9679 replies to this topic

[Mary]

Heh Heh, Pretty Cynical about NS for a NS fan aren't' cha? Not That I'm judging Or saying you're wrong but hear me out please; First off I know Sakura did not intend to tell Naruto the truth about the decision by the Konoha 11 to kill Sasuke in the first place, which in turn actually proves how sensitive she has become to his feelings and that, to some extent says she does love him already in some form or manner or she wouldn't be crying so much from guilt, I mean do you imagine a just a friend being that emotional for hurting you? though of course it also showed she was determined to change her self so as to not always rely on him for the rest of her life. Now We're not accusing that you don't like NS, but its does seem like you're arguing against them rather than for them, however I understand that you don't want to turn into something like NH or SS like, by being in denial of other possibilities and trying to be logical to facts as well and thats okay Its GOOD to think like that, its only that we all care about NS and thinking about the "what if it goes down the drain" concept will just make it depressing for us, though of course we would not rabidly attack other shippings like those NH or SS Fans

I am a cynical person, so of course my second favorite ship is not gonna get away scotch clean no matter how much I want them to be together. And thank you for finally understanding my motivation for posting those arguments, frankly I was starting to think you guys were acting like NH/SS fans (you know, turning a blind eye to events), and I was expecting a little bit more maturity from my fellow NS shippers, which is why I turned cynical. And why the hell are you worrying for? Everything that's happened in that manga up until now has only been good development for NS (even after the confession, didn't you see how the two remained as close as ever, while Naruto ignored Hinata after her confession?) There's no way we'll lose! You're worrying over nothing.

[Mary]

First off, let's cool it with the back-and-forths here. I've seen it happen more than once on this site, and it usually ends with awkwardness or one of the mods coming in.

Mary, you've brought up some great points, and I can tell from your posts that you're a true fan of this pairing. I also agree that we shouldn't have to put on "shipping goggles". I mean if we just flat out ignore arguments against our pairing, we're pretty much the same as a certain other fandom.
However, I do have to disagree with you on one point. Naruto didn't reject Sakura's confession. He himself didn't believe it was a sincere confession, so he wouldn't have been able to reject it. I've had this argument with SasuSaku fans on more than one occasion, where someone will simultaneously call Sakura's confession a "lie" and Naruto's reaction a "rejection". The fact of the matter is that it can't be both. If Naruto acknowledged Sakura's feelings as truth, then said he doesn't love her, or loves someone else, then his reaction would qualify as a rejection. But if he doesn't believe her feelings to be sincere in the first place, then how can his reaction be considered a rejection?
The best way to look at that scene is as confusion on both parties' parts.

That's an interesting way of looking at Naruto's "rejection". Sure I can buy that, if he doesn't believe her, he can't reject her. Still doesn't change the fact that he didn't believe her, which was the point of my whole little rant up there.

[ShippudenGirl]

Oooooooooooooo~! [points finger*] Debating doesn't have to have tension [stink eye*] accusations don't help either, let's all get along like old pals. Hehe. And just a little bit, as confident as an NS I am there is a possible way to lose. We can't say we can't lose until the manga calls it!

[rastaman]

That's an interesting way of looking at Naruto's "rejection". Sure I can buy that, if he doesn't believe her, he can't reject her. Still doesn't change the fact that he didn't believe her, which was the point of my whole little rant up there.

It's not that he doesn't believe her. Naruto feels responsible for Sasuke's rage because he has not kept his promise.
That's why Naruto changes the subject to Sakura calling him a criminal. Sasuke is a hindrance and Naruto is confused. That doesn't count as rejection.

[Mary]

It's not that he doesn't believe her. Naruto feels responsible for Sasuke's rage because he has not kept his promise.
That's why Naruto changes the subject to Sakura calling him a criminal. Sasuke is a hindrance and Naruto is confused. That doesn't count as rejection.

Can you please point to the panel where Naruto changed the subject or whatever, because I'm at a loss here as to what you're saying. Or aren't you referring to chapter 469?

[Paptala]

That's an interesting way of looking at Naruto's "rejection". Sure I can buy that, if he doesn't believe her, he can't reject her. Still doesn't change the fact that he didn't believe her, which was the point of my whole little rant up there.

