything literary wise makes NaruSaku the most logical choice at this point.

I was shocked when I read the S/K manifesto. It was superior to S/S in pretty much every way. While she was extremely attracted to Sasuke, she had no problems expressing her other emotions and feelings to him. Unlike S/S, you never get the feeling one person would be overly submissive or oppressed. She became a partner, and an equal. It also looked like he held her above the rest of the team/held a different affection for her. And when he tried to kill her she didn't try to make sense of it, or look for a loophole ( this is not directed at Sakura, but it is something ive seen in relatives and friends who are/were in unhealthy relationships) She decided she had enough, which does not always = stop loving. Just means you're not going to let yourself go through that crap anymore, not even for love. After what he did to her, I have no hope or want to see them together, but it was nice to see a Sasuke/girl relationship that seemed pretty decent. Shame it ended like that.

That and the "New Heaven and Earth"

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#5145 redragon88

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 02:20 AM

QUOTE (Nostradamus @ Oct 21 2012, 09:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Only 3 parts mine was a lot bigger. th_tongue.gif

I want to ask you guys/girls something. In 559 when Naruto talked to Hinata what exactly did he say to her? The whole "you saved me twice" or something like that. What exactly is the correct translation?

I think the correct translation would be that Naruto would be pretty lame if he had to be saved twice by Hinata. She already did so during the Pain arc, so he did want to put people in the same position again.

QUOTE (Lady_duckish @ Oct 21 2012, 09:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I was shocked when I read the S/K manifesto. It was superior to S/S in pretty much every way. While she was extremely attracted to Sasuke, she had no problems expressing her other emotions and feelings to him. Unlike S/S, you never get the feeling one person would be overly submissive or oppressed. She became a partner, and an equal. It also looked like he held her above the rest of the team/held a different affection for her. And when he tried to kill her she didn't try to make sense of it, or look for a loophole ( this is not directed at Sakura, but it is something ive seen in relatives and friends who are/were in unhealthy relationships) She decided she had enough, which does not always = stop loving. Just means you're not going to let yourself go through that crap anymore, not even for love. After what he did to her, I have no hope or want to see them together, but it was nice to see a Sasuke/girl relationship that seemed pretty decent. Shame it ended like that.

That and the "New Heaven and Earth"

Well, in many different stories people get together coming back from even worst scenarios, I think. I believe that's why people still ship SasuSaku, since they believe that eventually everything will be alright just like in previous stories.

In all honesty, I agree with that point of view and completely understand why people keep shipping it. But I've said before that I don't particularly care for how Sasuke went about treating Sakura in the story. Even if Sasuke was a sweetheart to her, my points as to why NaruSaku would happen still stand. It's all about the message of never giving up, accompanied by the development, parallels, and themes that the story has shown. Whether Sasuke had been a psychopath or the perfect guy still doesn't take away from how the story builds up to Naruto and Sakura ending together.

I never want to use Sasuke's bad points as an excuse for Sakura to go to Naruto. The only thing I want to use to justify Sakura choosing Naruto is how he slowly came to change her view about him by just being himself.

That "New Heaven and Earth" bit really is interesting. If SasuKarin does happen that was one heck of an early foreshadowing.

Edited by redragon88, 22 October 2012 - 02:22 AM.


#5146 TouKen4Life3g

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 04:20 AM

Man, I need to stop doing these LAP. Anyway, here we go!

Why NS has the most advantage out of the three right now --Click here to view--
@Paptala: Great post as always. I highly agree. Say what you want, but that movie was the biggest opportunity that Kishi could have established his approach on pairings and he decided to go with NaruSaku. Hinata was used for comedy and only interacted with Naruto once for a short time. Actually, she interacted with Sakura more than Naruto. In the end, she got a small screen time and nothing but comedy came out from her. As for Sasuke, barely 3 minutes on the movie and only to show Sakura's shallow love (or naive) for Sasuke. Again, Kishi has no reason to do this scene at all. He chose to do so for making a connection to the manga and continues to tease Naruto's love for Sakura. He only continues to create hope for Naruto to be together with Sakura in the end.

Like I said before, if you want SS and NH to be logical and to happen, they need an arc solely based on them, but it looks like that won't happen, especially to SS. Sakura already established that Naruto is the only one that will deal with Sasuke and no one should be in the way. What brought her back to curiosity is his statement about dying together as in what's his plan and is he trying to keep it to himself, even though she heard him. So, she has more concerns on Naruto because not only he is the only one that's with her as well as Sasuke is on the enemy's front but the fact that she worries about him a lot more than she thinks. Plus Sasuke intends to kill Naruto and will make him forever loser. Sakura has high hopes for Naruto to achieve everything, which is why she yelled back at Sasuke for bad mouthing Naruto.

Naruto vs. Sasuke will happen and when it happens, which is most likely towards the end, Sakura can't communicate with Sasuke before he goes to the battle, rather can do it with Naruto. They will have that calm before storm moment and it could be a breaking point to her character. As I said before, it's given that there will be another Team 7 reunion, but it will be the last one. That will happen after the final fight.


SK(?) and the timeline of SS and NH --Click here to view--
Now I want to comment back at redragon88 previous post about Sasuke and his possible pairing. As I stand today, I believe that SS has been dead since the end of part 1. Sure, Sakura is still in love with him, but it's finally brought to her attention on love, whether it's good or not, and judging by the panel, it's not good at all. In other words, it's finally time to let it go because no one is supporting her to be with Sasuke. No parallels, no hints from Sasuke, no third party support, nothing. It's all on her now and she needs to flick the switch and forever let it go. Does it mean she can be friend with Sasuke? Sure.

Now why did I bring redragon88 post to this? Well I want to say something about Karin. I know well enough that people in here don't really put much focus in SK, but here me out. Otherwise, no need to read further. Ok, to be honest, Sasuke only has two directions: Karin or alone. I recapped the manga a while ago and while I'm not sold on SK, I must say that it has better potential than SS to say the least. People often forgot that Karin is not a typical fangirl who is weaken by a man, and that's what got me liking her as a character. First of all, she has harsh tone with Sasuke when he acts like he's the top dog. For example, when Sasuke told her to use her ability to sense Juugo's location, she scold him for thinking he's the leader all the sudden and tell him to wait up. There are other ones like bashing him for getting brutally hurt if he's the one that defeats Orochimaru, or when Sasuke asked for Itachi's location while hurt. Simply put, she is strong (not in attack power but her will).

People would say, "Well Sakura spends more time with Sasuke than Karin." This is actually not debatable. What's really debatable is how much time did Sasuke and Karin spend in the past 3 years? First of all, Sakura finally got close to Sasuke physically when she was placed in Team 7. First arc is learning the ninja way and dealing with danger. Second is the Chunnin exam, which she spent time with Sasuke all the way to the elimination match, then Sasuke disappears and then they spent time, only for Sasuke to tell her that Naruto did the saving. He didn't even bother mentioning that he was going let both of them escape so he can die for his team. Nope, he only said that Naruto is the one that saves her and he is someone that she couldn't imagine. After that, you got the hospital scene which Sasuke was completely blank by Itachi and then, the apple scene. Then we got the confession and that was it. Wow, Sakura is right, they really never talk. If you noticed, the time is not well spent and she spent more time with Naruto in part 1 and all of them were on positive note. Notice that when she has to keep the curse seal a secret, it was hurting her. When she told Naruto about Orochimaru and all, he brought her smile. That's amazing for a guy to heal a girl quickly with a smile. Also, why Kishi showed the panel of Sakura's smiling after remembering her talk. It's understandable that Naruto needed to know, but the whole couple of panel of Naruto cheering her up wasn't needed unless it's made for, I don't know, character development.

