526 replies to this topic

[rocci]

@darkrest
Poal is important for NS.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

@darkrest
Poal is important for NS.

From which perspective.
If you want to achieve "Naruto's capable of doing anything for Sakura?"
You're wrong since he also does it for his friends.

From Sakura perspective she despite knowing that Naruto wasnt after Sasuke because of the poal alone she thought it was the main reason because Naruto loves her.
And it was proved wrong.
He didnt even cared about it, since saving Sasuke was linked to hokage and the fact he views Sasuke as his equal and someome he could had become if he chose the dark path.

So there's nothing left on the poal it achieves nothing.
Important would be what Naruto feels about Sakura.

[luffyq1]

From which perspective.
If you want to achieve "Naruto's capable of doing anything for Sakura?"
You're wrong since he also does it for his friends.

From Sakura perspective she despite knowing that Naruto wasnt after Sasuke because of the poal alone she thought it was the main reason because Naruto loves her.
And it was proved wrong.
He didnt even cared about it, since saving Sasuke was linked to hokage and the fact he views Sasuke as his equal and someome he could had become if he chose the dark path.

So there's nothing left on the poal it achieves nothing.
Important would be what Naruto feels about Sakura.

If people don't like the idea of having the poal being dead, then just say that it's not nearly as important as it used to be, and there is clear evidence to support this statement. 

Edited by luffyq1, 24 June 2014 - 04:51 PM.

[Sir G]

hey guys.. whats poal?

[narusaku256]

hey guys.. whats poal?

Promise Of A Lifetime

[rocci]

@darkrest
Naruto perspective.
Naruto will save sasuke, with or without poal.
The poal has something to do with sakura, not sasuke.

[Hiraishin]

Is Sakura watching Naruto sleep with a smile on her face at the end of LOI considered an NS moment?

Yes. I really like that moment because she's smiling at him not because he did anything for her or anything, but he's just being himself. She's giving him a gentle smile that she hasn't given to anyone else, only Naruto (another example of this is in 245). There all he's doing is sleeping and she's smiling at him gently like that, I love it.

Also if the POAL is no longer any concern why hasn't he confessed yet?

Cause one, Naruto said he can't confess because he hasn't kept his promise. He doesn't feel worthy. Plus, like Otaru said, even if he does get opportunities it's up to Kishi to decide when Naruto confesses (and besides, after the invasion of Pein Sakura hadn't released from the promise yet and before the war Naruto was busy with some stuff, like with the toads and all and then he was sent to that island).

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

@darkrest
Naruto perspective.
Naruto will save sasuke, with or without poal.
The poal has something to do with sakura, not sasuke.

That's my post adresses, it relates to Sakura but in what department?
He made a promise to her on which never made an effort to achieve it.
THe fact is that if he does this what Naruto proves to Sakura?
Since he alredy did it thoughout the story, if any from the manga perspective the POAL was negative, selfish move from Sakura that she acknowledged it.
Kishimoto adressed she wants to save Sasuke because it's her duty, Naruto from the reasos stated on my previous post so where's the POAL?

The only thing the POAL did was making Sakura to work harder to help Naruto and it's effect already gone.
Like luffy1q said i understand that people might not like the idea of the POAL being dead but i'm deadly serious on the fact that it achives nothing, if it was important Naruto would be seen as selfish.

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 24 June 2014 - 05:35 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Sorry for being off-topic, but since I announced here for my exam, I should address the update. The result is in.

I PASSED!!!

[Nostradamus]

Sorry for being off-topic, but since I announced here for my exam, I should address the update. The result is in.

I PASSED!!!

Good for you.

[Gojira]

Sorry for being off-topic, but since I announced here for my exam, I should address the update. The result is in.

I PASSED!!!

A happy moment

[Otaru]

It's a lame excuse anyway, and it goes against his belifs, the confession pretty much states that on his mind Sakura loves Sasuke deeply and Sai enforces it even more by telling him that Sakura loves Sasuke.

Well why would it be a lame excuse ? It's important in japanese culture to be worthy before declaring to the girl you love. I also don't see how it's against Naruto beliefs ?
 

He also made it appear that he firmly believes that Sakura deeply loves Sasuke.

