Ah the home stretch and its cooler out.
Whether it's NS, SS, or NH, it doesn't matter. Naruto is not a shoujo manga. It's a shonen manga with a primary focus on fights, villains and plot. The pairings were just secondary plots that shipping fans gave too much importance due to the drama Kishimoto created and pairings wars inside the Fandom.
But whether you like it or not, Sasuke is the second main character of the manga. More than half of the manga and its arcs revolve around him and the Uchiha clan. He was Sakura's first love and the one she ended up with. He was also the main link that brought Sakura and Naruto together in Part 2 and the central theme of their interactions.
That's why I created this topic to discuss what a Part 2 for Sakura and Naruto would be like with Sasuke in the village and without any major drama surrounding him like in Part 1.
Ah you remembered that Naruto was a shounen manga and not a Shoujo...Wonder how long that will last?
The overfocus is because the Uchiha clan was one of the few elements Kishimoto developed early on. When he got into the later parts of the manga where he wasn't allowed to slow down because the anime was constantly at his heels. So he increasingly made it more and more important both because of a lack of other stories to work with and to justify the eternal chase after Sasuke.
Why that line sound very familiar to me. In fact, it sound like the general warning I gave after you got into a fight over SS with Blue in my Boruto Nicknames topic. As the person that has been the most on topic in this discussion. i find it very rude that you are lording over the members within the first page. Anyways your topic isn't just about what NS would be like if Sasuke was in the village for part two. For one, you pretty much imply you don't believe Naruto and Sakura had any bond at all unless Sasuke was gone, having no bond in part one, and only having a bond about Sasuke in part two. Which anyone who had any understanding of Naruto would have to disagree with; at least until after the ending. Two, you asked them various scenarios and the likelihood of SS happening in those. Which I am the only one, as far as I can tell, who has even tried to go through those. Hell, I have been going over your posts when I had time over the weekend, to see what you are even going on about in this discussion.
Sasuke also had a tragic past marked by the Uchiha clan massacre. Additionally, characters like Itachi, Madara, and Orochimaru constantly manipulated him, trying to sway him down the wrong path. These events played a crucial role in Sasuke's departure from Team 7, the ensuing drama and his descent into "darkness" of Part 2.
The issue is that you want a Sasuke who pines for Sakura or openly asks her out on dates like Naruto. He's a character with a completely opposite personality. That will never happen. However, in Part 1, it was clear that Sasuke cared about Sakura deeply, even to the point of being willing to die to save her. This was before the drama with the Uchihas unfolded and he left the village. Additionally, she had a level of influence over him, as seen when she helped break the cursed seal with her hug.
Even if less important characters could change after Naruto TnJ , it was naive to believe that Sasuke would never return, find a new purpose, or acknowledge Sakura in the end. "SasuSaku" was never dead until Sakura moved on from Sasuke. Sasuke had already demonstrated his capacity for a complete turnaround without any Naruto TnJ. His decision to abandon his plan to destroy the village and instead fight in the war to protect it as clear evidence of this.
Sasuke also did nearly die to save Naruto from Haku's attack. Are you saying he was in love with Naruto then? Hell it was instinctual when he did it for Naruto. So, based on that is he more in love with Naruto or Sakura? He at least talks to and spends time with Naruto. Again, Sasuke did care for Sakura like he care for Naruto, but he ended his bond with Sakura when he left the village. And he made it clear he never loved her.
Though granted, you kind of made it clear you will ignore anything Sasuke says or feels when it doesn't suit your narrative. You don't care what he says, how he feels, what he thinks, what he wants, or even who he loves. He is just a big sexy dreamy bad boy you can fix and anything to the contrary? He better shut his mouth.
Wait wasn't the TnJ and the eternal chase just Kishimoto trolling or something to you or something like that? It so hard to remember when and when not Kishimoto is trolling according to your standards.
If he didn't like it, Kishimoto had the pen and the authority to avoid making them official and stopping emphasizing Sakura's feelings altogether. The idea that Kishimoto was forced to do anything by the shipping fandom or editors is absurd. As the creator and owner of the franchise, he had complete creative control over everything in his manga, including secondary plots pairings. Especially at the end of the manga when Kishimoto was doing whatever he wanted. Or did some editor forced Kishimoto to make Kaguya? Madara was much more popular than her .
