54216 replies to this topic

[DrK]

The difference between IH and NH:

 

IH: 

Orihime: Kurosaki-kun!

Ichigo: INOUE!

 

NH:

Hinata: Naruto-kun...

Naruto: ...

 

It's pretty obvious why one is more interesting than the other.

Edited by DrK, 21 November 2017 - 08:25 PM.

[Tsuki Hoshino]

^ pretty much that. 

[HalfDemonInuyasha]

Exactly. When coupling with all that we know, all the retcons, the inconsistencies....how was the ending we got planned and was his entire intention all along? Especially when he shows that he really had no idea what he was doing when he even forgets the most simple of concepts.

We get mad when DC writers and Marvel writers make this mistake...so why does Kishimoto get a pass all of a sudden?

The idea of being a good creator of something is to stay away from retcons and only use them as a last resort. To heavily rely on retcons and asspulls to "Tell your story" is not a good way to write your story. Heck, Marvel even has a contest for writers who can cleverly explain a retcon away. If a writer can do that and Marvel likes it, they throw a party for the writer hosted by Stan Lee himself.

Essentially, retcons are a bad thing. Especially when you are using them to try and "support" the reason why you did something.

B-B-But, Kishi SAYS it was planned, and Kishi's is NEVER wrong OR inconsistent no matter what! So that means YOU'RE wrong!

[Gravenimage]

B-B-But, Kishi SAYS it was planned, and Kishi's is NEVER wrong OR inconsistent no matter what! So that means YOU'RE wrong!

 

Lol someone must have gotten the" Analyzer" syndrome.

[TheFirstEvil100]

 

Lol someone must have gotten the" Analyzer" syndrome.

I think he is just acting like her, cause this is what she wants for all of us to love this BS of a ending and all that lol.

[VanitasDS76491]

I think he is just acting like her, cause this is what she wants for all of us to love this BS of a ending and all that lol.

OR he's joking to mess with her.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

OR he's joking to mess with her.

 

God, I hope that's the case. Analyzer is a pain in the ass as is, we don't need someone else ot be like her.

[James S Cassidy]

B-B-But, Kishi SAYS it was planned, and Kishi's is NEVER wrong OR inconsistent no matter what! So that means YOU'RE wrong!

I know you're being facetious, but the same people who say that are the same people that say "Kishimoto didn't say that" or "Kishimoto was joking" when he says something bad about NH and SS. It's also funny that the "planned from the beginning" isn't what he said two other times when asked that question. One answer was about half-way through, the other somewhere during the War arc.

I am going to take a wild guess and say the decision was made two years before the ending....I came to this one because that was when the Naruto the Last movie started production....and yet, despite this "decision," he still made the NS moments in the war arc. Especially the chapter titled "The Real End" with Sakura crying over Naruto and Karin crying over Sasuke as they were dying. I wonder if that was the end Kishimoto originally planned.

 

 

^ THIS. 1000%

 

As I said for Bleach,  I said this before, I'll said it again. That ending was much more acceptable than what Naruto had experienced. Many people dislike Orihime but the girl, like you said James, was involved into the plot. Plus she has a better development than Hinata (I think most people dislike her because they had the same English VA, Stephanie Sheh) and a bubbly/comic relief.

It's funny how some hated Orihime for that bubbly personality and yet like Hinata for being just like her or worse.
So here is two anime characters who have the same personality, the same character type, and even the same voice actor...and yet one is hated and the other one isn't...

I wonder how many pro-enders were made that IchiRuki didn't become canon.

 

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

I know you're being facetious, but the same people who say that are the same people that say "Kishimoto didn't say that" or "Kishimoto was joking" when he says something bad about NH and SS. It's also funny that the "planned from the beginning" isn't what he said two other times when asked that question. One answer was about half-way through, the other somewhere during the War arc.

I am going to take a wild guess and say the decision was made two years before the ending....I came to this one because that was when the Naruto the Last movie started production....and yet, despite this "decision," he still made the NS moments in the war arc. Especially the chapter titled "The Real End" with Sakura crying over Naruto and Karin crying over Sasuke as they were dying. I wonder if that was the end Kishimoto originally planned.

 

It's funny how some hated Orihime for that bubbly personality and yet like Hinata for being just like her or worse.
So here is two anime characters who have the same personality, the same character type, and even the same voice actor...and yet one is hated and the other one isn't...

I wonder how many pro-enders were made that IchiRuki didn't become canon.