No, not that much IMO. He also made it clear she put Naruto above Sasuke.
 

The poal is dead because it has no importance, it's just a gray side quest forgotten linked to a main quest, it's like one of world of warcraft main quests like "kill 10 thugs" and you have a side quest that you must bring "10 thug's red bandana", you're going to achieve it anyway without looking to fullfill this poal.

 

Well I don't play to WOWC LOL so I don't know what you are talking about, but IMO, the POAL is of big importance, even now. It has been lessen, but it didn't disappear IMO. Maybe I'm wrong, I don't know it's just my feeling about it.
 

My only problem is that a confession from Naruto makes no sense because Kishimoto put walls around him(Sakura's love for Sasuke from Naruto's perspective), unless if he does more bad writing on which i dont care and goes with.

 

Yeah it's still not sure Naruto would confess.
I still think Naruto will do it, but it also could be a move from Sakura.
 

That's my post adresses, it relates to Sakura but in what department?

 

IMO, it's not related to Sakura. If POAL still is vivid, then it's related to Naruto.
To me, it's because it's referring to this "be worthy before confess" thing, like I said before.
Even if the POAL looks dead by now, I think this point of view is still true for Naruto.
But he wants to save Sasuke also for himself, it was like that since the start.

But everything changed, it's comprehensible because through time, Sasuke changed a lot, and it's not anymore bringing back little Sasuke. They grew, they evolved.
At first, Naruto wanted to bring back Sasuke to Sakura to make her smile, even if it could break his own heart into pieces.
I think through time, this slowly changed because Sasuke became more and more harsh and Sakura was moving away from that little girl that was crying for Sasuke. She grew with Naruto, and came to be fond of him. She may doesn't acknowledge her love for him yet, but it's so obvious it hurts lol. Yamato saw right through it, and Sai is questioning himself and teasing Sakura about it.

Also, it's interesting to not forget that Naruto would have come after Sasuke even if Sakura wouldn't came to him crying.
 

He made a promise to her on which never made an effort to achieve it.

Do you really think he never made an effort on achieving this promise ? Really ? O_o
Sasuke could have killed him.
 

THe fact is that if he does this what Naruto proves to Sakura?

IMO, nothing, and Kishimoto already stated that when he made Naruto talk about him not being worthy enough. It's about how Naruto perceive himself, IMO.
 

Since he alredy did it thoughout the story, if any from the manga perspective the POAL was negative, selfish move from Sakura that she acknowledged it.

 

I didn't understand that sentence ?

 

Kishimoto adressed she wants to save Sasuke because it's her duty, Naruto from the reasos stated on my previous post so where's the POAL?

 

Yeah it's true Sakura came to put it on her shoulders because she didn't want Naruto to suffer. But if you consider my interpretation of the POAL, this doesn't make it dead, because even if Sakura thinks it's her duty, Naruto still seem to think he will never be worthy of Sakura if he can't keep his promise. I think that time with Sai was maybe to tell us that Naruto would never confess until he could bring back Sasuke.
 

 

The only thing the POAL did was making Sakura to work harder to help Naruto and it's effect already gone.

 

Well I think that was the purpose yes. To make sakura realise something.
 

 

Like luffy1q said i understand that people might not like the idea of the POAL being dead but i'm deadly serious on the fact that it achives nothing, if it was important Naruto would be seen as selfish.

I think it never achieved nothing in the story. It's just all about feelings. It was just to show us the depth of Naruto's love for Sakura, IMO, and to use it later to make her realise something. The POAL alone proves NaruSaku to be the endgame. Because it's serving ONLY NaruSaku and nothing else.

Edited by Otaru, 24 June 2014 - 11:28 PM.

[xxRomanceGirlxx]

The thing with the PoaL is confusing. All the PoaL ever did for Naruto was push him more to save Sasuke and  make him more guilty if he didn't, but it was never his main motivation. It's always been obvious Naruto wants to save Sasuke for himself too. And I think what Naruto told Sakura in the confession about having nothing to do with that promise was because Sakura was acting like that was his only reason for saving Sasuke. That wasn't true so he made it perfectly clear. Saying his promise to Sakura doesn't mean anything at all to him anymore is putting it a little too far though.

