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My Final Realization Of What bothered Me About The Naruto Manga


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#441 archangel

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 09:28 AM

 I wonder what would happen if Kishimoto came back and changed the ending for the better with NS and SK being canon, Hinata becoming leader of her clan or something, Naruto becoming Hokage and actually being happy with a loving family and Sasuke and Team 7 being that amazing team again. I wonder what kind of reaction the fandom would have....And who are you gonna piss off by changing it to this? The 15% of the fandom that are rabid pairing fans? They are not Naruto fans. You couldn't possibly make it worse by making NS and SK canon now....so why not try it and see what happens. You may get a positive result out of it. Hell, you'd probably get a really high boost for making SNS canon. XDDD

Well I can't talk for everyone, but that is, how can I say this oh yeah, EXACTLY what I want from the ending. I mean 699-700 seems to forget that Naruto is the main character. It's Naruto we should follow and not Sasuke (699 especially). Naruto's goal are the one that matter. I mean making him become a douchebag as a father, not seeing him achieve his dream, the magical moment where he become Hokage, not even resolve his feeling with Sakura in a realistic manner. They basically SHOVE this in to make a quick buck but it backfire big since most Naruto fan in general didn't seem to like something being force down their throat and by doing so, destroyed what they loved about the character in the first place. .


Edited by archangel, 01 March 2016 - 09:29 AM.


#442 BlackBird19

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 09:29 AM

I can definitely see where both James and Neon are coming from. Some fans want nothing to do with Naruto anymore even if they do some sort of alt ending that involved NS. They don't trust Kishi and would rather have the pairing stay untouched. Some fans want to see an alt ending just to see somebody put forth some effort to acknowledge the mistakes that were made with this story. It would show that NS fans actually knew what they were talking about. And some fans want to see a NS ending just to watch the fan base implode in on itself simply because that's what it deserves.

 

As far as SNS goes, I believe Kishi isn't actually some fan of it. I feel it's the only thing he is confident in writing. He has proven he is incapable of properly writing a female character. That inability caused his female lead, Sakura to receive so much hate. Since she got the lion's share of panel time over the other females we could easily see that he lacks any kind understanding of women causing her to be written so poorly. Hinata was then viewed in a better light because she appeared more infrequently, so he wasn't able to ruin her as easily. However that still didn't save her or any other female from receiving hate. To be fair though every one of his characters has received a good dose of hate. Also, I think it's safe to say that Sasuke is his favorite character. So it was easier for him to write about some overblown bond between his two male leads. The yaoi fans then seamlessly took it from there.

 

Now the Last made some money but it wasn't received very well, which in turn made them doubt NH's popularity and pull back some on going all in with NH. So they went to what they were sure would make their remaining fan base happier in the next movie. Something that would be easy for Kishi to write. More Sasuke and more Sasuke/Naruto screen time. Remember, the remaining fans that aren't Hinata/NH fans are Sasuke fans, whether he be alone or in a pairing. Also, most SS or SNS fans like those pairings because of Sasuke. 

 

So now the franchise is left in the hands of Boruto. This should mean more NH and still some Sasuke. But what will happen if the Sasuke-centric pairings get placed on the backburner? Would they do that? Will all the NH be poorly received again if that's the route they go? Will they actually follow through with leaving Naruto and Sasuke in the background keeping the spotlight on the next generation? Those are some of the questions that SJ and SP as businesses have to be asking themselves. I genuinely wonder what exactly is going to happen to this slowly crumbling franchise. 



#443 db84x

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 11:09 AM

Its time to forget pairing war since story already left for next gen, but this time don't made any high hope on story because its still in manga magazine for kid and preteen



#444 NeonRanger

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 11:42 AM

 

I though it was the same guy that came onto Kishi's staff 2010 and wrote TL or is a different assisstant. Now I'm totally confused.

 

 

I don't think Kishi is literally a full anti-Sakura. He hates Sakura for what she is and what became of her (because of obvious reasons). He even chose to say that he liked Sakura at the 2015 Jump Festa (on Dec, 20, 2014)because with the all the pressure he was receiving, and this lead to Junko telling him to shut up in a polite way, "Please be silent, sensei." The way I see it, Kishi already gave us his original intent on the endgame pairing he considered going with NS, but used his pettiness of Hinata was a BS excuse of him to coping out. Kishi does not care for Naruto and frankly, Kishi is too ashamed or denial to redo the ending and make it NS.