Of course Naruto didn't believe her - the minute she brought up Sasuke and the promise and forgetting them, Naruto knew something was up. It wouldn't have mattered the level of truth in Sakura's claims to love him, and this is why.

Naruto knew that she was lying about not caring about Sasuke, and that nothing happened to make her travel all the way to summit (her weird behavior was giving this one away). So when he hears Sakura telling him that she loves him, something that is hard for him to believe (he's stuck on the idea that she loves Sasuke), naturally he's going to think its a lie by association of the other lies he knows she's telling him.

Regardless, Naruto's blush during her confession, his response to her during their argument ("If you don't like me then just say so!" "It's just weird!" - he never denied liking her still), shows that he's still in love with her after the confession. Since that time, we've seen nothing to suggest that he doesn't still love her romantically.

Bottom line, whether or not Naruto believed Sakura is irrelevant - he's still in love with her at this point in time until we're shown otherwise in the manga.

Edited by Paptala, 29 May 2011 - 04:11 PM.

[bthug]

Of course Naruto didn't believe her - the minute she brought up Sasuke and the promise and forgetting them, Naruto knew something was up. It wouldn't have mattered the level of truth in Sakura's claims to love him, and this is why.

Naruto knew that she was lying about not caring about Sasuke, and that nothing happened to make her travel all the way to summit (her weird behavior was giving this one away). So when he hears Sakura telling him that she loves him, something that is hard for him to believe (he's stuck on the idea that she loves Sasuke), naturally he's going to think its a lie by association of the other lies he knows she's telling him.

Regardless, Naruto's blush during her confession, his response to her during their argument ("If you don't like me then just say so!" "It's just weird!" - he never denied liking her still), shows that he's still in love with her after the confession. Since that time, we've seen nothing to suggest that he doesn't still love her romantically.

Bottom line, whether or not Naruto believed Sakura is irrelevant - he's still in love with her at this point in time until we're shown otherwise in the manga.

I concur.......Naruto was just stunned that she came all this way to tell him something that was out of nowhere and while she confessed her love for Naruto she mentioned sasuke's names more then anytime i've ever heard. I guess Naruto likes the feeling of earning things, so when she came out and just told him it must have really confused him.

Also until otherwise shown, Naruto still loves Sakura, but their is a horrible possibility that his feelings have changed and maybe the confession was a way for Naruto to get over not only the promise but Sakura in general ( i doubt it thou). Then again Naruto did say he hates people that lie to themselves.....Maybe all this is kishi' way of making it look like Naruto turned Sakura down.

[Phantom_999]

I am a cynical person, so of course my second favorite ship is not gonna get away scotch clean no matter how much I want them to be together. And thank you for finally understanding my motivation for posting those arguments, frankly I was starting to think you guys were acting like NH/SS fans (you know, turning a blind eye to events), and I was expecting a little bit more maturity from my fellow NS shippers, which is why I turned cynical. And why the hell are you worrying for? Everything that's happened in that manga up until now has only been good development for NS (even after the confession, didn't you see how the two remained as close as ever, while Naruto ignored Hinata after her confession?) There's no way we'll lose! You're worrying over nothing.

Yeah I know I'm worrying over nothing thanks though. I have huge faith in our pairing, but I also have low self esteem so if NS is dashed its not that I didn't see it coming, but it will devastate me all the same but yeah evidence suggests other wise but we can't deny what other facts there are too lest we turn into something Like NH or SS that will go berserk if they don't see their shipping happening. Overall though we should treasure each NS moment we have got for now or we won't be able to show our happy faces properly When it happens Though even with guarantees Kishimoto could still change his mind(I'm just saying he COULD)

[Paptala]

In light of this new chapter, how do you guys view that one quote from Kishimoto's interview now? :

"It looks like Sakura really loves Sasuke, but Naruto is close."

The bolded part makes me wonder now - Naruto is close to what exactly? Close to Sakura's heart? Undoubtedly. Close to making her fall in love with him for good? Possibly.

[Ani]

In light of this new chapter, how do you guys view that one quote from Kishimoto's interview now? :

"It looks like Sakura really loves Sasuke, but Naruto is close."

The bolded part makes me wonder now - Naruto is close to what exactly? Close to Sakura's heart? Undoubtedly. Close to making her fall in love with him for good? Possibly.

This right here.

[bthug]

Or close as in friends.