 

IMO, I think Naruto didn't let go of the PoaL. He still considers it on. Naruto didn't believe a word of Sakura's confession. He knows how much she still wants Sasuke back, that she was lying about not caring, so he's going to keep it. What the confession meant to show was that, whether the promise was on or off, he would still save Sasuke.

 

As for when Naruto will confess, I'm not sure. It's most likely Naruto's not going to tell Sakura his feelings until Sasuke is secured, be it back in the village or just redeemed. However, depending on if there's going to be a last arc with Sasuke trying to come back to the village and resolving all his issues with Naruto, it's possible Naruto will confess sooner. It's all up to Kishi.

 

There is one thing I'm still curious over. If Naruto fully intended to tell Sakura he loves her but says he can't until Sasuke's back, then for what purpose did he want to confess if he still believes she loves Sasuke? If we look at it from Naruto's POV, it feels more like he's just going to confess and then brace himself for rejection.

Edited by xxRomanceGirlxx, 24 June 2014 - 11:09 PM.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

Well why would it be a lame excuse ? It's important in japanese culture to be worthy before declaring to the girl you love. I also don't see how it's against Naruto beliefs ?

I explained it.
 

No, not that much IMO. He also made it clear she put Naruto above Sasuke.

I'm talking from Naruto's perspective, he knows that she cares about him however he made sure though Sai and the whole moment that Sakura really loves Sasuke.
I'm not talking from reader's point of view.
 

Well I don't play to WOWC LOL so I don't know what you are talking about, but IMO, the POAL is of big importance, even now. It has been lessen, but it didn't disappear IMO. Maybe I'm wrong, I don't know it's just my feeling about it.

You say the importance of the POAL but doesnt explain why, rocci told me it was important to Sakura but however didnt told why it's important to her.
From the plot's view, the POAL was negative, selfish and immature from Sakura's character, she decided to get rid of it by breaking the poal, but she knew that the POAL is not important for Naruto.
Because other scenarios already took out the meaning of it, the hospital scene where Sakura vowed to bring Sasuke together with Naruto, her "duty" to save Sasuke showed now recently, and Naruto's reasons to save Sasuke doesnt even relate to the POAL from the distance, it's good for Naruto to have fullfilled that promise but however he had broken other promises too like when he told Obito that he would not let any of his friends die and Neji died.
So the point is the poal was greatly diminished to a point it achieves absolutely nothing.
 

Yeah it's still not sure Naruto would confess.
I still think Naruto will do it, but it also could be a move from Sakura.

I think he might confess but i dont think it's linked ot the poal or whatever i just think that it's weird from him to come out of nowhere confessing when Kishimoto showed Naruto firmly believing that she loves Sasuke, so makes no sense for me to a guy who's going to confess to a woman if he strongly believes she loves another guy, and also makes it really weird for Sakura to come out and confess to Naruto because well it's Naruto who's wants to be with Sakura and pursued her with date requests it end up with her pratically being handed into a plate to him since he pratically did nothing to her that would basically tells her that he's interested romantically on her, if wasnt for Sai telling Sakura that Naruto loves her she would never had found that out.

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 24 June 2014 - 11:21 PM.

[Otaru]

There is one thing I'm still curious over. If Naruto fully intended to tell Sakura he loves her but says he can't until Sasuke's back, then for what purpose did he want to confess if he still believes she loves Sasuke? If we look at it from Naruto's POV, it feels more like he's just going to confess and then brace himself for rejection.

 
I think it's because Naruto always try.
IMO, it's important for him to confess good at least one time.
 
You know this film when Naruto talk about Sakura ? I think it's what Kishimoto is trying to depict.
Naruto will never force himself to Sakura, but he wants her to choose him. So he will try one day, when he will feel worthy enough.
I don't know but, while reading this manga, it seems to me that Naruto feels that Sakura could love him, that it's a possibility. It's like he believes it.
Well, it's like himself so...
 

I explained it.

I think I missed it
 

I'm talking from Naruto's perspective, he knows that she cares about him however he made sure though Sai and the whole moment that Sakura really loves Sasuke.
I'm not talking from reader's point of view.