 

One, there will be little no profit to gain from it. 2. Even if Shuiesha and SJ considered the possibilities or know for a fact that NS could bring them millions, they are too biased and too hateful of Sakura's character redo the ending. They have a right to refused kishi's submissions. The leaked rumors a year ago about the Sakura hate and how Shuiesha editors refused to give a Sakura an ending (perhaps NS) proves how toxic the shonen manga industry really is. Kishi's options are verbally or through doujinshi. And 3 There is hardly enough inspiration to give him the courage to redo the ending because he no longer cares. There has to be some author like me, Kirabook or some unknown author out there to incorporate NS into their original works gets very recognized a popular enough "worldwide" to be very convincing to turn Kishi's eye.  Otherwise, he's going to stick to that sc-fi manga of his the is upcoming and never turn back.

 

Kishi had years, from the beginning of the part 2 til the War Arc, to improve or make Sakura likable. Part 2 Sakura was fine until Pain. And even before than she wasn't as heavily involve since the Sasori fight. She just suddenly dropped and appear for the sake of fodder    and because she was already labeled heroine, so we have to roll with it. 

 

If Kishi cared enough about Sakura why does Gaiden exist? One could say he's trying to show SS as toxic, but from Gaiden the only person who was depicted as an idiot was Sakura. She posted a picture of herself over Karin, she decided to punch down a house instead of just answering a simple question that would have avoided everything. Kishi, on the other hand depicted as a Saint who wants to change the system. 

 

SK received a proper closure to their ship. That Karin's love was selfless. NS was because of rivalry. Karin was presented as a girl who knew her boundaries and decided not to chase after Sasuke because she knew that he didn't like her, something that we wish would happen between Hinata and Naruto. Sakura was the only character that we know as of late is a full time housewife. Not bad, but Sakura was depicted as someone more than that. Just having a panel of her at the hospital would do no wrong. Ino was shown finishing a mission, and she herself is a part-time mom. 

 

Kishi could have made NH canon, and left Sakura single or with Lee, that way we are more aware that Kishi sees SS as toxic ship, that he wanted NS but it was a forced hand by SP, but he didn't. 

 

Kishi does not defend Sakura as he does for Sasuke, Naruto, Itachi, and SNS. I have not seen a anti-Hinata statement as I do for Sakura. Only two negative things were said about NH during past interviews; that NH was pity and Neji died as Cupid (more anti-Neji than NH). Kishi's said Sakura is an "addicted" girl who men tends to avoid by not showing up at all. An over demanding housewife. Kishi described Sasuke as an antagonist with a "pure" soul. If Kishi can describe Sasuke as pure, what stopped him from at least giving a positive comment for Sakura?

 

For someone ashamed of NS, he is very quick to jump, defend, and support SNS. He did wrote Boruto. He makes it clear enough of SNS relationship. He made it clear that he likes SNS, otherwise how else are Junko and Non-tan suddenly involving themselves in a "SNS" CD (they both like SNS as well)?

 

He fought with his editor to have SNS hold hands, and was only convinced of the cut arms because he wanted gore and he believed it had a deeper meaning. Why  didn't Kishi fought enough to for Sakura like he does with SNS?

 

Kishi could have wrote Sakura better, but he didn't. He couldn't have gave a proper conclusion for NS, but he didn't. He could have avoided anti-Sakura statements but he laughed with them, while speaking seriously about SNS, Sasuke, and Naruto. During NYCC he even said that Hinata was there for Naruto, that NH was meant to be when he could have just as easily said that NH is a good pairing. 

 

 

Sakura would be as hated as she is if Kishi at the slightest bit cared about Sakura. Even if he liked her, he sure didn't care about her enough to give a backstory or make her more important than SNS/ Uchihas. Part 1 wasn't only about SNS, but part 2 SNS was pretty much the symbol of this manga and Sakura was fodder.

 

If Kishi cared enough about Sakura, then an alt ending would be fine, even though I still won't be okay with it. I'll support other who do. But the since the ending it's less than likely that NS would get proper closure if Kishi decided to make an alt ending. He might have gave SK a proper closure, but it came at the expense of baby mama drama. Kishi already told us that he ask for female opinions/ aid on romance moments.

 

There are plenty of others who can write a better conclusion than Kishi. We had faith in him before, and look what happened. That's why I'm not in board with this whole alt ending thing. Another author and another unbiased studio, I will be fine with. But Kishi ruins anything he touches. And with how Gaiden turned out, I'm glad if he didn't touch NS. The minute he decided to green lit The Last, he made his decision. SP is a crappy studio, and how this filler arc went, I don't NS involved as well. I don't want five class treatment/ apologies but I'm not accepting canon from dog kitten either. Kishi had an opportunity before the final publication of 72, he had an opportunity with Gaiden and Boruto. He didn't take it or made any improvement whatsoever. He gave most of rights away to his assistants, to make a new gen manga no one wants to accept. He's done with Naruto. There is too much kitten in between that would make me satisfied with some NS alt. 


