54213 replies to this topic

[Khaleesi]

Take a break. I think you've been writing this post for more than half an hour XD

It's just that I've been looking for some panels but didn't find them u_u I'm about to finish anyway.

[ThroughWithLove]

So it doesn't matter if Kishimoto constructed their bond from a red-herring purpose (both NS and SK), what he did made the ships make sense. But to be honest, Sasuke should have died.

 

 

This is a good post and you've made a lot of good points, but I'd have to disagree with this part. Sasuke should have gotten his comeuppance and Naruto should've learned what being hokage was about (i.e. not this "if I can't even save a friend, I can't be hokage" BS) , but unless Sasuke's death is of his own volition (realizing the error of his ways in the end and sacrificing himself to save Naruto---perhaps even with a good throwback to Zabuza arc when he jumped in the way to save Naruto from Haku), I'm just not sure it fits thematically to up and kill him off. I just can't see that kid who went out of his way to make a promise of lifetime promise to bring Sasuke back turning around and offing the dude without a boatload of character development to justify it.

Edited by ThroughWithLove, 30 July 2017 - 11:34 PM.

[ThroughWithLove]

Analyzer-kun uses semanticaga!

 

You still don't understand contradiction. Here's the thing:

I decided NH at the end.

I decided NH at the beginning.

 

That's a contradiction.

 

I planned NH at the beginning.

I -decided- NH at the middle.

 

Is NOT a contradiction. Planned is the equivalent to the first draft.

Decided is equivalent to committing.

 

Do you understand now?

 

Edited by ThroughWithLove, 30 July 2017 - 11:52 PM.

[ThroughWithLove]

 

​Maybe, but based on what was built up, not having Sasuke die was fine.

 

I thought everything post chapter 450-700 was trash, but the simple concept of not having Sasuke die is fine IMO. Jiraiya and Kakashi weren't able to save their friends, but Naruto was. New generation always surpasses the older one, just as numerous characters have repeatedly said throughout the manga.

Edited by ThroughWithLove, 30 July 2017 - 11:41 PM.

[Khaleesi]

Ok, I finished I gave up about the panels

[ThroughWithLove]

Ok, I finished I gave up about the panels

 

Which panels were they?

[FutureHalfofFamer]

The First part is mockery, so ignoring it.
 
You still don't understand contradiction. Here's the thing:
I decided NH at the end.
I decided NH at the beginning.
 
That's a contradiction.
 
I planned NH at the beginning.
I -decided- NH at the middle.
 
Is NOT a contradiction. Planned is the equivalent to the first draft.
Decided is equivalent to committing.
 
Do you understand now?
 
Your point about the Manga and Movie is irrelevant, because they're both canon. This does not diminish the other material in anyway, particularly since Kishimoto approved of the script after a lot of red marking. Note he says it wasn't his idea originally, but he certainly edited and help cultivate the idea. But again, the Last's canon status is indisputable, and should not be thrown out. Further, you don't need the Last to justify NH, it's well established in the manga.
 
You'll also have to elaborate exactly what is coming across as fact. You're generalizing and not really pointing to anything in particular in your example, basically restating what I said.
 
Your next paragraph doesn't work, because Naruto -specifies- why. He -says- it is Hinata that made him go ninetails. He does not say it was the village or everything else. He had given up, despite all of those things. No, seeing Hinata go down was the clarified spark. This instance is why it is not baseless or contradicting to say Naruto loved Hinata but did not know why. It is a valid theory with just the manga, and with the Last, it is the valid answer.
 
On your final part, it doesn't really have a real impact. It is a joke, and it's important really fades and is diminished after the moment ends.
 
Edit: Adding more with seeing more added:
 
Your generalization of NH is very off, and shows a lack of understanding of the bond. Now, what you want to do from a writing point of view is up to your opinion. But Kishimoto's choice is perfectly fine, and while underutilized, well executed.
 
No idea what you are talking about in your banana example, or how it relates to the previous paragraph at all.

Nobody took you serious even in your own ship's(NH and SS) forum. No one will take you seriously here. You're a walking Ha ha. You're a joke. Comedic relief in the flesh. As I said before, get banned.

Edited by FutureHalfofFamer, 30 July 2017 - 11:52 PM.

[Khaleesi]

The First part is mockery, so ignoring it.

 

You still don't understand contradiction. Here's the thing:

I decided NH at the end.

I decided NH at the beginning.

 

That's a contradiction.