Before going back to Karin, let’s recap Naruto/Hinata for a short moment. The first interaction is when Hinata tells him that he can look at her paper, but he refuses because well, chances that he might fail was high. Sakura steps in and looks like she wants to see him to succeed. Talk about stealing the glory. The next interaction is when Hinata gives him the healing stuff. That’s a way to have Naruto to respect her before going against Neji, so Naruto can see the fight reasonable to fight back Neji. Next, we have Hinata finally got a word to him, which he finally sees her as a friend. Now then, we don’t see them together interacting until Part 2 second arc. Splendid…it was more of an intro to the new design of Team 8 and 10, and apparently, Hinata hasn’t got out of shyness and has no confidence, so she fainted. Search for Itachi Arc, they teamed up but not one interaction other than best of luck. Then, we got her worrying about Naruto against Tobi, no reaction from Naruto. Then, in the Pain Invasion Arc, we got her finally standing up and have confidence, regardless of the odds. She confessed and then easily blasted. Yeah, when I think of a heroine, I’ll think of someone who got one shot and never won a fight outside filler. Sure, Sakura took a backseat, but Sasori vs. Sakura/Chiyo kicked ass and she has been in the manga more enough than any other females. Anyway, Naruto doesn’t comment back on her courage until now. Wow, he only commented on that and not the confession, which a lot of media has ignored it. So yeah, if you noticed, not much is going on there and only like two developments for Hinata. One is acknowledgement of a friend and the next one is acknowledgement of her courage/strength, which she needed that due to well, she didn’t win a fight ever. I see this as more of a Hinata’s development. There is no tease, no Naruto’s reaction that will indicate that she likes her more than a friend, no third party, and the list goes on. Opportunity has been missed and the glory moments were stolen by Sakura (the hug, the cheering, etc.).


Karin, SK vs. SS, and My overall take on SK --Click here to view--
As for Karin, she was in like 2 1/2 arcs with Sasuke (1/2 from Killer Bee's fight). First of all, when we were introduced to Karin, there were impressions that we assume that they met each other already during the time skip. What amazes me is that she gets the treatment of being acknowledged as one of the kind. I guess that was foreshadowing for her to be more than a ninja (Uzumaki). Sasuke knows where she's at and what's she's capable of, so yeah, they know each other. Let's only focus on her, not the rest of the team. Karin has been there when Sasuke cried after Sasuke remembers Itachi. She knows Sasuke's main goal as you can tell with her no reaction when he told the team that his goal is to find Itachi and kill him. Karin witnessed the whole transformation of Sasuke becoming evil, thanks to her ability. Also, it is believed that Karin knows the truth behind Konoha and Itachi as she was there during Danzou's fight. She doesn't react and it may be true that she probably heard the same story from Tobi, but probably shorter.

Sakura doesn't understand Sasuke as much as others like Naruto. She knows that he wants revenge and he wanted power. Karin seems to know more to it and probably knows Itachi and Konoha. Actually, even now, Sakura doesn't know Sasuke's reason for wanting to attack Konoha. The main part that got me rethinking about Karin is the flashback. First of all, one would say Team Taka are just there for one arc (Search for Itachi Arc), which is proven wrong. Second, one would say they have nothing to offer other than being there, which again proven wrong judging by Kabuto's remark to Sasuke. Lastly, Karin has a flashback about meeting Sasuke for the first time. The shocking part is the event, which leaves questions. Karin was in trouble and Sasuke rescued her in FoD. You would have thought her first meeting is back at Orochimaru's hideout. This makes me wonder why Kishi would go this far. Sasuke's smile is something that only fanfic can do. It left me wondering why on earth he smiled for a girl who he doesn't even know. The part that got me rethinking is her comment, "Once more, I want to see that smile." That's not really selfish. Heck, that's something Naruto has been doing for Sakura. Karin couldn't do it because Sasuke went too cold and only his darkness is showing. I actually respect her for liking Sasuke. There is more to her because we only got her origin of meeting Sasuke. We will get a recap of what happened to Sasuke during time skip. My guess is that she saw him and looked surprised to see him at Orochimaru's hideout.

Now, as for her being done with him, it's funny how that line happened before Naruto steps in and present his speech. In that whole chapter, it's all focus on Naruto's determination. There was no Karin. Next chapter, as soon as Sasuke does his cocky smile back in part 1, we now see Karin with "..." impression. Why Kishi place that panel? Does it mean she heard the whole speech? Did she sense something familiar from Sasuke? Remember, she can sense chakra. The fact Karin is alive makes me wonder why if she was considered by some "another fangirl character with nothing but sense power." Another thing, why Karin escapes from jail, only to head to Sasuke? How would she know that he's calm at the moment? Why even go back if she's "done with him"?

Overall, she is not a person to put aside when it comes to this story. The bomb was dropped when Kishi revealed that she's an Uzumaki, which surprised Sasuke, confirming that he didn't know until now. When I heard that, I immediately think that there's a chance for SK. The name Uzumaki is really huge and shouldn't be taken lightly. That name drop for Karin brought her to a higher priority list. That name is not something you can easily drop on any characters. That's like the anime creating a new filler arc with a new Uchiha. While it can make sense on its own, the reward of them has a good moral that actually fits the theme. Sure, none of them are objects, but to our perspective, it has a good meaning. After all, this pairing as in bond/teamwork wise is been praised heavily, let alone Karin.


Teases: foreshadowing? (Fun notes) --Click here to view--
Something that redragon88 said is interesting and that is about the tease from the third party. For whatever reason, Kishi decides to drop the tease to certain characters and expose the couple who are not together, yet ended up together or possibly has the potential to be a couple. The most notable one is Naruto/Sakura. Konohamaru was the first one to tease them that they are a couple while Naruto is all flattered. Then, we got another one in Naruto vs. Gaara with the frogs. For some reason, Kishi decided to use Juugo and Suigetsu to talk about them being together and not wanting to be disturbed. It’s rather strange but does it have a hidden message? It could be true. Naruto thought Shikamaru and Temari were dating, though not true. It sure didn’t stop anime and possibly more outside of anime to continue to fanservice this one. Granted, Kishi told that he doesn’t want Shikamaru to be paired with, but he can just say that to escape the question.

Why do I bring this up? Well, to be honest, it could serve a purpose in a strange way like a foreshadowing. The tease needs to be about a couple, not a single one. Sasuke/Sakura didn’t get any teases at all; just rapid fangirl wants her out to get to Sasuke. Naruto/Hinata didn’t get any teases either. Hinata is really solo on this one for her shyness, which is her character. It doesn’t help that Kishi didn’t do anything further in the movie, rather have like 5 people teases, even though one got mad (AU! Hinata). As I said before, Kishi could possibly do this to let us know that they could be a real couple. I mean one got confirmed from this. Want to guess? It’s Asuma and Kurenai. Kakashi saw them and thought they were on a date as Kurenai denies it. Talk about seeing the future, Kakashi. Well, can’t say you got to rely on this stuff, but it’s interesting to note.


The conclusion --Click here to view--
To end this whole LAP, simply put, NS is most logical pairing there is. The other two, SS/NH, need more time to develop more starting with Sasuke being open minded with Sakura and Naruto actually go out with her for a good fun time. Unfortunately, that’s not going to happen. The time is already been wasted and we are near to the climax. Sakura has more questions for Naruto, while Sasuke continues to be away from them. Hinata only want to express her love, if Kishi care at all, but that’s like the last development for her. Otherwise, the one with Naruto telling her to stand up is her last development. As for Sasuke, do you really think his whole character will change drastically, up to the point we don’t even recognize him anymore? The only difference will be that he will be good and that’s it. The attitude he has will remain. I don’t even know if Sakura expects love from him anymore. She just wants him to be back to them as Team 7. What about romance? Nothing will change. She needs to finally bury the hatchet and we are getting there. SK has a chance to happen. It’s all on Karin’s first action when meeting with Sasuke again. Make it or break it. Otherwise, Sasuke will continue to be alone, which is ok for him. Also, I don’t see Team Taka dying at all. Kishi had the opportunity to do so. Can it still happen? Sure, but it’s unlikely. It’s not like they’re bad, rather just outcast and following the leader, Sasuke. In the end, if NS and SK/Sasuke happens, everyone wins. What about Hinata? To begin with, her theme was more of admiration of a hero, which is Naruto. So you could kind-of say she’s a fan. Yeah, she will be alone. Then again, Kishi could pair her with Neji or Kiba or whoever. He sure acknowledges that incest is ok in his movie and I have nothing against it. I already encountered that (Elfien Lied). That’s all I want to say.

