4869 replies to this topic

[Serenity Namikaze]

I for one think everyones missing the point and looking at things from the wrong perspective.

Im glad Kishimoto-sensei has given us real and solid characters in this story. flesha nd blood bleeding characters who take hurts and wounds and grow from them as they heal.

A hero who has his entire world ripped apart and his entire belief system torn down around his ears who collapses under the strain only to rise up again and go to confront the main people in his life.

A heroine who started under and illusion and who slowly and steadily has grown to see clearly. who hesitates to kill the person who was once a person of great importance in her life. but is willing to sacrafice not only her own life but the chance that she might be loved by another important person by killing the character thats like a brother to the one shes fallen in love with.

lastly theres Sasuke. people keep looking at him as a main character and he simply isnt. hes the reason for the protaginist and main characters to strive and grow and heal. hes getting all the attention because without him the main characters would stagnate and become an orange knucklehead and a pink dreamer. instead theyve become powerful and mature.

now they are progressing forward and the story with them.

I couldn't say it better myself, really nice catsi

I'm glad that Kishi did develop the more psychological side of his character. Actually, that one of the first thing that I've learn to like about Naruto in general

Edited by silverserenity, 18 February 2010 - 08:21 PM.

[Jenskott]

Basically I only think SS has a chance because of the preposterous passes Sasuke keeps getting in this manga.

Sasuke has been portrayed like a reckless idiot, an easily manipulable tool and a heartless loon whose obsession with revenge has consumed his humanity and has turned him eviler and whose arrogance leads him to start fights where he routinely gets his butt kicked. If you actually look to his fights you will realize his allegedly vast powers and supposedly countless jutsus have never saved him from being severely harmed and wounded. Deidara, Itachi, Killer Bee, the five Kages... all of them have beaten him up. The only times he has "defeated" one fight he has lost the real battle or has paid one heavy prize: being in constant risk of being taken over by Orochimaru, losing his mightiest summon, finding out his brother wasn't evil, losing his friends, losing his eyesight...

Yes, he has a lot of techniques. And he is getting blind cause those techniques. And when push comes to shove, they don't help him at all.

And do you tell he gets passes?

He's become the main character

No.

He is the main VILLAIN. Or at least one of the main ones. And he has been since he left in Part I. There is one difference.

and everyone acts for his sake or in reaction to his actions.

Which is logical since he is one of the main villains. And usually villains are the ones start off and drive the plot. They are way more powerful than the heroic characters and wield more techniques. Read other series and you will realize usually it is like that in this sort of stories.

He's been fighting non stop for 6 MONTHS now while the supposed main character faints and runs around.

Kishimoto is alternating between developing Naruto and Sasuke.

And Naruto isn't the supposed ANYTHING. He IS the main character.

Truthfully, sometimes I think most fans would love Naruto was like Kenshiro (the Fist of North Star main character): an untochable, aloof, massively super-powerful character who never loses one fight and never is fazed by anything.

However, Kishimoto chose his character was more human and emotionally vulnerable. A character could being weak, could get beaten and crushed physically and emotionally, every time he would get over it and rise again, stronger -physically and emotionally- than before.

I'm sorry, but I also find that appealing.

So why not showering him with love he never wanted anyway at the end? He deserves to be happy!

That cynical conclusion of yours makes no sense and holds no water whatsoever. Nothing in this manga suggests that can be a likely or possible ending.

Kishimoto has progressively turned Sasuke eviler, loonier and more scarred in body and soul. He has got Sasuke rejecting all chances to relinquish his revenge and trying becoming happy. And he has stated Sasuke would get worse.

He doesn't seem being very concerned about Sasuke's happiness.

I for one think everyones missing the point and looking at things from the wrong perspective.

Im glad Kishimoto-sensei has given us real and solid characters in this story. flesha nd blood bleeding characters who take hurts and wounds and grow from them as they heal.

A hero who has his entire world ripped apart and his entire belief system torn down around his ears who collapses under the strain only to rise up again and go to confront the main people in his life.

A heroine who started under and illusion and who slowly and steadily has grown to see clearly. who hesitates to kill the person who was once a person of great importance in her life. but is willing to sacrafice not only her own life but the chance that she might be loved by another important person by killing the character thats like a brother to the one shes fallen in love with.

lastly theres Sasuke. people keep looking at him as a main character and he simply isnt. hes the reason for the protaginist and main characters to strive and grow and heal. hes getting all the attention because without him the main characters would stagnate and become an orange knucklehead and a pink dreamer. instead theyve become powerful and mature.

now they are progressing forward and the story with them.

I completely agree with you on all points, Catsi.

Edited by Jenskott, 18 February 2010 - 08:47 PM.

[Serenity Namikaze]

Truthfully, sometimes I think most fans would love Naruto was like Kenshiro (the Fist of North Star main character): an untochable, aloof, massively super-powerful character who never loses one fight and never is fazed by anything.

However, Kishimoto chose his character was more human and emotionally vulnerable. A character could being weak, could get beaten and crushed physically and emotionally, every time he would get over it and rise again, stronger -physically and emotionally- than before.

