54213 replies to this topic

[Gravenimage]

It seems he's making NS here. The writer wants to make Naruto and the others being true to their character.

 

I hope you're right. Naruto and Sakura don't have to kiss. It will be enough for me that they have a serious long talk about their feelings for one another (I'm sure everyone in this forum wants to see that happening )

[T XD]

 

I hope you're right. Naruto and Sakura don't have to kiss. It will be enough for me that they have a serious long talk about their feelings for one another (I'm sure everyone in this forum wants to see that happening )

From the way it is, it's going to be NS. It's similar to the way they're in the manga, which fortunately, there's no selling out this time XD

Edited by T XD, 09 January 2017 - 12:59 PM.

[Riverkid]

Quote from Sakura in 'The Last' : "Do you remember when you said you loved me ? ... i wonder... did you only said that because i loved Sasuke ? and you simply didn't want to lose to him ?"

Naruto had a crush on Sakura since the Academy (before they were assigned in a team together). Sakura wasn't the only Girl who had a crush on Sasuke (The Fangirl-Group was pretty large). If Naruto was really envious of Sasuke, then not because Sakura had a crush on him.
 

Sasuke basically got all the attention, and 'attention' was something Naruto desperately fought for as a child. So if Naruto really intended to 'win' against Sasuke, then only by getting more attention than him. So.. How would he have 'more' attention than Sasuke when he only tried to pick up Sakura from his FanGirl-Group ? What about Ino and the other Girls who had a crush on him? Shouldn't Naruto also have tried to pick them up too if he really wanted to get more attention than Sasuke ? I mean Ino gave Sasuke the same attention as Sakura. 

So the big qusiton here is : "why did Naruto choose Sakura from all the girls, and why 'only' her ?"

Sakura was also propably the most difficult Person he could choose since Sakura 'hated' Naruto, so this wouldn't make any sense. Narutos chances getting a other girl was much higher back in the days than with Sakura. Doesn't it maybe prove the point that Narutos feelings towards Sakura had nothing to do with Sasuke? And that maybe Sakura was the reason why Naruto was even more 'envious' of Sasuke ? 

Sasuke wasn't the only one who got more attention than Naruto. Basically everyone got more attention than him. However i do believe that Sakura was the last missing final straw which leads Naruto to start the 'rivalry' against him. 

I mean it's the same with Kakashi - Obtio - Rin. Kakashi got so much attention because he was a skilled student, and Rin was one of the FanGirls. Obito didn't start the 'rivalry' against Kakashi because he got more 'attention', because he got the 'attention' from the Girl he had a crush on. That's the same with Naruto.. he started the 'rivalry' because Sasuke got the attention from the Girl he loves/d. 


 

[SlyNinjaKnight]

Quote from Sakura in 'The Last' : "Do you remember when you said you loved me ? ... i wonder... did you only said that because i loved Sasuke ? and you simply didn't want to lose to him ?"

Naruto had a crush on Sakura since the Academy (before they were assigned in a team together). Sakura wasn't the only Girl who had a crush on Sasuke (The Fangirl-Group was pretty large). If Naruto was really envious of Sasuke, then not because Sakura had a crush on him.
 

Sasuke basically got all the attention, and 'attention' was something Naruto desperately fought for as a child. So if Naruto really intended to 'win' against Sasuke, then only by getting more attention than him. So.. How would he have 'more' attention than Sasuke when he only tried to pick up Sakura from his FanGirl-Group ? What about Ino and the other Girls who had a crush on him? Shouldn't Naruto also have tried to pick them up too if he really wanted to get more attention than Sasuke ? I mean Ino gave Sasuke the same attention as Sakura. 

So the big qusiton here is : "why did Naruto choose Sakura from all the girls, and why 'only' her ?"

Sakura was also propably the most difficult Person he could choose since Sakura 'hated' Naruto, so this wouldn't make any sense. Narutos chances getting a other girl was much higher back in the days than with Sakura. Doesn't it maybe prove the point that Narutos feelings towards Sakura had nothing to do with Sasuke? And that maybe Sakura was the reason why Naruto was even more 'envious' of Sasuke ? 

Sasuke wasn't the only one who got more attention than Naruto. Basically everyone got more attention than him. However i do believe that Sakura was the last missing final straw which leads Naruto to start the 'rivalry' against him. 

I mean it's the same with Kakashi - Obtio - Rin. Kakashi got so much attention because he was a skilled student, and Rin was one of the FanGirls. Obito didn't start the 'rivalry' against Kakashi because he got more 'attention', because he got the 'attention' from the Girl he had a crush on. That's the same with Naruto.. he started the 'rivalry' because Sasuke got the attention from the Girl he loves/d. 