Questions? cool.gif

Edited by NaruSaku4Life3g, 22 October 2012 - 05:37 AM.


#5147 Transformers03

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 05:51 AM

QUOTE (Derock @ Oct 20 2012, 11:47 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Only for the bolded part:

You know the funniest part about Sakura's confession to Naruto? It was critically praised by the manga critics during their volume reviews, unlike Hinata's confession. They said it was well-received because of not only for dramatic purpose but makes the audience guessing the fact whenever she was sincere or faking it.


I honestly believe that Sakura's confession to Naruto was one of the best written scenes in the entire series. I love the manipulation of the audiences feelings and expectation, and I also honestly believe that we are suppose to be rooting for them to get together. It's just to many fans see it to negatively, most assumed it was a lie and bashed Sakura for it. In reality, even if it was a fake, she did all that for him, for Naruto.

QUOTE (NaruSaku4Life3g @ Oct 21 2012, 09:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Man, I need to stop doing these LAP. Anyway, here we go!

Why NS has the most advantage out of the three right now --Click here to view--
@Paptala: Great post as always. I highly agree. Say what you want, but that movie was the biggest opportunity that Kishi could have established his approach on pairings and he decided to go with NaruSaku. Hinata was used for comedy and only interacted with Naruto once for a short time. Actually, she interacted with Sakura more than Naruto. In the end, she got a small screen time and nothing but comedy came out from her. As for Sasuke, barely 3 minutes on the movie and only to show Sakura's shallow love (or naive) for Sasuke. Again, Kishi has no reason to do this scene at all. He chose to do so for making a connection to the manga and continues to tease Naruto's love for Sakura. He only continues to create hope for Naruto to be together with Sakura in the end.

Like I said before, if you want SS and NH to be logical and to happen, they need an arc solely based on them, but it looks like that won't happen, especially to SS. Sakura already established that Naruto is the only one that will deal with Sasuke and no one should be in the way. What brought her back to curiosity is his statement about dying together as in what's his plan and is he trying to keep it to himself, even though she heard him. So, she has more concerns on Naruto because not only he is the only one that's with her as well as Sasuke is on the enemy's front but the fact that she worries about him a lot more than she thinks. Plus Sasuke intends to kill Naruto and will make him forever loser. Sakura has high hopes for Naruto to achieve everything, which is why she yelled back at Sasuke for bad mouthing Naruto.

Naruto vs. Sasuke will happen and when it happens, which is most likely towards the end, Sakura can't communicate with Sasuke before he goes to the battle, rather can do it with Naruto. They will have that calm before storm moment and it could be a breaking point to her character. As I said before, it's given that there will be another Team 7 reunion, but it will be the last one. That will happen after the final fight.

SK(?) and the timeline of SS and NH --Click here to view--
Now I want to comment back at redragon88 previous post about Sasuke and his possible pairing. As I stand today, I believe that SS has been dead since the end of part 1. Sure, Sakura is still in love with him, but it's finally brought to her attention on love, whether it's good or not, and judging by the panel, it's not good at all. In other words, it's finally time to let it go because no one is supporting her to be with Sasuke. No parallels, no hints from Sasuke, no third party support, nothing. It's all on her now and she needs to flick the switch and forever let it go. Does it mean she can be friend with Sasuke? Sure.

Now why did I bring redragon88 post to this? Well I want to say something about Karin. I know well enough that people in here don't really put much focus in SK, but here me out. Otherwise, no need to read further. Ok, to be honest, Sasuke only has two directions: Karin or alone. I recapped the manga a while ago and while I'm not sold on SK, I must say that it has better potential than SS to say the least. People often forgot that Karin is not a typical fangirl who is weaken by a man, and that's what got me liking her as a character. First of all, she has harsh tone with Sasuke when he acts like he's the top dog. For example, when Sasuke told her to use her ability to sense Juugo's location, she scold him for thinking he's the leader all the sudden and tell him to wait up. There are other ones like bashing him for getting brutally hurt if he's the one that defeats Orochimaru, or when Sasuke asked for Itachi's location while hurt. Simply put, she is strong (not in attack power but her will).

People would say, "Well Sakura spends more time with Sasuke than Karin." This is actually not debatable. What's really debatable is how much time did Sasuke and Karin spend in the past 3 years? First of all, Sakura finally got close to Sasuke physically when she was placed in Team 7. First arc is learning the ninja way and dealing with danger. Second is the Chunnin exam, which she spent time with Sasuke all the way to the elimination match, then Sasuke disappears and then they spent time, only for Sasuke to tell her that Naruto did the saving. He didn't even bother mentioning that he was going let both of them escape so he can die for his team. Nope, he only said that Naruto is the one that saves her and he is someone that she couldn't imagine. After that, you got the hospital scene which Sasuke was completely blank by Itachi and then, the apple scene. Then we got the confession and that was it. Wow, Sakura is right, they really never talk. If you noticed, the time is not well spent and she spent more time with Naruto in part 1 and all of them were on positive note. Notice that when she has to keep the curse seal a secret, it was hurting her. When she told Naruto about Orochimaru and all, he brought her smile. That's amazing for a guy to heal a girl quickly with a smile. Also, why Kishi showed the panel of Sakura's smiling after remembering her talk. It's understandable that Naruto needed to know, but the whole couple of panel of Naruto cheering her up wasn't needed unless it's made for, I don't know, character development.

Before going back to Karin, let’s recap Naruto/Hinata for a short moment. The first interaction is when Hinata tells him that he can look at her paper, but he refuses because well, chances that he might fail was high. Sakura steps in and looks like she wants to see him to succeed. Talk about stealing the glory. The next interaction is when Hinata gives him the healing stuff. That’s a way to have Naruto to respect her before going against Neji, so Naruto can see the fight reasonable to fight back Neji. Next, we have Hinata finally got a word to him, which he finally sees her as a friend. Now then, we don’t see them together interacting until Part 2 second arc. Splendid…it was more of an intro to the new design of Team 8 and 10, and apparently, Hinata hasn’t got out of shyness and has no confidence, so she fainted. Search for Itachi Arc, they teamed up but not one interaction other than best of luck. Then, we got her worrying about Naruto against Tobi, no reaction from Naruto. Then, in the Pain Invasion Arc, we got her finally standing up and have confidence, regardless of the odds. She confessed and then easily blasted. Yeah, when I think of a heroine, I’ll think of someone who got one shot and never won a fight outside filler. Sure, Sakura took a backseat, but Sasori vs. Sakura/Chiyo kicked ass and she has been in the manga more enough than any other females. Anyway, Naruto doesn’t comment back on her courage until now. Wow, he only commented on that and not the confession, which a lot of media has ignored it. So yeah, if you noticed, not much is going on there and only like two developments for Hinata. One is acknowledgement of a friend and the next one is acknowledgement of her courage/strength, which she needed that due to well, she didn’t win a fight ever. I see this as more of a Hinata’s development. There is no tease, no Naruto’s reaction that will indicate that she likes her more than a friend, no third party, and the list goes on. Opportunity has been missed and the glory moments were stolen by Sakura (the hug, the cheering, etc.).

Karin, SK vs. SS, and My overall take on SK --Click here to view--
As for Karin, she was in like 2 1/2 arcs with Sasuke (1/2 from Killer Bee's fight). First of all, when we were introduced to Karin, there were impressions that we assume that they met each other already during the time skip. What amazes me is that she gets the treatment of being acknowledged as one of the kind. I guess that was foreshadowing for her to be more than a ninja (Uzumaki). Sasuke knows where she's at and what's she's capable of, so yeah, they know each other. Let's only focus on her, not the rest of the team. Karin has been there when Sasuke cried after Sasuke remembers Itachi. She knows Sasuke's main goal as you can tell with her no reaction when he told the team that his goal is to find Itachi and kill him. Karin witnessed the whole transformation of Sasuke becoming evil, thanks to her ability. Also, it is believed that Karin knows the truth behind Konoha and Itachi as she was there during Danzou's fight. She doesn't react and it may be true that she probably heard the same story from Tobi, but probably shorter.