I'm sorry, but I also find that appealing.

I totally agreed with you. A character that faces difficulties but rise again and learn from that painful experience is what make this manga more realistic and good.

[ciardha]

Truthfully, sometimes I think most fans would love Naruto was like Kenshiro (the Fist of North Star main character): an untochable, aloof, massively super-powerful character who never loses one fight and never is fazed by anything.

Which is why I found that series crashingly dull. That type character was also common in action orientated seinen manga, with the addition of having tons of near naked women falling all over the guy. Such as in Space Adventure Cobra- the women were treated as disposable objects basically- used in a chapter and often getting killed off brutally near the end of the chapter, with no references to the character ever again.

Naruto and Sakura are far more heroic to me because their reactions are much more like what a real person's would be. In real life people fail and cry too, and people still call them heroes.

Edited by ciardha, 18 February 2010 - 09:40 PM.

[Jenskott]

Which is why I found that series crashingly dull.

Well... I didn't. As a matter of fact, it is one of my favorite mangas ever. It is a matter of taste (although Kenshiro wasn't my favorite. I favored Shin, Rei or Toki).

I never watched Space Adventure Cobra. I found out plot-related details and I wasn't terribly interested.

I have no troubles with a "Type Kenshiro" main character, but I also can appreciate a "Type Naruto" main character.

[Gravenimage]

Which is why I found that series crashingly dull. That type character was also common in action orientated seinen manga, with the addition of having tons of near naked women falling all over the guy. Such as in Space Adventure Cobra- the women were treated as disposable objects basically- used in a chapter and often getting killed off brutally near the end of the chapter, with no references to the character ever again.

Naruto and Sakura are far more heroic to me because their reactions are much more like what a real person's would be. In real life people fail and cry too, and people still call them heroes.

This is one of the many reasons why Kishi is one of the best mangakas ever. He writes his manga like it was so real waiting to come back to life making the characters like they were very real and human. I love Sakura because she's very human she has her flaws and makes mistakes but she learns from them and try to overcome them. Just look what she did she tried to take whole burden to take out Sasuke herself without letting anyone accompany her, she alone was going to take care of Sasuke by her own hand. Even if she failed she did a good job and she was very brave to make the decision to do it on her own very Naruto like. The one thing that make her my fav heroine it has to be that she was ready to kill Sasuke to protect Naruto and her village not caring if he would hate her for it, she was ready to be hated by him. But it will be enough for her to know that she protected Naruto because she cares for him very much.

[Strangelove]

and i don't think Naruto would hate Sakura, maybe angry at her yes, but hate? Nahh he isn't the type to hold a grudge forever.

Edited by Strangelove, 21 February 2010 - 07:32 PM.

[catsi563]

one of the main things that Sakura and Naruto have to do is get past the current stage that theyre in. the stage theyre in is one of taking everything on themselves instead of doing and protecting each other together.

Sakura began this by saing that next time theyd go together. but shes slipped a bit by learning of Narutos burden. Her desire to protect him has overidden her ability to work together with him a bit. naruto is still taking everything on his shoulders as he feels he should bear all burdens so he can protect everyone.

the two need to grow past this to allow each to take a portion of the burden. knowing that they can carry that load for the other.

that may very well come soon between the two in the next few chapters.

[ciardha]

and i don't think Naruto would hate Sakura, maybe angry at her yes, but hate? Nahh he isn't the type to hold a grudge forever.

He didn't actually hate Sakura anyway. When Sai said Sakura thought you'd probably hate her once you found she was going to kill Sasuke, Naruto looked at Sai like "That's crazy! I'd never hate Sakura."

I seriously doubt he's even angry at her in that sense- more like scared to death about her doing something so reckless for his sake, and distraught that everything has shattered apart. Once he sees how far into the darkness Sasuke has gone his only anger toward her will be her doing something so reckless for his sake. That kind of anger is going to draw them closer together not further apart.

Edited by ciardha, 21 February 2010 - 08:14 PM.

[Gravenimage]

He didn't actually hate Sakura anyway. When Sai said Sakura thought you'd probably hate her once you found she was going to kill Sasuke, Naruto looked at Sai like "That's crazy! I'd never hate Sakura."

I seriously doubt he's even angry at her in that sense- more like scared to death about her doing something so reckless for his sake, and distraught that everything has shattered apart. Once he sees how far into the darkness Sasuke has gone his only anger toward her will be her doing something so reckless for his sake. That kind of anger is going to draw them closer together not further apart.

Yup that's what I think Kishi is doing with this arc. Breaking team seven's bond with Sasuke and strengthen Naruto and Sakura's bond. I believe in future chapters we may have a canon pairing but with Kishi pulling the strings I don't know.

[firegirl]

But, that "but" could be tied to maybe she could read her too. See that she had a plan as well.
It doesnt necessarily tie into her sentence of her loving Sasuke.

Maybe we havent seen her point of view, but many people have said it, and noticed it.

Honestly, she has done alot of things thats gone agaisnt her development as a ninja. She was supposed to be getting smarter, yet she goes through with a half thought out plan.
She was supposed to be more heroic with her development yet she was just put off as a damsel in distress again.
Ninja's arent supposed to turn their backs on their supposed enemies, even if she was trying to gain his trust, yet she did and Sasuke tried to kill her.