 

 

I'm pretty sure the main reason Naruto 'choose' Sakura was because he saw himself in her. At the start of their time at the Academy, Sakura was picked on by bullies because of her forehead. It wasn't until she befriended Ino that Sakura gained enough confidence to fight back against her bullies. I think that's why in the genjutsu dream in The Last film, the writers made sure to have Hinata picked on by bullies for her eyes because they knew that Kishimoto had used it for Sakura back in Part I, and it had worked back then, so why not copy it in The Last. 

[VanitasDS76491]

I'm pretty sure the main reason Naruto 'choose' Sakura was because he saw himself in her. At the start of their time at the Academy, Sakura was picked on by bullies because of her forehead. It wasn't until she befriended Ino that Sakura gained enough confidence to fight back against her bullies. I think that's why in the genjutsu dream in The Last film, the writers made sure to have Hinata picked on by bullies for her eyes because they knew that Kishimoto had used it for Sakura back in Part I, and it had worked back then, so why not copy it in The Last.

That's right hinata basically was given sakura past with bullies since when never saw that with hinata and that flashback in the pain arc from the anime doesn't count either. Naruto even said after he and Sasuke on the roof of the hospital sakura had nothing to do with their fight and to stay out of it. So ya that whole naruto loving sakura cause of a rivalry with sasuke was kitten.

[Riverkid]

That's right hinata basically was given sakura past with bullies since when never saw that with hinata and that flashback in the pain arc from the anime doesn't count either. Naruto even said after he and Sasuke on the roof of the hospital sakura had nothing to do with their fight and to stay out of it. So ya that whole naruto loving sakura cause of a rivalry with sasuke was kitten.

 

 

 

I'm pretty sure the main reason Naruto 'choose' Sakura was because he saw himself in her. At the start of their time at the Academy, Sakura was picked on by bullies because of her forehead. It wasn't until she befriended Ino that Sakura gained enough confidence to fight back against her bullies. I think that's why in the genjutsu dream in The Last film, the writers made sure to have Hinata picked on by bullies for her eyes because they knew that Kishimoto had used it for Sakura back in Part I, and it had worked back then, so why not copy it in The Last. 

Hinata is from the Hyuga-Clan. One of the strongest and noblest Clan in Konoha which everyone should know. Why would someone bully her ? That just doesnt sound right (except you are really dumb to mess with a member of the hyuga clan)

On the other hand we have Sakura from a underdog Clan/family and with a large forhead. the reasons to bully her would be atleast justified since you don't mess around with a noble clan and won't get any trouble if someone find out. Sakura suit the bullied-role way more than Hinata, its a pretty damn shame that Kishi didn't used that. 

Edited by Riverkid, 10 January 2017 - 02:37 AM.

[VanitasDS76491]

Hinata is from the Hyuga-Clan. One of the strongest and noblest Clan in Konoha which everyone should know. Why would someone bully her ? That just doesnt sound right (except you are really dumb to mess with a member of the hyuga clan)
On the other hand we have Sakura from a underdog Clan/family and with a large forhead. the reasons to bully her would be atleast justified since you don't mess around with a noble clan and won't get any trouble if someone find out. Sakura suit the bullied-role way more than Hinata, its a pretty damn shame that Kishi didn't used that.

That and hinata has no spine to stand up for herself at sakura does unless sasuke is involved. Really the hyuga are the strongest and most noble clan in the leaf village going off the series kishi made clear the uchiha the strongest and noble given how much he ruined the story playing favorites with them and him taking it up the ass from the uchiha.

[Konoha'sCrimsonFox]

NaruSaku and SasuKarin are confirmed by the author and Sasuke will have a big impact on this story just as much as Hinata is having (with Toneri).

 

Some of the events have been alternated (chapter 1) that never took place in the original like Sakura reflecting back at her confessions to both her teammates, Naruto eating alone at Ichiraku Ramen, no scarf-kun, no Sakura playing matchmaker ect.

 

And judging with by the part that we are currently reading. I believe the past three pages was so post to be the cave scene where Sakura berates Naruto to be more supportive of Hinata lol from the film version that Tokai converted the entire scene to be a NS teasing scene by Sai. Possibly there may not be a river genjutsu scene to. We shall see.

 

So its best to ignore all the current canon kiiten BS for now. 

 

 

The Pein Arc has some relativity with this one regarding Hinata.

Here she thought about Sakura having feelings for Naruto. At the end of Pein Arc, Hinata was similing with the other villagers when Sakura hugged Naruto.