Sakura doesn't understand Sasuke as much as others like Naruto. She knows that he wants revenge and he wanted power. Karin seems to know more to it and probably knows Itachi and Konoha. Actually, even now, Sakura doesn't know Sasuke's reason for wanting to attack Konoha. The main part that got me rethinking about Karin is the flashback. First of all, one would say Team Taka are just there for one arc (Search for Itachi Arc), which is proven wrong. Second, one would say they have nothing to offer other than being there, which again proven wrong judging by Kabuto's remark to Sasuke. Lastly, Karin has a flashback about meeting Sasuke for the first time. The shocking part is the event, which leaves questions. Karin was in trouble and Sasuke rescued her in FoD. You would have thought her first meeting is back at Orochimaru's hideout. This makes me wonder why Kishi would go this far. Sasuke's smile is something that only fanfic can do. It left me wondering why on earth he smiled for a girl who he doesn't even know. The part that got me rethinking is her comment, "Once more, I want to see that smile." That's not really selfish. Heck, that's something Naruto has been doing for Sakura. Karin couldn't do it because Sasuke went too cold and only his darkness is showing. I actually respect her for liking Sasuke. There is more to her because we only got her origin of meeting Sasuke. We will get a recap of what happened to Sasuke during time skip. My guess is that she saw him and looked surprised to see him at Orochimaru's hideout.

Now, as for her being done with him, it's funny how that line happened before Naruto steps in and present his speech. In that whole chapter, it's all focus on Naruto's determination. There was no Karin. Next chapter, as soon as Sasuke does his cocky smile back in part 1, we now see Karin with "..." impression. Why Kishi place that panel? Does it mean she heard the whole speech? Did she sense something familiar from Sasuke? Remember, she can sense chakra. The fact Karin is alive makes me wonder why if she was considered by some "another fangirl character with nothing but sense power." Another thing, why Karin escapes from jail, only to head to Sasuke? How would she know that he's calm at the moment? Why even go back if she's "done with him"?

Overall, she is not a person to put aside when it comes to this story. The bomb was dropped when Kishi revealed that she's an Uzumaki, which surprised Sasuke, confirming that he didn't know until now. When I heard that, I immediately think that there's a chance for SK. The name Uzumaki is really huge and shouldn't be taken lightly. That name drop for Karin brought her to a higher priority list. That name is not something you can easily drop on any characters. That's like the anime creating a new filler arc with a new Uchiha. While it can make sense on its own, the reward of them has a good moral that actually fits the theme. Sure, none of them are objects, but to our perspective, it has a good meaning. After all, this pairing as in bond/teamwork wise is been praised heavily, let alone Karin.

Teases: foreshadowing? (Fun notes) --Click here to view--
Something that redragon88 said is interesting and that is about the tease from the third party. For whatever reason, Kishi decides to drop the tease to certain characters and expose the couple who are not together, yet ended up together or possibly has the potential to be a couple. The most notable one is Naruto/Sakura. Konohamaru was the first one to tease them that they are a couple while Naruto is all flattered. Then, we got another one in Naruto vs. Gaara with the frogs. For some reason, Kishi decided to use Juugo and Suigetsu to talk about them being together and not wanting to be disturbed. It’s rather strange but does it have a hidden message? It could be true. Naruto thought Shikamaru and Temari were dating, though not true. It sure didn’t stop anime and possibly more outside of anime to continue to fanservice this one. Granted, Kishi told that he doesn’t want Shikamaru to be paired with, but he can just say that to escape the question.

Why do I bring this up? Well, to be honest, it could serve a purpose in a strange way like a foreshadowing. The tease needs to be about a couple, not a single one. Sasuke/Sakura didn’t get any teases at all; just rapid fangirl wants her out to get to Sasuke. Naruto/Hinata didn’t get any teases either. Hinata is really solo on this one for her shyness, which is her character. It doesn’t help that Kishi didn’t do anything further in the movie, rather have like 5 people teases, even though one got mad (AU! Hinata). As I said before, Kishi could possibly do this to let us know that they could be a real couple. I mean one got confirmed from this. Want to guess? It’s Asuma and Kurenai. Kakashi saw them and thought they were on a date as Kurenai denies it. Talk about seeing the future, Kakashi. Well, can’t say you got to rely on this stuff, but it’s interesting to note.

The conclusion --Click here to view--
To end this whole LAP, simply put, NS is most logical pairing there is. The other two, SS/NH, need more time to develop more starting with Sasuke being open minded with Sakura and Naruto actually go out with her for a good fun time. Unfortunately, that’s not going to happen. The time is already been wasted and we are near to the climax. Sakura has more questions for Naruto, while Sasuke continues to be away from them. Hinata only want to express her love, if Kishi care at all, but that’s like the last development for her. Otherwise, the one with Naruto telling her to stand up is her last development. As for Sasuke, do you really think his whole character will change drastically, up to the point we don’t even recognize him anymore? The only difference will be that he will be good and that’s it. The attitude he has will remain. I don’t even know if Sakura expects love from him anymore. She just wants him to be back to them as Team 7. What about romance? Nothing will change. She needs to finally bury the hatchet and we are getting there. SK has a chance to happen. It’s all on Karin’s first action when meeting with Sasuke again. Make it or break it. Otherwise, Sasuke will continue to be alone, which is ok for him. Also, I don’t see Team Taka dying at all. Kishi had the opportunity to do so. Can it still happen? Sure, but it’s unlikely. It’s not like they’re bad, rather just outcast and following the leader, Sasuke. In the end, if NS and SK/Sasuke happens, everyone wins. What about Hinata? To begin with, her theme was more of admiration of a hero, which is Naruto. So you could kind-of say she’s a fan. Yeah, she will be alone. Then again, Kishi could pair her with Neji or Kiba or whoever. He sure acknowledges that incest is ok in his movie and I have nothing against it. I already encountered that (Elfien Lied). That’s all I want to say.
Questions? cool.gif


GREAT POST.
I'll replay more later.........

#5148 narulsaku

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 06:05 AM

all i know that sakura cares for naruto but after that confession would naruto accept that if sakura again says i love you naruto!?

god is sweet.......
courage,,,,,,,,,,,
doesn't always roar.............
sometimescourage is quite voice at the
end of the day saying,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
'll try again tomorrow"


#5149 PhenixElite

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 06:31 AM

QUOTE (NaruSaku4Life3g @ Oct 22 2012, 05:20 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Man, I need to stop doing these LAP. Anyway, here we go!

Why NS has the most advantage out of the three right now --Click here to view--
@Paptala: Great post as always. I highly agree. Say what you want, but that movie was the biggest opportunity that Kishi could have established his approach on pairings and he decided to go with NaruSaku. Hinata was used for comedy and only interacted with Naruto once for a short time. Actually, she interacted with Sakura more than Naruto. In the end, she got a small screen time and nothing but comedy came out from her. As for Sasuke, barely 3 minutes on the movie and only to show Sakura's shallow love (or naive) for Sasuke. Again, Kishi has no reason to do this scene at all. He chose to do so for making a connection to the manga and continues to tease Naruto's love for Sakura. He only continues to create hope for Naruto to be together with Sakura in the end.

Like I said before, if you want SS and NH to be logical and to happen, they need an arc solely based on them, but it looks like that won't happen, especially to SS. Sakura already established that Naruto is the only one that will deal with Sasuke and no one should be in the way. What brought her back to curiosity is his statement about dying together as in what's his plan and is he trying to keep it to himself, even though she heard him. So, she has more concerns on Naruto because not only he is the only one that's with her as well as Sasuke is on the enemy's front but the fact that she worries about him a lot more than she thinks. Plus Sasuke intends to kill Naruto and will make him forever loser. Sakura has high hopes for Naruto to achieve everything, which is why she yelled back at Sasuke for bad mouthing Naruto.

