4869 replies to this topic

[fireandice]

Sure...SasuSaku is JUZ GUNNA HAPPEN U GUYZ !!!!!

Okay, seriously, I think it's pretty simple. I don't believe Part 1 Sasuke hated Sakura. I believe he found her kind of annoying at first, but as Team 7 worked together, like with Naruto, I believe he cared and saw her as a friend. I mean like when in the fight against Gaara, Sasuke said to Naruto how he'd lost everything dear to him before, and he doesn't want that to happen again.

However, to Sasuke, Itachi had always been a central point of his life, that when it came to his brother, everything else paled in comparison. Whether he hated him or loved him, Sasuke was always fixated on Itachi. In fact, the main reason why he was so hurt and traumatized by Itachi's betrayal was because he really loved his brother and looked up to him. I mean, it hurts a hell lot more when someone you trust betrays you and it seems like you don't know them anymore, no? So, unfortunately for Sasuke he just couldn't let go of Itachi. In Part 1, he ended up succumbing to it by leaving for Orochimaru.

It's not that I think Sasuke would abuse his future wife or anything, but the path he's chosen to walk is beyond the point of no return, tbh. The thing is that his entire life, past present and future is fixated on Itachi. Honestly, I'm not even sure he looks like he wants to bother with reviving his clan anymore. He seems like he really doesn't want to live, what with his recklessness in his recent fights.

[Gravenimage]

I just realized that reading those past quotes I have come to the conclusion that S/S can only happen if Sasuke was OC. Its the same thing with Hinata they believe N/H can happen by changing her personality with Sakura becoming a tsundere. So in other words the one sided pairings can only happen if the characters are OC.

[pinkheartsyellowstars]

Avenging his clan was far more important than having the respect of the entire village or even making friends and creating bonds. He's a lone wolf on a mission to kill his brother and avenge his clan why did he chose revenge over friendship and honor for protecting the village??? the answer is simple Sasuke values his honor for his clan more than anything. More than bonds of friendship and the honor of Konoha. To him his family was everything and he desired to be acknowledged by his family as a prodigy like they viewed Itachi.
So in conclusion Sasuke is out for revenge because he wants to restore honor to his clan and because he loves his clan more than Konoha or his former team. His clan his family was everything to him it was his life and purpose to be alive. Now his purpose to be alive is to have revenge against the ones who made his brother's life a living hell all for the sake of peace in Konoha. But by doing so Itachi's sacrifice was all in vain, it was for nothing.

Oh..Not only that Graven, some SS fans stated that Sasuke needs to restore his clan, so the perfect partner would be Sakura. So Sakura is now a machine for making Uchiha babies? ....

Edited by pinkheartsyellowstars, 24 January 2010 - 03:20 PM.

[Gravenimage]

Oh..Not only that Graven, some SS fans stated that Sasuke needs to restore his clan, so the perfect partner would be Sakura. So Sakura is now a machine for making Uchiha babies? ....

Oh yeah I have heard that one so many times before like Sakura was the only woman alive in the world . I have also heard the classic excuse for N/H and S/S to become canon because they are far more N/H and S/S fans in the entire world and Kishi has no choice but to make those pairings canon in his manga, all because of the large number of fans worldwide. If he makes N/S canon the fans will be disappointed and he will lose large amount of money in the ending of his manga. So Kishi has no choice but to make those pairings with no development canon because his wallet depends on it.

Edited by Gravenimage, 24 January 2010 - 04:07 PM.

[Jenskott]

I just realized that reading those past quotes I have come to the conclusion that S/S can only happen if Sasuke was OC. Its the same thing with Hinata they believe N/H can happen by changing her personality with Sakura becoming a tsundere. So in other words the one sided pairings can only happen if the characters are OC.

Pretty much,yes.

And personally I think if Sasuke hooks up with someone, that person will be Karin. I am not a SasuKarin shipper, but that is what I think.

Oh..Not only that Graven, some SS fans stated that Sasuke needs to restore his clan, so the perfect partner would be Sakura. So Sakura is now a machine for making Uchiha babies?

They have been telling that for years. And when someone called them on it, they inquired why NS fans always assume Sasuke will only want Sakura for being his Uchiha-making machine.

What a way to turn the argument around.

Oh yeah I have heard that one so many times before like Sakura was the only woman alive in the world

I always found that stupid. Why do they assume Sasuke only can restore his clan with Sakura? Assuming he is really interested in restoring his clan or finding his soulmate why do they think he has no more options?