 

I planned NH at the beginning.

I -decided- NH at the middle.

 

Is NOT a contradiction. Planned is the equivalent to the first draft.

Decided is equivalent to committing.

 

Do you understand now?

 

Your point about the Manga and Movie is irrelevant, because they're both canon. This does not diminish the other material in anyway, particularly since Kishimoto approved of the script after a lot of red marking. Note he says it wasn't his idea originally, but he certainly edited and help cultivate the idea. But again, the Last's canon status is indisputable, and should not be thrown out. Further, you don't need the Last to justify NH, it's well established in the manga.

 

You'll also have to elaborate exactly what is coming across as fact. You're generalizing and not really pointing to anything in particular in your example, basically restating what I said.

 

Your next paragraph doesn't work, because Naruto -specifies- why. He -says- it is Hinata that made him go ninetails. He does not say it was the village or everything else. He had given up, despite all of those things. No, seeing Hinata go down was the clarified spark. This instance is why it is not baseless or contradicting to say Naruto loved Hinata but did not know why. It is a valid theory with just the manga, and with the Last, it is the valid answer.

 

On your final part, it doesn't really have a real impact. It is a joke, and it's important really fades and is diminished after the moment ends.

 

Edit: Adding more with seeing more added:

 

Your generalization of NH is very off, and shows a lack of understanding of the bond. Now, what you want to do from a writing point of view is up to your opinion. But Kishimoto's choice is perfectly fine, and while underutilized, well executed.

 

No idea what you are talking about in your banana example, or how it relates to the previous paragraph at all.

 

Aswering this quick because you did it before I could finish.

 

>"You still don't understand contradiction. Here's the thing:

I decided NH at the end.

I decided NH at the beginning.

 

That's a contradiction.

 

I planned NH at the beginning.

I -decided- NH at the middle.

 

Is NOT a contradiction. Planned is the equivalent to the first draft.

Decided is equivalent to committing.

 

Do you understand now?"

 

I know what's the difference between planning and deciding. That's not the issue. He did say first it was that he planned it from the beggining. But he also said he set his mind on the beggining. Later, he said he decided on the middle, and then that he decided a while ago. That is contradiction.

 

>"Your point about the Manga and Movie is irrelevant, because they're both canon. This does not diminish the other material in anyway, particularly since Kishimoto approved of the script after a lot of red marking. Note he says it wasn't his idea originally, but he certainly edited and help cultivate the idea. But again, the Last's canon status is indisputable, and should not be thrown out. Further, you don't need the Last to justify NH, it's well established in the manga."

 

No, it's not irrelevant. Making them both canon doesn't fix the issue that I've stated. And yeah, you need it to justify NH, as how I said before there wasn't anything about them until they could be above 18. He even said, if there wasn't a NH love story, it would be unfair to readers to understand how they get together.

 

> "You'll also have to elaborate exactly what is coming across as fact. You're generalizing and not really pointing to anything in particular in your example, basically restating what I said."

 

So you didn't get that you are doing the same as you point out people are doing. Okay.

 

> "Your next paragraph doesn't work, because Naruto -specifies- why. He -says- it is Hinata that made him go ninetails. He does not say it was the village or everything else. He had given up, despite all of those things. No, seeing Hinata go down was the clarified spark. This instance is why it is not baseless or contradicting to say Naruto loved Hinata but did not know why. It is a valid theory with just the manga, and with the Last, it is the valid answer."

 

He said that after seeing her death he went Ninetails, he doesn't say "I went Ninetails only because of her" or "she was the only reason". This affirmation is a dissmissal of all what he could've been feeling during his battle. An emotional explotion has its triggers, but they never come from one thing. This is just psychology.

 

As for the higlighted text, I've already explained the issues between the manga and movie and won't repeat it. 

 

> "On your final part, it doesn't really have a real impact. It is a joke, and it's important really fades and is diminished after the moment ends."

 

Again, you are forgetting to see and take the situation into Narutoverse context and not only your lecture of the scenes. For us is a joke, but it is a real moment that happens to the characters and goes to their memories. Memories are an important part of any kind of bond.

 

> "Your generalization of NH is very off, and shows a lack of understanding of the bond. Now, what you want to do from a writing point of view is up to your opinion. But Kishimoto's choice is perfectly fine, and while underutilized, well executed."

 

Even romanticizing NH's bond as you do, it still doesn't make sense contrasting to NS. So I dissagree entirely.