Naruto vs. Sasuke will happen and when it happens, which is most likely towards the end, Sakura can't communicate with Sasuke before he goes to the battle, rather can do it with Naruto. They will have that calm before storm moment and it could be a breaking point to her character. As I said before, it's given that there will be another Team 7 reunion, but it will be the last one. That will happen after the final fight.

SK(?) and the timeline of SS and NH --Click here to view--
Now I want to comment back at redragon88 previous post about Sasuke and his possible pairing. As I stand today, I believe that SS has been dead since the end of part 1. Sure, Sakura is still in love with him, but it's finally brought to her attention on love, whether it's good or not, and judging by the panel, it's not good at all. In other words, it's finally time to let it go because no one is supporting her to be with Sasuke. No parallels, no hints from Sasuke, no third party support, nothing. It's all on her now and she needs to flick the switch and forever let it go. Does it mean she can be friend with Sasuke? Sure.

Now why did I bring redragon88 post to this? Well I want to say something about Karin. I know well enough that people in here don't really put much focus in SK, but here me out. Otherwise, no need to read further. Ok, to be honest, Sasuke only has two directions: Karin or alone. I recapped the manga a while ago and while I'm not sold on SK, I must say that it has better potential than SS to say the least. People often forgot that Karin is not a typical fangirl who is weaken by a man, and that's what got me liking her as a character. First of all, she has harsh tone with Sasuke when he acts like he's the top dog. For example, when Sasuke told her to use her ability to sense Juugo's location, she scold him for thinking he's the leader all the sudden and tell him to wait up. There are other ones like bashing him for getting brutally hurt if he's the one that defeats Orochimaru, or when Sasuke asked for Itachi's location while hurt. Simply put, she is strong (not in attack power but her will).

People would say, "Well Sakura spends more time with Sasuke than Karin." This is actually not debatable. What's really debatable is how much time did Sasuke and Karin spend in the past 3 years? First of all, Sakura finally got close to Sasuke physically when she was placed in Team 7. First arc is learning the ninja way and dealing with danger. Second is the Chunnin exam, which she spent time with Sasuke all the way to the elimination match, then Sasuke disappears and then they spent time, only for Sasuke to tell her that Naruto did the saving. He didn't even bother mentioning that he was going let both of them escape so he can die for his team. Nope, he only said that Naruto is the one that saves her and he is someone that she couldn't imagine. After that, you got the hospital scene which Sasuke was completely blank by Itachi and then, the apple scene. Then we got the confession and that was it. Wow, Sakura is right, they really never talk. If you noticed, the time is not well spent and she spent more time with Naruto in part 1 and all of them were on positive note. Notice that when she has to keep the curse seal a secret, it was hurting her. When she told Naruto about Orochimaru and all, he brought her smile. That's amazing for a guy to heal a girl quickly with a smile. Also, why Kishi showed the panel of Sakura's smiling after remembering her talk. It's understandable that Naruto needed to know, but the whole couple of panel of Naruto cheering her up wasn't needed unless it's made for, I don't know, character development.

Before going back to Karin, let’s recap Naruto/Hinata for a short moment. The first interaction is when Hinata tells him that he can look at her paper, but he refuses because well, chances that he might fail was high. Sakura steps in and looks like she wants to see him to succeed. Talk about stealing the glory. The next interaction is when Hinata gives him the healing stuff. That’s a way to have Naruto to respect her before going against Neji, so Naruto can see the fight reasonable to fight back Neji. Next, we have Hinata finally got a word to him, which he finally sees her as a friend. Now then, we don’t see them together interacting until Part 2 second arc. Splendid…it was more of an intro to the new design of Team 8 and 10, and apparently, Hinata hasn’t got out of shyness and has no confidence, so she fainted. Search for Itachi Arc, they teamed up but not one interaction other than best of luck. Then, we got her worrying about Naruto against Tobi, no reaction from Naruto. Then, in the Pain Invasion Arc, we got her finally standing up and have confidence, regardless of the odds. She confessed and then easily blasted. Yeah, when I think of a heroine, I’ll think of someone who got one shot and never won a fight outside filler. Sure, Sakura took a backseat, but Sasori vs. Sakura/Chiyo kicked ass and she has been in the manga more enough than any other females. Anyway, Naruto doesn’t comment back on her courage until now. Wow, he only commented on that and not the confession, which a lot of media has ignored it. So yeah, if you noticed, not much is going on there and only like two developments for Hinata. One is acknowledgement of a friend and the next one is acknowledgement of her courage/strength, which she needed that due to well, she didn’t win a fight ever. I see this as more of a Hinata’s development. There is no tease, no Naruto’s reaction that will indicate that she likes her more than a friend, no third party, and the list goes on. Opportunity has been missed and the glory moments were stolen by Sakura (the hug, the cheering, etc.).

Karin, SK vs. SS, and My overall take on SK --Click here to view--
As for Karin, she was in like 2 1/2 arcs with Sasuke (1/2 from Killer Bee's fight). First of all, when we were introduced to Karin, there were impressions that we assume that they met each other already during the time skip. What amazes me is that she gets the treatment of being acknowledged as one of the kind. I guess that was foreshadowing for her to be more than a ninja (Uzumaki). Sasuke knows where she's at and what's she's capable of, so yeah, they know each other. Let's only focus on her, not the rest of the team. Karin has been there when Sasuke cried after Sasuke remembers Itachi. She knows Sasuke's main goal as you can tell with her no reaction when he told the team that his goal is to find Itachi and kill him. Karin witnessed the whole transformation of Sasuke becoming evil, thanks to her ability. Also, it is believed that Karin knows the truth behind Konoha and Itachi as she was there during Danzou's fight. She doesn't react and it may be true that she probably heard the same story from Tobi, but probably shorter.

Sakura doesn't understand Sasuke as much as others like Naruto. She knows that he wants revenge and he wanted power. Karin seems to know more to it and probably knows Itachi and Konoha. Actually, even now, Sakura doesn't know Sasuke's reason for wanting to attack Konoha. The main part that got me rethinking about Karin is the flashback. First of all, one would say Team Taka are just there for one arc (Search for Itachi Arc), which is proven wrong. Second, one would say they have nothing to offer other than being there, which again proven wrong judging by Kabuto's remark to Sasuke. Lastly, Karin has a flashback about meeting Sasuke for the first time. The shocking part is the event, which leaves questions. Karin was in trouble and Sasuke rescued her in FoD. You would have thought her first meeting is back at Orochimaru's hideout. This makes me wonder why Kishi would go this far. Sasuke's smile is something that only fanfic can do. It left me wondering why on earth he smiled for a girl who he doesn't even know. The part that got me rethinking is her comment, "Once more, I want to see that smile." That's not really selfish. Heck, that's something Naruto has been doing for Sakura. Karin couldn't do it because Sasuke went too cold and only his darkness is showing. I actually respect her for liking Sasuke. There is more to her because we only got her origin of meeting Sasuke. We will get a recap of what happened to Sasuke during time skip. My guess is that she saw him and looked surprised to see him at Orochimaru's hideout.

Now, as for her being done with him, it's funny how that line happened before Naruto steps in and present his speech. In that whole chapter, it's all focus on Naruto's determination. There was no Karin. Next chapter, as soon as Sasuke does his cocky smile back in part 1, we now see Karin with "..." impression. Why Kishi place that panel? Does it mean she heard the whole speech? Did she sense something familiar from Sasuke? Remember, she can sense chakra. The fact Karin is alive makes me wonder why if she was considered by some "another fangirl character with nothing but sense power." Another thing, why Karin escapes from jail, only to head to Sasuke? How would she know that he's calm at the moment? Why even go back if she's "done with him"?