Sasuke ultimately accepted Sakura's feelings, while Rin ended up dead by Kakashi's hand, leaving Kakashi filled with guilt and resentment. Kakashi could have easily dismissed Sakura's love as childish and foolissh and emphasized Naruto's loves for Sakura at this moment like he did with Rin. But he never did. Furthermore, Kakashi defended Sakura's feelings for Sasuke when she confessed for the second time, arguing that Sasuke was wrong to reject them.
While there are parallels between Team 7 and other characters, fundamental differences prevent them from being mere clones. Sasuke, Naruto and Sakura has their own unique identities. Additionally, there's no Hinata's equivalent in the other teams and neither Kushina and Minato have any ""Sasuke"" in their life.
Theoretically, Sakura surpassed Rin. She didn't die and won the love of her teammate. Naruto surpassed Obito. He didn't become a simp obsessed with a girl for his entire life and achieved his dream of becoming Hokage.
Sakura surpassed Tsunade. She didn't lose any loved ones and managed to save Sasuke and Naruto, unlike Tsunade who lost Dan and Nawaki. Naruto surpassed Jiraiya. He managed to save his friend and became Hokage.
It was never stated that the only important aspect of the parallels was Naruto simply winning Sakura's love. It's not like Naruto gives this the same importance to that as he does to Sasuke or his dream of becoming Hokage. He never said: "How I can become Hokage without Sakura-Chan as my wife?" But he did say he couldn't be Hokage without Sasuke back.
The POAL, which was once was requirement for Naruto to confess his feelings to Sakura, was simply disregarded when Sakura "confessed". Instead, Naruto declared his unwavering resolve to save Sasuke, regardless of Sakura's approval.
You seem to underestimate the power of corporations. They order Kishimoto to do something and he does it or he loses money to feed his family. By the time of the ending Naruto stop mattering as the only thing that mattered was setting up the sequel Boruto. Eventually, there was a point he wasn't allowed to say no because there was too much money put into the Next Generation project.
Its strange you hate Ikemoto so much when he is the primary reason SS happened.
Kaguya was to make the Hyuuga's more important to the plot and introduce the second sage who was the ancestor of the Hyuuga clan. To justify Hinata becoming the Heroine, and to replace the branch seal plot that died with Neji. As well as connect the story to the Last's plot.
The same logic can be applied to both SS and NH. Why did Kishimoto make Hinata confess her love for Naruto and kill Neji if he didn't have plans for NH? Why did Kishimoto make Sakura admits that she still loved Sasuke in chapter 540, have her declare her love so many times throughout the series?
The Last began it's production in 2012. So, by then, Kishimoto had already decided the main couples. Probably, he just threw the Kushina/Sakura to keep the NaruSaku fandom interested in the manga until the end, prolonging the dramas or pairing wars between SS/NH/NS until the last chapter.
Not that I agree with this stupid logic of deceiving a portion of the manga readers. But he himself admitted to using it as a form of trolling and red herrings in a interview later.
His new editor during the Pein arc was a nH fan and wanted her to replace Sakura. For Neji death, Derock says that one anime staff member literally wouldn't stop whining about how much he hated Neji and demanding Kishimoto kill him. 540 was the Iwa ninja who gave her a love letter for healing him, her turning him down, and he praises the guy she likes. She then has a negative look on her face when she thinks of Sasuke. The readers were not suppose to take that as a good thing, but well people like you did.
Was the Last always intended to be canon? Or was it originally going to be another anime movie till Kishimoto decided he was going to end his cash cow manga, and various companies came up with ideas how to keep it going so they can continue to make money from it?
You'd be surprised what people will say to get their paychecks. Mark Hamill didn't like The Last Jedi and thought he wasn't even playing Luke Skywalker. Fans who didn't like the movie used his statements for support in their own dislike for it. Mark Hamill stops making statements critical of Star Wars. Kishimoto interviews after the ending that convince fans the ending was last minute change, so they leave. Kishimoto starts giving interviews where nH/SS was the plan all along. Quite the conundrum isn't it?
I've always disagreed with this argument that Sakura's role as a main female hinges on her ending up with Naruto.
Sakura's prominence throughout the manga and her significance as Team 7's member solidify her place as a main female of the franchise, regardless of whether she ended up alone or married to any random character.