I guess that is because they hated Karin so strongly when she showed up in spoilers for first time. Because her existence proved there were other options open to him.

Personally I think no Leaf kunoichi is an option to him now. Neither of them will want hooking up with a sentenced-to-death traitor (Ino crying because all are planning on slaying him isn't proof of she is in love with him or intends becoming his bride). And he wants nothing with Konohagakure other than it being scorched down and razed to the ground.

I have also heard the classic excuse for N/H and S/S to become canon because they are far more N/H and S/S fans in the entire world and Kishi has no choice but to make those pairings canon in his manga, all because of the large number of fans worldwide. If he makes N/S canon the fans will be disappointed and he will lose large amount of money in the ending of his manga. So Kishi has no choice but to make those pairings with no development canon because his wallet depends on it.

This is another instance of the overblown sense of self-entitlement and self-importance of the fandom.

Let's get real: the most of Naruto readers peruse the manga for the fights. Fans exclusively read the manga for finding out who hooks up with who are a minority. Fans would drop the manga entirely if their favorite pairing are even fewer, and the most of them read the story illegally withouth paying the author a dime.

So no, he won't lose money if he makes NS canon. Believe me, his wallet doesn't depend on it.

Moreover, NH/SS are more popular among Western fans. And he DOESN'T know anything about the Western fandom. He said he knew nothing about Western fandom or how many non-Japanese people followed his manga.

He doesn't even know those NH/SS fans exist.

[Gravenimage]

Pretty much,yes.

And personally I think if Sasuke hooks up with someone, that person will be Karin. I am not a SasuKarin shipper, but that is what I think.



They have been telling that for years. And when someone called them on it, they inquired why NS fans always assume Sasuke will only want Sakura for being his Uchiha-making machine.

What a way to turn the argument around.



I always found that stupid. Why do they assume Sasuke only can restore his clan with Sakura? Assuming he is really interested in restoring his clan or finding his soulmate why do they think he has no more options?

I guess that is because they hated Karin so strongly when she showed up in spoilers for first time. Because her existence proved there were other options open to him.

Personally I think no Leaf kunoichi is an option to him now. Neither of them will want hooking up with a sentenced-to-death traitor (Ino crying because all are planning on slaying him isn't proof of she is in love with him or intends becoming his bride). And he wants nothing with Konohagakure other than it being scorched down and razed to the ground.



This is another instance of the overblown sense of self-entitlement and self-importance of the fandom.

Let's get real: the most of Naruto readers peruse the manga for the fights. Fans exclusively read the manga for finding out who hooks up with who are a minority. Fans would drop the manga entirely if their favorite pairing are even fewer, and the most of them read the story illegally withouth paying the author a dime.

So no, he won't lose money if he makes NS canon. Believe me, his wallet doesn't depend on it.

Moreover, NH/SS are more popular among Western fans. And he DOESN'T know anything about the Western fandom. He said he knew nothing about Western fandom or how many non-Japanese people followed his manga.

He doesn't even know those NH/SS fans exist.

You're right I remember Kishi saying that in a interview. That he had no idea his manga was very famous outside of Japan good point kudos to you.

[socermania2]

He doesn't even know those NH/SS fans exist.

He does. SasuSaku is the most popular het pairing in the WORLD, including Japan.

NaruHina is a sideship.

[ciardha]

Nope. They will grumble and complain and brood over what it should have been arguing what it will be.

And -hopefully- they shall move on eventually.

Everyone of you have done good points. It still baffles me some fans are downright convinced Sasuke is, deep down, a warm, gentle and kind soul.

Ironically, that is right like Naruto is.

Why SS fans are always giving Sasuke the Naruto's personality and NH fans always give Hinata the Sakura's personality? Do they realize inwardly their pairings are impausible due to the characters' personalities?

More than likely, although they'll deny it six ways to Tuesday. That's why their hatred is so intense toward narusaku.

[Jenskott]

He does. SasuSaku is the most popular het pairing in the WORLD, including Japan.

NaruHina is a sideship.

I was talking about Western NH/SS fans. He says he doesn't know what the Western fandom is like, so he doesn't know they exist.

And I am not so sure about SasuSaku being the most popular het pairing. I know it is ASSUMED, and it is most popular over internet, but it doesn't mean that assumption is true.

Personally I think the majority of Naruto fans don't talk in boards or craft fanworks. We don't know what they think.

For example, several of my friends like Naruto. Neither of them writes posts in forums. Neither of them is passionate about pairings. And neither of them -us- thinks SS will happen. On the other hand, all of them -us- thinks NS is virtually canon.