Overall, she is not a person to put aside when it comes to this story. The bomb was dropped when Kishi revealed that she's an Uzumaki, which surprised Sasuke, confirming that he didn't know until now. When I heard that, I immediately think that there's a chance for SK. The name Uzumaki is really huge and shouldn't be taken lightly. That name drop for Karin brought her to a higher priority list. That name is not something you can easily drop on any characters. That's like the anime creating a new filler arc with a new Uchiha. While it can make sense on its own, the reward of them has a good moral that actually fits the theme. Sure, none of them are objects, but to our perspective, it has a good meaning. After all, this pairing as in bond/teamwork wise is been praised heavily, let alone Karin.

Teases: foreshadowing? (Fun notes) --Click here to view--
Something that redragon88 said is interesting and that is about the tease from the third party. For whatever reason, Kishi decides to drop the tease to certain characters and expose the couple who are not together, yet ended up together or possibly has the potential to be a couple. The most notable one is Naruto/Sakura. Konohamaru was the first one to tease them that they are a couple while Naruto is all flattered. Then, we got another one in Naruto vs. Gaara with the frogs. For some reason, Kishi decided to use Juugo and Suigetsu to talk about them being together and not wanting to be disturbed. It’s rather strange but does it have a hidden message? It could be true. Naruto thought Shikamaru and Temari were dating, though not true. It sure didn’t stop anime and possibly more outside of anime to continue to fanservice this one. Granted, Kishi told that he doesn’t want Shikamaru to be paired with, but he can just say that to escape the question.

Why do I bring this up? Well, to be honest, it could serve a purpose in a strange way like a foreshadowing. The tease needs to be about a couple, not a single one. Sasuke/Sakura didn’t get any teases at all; just rapid fangirl wants her out to get to Sasuke. Naruto/Hinata didn’t get any teases either. Hinata is really solo on this one for her shyness, which is her character. It doesn’t help that Kishi didn’t do anything further in the movie, rather have like 5 people teases, even though one got mad (AU! Hinata). As I said before, Kishi could possibly do this to let us know that they could be a real couple. I mean one got confirmed from this. Want to guess? It’s Asuma and Kurenai. Kakashi saw them and thought they were on a date as Kurenai denies it. Talk about seeing the future, Kakashi. Well, can’t say you got to rely on this stuff, but it’s interesting to note.

The conclusion --Click here to view--
To end this whole LAP, simply put, NS is most logical pairing there is. The other two, SS/NH, need more time to develop more starting with Sasuke being open minded with Sakura and Naruto actually go out with her for a good fun time. Unfortunately, that’s not going to happen. The time is already been wasted and we are near to the climax. Sakura has more questions for Naruto, while Sasuke continues to be away from them. Hinata only want to express her love, if Kishi care at all, but that’s like the last development for her. Otherwise, the one with Naruto telling her to stand up is her last development. As for Sasuke, do you really think his whole character will change drastically, up to the point we don’t even recognize him anymore? The only difference will be that he will be good and that’s it. The attitude he has will remain. I don’t even know if Sakura expects love from him anymore. She just wants him to be back to them as Team 7. What about romance? Nothing will change. She needs to finally bury the hatchet and we are getting there. SK has a chance to happen. It’s all on Karin’s first action when meeting with Sasuke again. Make it or break it. Otherwise, Sasuke will continue to be alone, which is ok for him. Also, I don’t see Team Taka dying at all. Kishi had the opportunity to do so. Can it still happen? Sure, but it’s unlikely. It’s not like they’re bad, rather just outcast and following the leader, Sasuke. In the end, if NS and SK/Sasuke happens, everyone wins. What about Hinata? To begin with, her theme was more of admiration of a hero, which is Naruto. So you could kind-of say she’s a fan. Yeah, she will be alone. Then again, Kishi could pair her with Neji or Kiba or whoever. He sure acknowledges that incest is ok in his movie and I have nothing against it. I already encountered that (Elfien Lied). That’s all I want to say.
Questions? cool.gif

Marvelous post!!!

Couldnt agree more! For me there are no questions left.
You pointed out everything i got on my mind, but i would be to lazy to write that all down laugh.gif.
Really well done!

ada_wong_signature_by_valxy-d5m0oa1.png


#5150 candycane-chan

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 06:38 AM

    QUOTE (NaruSaku4Life3g @ Oct 22 2012, 08:50 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    Man, I need to stop doing these LAP. Anyway, here we go!

    Why NS has the most advantage out of the three right now --Click here to view--
    @Paptala: Great post as always. I highly agree. Say what you want, but that movie was the biggest opportunity that Kishi could have established his approach on pairings and he decided to go with NaruSaku. Hinata was used for comedy and only interacted with Naruto once for a short time. Actually, she interacted with Sakura more than Naruto. In the end, she got a small screen time and nothing but comedy came out from her. As for Sasuke, barely 3 minutes on the movie and only to show Sakura's shallow love (or naive) for Sasuke. Again, Kishi has no reason to do this scene at all. He chose to do so for making a connection to the manga and continues to tease Naruto's love for Sakura. He only continues to create hope for Naruto to be together with Sakura in the end.

    Like I said before, if you want SS and NH to be logical and to happen, they need an arc solely based on them, but it looks like that won't happen, especially to SS. Sakura already established that Naruto is the only one that will deal with Sasuke and no one should be in the way. What brought her back to curiosity is his statement about dying together as in what's his plan and is he trying to keep it to himself, even though she heard him. So, she has more concerns on Naruto because not only he is the only one that's with her as well as Sasuke is on the enemy's front but the fact that she worries about him a lot more than she thinks. Plus Sasuke intends to kill Naruto and will make him forever loser. Sakura has high hopes for Naruto to achieve everything, which is why she yelled back at Sasuke for bad mouthing Naruto.

    Naruto vs. Sasuke will happen and when it happens, which is most likely towards the end, Sakura can't communicate with Sasuke before he goes to the battle, rather can do it with Naruto. They will have that calm before storm moment and it could be a breaking point to her character. As I said before, it's given that there will be another Team 7 reunion, but it will be the last one. That will happen after the final fight.

    SK(?) and the timeline of SS and NH --Click here to view--
    Now I want to comment back at redragon88 previous post about Sasuke and his possible pairing. As I stand today, I believe that SS has been dead since the end of part 1. Sure, Sakura is still in love with him, but it's finally brought to her attention on love, whether it's good or not, and judging by the panel, it's not good at all. In other words, it's finally time to let it go because no one is supporting her to be with Sasuke. No parallels, no hints from Sasuke, no third party support, nothing. It's all on her now and she needs to flick the switch and forever let it go. Does it mean she can be friend with Sasuke? Sure.

    Now why did I bring redragon88 post to this? Well I want to say something about Karin. I know well enough that people in here don't really put much focus in SK, but here me out. Otherwise, no need to read further. Ok, to be honest, Sasuke only has two directions: Karin or alone. I recapped the manga a while ago and while I'm not sold on SK, I must say that it has better potential than SS to say the least. People often forgot that Karin is not a typical fangirl who is weaken by a man, and that's what got me liking her as a character. First of all, she has harsh tone with Sasuke when he acts like he's the top dog. For example, when Sasuke told her to use her ability to sense Juugo's location, she scold him for thinking he's the leader all the sudden and tell him to wait up. There are other ones like bashing him for getting brutally hurt if he's the one that defeats Orochimaru, or when Sasuke asked for Itachi's location while hurt. Simply put, she is strong (not in attack power but her will).