Edited by NeonRanger, 01 March 2016 - 12:16 PM.

Hello, Hello, Hello!  :argh:


#445 BlackBird19

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 11:48 AM

@db

High hopes for the story went out the at the end of the Pein arc. But since you said so many times that the fans left are shipping fans, who's gonna read the new manga if the pairings aren't emphasized? A monthly manga in a magazine that's been dropping in circulation every year at that.



#446 Konoha'sCrimsonFox

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 12:24 PM

 

Kishi had years, from the beginning of the part 2 til the War Arc, to improve or make Sakura likable. Part 2 Sakura was fine until Pain. And even before than she wasn't as heavily involve since the Sasori fight. She just suddenly dropped and appear for the sake of fodder    and because she was already labeled heroine, so we have to roll with it. 

 

If Kishi cared enough about Sakura why does Gaiden exist? One could say he's trying to show SS as toxic, but from Gaiden the only person who was depicted as an idiot was Sakura. She posted a picture of herself over Karin, she decided to punch down a house instead of just answering a simple question that would have avoided everything. Kishi, on the other hand depicted as a Saint who wants to change the system. 

 

SK received a proper closure to their ship. That Karin's love was selfless. NS was because of rivalry. Karin was presented as a girl who knew her boundaries and decided not to chase after Sasuke because she knew that he didn't like her, something that we wish would happen between Hinata and Naruto. Sakura was the only character that we know as of late is a full time housewife. Not bad, but Sakura was depicted as someone more than that. Just having a panel of her at the hospital would do no wrong. Ino was shown finishing a mission, and she herself is a part-time mom. 

 

Kishi could have made NH canon, and left Sakura single or with Lee, that way we are more aware that Kishi sees SS as toxic ship, that he wanted NS but it was a forced hand by SP, but he didn't. 

 

Kishi does not defend Sakura as he does for Sasuke, Naruto, Itachi, and SNS. I have not seen a anti-Hinata statement as I do for Sakura. Only two negative things were said about NH during past interviews; that NH was pity and Neji died as Cupid (more anti-Neji than NH). Kishi's said Sakura is an "addicted" girl who men tends to avoid by not showing up at all. An over demanding housewife. Kishi described Sasuke as an antagonist with a "pure" soul. If Kishi can describe Sasuke as pure, what stopped him from at least giving a positive comment for Sakura?

 

For someone ashamed of NS, he is very quick to jump, defend, and support SNS. He did wrote Boruto. He makes it clear enough of SNS relationship. He made it clear that he likes SNS, otherwise how else are Junko and Non-tan suddenly involving themselves in a "SNS" CD (they both like SNS as well)?

 

He fought with his editor to have SNS hold hands, and was only convinced of the cut arms because he wanted gore and he believed it had a deeper meaning. Why  didn't Kishi fought enough to for Sakura like he does with SNS?

 

Kishi could have wrote Sakura better, but he didn't. He couldn't have gave a proper conclusion for NS, but he didn't. He could have avoided anti-Sakura statements but he laughed with them, while speaking seriously about SNS, Sasuke, and Naruto. During NYCC he even said that Hinata was there for Naruto, that NH was meant to be when he could have just as easily said that NH is a good pairing. 

 

 

Sakura would be as hated as she is if Kishi at the slightest bit cared about Sakura. Even if he liked her, he sure didn't care about her enough to give a backstory or make her more important than SNS/ Uchihas. Part 1 wasn't only about SNS, but part 2 SNS was pretty much the symbol of this manga and Sakura was fodder.

 

If Kishi cared enough about Sakura, then an alt ending would be fine, even though I still won't be okay with it. I'll support other who do. But the since the ending it's less than likely that NS would get proper closure if Kishinev decided to make a alt ending. He might have gave SK a proper closure, but it came at the expense of baby mama drama. Kishi already told us that he ask for female opinions/ aid on romance moments.

 

There are plenty of others who can right a better conclusion than Kishi. 

 

You have to considered the fact the now it would like 8 years ago that Kishi wanted out of Naruto but SJ forced or urged him to continue because the manga was too popular to end, an SJ article posted on JP Yahoo last year and of course you have the Sakura hate that have made Kishi changed for the worse. Kishi was desperate to end the manga and get away from it in exchange. He becomes WSJ's puppet. The reason why they grant Kishi a SNS or SN was never a threat to the New Era project like NS and SK were. According to these rumor last year, Kishi did rallied support from other mangaka, but was declined due to the majority of the anti-Sakura fan votes and hate mails.