 

 

Point 1, it is a real pain in the ass how people who are pro-ending tend to be like that, and fail to see that stuff with Sakura and Karin crying for Naruto and Sasuke. I'd imagine that's what Kishimoto wanted to go with, but he ended up being forced in a sense to do the ending we got.

 

Point 2, the difference I see with Orihime in Bleach is she at least is able to develop as a character and she isn't solely focused on her feelings for Ichigo, but the desire to want to help all her friends. And we see how she and Ichigo are actually comfortable with each other and don't feel forced when hanging out like Naruto and Hinata do.

[DrK]

 

Point 1, it is a real pain in the ass how people who are pro-ending tend to be like that, and fail to see that stuff with Sakura and Karin crying for Naruto and Sasuke. I'd imagine that's what Kishimoto wanted to go with, but he ended up being forced in a sense to do the ending we got.

 

Point 2, the difference I see with Orihime in Bleach is she at least is able to develop as a character and she isn't solely focused on her feelings for Ichigo, but the desire to want to help all her friends. And we see how she and Ichigo are actually comfortable with each other and don't feel forced when hanging out like Naruto and Hinata do.

We also don't learn what Ichigo likes. He isn't romantically inclined.

 

Naruto on the other hand, Sakura is the epitome of what he likes. If he wasn't with her, he needed to be with Ino or Temari or something. This dude would never find Hinata appealing.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

We also don't learn what Ichigo likes. He isn't romantically inclined.

 

Naruto on the other hand, Sakura is the epitome of what he likes. If he wasn't with her, he needed to be with Ino or Temari or something. This dude would never find Hinata appealing.

 

True with Ichigo, though sometimes it is shown he is more indebted to Rukia for giving him the means to protect people, while with Orihime, he is driven especially hard when it comes to trying to protect her, but some people do write it off now and then.

[James S Cassidy]

 

Point 1, it is a real pain in the ass how people who are pro-ending tend to be like that, and fail to see that stuff with Sakura and Karin crying for Naruto and Sasuke. I'd imagine that's what Kishimoto wanted to go with, but he ended up being forced in a sense to do the ending we got.

 

Point 2, the difference I see with Orihime in Bleach is she at least is able to develop as a character and she isn't solely focused on her feelings for Ichigo, but the desire to want to help all her friends. And we see how she and Ichigo are actually comfortable with each other and don't feel forced when hanging out like Naruto and Hinata do.

The funny thing about Orihime is is that she wasn;t obsessive over her love for Ichigo and actually was willing to let Ichigo make a decisions on his own. It wasn;t like she was doing it for attention, she actually did it because she didn't want to see Ichigo get hurt over her.

I mean, Orihime on the surface seems like Hinata, but below that outside and she acts alot more like Sakura at times. She can be tough, outspoken, and even willing to stand in. You can see both Hinata and Sakura in Orihime and maybe that's why they hate her. Because she is not just another Hinata clone, but rather an actual character.

http://i-purelove.tu...nt-and-even-the

I mean look at this and tell me if it reminds of you someone we know:


That doesn't sound like Hinata at all. Especially when most of Hinata's scenes start out with her saying "I am just being selfish."

At times, Orihime seems more to behaive like Sakura than Hinata.

I kind of want a picture of Orihime grabbing both Sakura and Hinata by the ears saying "You two are giving real girls a bad name."

Edited by James S Cassidy, 22 November 2017 - 05:59 AM.

[DrK]

Yeah, this Orihime I can see the view of "She's deserving"... Hinata never even came close to being that. All she did was watch Naruto from afar, providing him no comfort whatsoever. Then in later life she threw her own body in front of attacks creating a liability for everyone because she wasn't very useful in a fight.

Edited by DrK, 22 November 2017 - 06:08 AM.

[James S Cassidy]

Yeah, this Orihime I can see the view of "She's deserving"... Hinata never even came close to being that. All she did was watch Naruto from afar, providing him no comfort whatsoever. Then in later life she threw her own body in front of attacks creating a liability for everyone because she wasn't very useful in a fight.

R.I.P Neji

*Plays My Heart Will Go On*

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

R.I.P Neji

*Plays My Heart Will Go On*

 

We do not talk of it, but dammit, we do make sure to play appropriate music for it!