    People would say, "Well Sakura spends more time with Sasuke than Karin." This is actually not debatable. What's really debatable is how much time did Sasuke and Karin spend in the past 3 years? First of all, Sakura finally got close to Sasuke physically when she was placed in Team 7. First arc is learning the ninja way and dealing with danger. Second is the Chunnin exam, which she spent time with Sasuke all the way to the elimination match, then Sasuke disappears and then they spent time, only for Sasuke to tell her that Naruto did the saving. He didn't even bother mentioning that he was going let both of them escape so he can die for his team. Nope, he only said that Naruto is the one that saves her and he is someone that she couldn't imagine. After that, you got the hospital scene which Sasuke was completely blank by Itachi and then, the apple scene. Then we got the confession and that was it. Wow, Sakura is right, they really never talk. If you noticed, the time is not well spent and she spent more time with Naruto in part 1 and all of them were on positive note. Notice that when she has to keep the curse seal a secret, it was hurting her. When she told Naruto about Orochimaru and all, he brought her smile. That's amazing for a guy to heal a girl quickly with a smile. Also, why Kishi showed the panel of Sakura's smiling after remembering her talk. It's understandable that Naruto needed to know, but the whole couple of panel of Naruto cheering her up wasn't needed unless it's made for, I don't know, character development.

    Before going back to Karin, let’s recap Naruto/Hinata for a short moment. The first interaction is when Hinata tells him that he can look at her paper, but he refuses because well, chances that he might fail was high. Sakura steps in and looks like she wants to see him to succeed. Talk about stealing the glory. The next interaction is when Hinata gives him the healing stuff. That’s a way to have Naruto to respect her before going against Neji, so Naruto can see the fight reasonable to fight back Neji. Next, we have Hinata finally got a word to him, which he finally sees her as a friend. Now then, we don’t see them together interacting until Part 2 second arc. Splendid…it was more of an intro to the new design of Team 8 and 10, and apparently, Hinata hasn’t got out of shyness and has no confidence, so she fainted. Search for Itachi Arc, they teamed up but not one interaction other than best of luck. Then, we got her worrying about Naruto against Tobi, no reaction from Naruto. Then, in the Pain Invasion Arc, we got her finally standing up and have confidence, regardless of the odds. She confessed and then easily blasted. Yeah, when I think of a heroine, I’ll think of someone who got one shot and never won a fight outside filler. Sure, Sakura took a backseat, but Sasori vs. Sakura/Chiyo kicked ass and she has been in the manga more enough than any other females. Anyway, Naruto doesn’t comment back on her courage until now. Wow, he only commented on that and not the confession, which a lot of media has ignored it. So yeah, if you noticed, not much is going on there and only like two developments for Hinata. One is acknowledgement of a friend and the next one is acknowledgement of her courage/strength, which she needed that due to well, she didn’t win a fight ever. I see this as more of a Hinata’s development. There is no tease, no Naruto’s reaction that will indicate that she likes her more than a friend, no third party, and the list goes on. Opportunity has been missed and the glory moments were stolen by Sakura (the hug, the cheering, etc.).

    Karin, SK vs. SS, and My overall take on SK --Click here to view--
    As for Karin, she was in like 2 1/2 arcs with Sasuke (1/2 from Killer Bee's fight). First of all, when we were introduced to Karin, there were impressions that we assume that they met each other already during the time skip. What amazes me is that she gets the treatment of being acknowledged as one of the kind. I guess that was foreshadowing for her to be more than a ninja (Uzumaki). Sasuke knows where she's at and what's she's capable of, so yeah, they know each other. Let's only focus on her, not the rest of the team. Karin has been there when Sasuke cried after Sasuke remembers Itachi. She knows Sasuke's main goal as you can tell with her no reaction when he told the team that his goal is to find Itachi and kill him. Karin witnessed the whole transformation of Sasuke becoming evil, thanks to her ability. Also, it is believed that Karin knows the truth behind Konoha and Itachi as she was there during Danzou's fight. She doesn't react and it may be true that she probably heard the same story from Tobi, but probably shorter.

    Sakura doesn't understand Sasuke as much as others like Naruto. She knows that he wants revenge and he wanted power. Karin seems to know more to it and probably knows Itachi and Konoha. Actually, even now, Sakura doesn't know Sasuke's reason for wanting to attack Konoha. The main part that got me rethinking about Karin is the flashback. First of all, one would say Team Taka are just there for one arc (Search for Itachi Arc), which is proven wrong. Second, one would say they have nothing to offer other than being there, which again proven wrong judging by Kabuto's remark to Sasuke. Lastly, Karin has a flashback about meeting Sasuke for the first time. The shocking part is the event, which leaves questions. Karin was in trouble and Sasuke rescued her in FoD. You would have thought her first meeting is back at Orochimaru's hideout. This makes me wonder why Kishi would go this far. Sasuke's smile is something that only fanfic can do. It left me wondering why on earth he smiled for a girl who he doesn't even know. The part that got me rethinking is her comment, "Once more, I want to see that smile." That's not really selfish. Heck, that's something Naruto has been doing for Sakura. Karin couldn't do it because Sasuke went too cold and only his darkness is showing. I actually respect her for liking Sasuke. There is more to her because we only got her origin of meeting Sasuke. We will get a recap of what happened to Sasuke during time skip. My guess is that she saw him and looked surprised to see him at Orochimaru's hideout.

    Now, as for her being done with him, it's funny how that line happened before Naruto steps in and present his speech. In that whole chapter, it's all focus on Naruto's determination. There was no Karin. Next chapter, as soon as Sasuke does his cocky smile back in part 1, we now see Karin with "..." impression. Why Kishi place that panel? Does it mean she heard the whole speech? Did she sense something familiar from Sasuke? Remember, she can sense chakra. The fact Karin is alive makes me wonder why if she was considered by some "another fangirl character with nothing but sense power." Another thing, why Karin escapes from jail, only to head to Sasuke? How would she know that he's calm at the moment? Why even go back if she's "done with him"?

    Overall, she is not a person to put aside when it comes to this story. The bomb was dropped when Kishi revealed that she's an Uzumaki, which surprised Sasuke, confirming that he didn't know until now. When I heard that, I immediately think that there's a chance for SK. The name Uzumaki is really huge and shouldn't be taken lightly. That name drop for Karin brought her to a higher priority list. That name is not something you can easily drop on any characters. That's like the anime creating a new filler arc with a new Uchiha. While it can make sense on its own, the reward of them has a good moral that actually fits the theme. Sure, none of them are objects, but to our perspective, it has a good meaning. After all, this pairing as in bond/teamwork wise is been praised heavily, let alone Karin.

    Teases: foreshadowing? (Fun notes) --Click here to view--
    Something that redragon88 said is interesting and that is about the tease from the third party. For whatever reason, Kishi decides to drop the tease to certain characters and expose the couple who are not together, yet ended up together or possibly has the potential to be a couple. The most notable one is Naruto/Sakura. Konohamaru was the first one to tease them that they are a couple while Naruto is all flattered. Then, we got another one in Naruto vs. Gaara with the frogs. For some reason, Kishi decided to use Juugo and Suigetsu to talk about them being together and not wanting to be disturbed. It’s rather strange but does it have a hidden message? It could be true. Naruto thought Shikamaru and Temari were dating, though not true. It sure didn’t stop anime and possibly more outside of anime to continue to fanservice this one. Granted, Kishi told that he doesn’t want Shikamaru to be paired with, but he can just say that to escape the question.

    Why do I bring this up? Well, to be honest, it could serve a purpose in a strange way like a foreshadowing. The tease needs to be about a couple, not a single one. Sasuke/Sakura didn’t get any teases at all; just rapid fangirl wants her out to get to Sasuke. Naruto/Hinata didn’t get any teases either. Hinata is really solo on this one for her shyness, which is her character. It doesn’t help that Kishi didn’t do anything further in the movie, rather have like 5 people teases, even though one got mad (AU! Hinata). As I said before, Kishi could possibly do this to let us know that they could be a real couple. I mean one got confirmed from this. Want to guess? It’s Asuma and Kurenai. Kakashi saw them and thought they were on a date as Kurenai denies it. Talk about seeing the future, Kakashi. Well, can’t say you got to rely on this stuff, but it’s interesting to note.