 

Kishi focused on the Uchiha's more and NS dynamic dies after the Pain Arc because that is the only inspiration he has left for this franchise. He abandoned Naruto and his heritage because of NH. He abandoned Sakura because of SS. He tried his best to make Sasuke look like a saint and a good guy, but there is also an equivalent exchange. Sasuke is a bad husband and a s**** father. Theoretically, Kishi tried to kill off Sakura's character with the Chidori through her chest, but SS was a requirement for TL plot to make her a matchmaker, so he gave in to his editors. Kishi is desperate to do anything (that is not SNS) just to sever his ties with this franchise except the usual pay day. 


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#447 Luna

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 02:07 PM

The oddest thing happened to me today. A NH fan of all tihings messaged me on FF.Net asking me to write a NS story with Sakura and Naruto getting together behind Sasuke's and Hinata's back. I'm in shock tbh


 


#448 Bail o' Lies

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 02:09 PM

The oddest thing happened to me today. A NH fan of all things messaged me on FF.Net asking me to write a NS story with Sakura and Naruto getting together behind Sasuke's and Hinata's back. I'm in shock tbh

Could you ask them why they want that?



#449 Advaith

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 02:29 PM

The oddest thing happened to me today. A NH fan of all tihings messaged me on FF.Net asking me to write a NS story with Sakura and Naruto getting together behind Sasuke's and Hinata's back. I'm in shock tbh

What-Excuse-me-Say-what-GIF.gif

 

Be on guard.



#450 Tsuki Hoshino

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 06:49 PM

The oddest thing happened to me today. A NH fan of all tihings messaged me on FF.Net asking me to write a NS story with Sakura and Naruto getting together behind Sasuke's and Hinata's back. I'm in shock tbh

:hehehe:  You should give them what they want in the worst way possible.

Kill everyone off :zaru: 


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#451 db84x

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Posted 02 March 2016 - 03:47 AM

@ BlackBird19

More precisely neutral adult fans leave exchange by new kid and preteen fans.  I think most of NS overestimate power of shipper so they done indiscriminate attack too all part of Naruto fandom, the truth shipper only vocal minority while majority is don't care about shipping at all.  And there are a lot of complain from neutral due NS indiscriminate attack, since it soil their dream land.

 

Thats why now NH and SS avoid shipping discussion because we just minority in fandom.  Naruto fandom as whole already tired with shipping topic thats the fact.


Edited by db84x, 02 March 2016 - 03:48 AM.


#452 Gaara's hair

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Posted 02 March 2016 - 03:57 AM

Hahaha, what? Don't mind me.

#453 TouKen4Life3g

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Posted 02 March 2016 - 03:58 AM

I must be tired. I just have to be.

#454 Gaara's hair

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Posted 02 March 2016 - 04:03 AM

I must be tired. I just have to be.

A tired gorilla is not a good gorilla.

#455 TouKen4Life3g

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Posted 02 March 2016 - 04:05 AM

Sorry...

Btw I admit, I'm laughing at the topic about top 5 female characters and many can't really think of some. I'll say the best option is to think the least worst.

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Posted 02 March 2016 - 04:10 AM

Top 5 least worst female characters. Change the name of the thread!

#457 Tsuki Hoshino

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Posted 02 March 2016 - 04:13 AM


 

@ BlackBird19

More precisely neutral adult fans leave exchange by new kid and preteen fans.  I think most of NS overestimate power of shipper so they done indiscriminate attack too all part of Naruto fandom, the truth shipper only vocal minority while majority is don't care about shipping at all.  And there are a lot of complain from neutral due NS indiscriminate attack, since it soil their dream land.

 

Thats why now NH and SS avoid shipping discussion because we just minority in fandom.  Naruto fandom as whole already tired with shipping topic thats the fact.

Call me dumb but i don't understand this statement. 

Uummm Again we come back to "Omg NS shippers are like a hammer, they attack everything in sight and therefore piss off the fandom!"

Because NH and SS don't/haven't been just as bad/WORSE.

 


Edited by Tsuki Hoshino, 02 March 2016 - 04:13 AM.

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#458 TouKen4Life3g

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Posted 02 March 2016 - 04:15 AM

Top 5 least worst female characters. Change the name of the thread!

I just like how one wrote a question if the series even have 5 great female characters. Realistically, I think I can only think one but that doesn't mean great. Just stand out more I guess?

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Posted 02 March 2016 - 04:28 AM

Stand out? You can be a bad character and stand out. Top 5 female characters that stand out!

#460 TouKen4Life3g

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Posted 02 March 2016 - 04:41 AM

Stand out? You can be a bad character and stand out. Top 5 female characters that stand out!

Good point. I meant in a good way.




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