I feel like our pairing is the typical one where everyone should want this to happen and usually it does happen, but now i realize it usually only happens in like western cartoons/shows.
I've watched my fair share of anime and I must say I've been disappointed many times before. I've been disappointed more then happy (this one would devastate me the most). For some reason anime/manga just don't seem to go they way I think they do. Their seems to be so many x-factors in this specific case that its so hard to pinpoint whats going to happen...Man I REALLY WANT/NEED NARUSAKU to happen.

[Mary]

Of course Naruto didn't believe her - the minute she brought up Sasuke and the promise and forgetting them, Naruto knew something was up. It wouldn't have mattered the level of truth in Sakura's claims to love him, and this is why.

Naruto knew that she was lying about not caring about Sasuke, and that nothing happened to make her travel all the way to summit (her weird behavior was giving this one away). So when he hears Sakura telling him that she loves him, something that is hard for him to believe (he's stuck on the idea that she loves Sasuke), naturally he's going to think its a lie by association of the other lies he knows she's telling him.

Regardless, Naruto's blush during her confession, his response to her during their argument ("If you don't like me then just say so!" "It's just weird!" - he never denied liking her still), shows that he's still in love with her after the confession. Since that time, we've seen nothing to suggest that he doesn't still love her romantically.

Bottom line, whether or not Naruto believed Sakura is irrelevant - he's still in love with her at this point in time until we're shown otherwise in the manga.

You know, I actually agree with everything you said here (except for the last paragraph). I think it is relevant whether he believed her or not, because think about how awkward Sakura would feel if she had to re-confess to Naruto. She'd be scared that he'd doubt her sincerity again, which is why I say it is a big issue that he didn't believe her to begin with.

And are those the actual words that Kishi used (the "It looks like Sakura really loves Sasuke, but Naruto is close."), or is this another mistranslation?

[Super Boom]

Or close as in friends.

I feel like our pairing is the typical one where everyone should want this to happen and usually it does happen, but now i realize it usually only happens in like western cartoons/shows.
I've watched my fair share of anime and I must say I've been disappointed many times before. I've been disappointed more then happy (this one would devastate me the most). For some reason anime/manga just don't seem to go they way I think they do. Their seems to be so many x-factors in this specific case that its so hard to pinpoint whats going to happen...Man I REALLY WANT/NEED NARUSAKU to happen.

I sort of think the opposite actually. Part of the problem with the shipping wars in the West is how so many people misinterpret the character relationships. My sister watches the English dub on TV occasionally (a crime I know, considering how Disney butchers it), and tends to make comments along the lines of, "Well Sakura obviously hates Naruto because she beats him up all the time." I've seen several occasions where the whole tsundere trope is completely lost on some Western readers/viewers. In fact, from what I've seen, characters that utilize the trope as much as Naruto and Sakura do almost always end up as a couple in the end.
And this definitely doesn't apply towards Western literature by any means. I've seen more than one occasion in Western lit./movies where heroes end up with side characters, and the hero's male and female best friends hook up. I think Harry Potter is the example that most people here like to cite.

[bthug]

I sort of think the opposite actually. Part of the problem with the shipping wars in the West is how so many people misinterpret the character relationships. My sister watches the English dub on TV occasionally (a crime I know, considering how Disney butchers it), and tends to make comments along the lines of, "Well Sakura obviously hates Naruto because she beats him up all the time." I've seen several occasions where the whole tsundere trope is completely lost on some Western readers/viewers. In fact, from what I've seen, characters that utilize the trope as much as Naruto and Sakura do almost always end up as a couple in the end.
And this definitely doesn't apply towards Western literature by any means. I've seen more than one occasion in Western lit./movies where heroes end up with side characters, and the hero's male and female best friends hook up. I think Harry Potter is the example that most people here like to cite.

Wow really? To me I've always felt like Sakura punching Naruto is another way of showing that she cares, I've always seen those as mini Narusaku moments. Like when she punches him when his boxers land on her head (in his room hehe).....Or when she punches him for acting immature after not seeing him for 2yrs......Maybe its just me.

And your right about the harry potter thing which pissed me off, I thought for sure it would be Harry and Hermione their relationship was so similar to Naruto and Sakura.
But theirs other shows like LOST where

Lost --Click here to view--

Jack and Kate end up together, and they were the main hero/heroine....btw that couple was PERFECT

[Paptala]

Or close as in friends.