 

Yes and its debatable rather or not Hinata's insight about Sakura having "romantic" feelings for. You could be right "logically. However, this kitten canon works foreshadows Hinata not being bother by Sakura's feeling for Naruto because she thinks Sakura is close like a sister because they are close comrades and perhaps she felt happy for Naruto, knowing that Naruto never had a family. That why SP thought it was a good idea to write a cheesy NH fanfiction, portraying Sakura being a match maker.  

 

Although, as you can see. Tokai's version contradicts that. Hinata as mature into adulthood and further discern Sakura's feelings for Naruto being more than platonic and thus she's dejected. 

Edited by Konoha'sCrimsonFox, 10 January 2017 - 12:20 PM.

[T XD]

Yes and its debatable rather or not Hinata's insight about Sakura having "romantic" feelings for. You could be right "logically. However, this kitten canon works foreshadows Hinata not being bother by Sakura's feeling for Naruto because she thinks Sakura is close like a sister because they are close comrades and perhaps she felt happy for Naruto, knowing that Naruto never had a family. That why SP thought it was a good idea to write a cheesy NH fanfiction, portraying Sakura being a match maker.  

 

Although, as you can see. Tokai's version contradicts that. Hinata as mature into adulthood and further discern Sakura's feelings for Naruto being more than platonic and thus she's dejected. 

That's the best way for those who enjoy NH. That's why they did it that way.

[Konoha'sCrimsonFox]

That's the best way for those who enjoy NH. That's why they did it that way.

And that's why their version the so called "canon" is full of kitten.

[T XD]

And that's why their version the so called "canon" is full of kitten.

It's not written nor executed by Kishimoto. Thus, not canon.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

It's not written nor executed by Kishimoto. Thus, not canon.

 

True, too bad the fandom is rabid about it, all because they were the loudest. XP

[VanitasDS76491]

A naruhina fan tried to explain to me why naruto only loving Sakura because of sasuke was true. It made me laugh so hard. The notion that Naruto only loved Sakura because of his rivalry with sasuke is dumb. Sasuke has never loved Sakura so how could it be because of rivalry if he never loved her? Also i think the main proof that Naruto really loved Sakura is because of how he made the promise of a lifetime and fought so hard to bring sasuke back. Naruto knew that Sakura loved sasuke yet he fought to bring him back knowing that Sakura might chose sasuke over him. Naruto loves her so much that he would do anything for her even fight to bring the man she"loved" back. I know sasuke his is teammate but i don't believe Naruto would of fought that hard if Sakura wasn't involved. Back when the others decided sasuke should be dealt with i'm sure Naruto would of agreed with it if not for Sakura's involvement. Naruto would sacrifice the world and himself to save Sakura. So how anyone can say Naruto only loved Sakura because of superficial reasons is beyond me.

Again I say right sasuke met the sound four naruto said to sakura to stay out of their fight and that it was between him and Sasuke. While naruto making that promise was good I still think it was bad cause that promise was what ruined naruto, cause that's what his character wouldn't shut up about and the plot got dropped for a sub plot. Plus naruto should given up on sasuke after they first met in shippuden. He could brought him to stop him and let him get arrested. But no he has to let a psychopathic murder go cause he's got a man crush on sasuke like everyone bows down to the uchiha. At least in fairy tail when jellal helped out against with seis he got arrested for what he did despite him being controlled.

[TheFirstEvil100]

You know something remember when the clone wars first started way back and people hated Ahsoka but look at her now and how many love her and are want to know what happened to her that is how a good writer does their females in a story unlike Kishi and people say he is a good writer well namely NH fans that is.

 

not only that I get so pissed when they say Sakura did nothing but abuse Naruto it makes me so pissed when they say this like they know what abuse is, I tell you they kittening don't know a damn thing on abuse, I want to get real with all of you right now and say my dad abused my mum in more wats than one I saw what he did to her. As did my sister they kitten even wanted us to spy on her hell he once even lied to the police, what he did to myn mum was abuse and when and NH says that Sakura is abuseive  to Naruto makes my blood heat up.

 

Its also why I hate what Kishi said about why Sakura couldn't move on as she would be a bad woman if she did as it hits home a lot worse for me.

Edited by TheFirstEvil100, 12 January 2017 - 12:01 PM.