Sai told him she was only thinking about him. Sai talked about Sasuke because Naruto couldn't believe it and insisted on Sai. Then Sai said she was able to do it because it's hard on her to see Sasuke like that. He's not talking about deep love. It's all about Naruto, and Sai made it clear to Naruto himself. That's Naruto that doesn't believe it because in his mind Sakura would never accept to kill Sasuke. I think he felt kind of betrayed also, because he would have never accepted to kill Sasuke, and he would have never thought Sakura would.
 

You say the importance of the POAL but doesnt explain why, rocci told me it was important to Sakura but however didnt told why it's important to her.

Well I think I explained it later in my message.
To me, the purpose of the POAL is only about feelings concerning NaruSaku.
It serves nothing else in the manga.

 

From the plot's view, the POAL was negative, selfish and immature from Sakura's character, she decided to get rid of it by breaking the poal, but she knew that the POAL is not important for Naruto.
Because other scenarios already took out the meaning of it, the hospital scene where Sakura vowed to bring Sasuke together with Naruto, her "duty" to save Sasuke showed now recently, and Naruto's reasons to save Sasuke doesnt even relate to the POAL from the distance, it's good for Naruto to have fullfilled that promise but however he had broken other promises too like when he told Obito that he would not let any of his friends die and Neji died.
So the point is the poal was greatly diminished to a point it achieves absolutely nothing.

Well I think it was never meant to achieve nothing material or factual. IMO it was for us readers. It was to bring drama, to show the depth of Naruto's love for Sakura, and to make Sakura evolve from it later.
About Obito, it wasn't a "promise" like the one he made to Sakura. IMO.

 

I think he might confess but i dont think it's linked ot the poal or whatever i just think that it's weird from him to come out of nowhere confessing when Kishimoto showed Naruto firmly believing that she loves Sasuke, so makes no sense for me to a guy who's going to confess to a woman if he strongly believes she loves another guy, and also makes it really weird for Sakura to come out and confess to Naruto because well it's Naruto who's wants to be with Sakura and pursued her with date requests it end up with her pratically being handed into a plate to him since he pratically did nothing to her that would basically tells her that he's interested romantically on her, if wasnt for Sai telling Sakura that Naruto loves her she would never had found that out.

Yes it's not really linked to the POAL. It's just that the POAL refrain Naruto to do it until now. As Kishimoto made it appear.
I think since the confession of Sakura, Naruto doesn't believe anymore that Sakura loves Sasuke that much. Because he was shocked by what Sai told him. It touched him obviously, and he knows now that Sakura could put his safety above Sasuke's.

Yes he never forced himself on her, that's the beauty of the character.

Edited by Otaru, 24 June 2014 - 11:57 PM.

[FireFox]

@Otaru The POAL also served to let Sakura know how deep is Naruto's love for her because Naruto wasn't gonna reveal that to her because in his eyes he's unworthy of her love because he wasn't able to fulfill it he felt like he betrayed her trust this is also evident in the S/N fight at VOTE . All in All the main purpose of the POAL was for Sakura to find out about Naruto's love for her  because that's why Naruto did it in the first place to reassure her that everything will be ok for her not to worry and to make her happy . 

 

The POAL form NS perspective has several meanings then just one and its the most important moment of the NS relationship because this is what prompt Sakura to see Naruto in his true light and to grow closer to him whoever deny this is clearly in denial 

[tekopi]

Sorry for being off-topic, but since I announced here for my exam, I should address the update. The result is in.

I PASSED!!!

Congratulations! 

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

I think I missed it

Yes you did i told you why it makes no sense.
 

Sai told him she was only thinking about him. Sai talked about Sasuke because Naruto couldn't believe it and insisted on Sai. Then Sai said she was able to do it because it's hard on her to see Sasuke like that. He's not talking about deep love. It's all about Naruto, and Sai made it clear to Naruto himself. That's Naruto that doesn't believe it because in his mind Sakura would never accept to kill Sasuke. I think he felt kind of betrayed also, because he would have never accepted to kill Sasuke, and he would have never thought Sakura would.