 

>"No idea what you are talking about in your banana example, or how it relates to the previous paragraph at all."

 

Not my problem if you don't get it or can't connect it. I've already said what I had to.

[FutureHalfofFamer]

Aswering this quick because you did it before I could finish.
 
>"You still don't understand contradiction. Here's the thing:
I decided NH at the end.
I decided NH at the beginning.
 
That's a contradiction.
 
I planned NH at the beginning.
I -decided- NH at the middle.
 
Is NOT a contradiction. Planned is the equivalent to the first draft.
Decided is equivalent to committing.
 
Do you understand now?"
 
I know what's the difference between planning and deciding. That's not the issue. He did say first it was that he planned it from the beggining. But he also said he set his mind on the beggining. Later, he said he decided on the middle, and then that he decided a while ago. That is contradiction.
 
>"Your point about the Manga and Movie is irrelevant, because they're both canon. This does not diminish the other material in anyway, particularly since Kishimoto approved of the script after a lot of red marking. Note he says it wasn't his idea originally, but he certainly edited and help cultivate the idea. But again, the Last's canon status is indisputable, and should not be thrown out. Further, you don't need the Last to justify NH, it's well established in the manga."
 
No, it's not irrelevant. Making them both canon doesn't fix the issue that I've stated. And yeah, you need it to justify NH, as how I said before there wasn't anything about them until they could be above 18. He even said, if there wasn't a NH love story, it would be unfair to readers to understand how they get together.
 
> "You'll also have to elaborate exactly what is coming across as fact. You're generalizing and not really pointing to anything in particular in your example, basically restating what I said."
 
So you didn't get that you are doing the same as you point out people are doing. Okay.
 
> "Your next paragraph doesn't work, because Naruto -specifies- why. He -says- it is Hinata that made him go ninetails. He does not say it was the village or everything else. He had given up, despite all of those things. No, seeing Hinata go down was the clarified spark. This instance is why it is not baseless or contradicting to say Naruto loved Hinata but did not know why. It is a valid theory with just the manga, and with the Last, it is the valid answer."
 
He said that after seeing her death he went Ninetails, he doesn't say "I went Ninetails only because of her" or "she was the only reason". This affirmation is a dissmissal of all what he could've been feeling during his battle. An emotional explotion has its triggers, but they never come from one thing. This is just psychology.
 
As for the higlighted text, I've already explained the issues between the manga and movie and won't repeat it. 
 
> "On your final part, it doesn't really have a real impact. It is a joke, and it's important really fades and is diminished after the moment ends."
 
Again, you are forgetting to see and take the situation into Narutoverse context and not only your lecture of the scenes. For us is a joke, but it is a real moment that happens to the characters and goes to their memories. Memories are an important part of any kind of bond.
 
> "Your generalization of NH is very off, and shows a lack of understanding of the bond. Now, what you want to do from a writing point of view is up to your opinion. But Kishimoto's choice is perfectly fine, and while underutilized, well executed."
 
Even romanticizing NH's bond as you do, it still doesn't make sense contrasting to NS. So I dissagree entirely.
 
>"No idea what you are talking about in your banana example, or how it relates to the previous paragraph at all."
 
Not my problem if you don't get it or can't connect it. I've already said what I had to.

You been owning this guy left and right. Take my ring? Lol.

[Khaleesi]

This is a good post and you've made a lot of good points, but I'd have to disagree with this part. Sasuke should have gotten his comeuppance and Naruto should've learned what being hokage was about (i.e. not this "if I can't even save a friend, I can't be hokage" BS) , but unless Sasuke's death is of his own volition (realizing the error of his ways in the end and sacrificing himself to save Naruto---perhaps even with a good throwback to Zabuza arc when he jumped in the way to save Naruto from Haku), I'm just not sure it fits thematically to up and kill him off. I just can't see that kid who went out of his way to make a promise of lifetime promise to bring Sasuke back turning around and offing the dude without a boatload of character development to justify it.

I know it's a shonen manga but Hunter x Hunter is also for kids, yet had treated their alike characters (Gon and Killua/Kurapika) as how I would wanted to Naruto.

 

Sasuke should have died trying to redeem himself and saving Team 7, this would not redeem him, as for death to be a fair punishment for his crimes. Either this to be more idealistic 8as how Naruto discourse goes) or having him die following his ideals, which makes sense on how his character was build up. This would made Team 7 very sad, but even if Naruto and Sakura desired to save him, that is not always reality, see Darth Vader. For me, he should have died as a villian. And Naruto should have learn he can't save everyone and how selfish and obssesive of him was to pursue him and justify Sasuke's actions. Naruto doesn't really understands Sasuke, so I deeply understand why Sasuke gets annoyed at Naruto's, Sakura's and Kakashi's presence always on his tail.