Why wouldnt she love the guy? Isnt it said, if you still love someone even in their toughest times, then it is true love?
I mean, Ino might still him too, yet their little interaction, she still does.
WHY WOULD SHE?
Because girls let emotions control their life most of the times. Emotions rule their precise judgement.
But, one thing we can see about her development is that she is not stuck in the past. She is stuck in the now.
She can still love Sasuke even if he tried to kill her.

Karin does. Naruto does as a brother after Sasuke striked him with chidori. Ino does even when they didnt spend alot of time together.

What makes Sakura different from them. And some are caught up and can see his changes.

Well she had thought "If I kill Sasuke right now, this will all be over with"
So, honestly I think this is another sign of her feelings for Sasuke.
If she took to long she could doubt going through with her plan, she wanted to get it over and done with as fast as possible.
But, honestly this is just my thoughts.

. Sasuke can still read her like an open book.
The way he looked at her was the same way he did in Part 1, when he sensed, something was wrong.

this peson is a sasusaku fan and saying sakura has changed but still loves sasuke ?????

what do u guys think im in an debate

and need help

if anyone wants to join their is a huge debate going on at viz

Edited by firegirl, 22 February 2010 - 02:18 AM.

[Gravenimage]

this peson is a sasusaku fan and saying sakura has changed but still loves sasuke ?????

what do u guys think im in an debate

and need help

if anyone wants to join their is a huge debate going on at viz

That person has a nice point of view of things. However that person is ignoring completely the entire development of Sakura throughout the entire manga and the sings she has obviously shown that she has deep feelings for Naruto. Sorry I'm tire and I don't feel like naming all of the chapters with N/S development and moments. But I have to admit that person has a lot of guts to say that Sakura still loves Sasuke even if he tried to kill her....twice. I'm sorry but if I love a girl and she tries to kill me twice I will completely stop loving her because now I have a complete different view about her and she's no longer the person I thought she was. Sakura is smart and she's not insane to still have any romantic feelings when she clearly witnessed herself that Sasuke was about to stab her head with chidori if it wasn't for Kakashi who saved her life.

Also what is that person talking about saying that Sasuke was staring at her the same way he stared at her in part 1? first of all he's no longer part 1 Sasuke he's all evil part 2 Sasuke there's no chance he will stare at Sakura the same way he used to from part 1. He was staring at her seriously not trusting her a bit trying to stab her with chidori was proof that he didn't trusted her and he just wanted to kill her because he felt like it. That person needs to wake up and smell the coffee and realize that Sasuke is all evil to the core.

Edited by Gravenimage, 22 February 2010 - 02:45 AM.

[ShippudenGirl]

this peson is a sasusaku fan and saying sakura has changed but still loves sasuke ?????

what do u guys think im in an debate

and need help

if anyone wants to join their is a huge debate going on at viz

Uhh, say I'm sorry but Sakura NEVER loved him, she had a crush on him when she was freakin' 12 I mean come on! Yeah, I'm gonna go have my friend point a gun to my head as he laughs like a maniac and says die, yeah I'm really gonna love 'em after that, pff... Seriously, other pairings always look at Part 1, example SasuSaku: They think that Sakura is actually "In Love" with Sasuke, the cool Uchiha and she's just a weak fangirl.. My butt. Sasuke is the maniac that tried to KILL her, you gotta be kidding me, really? Sakura's grown up, geez this is why I like NaruSaku so much, they have a lot more development then anyone else and Sakura would die protecting him and he would for her. We don't have to base are evidence on Part 1 we have all we need now. SasuSaku never started, Sasuke found her annoying and tried to kill her. If that isn't enough evidence then I'm gonna go ripe my hair out... Sorry, just watched Friday the 13th and The Collector

[fireandice]

@firegirl

Heh, umm, why is it Sakura couldn't want to get it over and done with because she loves him PLATONICALLY? Goodness, I think she actually slowly began outgrowing her crush on him in part 1 and started caring for him more as a FRIEND.

I mean having a friend betray you is very hurtful already, I don't see why it has to mean she loves him romantically. Sasuke looks like he's beyond redemption already, if you think about it plotwise, what does it stand to achieve to have Sakura still love Sasuke romantically? That everything Naruto did for her escaped her notice? That she didn't mature and realize the one who cared most about her was by her side all along?

[RedDelicious]

I seriously doubt he's even angry at her in that sense- more like scared to death about her doing something so reckless for his sake...

I've been saying that in order for NaruSaku to take the next step, Naruto needs to realize that he has been causing her to be scared to death by all the reckless things he has been doing (behind her back) for her sake. If Sakura's actions cause him to take a closer look at his own actions, all the better.

[Froot]

I've got a question... Anywhere, in the entire series, did Hinata ever say that it was her goal to marry Naruto?

Think back to the Neji/Hinata fight and all that "I'll change the Hyuuga clan" thing Naruto said. Was marriage or anything romantic of the sort mentioned?