Then he explained that Sakura was going to do it because she didnt wanted Sasuke to keep going on the dark path anymore even if she have to kill him by himself, putting Naruto in shock and breaking his vision about team 7 being together again.
It emphasized for the 666x time on Naruto's mind that she truly loves Sasuke.
 

Well I think I explained it later in my message.
To me, the purpose of the POAL is only about feelings concerning NaruSaku.
It serves nothing else in the manga.

Still very abstract, the only feelings i can see this are off selfish, because the POAL for NaruSaku is negative.
 

Well I think it was never meant to achieve nothing material or factual. IMO it was for us readers. It was to bring drama, to show the depth of Naruto's love for Sakura, and to make Sakura evolve from it later.
About Obito, it wasn't a "promise" like the one he made to Sakura. IMO.

Once again it has nothing to do with now, the POAL was immature and the depth of Naruto's love was concluded when he came back, on the hospital scene after that another promise was made.
Later it comes back on Sakura's confession only to show that Naruto has his own reasons to save Sasuke and the POAL is not important but it needed to conclude it from Sakura's side because it was selfish to her, she made sure that she doesnt want nothing from him that's why she broke it.
 

Yes it's not really linked to the POAL. It's just that the POAL refrain Naruto to do it until now. As Kishimoto made it appear.
I think since the confession of Sakura, Naruto doesn't believe anymore that Sakura loves Sasuke that much. Because he was shocked by what Sai told him. It touched him obviously, and he knows now that Sakura could put his safety above Sasuke's.

That's a guess, my problem is that there's no link between the confession, summit and Naruto's feelings.
Because the only thing that reassures is that Naruto firmly believes she loves Sasuke.
There's no real conclusion, a dialogue between him and Sakura was avoided at all costs, even if you say "Naruto doenst believe anymore that Sakura loves Sasuke" i cant see it in any of the previous chapters.
Sure that there was the girlfriend thing which i believe it's a joke.
 

Yes he never forced himself on her, that's the beauty of the character.

So if you do nothing means that the other option is force himself on her?
what about complimenting her without seeming a joke, what about telling her she's strong what about having a single conversation with her on which he doesnt bring up the Sasuke subject?

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 25 June 2014 - 12:25 AM.

[Otaru]

@Otaru The POAL also served to let Sakura know how deep is Naruto's love for her because Naruto wasn't gonna reveal that to her because in his eyes he's unworthy of her love because he wasn't able to fulfill it he felt like he betrayed her trust this is also evident in the S/N fight at VOTE . All in All the main purpose of the POAL was for Sakura to find out about Naruto's love for her  because that's why Naruto did it in the first place to reassure her that everything will be ok for her not to worry and to make her happy . 
 
The POAL form NS perspective has several meanings then just one and its the most important moment of the NS relationship because this is what prompt Sakura to see Naruto in his true light and to grow closer to him whoever deny this is clearly in denial

Well that's what I said with other words.
The POAL, in other things, was to make Sakura react yes.
 

Then he explained that Sakura was going to do it because she didnt wanted Sasuke to keep going on the dark path anymore even if she have to kill him by himself, putting Naruto in shock and breaking his vision about team 7 being together again.
It emphasized for the 666x time on Naruto's mind that she truly loves Sasuke.

Well I don't interpret it like that because this is not the only thing Sai said.
 

Still very abstract, the only feelings i can see this are off selfish, because the POAL for NaruSaku is negative.

What she asked back then was selfish yes, as her love for Sasuke has always been selfish. Her love for Sasuke is a childish love. Just like Hinata's love for Naruto. To me, the POAL is not negative for NaruSaku, because on Naruto's part, it showed Naruto's strong feelings for her, even if it's not the only time his feelings were shown. On Sakura's part, at first, it's negative, but it's also very positive just after she asked, because she immediatly realised that Naruto "always knew, always understood her". And she's deeply touched by it. Later on in the story, Sakura tried to break it when Naruto went 4 tails, but he never heard that, he was not himself. Later on, she tried again, when she confessed to him. So it's true at the very first it's negative on her part, but it became positive rapidly. The only problem is that Naruto never saw it until her manipulative confession. Her dedication for him is always hidden from his eyes.