This is definitely a possibility. Kishi likes to be vague in interviews, and purposefully so. There's no sense in telling your readers what's going to happen before it happens.

Still, given the context of the sentence, I feel like it's implying something more than just Naruto is close as a friend.

I feel like our pairing is the typical one where everyone should want this to happen and usually it does happen, but now i realize it usually only happens in like western cartoons/shows.
I've watched my fair share of anime and I must say I've been disappointed many times before. I've been disappointed more then happy (this one would devastate me the most). For some reason anime/manga just don't seem to go they way I think they do. Their seems to be so many x-factors in this specific case that its so hard to pinpoint whats going to happen...Man I REALLY WANT/NEED NARUSAKU to happen.

To be honest, NaruSaku is the only couple I've actually shipped in any seriousness. In all other shounens that I've read, the pairing was obvious -> Ed and Winry, Ranma and Akane, Kenshin and Kaoru, Shinichi and Ran, Goku and Chichi, Gohan and Videl, etc. And in the shounens that it isn't obvious (like Bleach), I'm simply indifferent to pairings.

Logically, NaruSaku being canon makes the most sense when compared to the other three. But you never can really tell for sure...

You know, I actually agree with everything you said here (except for the last paragraph). I think it is relevant whether he believed her or not, because think about how awkward Sakura would feel if she had to re-confess to Naruto. She'd be scared that he'd doubt her sincerity again, which is why I say it is a big issue that he didn't believe her to begin with.

I think that any re-confession couldn't possibly be as awkward as her initial confession to Naruto, when she was there with an ulterior motive that she didn't want him to discover and trying to be prepared for him to hate her.

What I was getting at though, was that Naruto rejecting Sakura implies that he doesn't love her anymore, which is pretty clearly not the case.

And are those the actual words that Kishi used (the "It looks like Sakura really loves Sasuke, but Naruto is close."), or is this another mistranslation?

ナルトは近いが、サクラやはりサスケが好き的な発言。
Naruto's close, but Sakura loves Sasuke as we should expect from that speech.

It's not clear though as to whether Kishi was saying this, or whether the person he was speaking with was saying this.
http://www.narusaku....?showtopic=9517

Don't worry, I read quite a bit of manga and I'm usually always right so it has to happen.

Here's hoping this is one of those times where you're right.

[bthug]

You guys should watch this http://www.youtube.c...feature=feedlik
It's good and the beginning is funny

Also I was wondering where these two moments in the manga
1)Sakura to Naruto "Can't you flatter a girl without calling her a monster" (I loved her saying that and she was blushing the entire time)

2) When Sakura punches Naruto and sets the new record.....that was when he was going to show kakashi is sexy jutsu.

[Phantom_999]

Don't worry, I read quite a bit of manga and I'm usually always right so it has to happen.



Ah, a fellow Harry/Hermione shipper! But Naruto and Sakura will have a better ending, there's no way anybody could interpret their relationship as bro/sis(or am I wrong? )

*chuckles* I also wanted Harry/Hermione so another comrade for you!

[ciardha]

In light of this new chapter, how do you guys view that one quote from Kishimoto's interview now? :

"It looks like Sakura really loves Sasuke, but Naruto is close."

The bolded part makes me wonder now - Naruto is close to what exactly? Close to Sakura's heart? Undoubtedly. Close to making her fall in love with him for good? Possibly.

Except that's not what Kishimoto said, that's the version from a naruhina shipper's (who it turns out wasn't even there) mistranslated version (easy to spot because they messed up on the grammar a lot, making it a muddled mess to follow, everything is attributed to have been said by Kishimoto both questions and answers, things that Kishimoto didn't say are inserted, etc...). What he said in the corrected one about Sakura's feelings about (done by a sasunaru shipper that was there- yeah a sasunaru shipper who even said they didn't particularly care for Sakura, but was disgusted by the fake distorted version that had been circulating ) was:

"Sakura....Sasuke." no really, no loves, he said nothing for certain on what feelings Sakura might have about Sasuke.(implying exactly what happens in the manga- there's still stuff she has to sort through about Sasuke before she can fully get over him). Naruto was the only one Kishimoto did use a couple of words to reference Sakura's feelings for. And close when you are referencing feelings means having deeply romantic feelings for, it implies romantic intimacy.