Sakura remained far more important than Hinata until the final chapter of the manga written by Kishimoto.
I cannot recall Hinata having any significant role in the war aside from holding Naruto's hand and constantly mentioning his name like a robot.
- It was Sakura who unraveled White Zetsu's plan.
- Sakura received the Byakugou and healed the entire Ninja Alliance, surpassing Tsunade.
- Sakura saved Naruto while Hinata tripped over a rock.
- Sakura saved Sasuke and played a crucial role against Kaguya while Hinata remained trapped alongside the other secondary characters.
- Sakura received her character conclusion in the final volume and chapter of the manga.
- Sakura had a Gaiden dedicated to her daughter in the manga and later saved Sasuke, Naruto, and Sarada from a powerfull enemy.
- To this day, Sakura receives far more novels, merchandise, and official events than Hinata.
At most, Hinata was the heroine of The Last. In the Boruto manga in trash anyway and her presence is practically nonexisten
If popularity were a criterion for defining the manga's heroine, Sakura crushed Hinata in the last popularity poll. Hinata did not become the heroine nor did she become more popular for ending up as Naruto's housewife.
You can be as upset of it as much as you want. But that was Sakura's role and when she lost that she lost most of her relevance to the plot. She went from either the second or third most important character in the story to non-existent. Neither facts nor the truth rest solely on your approval of them.
Naruto Uzumaki was the main character in the story of the Manga Naruto; so the manga was about his journey of growth and self-discovery. Kakashi Hatake was his mentor his role was to teach the main character Naruto to help in the growth. Sasuke Uchiha was the rival his role was to challenge in order to help in the main Character Naruto's growth. Sakura Hanuro was the love interest her role was to emotionally support the main character Naruto in his growth. These are basics of story telling. If Sakura was not the love interest of the main character Naruto, why was she on the team!? Why was the love interest of the rival on the team and not the main character's? And again, according to you Sakura and Naruto have no bond. They were never close. They never cared about each other in the slightest. Sakura only EVER cared about Sasuke. Why Is a character like that part of the main cast of a story whose major themes include Bonds and Teamwork!?!
And even if that was her role. Why did she disappear from the plot afterwards and lose all relevance beyond that she birth the love interest for the Sequel main character? If her role never changed; if she was never removed and replaced as the heroine/love interest. She should have remain part of the main cast and fought alongside Sasuke and Naruto in the sequel. But she doesn't.
Honestly, this is one of the reasons Western Media has been in decline. People find something as basic as character roles offensive.
They thought she was unpopular and could be replaced. It backfired. And that poll last years showed that to everyone.
Around 70% of the fandom was focused on power levels and the plot. Meanwhile, pairing fans were constantly discussing their parallels, pairings, getting embroiled in shipping wars and mocking rival fans on Tumblr, blowing things out of proportion.
For example, I've even encountered many NaruSaku Shippers who believe Naruto failed completely as a character because he 'lost' Sakura and moved on.
Maybe if these fans had dedicated themselves more to the actual manga plot instead of talking about ship wars and pairings all the time, the shock and rage wouldn't have been so great for the losing side. Inevitably, in a love triangle dragged out for so long, some part of the fandom will feel like losers, whether they were SS, NH, or NS fans.
Anyway, this isn't exclusive to Kishimoto or Naruto manga. Ichigo and Rukia fans were outraged that Ichigo ended up with Orihime. Even today, there are shipping wars in the Avatar fandom, with Zutara and KataAang fans insulting each other and Zutara fans refusing to accept the canon.
Yet the pairing debates are what make the Naruto fanbase infamous and notoriously toxic that it puts off potential new fans as much as it chases off the old. Don't worry, most of the blame from what I have seen and heard falls largely on the nH fans, well at least before the ending. Then when nH/SS happened. Instead of peacefully enjoying their victory. They both started fighting each other and chasing every other faction off.
Well lets see, before the ending when Naruto loved Sakura he was working towards his goal and was often quite successful as well as optimistic. After the ending, he is a failure at everything he accomplishes and he seems utterly miserable. So, it is natural to think, "when the only difference is he was no longer in love with Sakura and the only goal he failed to achieve before the ending was getting together with her". 'Maybe if he had gotten with her the sequel and everything else would be better.'
Edited by Bail o' Lies, 01 June 2024 - 03:39 AM.