 

Once again it has nothing to do with now, the POAL was immature and the depth of Naruto's love was concluded when he came back, on the hospital scene after that another promise was made.
Later it comes back on Sakura's confession only to show that Naruto has his own reasons to save Sasuke and the POAL is not important but it needed to conclude it from Sakura's side because it was selfish to her, she made sure that she doesnt want nothing from him that's why she broke it.

I think Kishimoto wanted multiple events to show the depth of his love. Something like that can't be proven with only one thing.
 

That's a guess, my problem is that there's no link between the confession, summit and Naruto's feelings.
Because the only thing that reassures is that Naruto firmly believes she loves Sasuke.
There's no real conclusion, a dialogue between him and Sakura was avoided at all costs, even if you say "Naruto doenst believe anymore that Sakura loves Sasuke" i cant see it in any of the previous chapters.
Sure that there was the girlfriend thing which i believe it's a joke.

Yes it's true, it's only my feeling.
I think, as I said above, that Kishimoto is hiding things on purpose. I think he wants to make things last longer. But it appear weird to us, because NaruSaku has become really obvious since that time at the bridge. Really.
I don't think he firmly believes she loves Sasuke.
We don't really know what he thinks.
If what I said is a guess, then what you said too.
What Naruto feels right now about Sakura is uncertain (I'm not talking about his feelings of love for her, but about his understanding of her feelings.) I mean, even Sakura herself doesn't really know how she feels... she's highly shaken about all this.
Again, I think it's appearing weird to us because of the timeline.
For us it's been past 10 years.
In Naruto's word, it's a lot less.

So, you think Naruto was joking when he said Sakura was her girlfriend to Minato ? I really don't think so, but you're free to think as you want... I don't really feel like argue about that... I think Naruto would never joke about something like that to his dad. Even in the past, when he seemed to joke about it while talking to Konohamaru, we readers could see that he really meant it. He wanted her to be his girlfriend.

 

So if you do nothing means that the other option is force himself on her?
what about complimenting her without seeming a joke, what about telling her she's strong what about having a single conversation with her on which he doesnt bring up the Sasuke subject?

It's true they don't talk a lot of things out of Sasuke.
It's because Sasuke is omnipresent in everything.
Also, they don't have that much of calm moment to talk, and there is the fact that Kishimoto may doesn't want them to have a serious conversation... because if he would do that, he would be forced to reveal the truth...

Edited by Otaru, 25 June 2014 - 01:01 AM.

[xxRomanceGirlxx]

@Otaru:

 

I'm not sure I trust Naruto enough to believe she doesn't love Sasuke anymore. To be completely honest, while Naruto does know that everything Sakura did in the confession is for him and that has potential for him to think Sakura could love him (I say potential because nothing's clear right now),  thinking she's not loving Sasuke is more of a stretch IMO. Naruto didn't waver once in his belief Sakura loves Sasuke during that confession. He even insisted Sakura loved Sasuke too much to kill him and then Sai goes back to say "it's because she loves him, to kill the one she loves" etc.

 

If Naruto has enough trouble believing by himself that Sakura's over Sasuke, then hearing someone, even someone like Sai who never saw how she was with Sasuke, say she loves him so much, then Naruto's going to latch onto that and believe it even more. I don't think he's secure enough to say Sakura doesn't love Sasuke anymore or even if she loves Naruto himself for that matter IMO.

 

And on the topic of the confession, I don't entirely understand the argument Naruto accepts Sakura has feelings for him/loves him. I've seen people argue Naruto was only calling her not caring about Sasuke a lie and giving up on Sasuke, but it felt more like he was rejecting all of it. I understand his SS flashbacks and what he was thinking is debatable, but when Sakura hugged him and explained her feelings for both him & Sasuke, Naruto got angry and shoved her away (and cut her off just when Sakura went back to her feelings for himself) . Cue the "I hate people who lie to themselves" line.

 

The only thing that makes me consider otherwise is Naruto in 631, but it's not enough evidence IMO to completely shoot down the "Naruto doesn't think she loves or likes him" argument so we'll just have to wait and see.

Edited by xxRomanceGirlxx, 25 June 2014 - 12:41 AM.