[HalfDemonInuyasha]

I know you're being facetious, but the same people who say that are the same people that say "Kishimoto didn't say that" or "Kishimoto was joking" when he says something bad about NH and SS. It's also funny that the "planned from the beginning" isn't what he said two other times when asked that question. One answer was about half-way through, the other somewhere during the War arc.

I am going to take a wild guess and say the decision was made two years before the ending....I came to this one because that was when the Naruto the Last movie started production....and yet, despite this "decision," he still made the NS moments in the war arc. Especially the chapter titled "The Real End" with Sakura crying over Naruto and Karin crying over Sasuke as they were dying. I wonder if that was the end Kishimoto originally planned.

 

It's funny how some hated Orihime for that bubbly personality and yet like Hinata for being just like her or worse.
So here is two anime characters who have the same personality, the same character type, and even the same voice actor...and yet one is hated and the other one isn't...

I wonder how many pro-enders were made that IchiRuki didn't become canon.

 

Such people only choose the hypocrisy that best fits their own narrative. They'll pick out the one time Kishi said NH was "planned from the beginning" and then even if you show them ten or more times where he said something completely different, they'll just point to that one they picked and say, "But he said here..." and that's all that matters to them. Who cares about enormous plot-holes, character 180s, enormous inconsistencies, etc.? So long as Kishi says at least once that it was all "planned", then it MUST be in their minds.

And with Orihime...just more hypocrisy. As I keep saying, the ones who claim to hate NS probably have NO problem with most other similar, if not the same type of pairings in other anime/manga and having little to NO issue with the tsundere girl, even if she's just as, if not more "abusive" than Sakura is to the MC.
 

[Kasimir38]

I mean look at this and tell me if it reminds of you someone we know:


That doesn't sound like Hinata at all. Especially when most of Hinata's scenes start out with her saying "I am just being selfish."

At times, Orihime seems more to behaive like Sakura than Hinata.

I kind of want a picture of Orihime grabbing both Sakura and Hinata by the ears saying "You two are giving real girls a bad name."

 

I love how Orihime is Hinata and Sakura combined: Calm and kind, but also strong-willed and determined. I don't understand how people disliked her but somehow love Hinata. I like them both, but Orihime a bit more.

 

Tbh, someone already mentioned this, but NS only works out if Sasuke stays the villain. (Or probably doesn't survive) With Sasuke back in the town, it's pretty obvious that NS won't work out. Sakura is always reminded of him, seeing him waddling around, and probably she feels some sort of responsibility? Because she told him that she loves him and it would be strange if she would have changed her heart. (I don't think it would be strange, for the given situation) 

But...well. I feel that this debate has no end bc's in the end, Kishimoto can totally flip tables and decide that Naruto actually always liked Kiba and we couldn't do anything about it just ranting no matter how little sense it made, it would stay canon. Actually, Hinata makes much sense if we consider Sasuke in all of the calculations and leave Karin out.

I remember when Karin was introduced to the show, I was so happy because I thought Sakura is finally free.

[Shashank95]

Now I know why everything is messed up.



Them dudes were too weak to blow trees with the Hizzzokage Snoop!

[Kagomaru]

B-B-But, Kishi SAYS it was planned, and Kishi's is NEVER wrong OR inconsistent no matter what! So that means YOU'RE wrong!

And he's never been influenced by editors or fans!  And Sakura never loved Naruto even if Kishi said that she was being honest about her confession and all prior and subsequent evidence supports his claim! You're all delusional conspiracy theorists!  Delusional,  I say!

Edited by Kagomaru, 22 November 2017 - 04:01 PM.

[DrK]

Tbh, someone already mentioned this, but NS only works out if Sasuke stays the villain. (Or probably doesn't survive) With Sasuke back in the town, it's pretty obvious that NS won't work out. Sakura is always reminded of him, seeing him waddling around, and probably she feels some sort of responsibility? Because she told him that she loves him and it would be strange if she would have changed her heart. (I don't think it would be strange, for the given situation) 

The thing is, the guy doesn't show up for 12 years? She probably would stop feeling responsible after year #5 or so. If she felt responsible at all. She was a 12 year old girl. Even if the guy didn't try to murder her. Hell, even if the guy didn't leave at all. Of course her heart is gonna change eventually. Are we then going to infer that Hinata also has to be with Naruto, even if Naruto doesn't want to be with her? Because there was no indication that Sasuke ever wanted to be with Sakura. And he's not the kind of guy who would want pity to be taken on him. I just don't really see how this is the conclusion that you come to.