[NeonRanger]

Not to defend NH, but them (and other anti-Sakura fans) seeing Sakura as an "abusive" person is a legit argument. You have to remember not everyone researched the definition of "tsundere" or have limited taste in manga (my sister, for one, has only ever read and watch Naruto, nothing else) to where they will not see NS as a common trope you would see if you read more manga. Then you have people who hate the trope point blank. Not everyone tolerates Sakura hitting Naruto; for me I was uncomfortable with part 1 Sakura. Especially when her reason for hitting Naruto were hypocritical (like the peeing moment in the FoD). And Kishi was aware of it as well, if you see from part 2 you can easily see Sakura soften around Naruto. 

 

I don't know why Sakura ended up taking the most crap for her "tsundere", maybe because Naruto is popular. In general, "tsundere" is  becoming a less liked character trope. My sis doesn't hates NH, but she hates Sakura's personality more which is why she shrugged when NH was canon. 

[T XD]

Not to defend NH, but them (and other anti-Sakura fans) seeing Sakura as an "abusive" person is a legit argument. You have to remember not everyone researched the definition of "tsundere" or have limited taste in manga (my sister, for one, has only ever read and watch Naruto, nothing else) to where they will not see NS as a common trope you would see if you read more manga. Then you have people who hate the trope point blank. Not everyone tolerates Sakura hitting Naruto; for me I was uncomfortable with part 1 Sakura. Especially when her reason for hitting Naruto were hypocritical (like the peeing moment in the FoD). And Kishi was aware of it as well, if you see from part 2 you can easily see Sakura soften around Naruto.
 
I don't know why Sakura ended up taking the most crap for her "tsundere", maybe because Naruto is popular. In general, "tsundere" is  becoming a less liked character trope. My sis doesn't hates NH, but she hates Sakura's personality more which is why she shrugged when NH was canon.

 
Yes, there are those who don't know about tsundere characters cause of their limited experience with manga and anime, and there are those who don't like tsundere character. But, no, they're not becoming less liked character trope cause the majority like tsundere characters of different tsundere types of characters.
 
Tsundere character, usually, is what makes the heroine in most of the manga and anime there is. How I know ? I've seen some manga and many anime. New manga and anime are still continuing with tsundere characters. There's also many male tsundere characters. Tsundere character/s is liked to be there for many manga and anime cause it's well liked in Japan. For me, sometimes I think it's a must.
Also, there are hero and heroine characters who aren't tsundere and they make them act tsundere from time to time.
 
If tsundere characters were becoming less liked characters, mangakas won't be putting tsundere characters as heroes and  / or heroines in new stories, nor mangakas will be willing to continue showing the tsundere behaviors of their tsundere character/s with their already continuing manga.
 
About Sakura, regarding hitting, there are more tsundere characters who hit the hero and / or other characters by a long shot like some pinata She's of the mild ones in hitting XD

Edited by T XD, 12 January 2017 - 04:29 PM.

[NeonRanger]

Yeah, you're right. That's why I came to the conclusion that Sakura ended up taking the most crap simply because Naruto attracted a wider fanbase. It also didn't help that this fanbase has to be the most closed minded fan base I ever meet. The fact that people still call Sakura "abusive" makes me confused. It also makes me cringe when they say that Sakura herself was abusive towards Sasuke, out of all characters. 

[tricksie]

Not to defend NH, but them (and other anti-Sakura fans) seeing Sakura as an "abusive" person is a legit argument. You have to remember not everyone researched the definition of "tsundere" or have limited taste in manga (my sister, for one, has only ever read and watch Naruto, nothing else) to where they will not see NS as a common trope you would see if you read more manga. Then you have people who hate the trope point blank. Not everyone tolerates Sakura hitting Naruto; for me I was uncomfortable with part 1 Sakura. Especially when her reason for hitting Naruto were hypocritical (like the peeing moment in the FoD). And Kishi was aware of it as well, if you see from part 2 you can easily see Sakura soften around Naruto. 

 

I don't know why Sakura ended up taking the most crap for her "tsundere", maybe because Naruto is popular. In general, "tsundere" is  becoming a less liked character trope. My sis doesn't hates NH, but she hates Sakura's personality more which is why she shrugged when NH was canon. 

The other thing fans (NH fans especially) conveniently forget about the 'abusive' trope stuff is that it was all done in the framework of Part 1...when they are all crappy, selfish characters. The fans who want to keep Sakura in the abuser/tsundere role are very selective about keeping Sakura this way, while letting Naruto, Sasuke and even Hinata grow out of their Part 1 characters and develop.

 

It's a very one-sided, Sakura-bashing type of idea.