 

Sasuke's death would have been a hell of a ground-breaking bonding moment and character development for Naruto and Sakura.

 

On a darker note, I would have also killed off Karin by suicide   But that's another story...

 

 

Which panels were they?

The examples of the manga I wrote.

[T XD]

The First part is mockery, so ignoring it.

 

You still don't understand contradiction. Here's the thing:

I decided NH at the end.

I decided NH at the beginning.

 

That's a contradiction.

 

I planned NH at the beginning.

I -decided- NH at the middle.

 

Is NOT a contradiction. Planned is the equivalent to the first draft.

Decided is equivalent to committing.

 

Do you understand now?

 

Your point about the Manga and Movie is irrelevant, because they're both canon. This does not diminish the other material in anyway, particularly since Kishimoto approved of the script after a lot of red marking. Note he says it wasn't his idea originally, but he certainly edited and help cultivate the idea. But again, the Last's canon status is indisputable, and should not be thrown out. Further, you don't need the Last to justify NH, it's well established in the manga.

 

You'll also have to elaborate exactly what is coming across as fact. You're generalizing and not really pointing to anything in particular in your example, basically restating what I said.

 

Your next paragraph doesn't work, because Naruto -specifies- why. He -says- it is Hinata that made him go ninetails. He does not say it was the village or everything else. He had given up, despite all of those things. No, seeing Hinata go down was the clarified spark. This instance is why it is not baseless or contradicting to say Naruto loved Hinata but did not know why. It is a valid theory with just the manga, and with the Last, it is the valid answer.

 

On your final part, it doesn't really have a real impact. It is a joke, and it's important really fades and is diminished after the moment ends.

 

Edit: Adding more with seeing more added:

 

Your generalization of NH is very off, and shows a lack of understanding of the bond. Now, what you want to do from a writing point of view is up to your opinion. But Kishimoto's choice is perfectly fine, and while underutilized, well executed.

 

No idea what you are talking about in your banana example, or how it relates to the previous paragraph at all.

No offense. Do you reread your posts before posting them ? Cause this post is ironic and irrational at the same time from what I've read till now.

Edited by T XD, 31 July 2017 - 12:29 AM.

[Khaleesi]

You been owning this guy left and right. Take my ring? Lol.

Your ring? does this means you want to fight?

 

Your ring

 

I'm 1.50, come at me bro (ง'̀-'́)ง

Edited by Khaleesi, 31 July 2017 - 12:25 AM.

[T XD]

Your ring? does this means you want to fight?

 

Your ring

 

I'm 1.50, come at me bro (ง'̀-'́)ง

I think s/he meant to marry him / her XD

Edited by T XD, 31 July 2017 - 12:28 AM.

[Khaleesi]

Sorry bros I got bored I'm now out to play Overwatch.

 

Nothing else to see here

[Khaleesi]

I think he meant marry him / her XD

 

[T XD]

 

Tsk. Tsk. Workaholic

[FutureHalfofFamer]

Your ring? does this means you want to fight?

 

Your ring

 

I'm 1.50, come at me bro (ง'̀-'́)ง

 

[ThroughWithLove]

 

"If you see a cat, but we see a cow, and at the end of the road it's a cow, and you say that the cow was not justified...but we -all- saw the cow, then perhaps you misread the manga?"

 

Or perhaps you're simply exercising confirmation bias.

[FutureHalfofFamer]

This is very rude. Further, I have never posted in any NH and SS forum.

 

Go back to NH/SS forums and go cry about it, so they can come to this site,  create an account, try to avenge you and I can own them as well.  On this site, you're like a innocent bystander at the wrong place at the wrong time, a lamb fresh for the slaughter. Notice you only been on this site for a few weeks, and you're already the most laughed at on this site, I was only a guest at that time and I laughed at you and your statements a lot. Your best bet is to simply log off this site, go back to your NH and SS forums and hope I don't find you on your own ship's site and own you there.

 

P.S.- Get banned.

Edited by FutureHalfofFamer, 31 July 2017 - 12:55 AM.

[Yyubie]

Did you ever wonder why they show this very close up , while the others just together , she got in one screen close up alone ?