    The conclusion --Click here to view--
    To end this whole LAP, simply put, NS is most logical pairing there is. The other two, SS/NH, need more time to develop more starting with Sasuke being open minded with Sakura and Naruto actually go out with her for a good fun time. Unfortunately, that’s not going to happen. The time is already been wasted and we are near to the climax. Sakura has more questions for Naruto, while Sasuke continues to be away from them. Hinata only want to express her love, if Kishi care at all, but that’s like the last development for her. Otherwise, the one with Naruto telling her to stand up is her last development. As for Sasuke, do you really think his whole character will change drastically, up to the point we don’t even recognize him anymore? The only difference will be that he will be good and that’s it. The attitude he has will remain. I don’t even know if Sakura expects love from him anymore. She just wants him to be back to them as Team 7. What about romance? Nothing will change. She needs to finally bury the hatchet and we are getting there. SK has a chance to happen. It’s all on Karin’s first action when meeting with Sasuke again. Make it or break it. Otherwise, Sasuke will continue to be alone, which is ok for him. Also, I don’t see Team Taka dying at all. Kishi had the opportunity to do so. Can it still happen? Sure, but it’s unlikely. It’s not like they’re bad, rather just outcast and following the leader, Sasuke. In the end, if NS and SK/Sasuke happens, everyone wins. What about Hinata? To begin with, her theme was more of admiration of a hero, which is Naruto. So you could kind-of say she’s a fan. Yeah, she will be alone. Then again, Kishi could pair her with Neji or Kiba or whoever. He sure acknowledges that incest is ok in his movie and I have nothing against it. I already encountered that (Elfien Lied). That’s all I want to say.
    Questions? cool.gif


    AMAZING wow.png Great post 111191.gif
    I almost forgot about the time when konohamaru teased naruto about sakura being his "this"
    Things have definetly changed since then.

    And about hinata,she's a side a character had so lltle panel time so litle dvelopmemt compared to others like chouji and shikimaru ,so kishi doesn't even have to mention her reaction at all.Unless he decides to show us a glimce of everyone's future.

    Edited by candycane-chan, 22 October 2012 - 10:11 AM.


    #5151 redragon88

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    Posted 22 October 2012 - 07:36 AM

    @ NaruSaku4Life3g

    Boss post is boss.

    You pretty much summed up how I view things as well.

    #5152 narulsaku

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    Posted 22 October 2012 - 01:35 PM

    oh yes narusaku4life3g that was the best post i ve seen in my life.

    god is sweet.......
    courage,,,,,,,,,,,
    doesn't always roar.............
    sometimescourage is quite voice at the
    end of the day saying,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
    'll try again tomorrow"


    #5153 PhenixElite

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    Posted 22 October 2012 - 02:05 PM

    A short question:
    Is there someone else who thinks that the anime studio maybe knows which pairing kishis going to make canon?

    I came to that thought as i saw some translations of naruto openings and endings. I mean if you compare the translation with the animations in some openings/endings, youll see that they sometimes fit perfectly with NS.
    An example:
    You see how young jiraya pushes young naruto to young sakuras side and the songtext says:"the answer i was looking for has always been in front of me" or something like that.

    Another example would be ending 22 i think.
    You see sakura reaching out for naruto and naruto's screaming something and the songtext says:" also if my feelings are deeply hurt im going to shout theres only one love for me."

    But there are also many other like this. I cant imagine thus is coincidence, so there mist be something behind that.

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    #5154 narulsaku

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    Posted 22 October 2012 - 02:25 PM

    yes PxE i can understand what you are tring to say . but we dont have sure proves that the opening and ending are always like that. but i agree with what you said. and i also think that the tv station knows them. cause in the filler i ve seen many ns moments. but there are funny moments too. in the first filler there was only action, in the saecond there was the same. in the 1st filler of part 2 there was some ns moments. hey do you guys ever noticed that the tv station add some new moments in the anime?

    god is sweet.......
    courage,,,,,,,,,,,
    doesn't always roar.............
    sometimescourage is quite voice at the
    end of the day saying,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
    'll try again tomorrow"


    #5155 T XD

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    Posted 22 October 2012 - 03:31 PM

    QUOTE (PhenixElite @ Oct 22 2012, 05:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    A short question:
    Is there someone else who thinks that the anime studio maybe knows which pairing kishis going to make canon?

    I came to that thought as i saw some translations of naruto openings and endings. I mean if you compare the translation with the animations in some openings/endings, youll see that they sometimes fit perfectly with NS.
    An example:
    You see how young jiraya pushes young naruto to young sakuras side and the songtext says:"the answer i was looking for has always been in front of me" or something like that.

    Another example would be ending 22 i think.
    You see sakura reaching out for naruto and naruto's screaming something and the songtext says:" also if my feelings are deeply hurt im going to shout theres only one love for me."

    But there are also many other like this. I cant imagine thus is coincidence, so there mist be something behind that.

    You're not the only who notices those moments in the openings and endings biggrin.gif

    The anime studio may know which pairing is going to happen but if they don't, they will know by the manga and in the other hand, they need to put some romance in the openings and ending like they do in every other anime. It's very typical of them.
    It's very clear that they had the idea which is going to be the main couple.

    QUOTE (narulsaku @ Oct 22 2012, 05:25 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    yes PxE i can understand what you are tring to say . but we dont have sure proves that the opening and ending are always like that. but i agree with what you said. and i also think that the tv station knows them. cause in the filler i ve seen many ns moments. but there are funny moments too. in the first filler there was only action, in the saecond there was the same. in the 1st filler of part 2 there was some ns moments. hey do you guys ever noticed that the tv station add some new moments in the anime?

    Yeah, they do that sometimes but I don't really like it even if it corresponds with the story line of the episode.

    Edited by T XD, 22 October 2012 - 03:34 PM.


    #5156 Luna

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    Posted 22 October 2012 - 03:45 PM

    A bit off-topic but
    Is this real? --Click here to view--


    Edit: Apparently its a narusaku event for january 2013 in japan.
    Yellow x pink official site


    Edited by Baka chan, 22 October 2012 - 03:48 PM.


     


    #5157 TouKen4Life3g

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    Posted 22 October 2012 - 03:52 PM

    QUOTE (Baka chan @ Oct 22 2012, 11:45 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    A bit off-topic but

    Edit: Apparently its a narusaku event for january 2013 in japan.
    Yellow x pink official site

    Oh it's real. It's an event for NaruSaku in Japan. It goes to show you the rising power of NaruSaku. That's pretty impressive. Maybe the movie helped. Who knows. tongue.gif It makes me happy, that's for sure.

    Thank you so much for a nice feedback on my LAP. Well worth my time. thanks.gif

    Edited by NaruSaku4Life3g, 22 October 2012 - 03:53 PM.


    #5158 T XD

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    Posted 22 October 2012 - 04:00 PM

    QUOTE (Baka chan @ Oct 22 2012, 06:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    A bit off-topic but

    Edit: Apparently its a narusaku event for january 2013 in japan.
    Yellow x pink official site

    Yup, like NaruSaku4life3g said biggrin.gif and by the way, I'm glad you put the link XD I was searching of what was the name of this event.

    #5159 Luna

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    Posted 22 October 2012 - 04:18 PM

    QUOTE (NaruSaku4Life3g @ Oct 22 2012, 11:52 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    Oh it's real. It's an event for NaruSaku in Japan. It goes to show you the rising power of NaruSaku. That's pretty impressive. Maybe the movie helped. Who knows. tongue.gif It makes me happy, that's for sure.

    Thank you so much for a nice feedback on my LAP. Well worth my time. thanks.gif



    QUOTE (T XD @ Oct 22 2012, 12:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    Yup, like NaruSaku4life3g said biggrin.gif and by the way, I'm glad you put the link XD I was searching of what was the name of this event.

    Thanks biggrin.gif Sometimes I just normally look for anything new on the pairing and found this. NaruSaku I growing. ^.^


     


    #5160 PhenixElite

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    Posted 22 October 2012 - 04:27 PM

    Oha a whole event based on NaruSaku nothing better than this. Seems like there are many others who know which pairings going to be canon!!! biggrin.gif

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