 

That doesn't mean that people (like your sis) can't be uncomfortable with the idea of Sakura hitting Naruto. No more than they might be uncomfortable with the idea of the main character taking a leak in the middle of a suspenseful scene. (Imagine Superman or Batman stopping to take a whiz.) My point is some of those things — the rough exterior that hides a soft side (Sakura), potty humor to break up tension (Naruto) — are exaggerated for the sake of the story. And also for Japanese manga humor and tropes. (It may seem unsettling for a new reader, but both those things have been done a lot, thus they became a little less unusual.)

 

So if someone says they don't like Sakura because she's abusive, make them dig a little deeper. Because if Sakura has to remain abusive, then Naruto has to remain the self-centered (and often mean) prankster, and Sasuke has to remain too cool for everyone. And Hinata has to forever remain weird.

 

If Sakura is still abusive, but Naruto has turned into Naruto the beloved hero, Hinata is the pretty, self-assured girl, and Sasuke is the new non-pervy Jiraiya out to save the village....then you know it's more about hatred of Sakura than it is about what Naruto was ever really about.

 

edit: Just thinking about it, I think that it also matters if you read the manga or watched the anime. I think they play up a lot more of that Tsundere crap with Sakura in the anime and sympathize more with Hinata. So if you're watching Sakura in the anime...you're probably getting a much more exaggerated version than the manga.

[NeonRanger]

My sis dedicated herself more into anime (dub) than the manga (she hates reading in general). So I didn't really put much effort in convincing her that Sakura isn't like that because I knew she'd never finish the manga (she stopped right before part 1 SNS fight and continued into anime).

 

Ive noticed plenty of anti Sakura fans base her character off the anime. SP really does exaggerate their character types. 

[Riverkid]

Not to defend NH, but them (and other anti-Sakura fans) seeing Sakura as an "abusive" person is a legit argument. You have to remember not everyone researched the definition of "tsundere" or have limited taste in manga (my sister, for one, has only ever read and watch Naruto, nothing else) to where they will not see NS as a common trope you would see if you read more manga. Then you have people who hate the trope point blank. Not everyone tolerates Sakura hitting Naruto; for me I was uncomfortable with part 1 Sakura. Especially when her reason for hitting Naruto were hypocritical (like the peeing moment in the FoD). And Kishi was aware of it as well, if you see from part 2 you can easily see Sakura soften around Naruto. 

 

I don't know why Sakura ended up taking the most crap for her "tsundere", maybe because Naruto is popular. In general, "tsundere" is  becoming a less liked character trope. My sis doesn't hates NH, but she hates Sakura's personality more which is why she shrugged when NH was canon. 

 

You have to think beyond that. In a topic like that its pretty pointless to argue about the Character or the Character-type. its more important what Kishimoto tried to accomplish with the way how he created Sakura. 

Sakura was acutally a 'good' Character in Season 1, atleast way better than everyone is rating her. A 'good' Character doesn't have to be usefull for the Protagonist or likeable for the audience but instead usefull for the Story. It was Kishimotos intention to create Team-7 with a terrible Teamdynamic because they should 'break' apart towards the end of season 1. Having Sakura there with a annoying personality and also with a favor for Sasuke (the rival of Naruto) she was doing a great job by supporting Kishimotos intention. The Character of Sakura was used for the Story in Season 1, while in Shippuden she was more used for the Protagonist 'Naruto'.

However Kishimoto still did some 'Errors' with the Character of Sakura in season 1. The Errors are not the overused punches towards Naruto but the 'driven source' Kishimoto gave her (or rather displayed for the audience). Narutos drive was to be the next Hokage, Sasukes drive was to be strong enough to kill Itachi... but Sakuras drive was always to be noticed by Sasuke. This Drive of Sakura peaked at the moment where she tried to stop Sasuke from leaving the village (the conversation where she confessed her love towards him). Saying stuff like "i will abandon the village with you" "i only need you (i dont need the village, friends or parents)" etc. was really hurting the Character of Sakura because she doesn't think like a Shinobi at all and she feels out of place in this world. A Shinobi protect his own village and his friends - unless your have an other source to abandon these values like Madara abandon the leaf because he felt betrayed from his own clan - Sakura didnt have a reason to abandon the village or her friends, it was just because she had a crush on Sasuke.. and thats a Character for a shoujo-manga and not for a shonen. 

 

Kishimoto gladly fixed that at the end and also in shippuden to give her the drive to be a strong kunoichi like tsunade and being usefull for the Protagonist.

Sadly he didn't fixed Hinata in the same way, and she stayed as a Character more for a shoujo-type, since her only drive was and will always be 'Naruto-kun'
 

 

 

Edited by Riverkid, 12 January 2017 - 08:58 PM.