I know it is anecdotal evidence, and it doesn't prove SS isn't the most popular het pairing, but I think it helps to illustrate my point.

More than likely, although they'll deny it six ways to Tuesday. That's why their hatred is so intense toward narusaku.

Indeed.

I still remember a Nabiki/Ranma fanfic completely changed Ranma, Akane and Nabiki personalities and ignored their backstories and the developments they had gone through the manga, all for the sake of pairing up Ranma and Nabiki.

[ciardha]

I was talking about Western NH/SS fans. He says he doesn't know what the Western fandom is like, so he doesn't know they exist.

And I am not so sure about SasuSaku being the most popular het pairing. I know it is ASSUMED, and it is most popular over internet, but it doesn't mean that assumption is true.

Personally I think the majority of Naruto fans don't talk in boards or craft fanworks. We don't know what they think.

For example, several of my friends like Naruto. Neither of them writes posts in forums. Neither of them is passionate about pairings. And neither of them -us- thinks SS will happen. On the other hand, all of them -us- thinks NS is virtually canon.

I know it is anecdotal evidence, and it doesn't prove SS isn't the most popular het pairing, but I think it helps to illustrate my point.

In part 1 it might have been, but I can give another example with US cosplayers, pre chapter 296 I saw more sasusaku and naruhina cosplay couples, but since then the sasusaku and naruhina shipper cosplayers have dropped way below the narusaku shipper cosplayers. 437 didn't cause any increase in naruhina cosplayers, but I'm seeing more and more narusaku couple cosplayers both at anime cons and cosplayers online.

The majority of narusaku fans aren't vocal- when a pairing you like is assured canon, why bother. I felt that way in the majority anime/manga series I've followed over the years, about the only thing that would draw me out to comment was when I saw the all to common bashing of the strong willed female part of the couple I shipped. Kishimoto just has created a number of characters that are so well crafted that I've been drawn in and my creativity was sparked as well. But the majority of readers understand the manga tropes and know what Kishimoto is doing. They enjoy the path to love Naruto and Sakura are on so they are content to just sit back and read. I'm rather certain that the majority of readers who like het pairings around the world like narusaku. They just don't feel the need to say anything when the story is going the way they like. I know a fair number of Naruto readers that feel that way.

You see so many more sasusaku and naruhina fans being vocal online because their pairings can't and won't happen. Same for the yaoi ships which vastly outnumber in fans the het ships online (especially amongst the Japanese fans). The most popular ship of all is Iruka and Kakashi and they hadn't even interacted in one scene until the destruction of Konoha arc! Plus Kakashi and Iruka are definitely both het guys. Kakashi's an overt het perv (reading het porny novels in public, in front of preteens no less...) and Iruka is a secret one (the reaction to Naruto's sexy no jutsu)

Edited by ciardha, 24 January 2010 - 07:43 PM.

[RedDelicious]

Miss Soupy already replied to the long funny quote, but I wanted to pitch in a few things.

he's much too family-oriented to inflict any sort of pain on his wife

He spent most of his life trying to kill his brother. It seems like if his wife did anything that Sasuke didn't approve of, his reaction would likely be abusive.

He knows better than anyone how much it hurts to be emotionally abused by people you love

And yet, he still wants to inflict that hurt on everyone else, to make others share his pain. At least Nagato had the delusion that it would bring peace. Sasuke just wants to make everyone else as miserable as him.

A man knows when he's being abusive; they do it intentionally.

There are plenty of movies/tv on spousal abuse, that show the man being very loving and caring. Except for the times when he is being physically or emotionally abusive. (Usually with the justification that he wouldn't have snapped if he didn't care so much. )

And his reaction to her giving him the apples wasn't abusive. He was moody and he snapped. He didn't actually hit her.

Not that time. But he did hit her later. Knocking someone unconscious is always risky, despite how often it happens in stories. And in Part II, he would have tried to kill them all, until Orochimaru stopped him.

(In case someone tries to bring up Sakura hitting Naruto, remind them that it is done for humor, and that Naruto's thoughts show that he deliberately provokes her, at times, to be playful.)

And yes, Sasuke has made Sakura cry many times... She was an emotional teenager. Of course she cried a lot.

This is conjecture, but the reason we think of Sakura crying a lot is *because* Sasuke made her cry many times. If Saskuke wasn't around, it would leave a huge vacuum in the Naruto story, but at least Sakura wouldn't be thought of as "weepy".

... and he's only, as you put it, "violent" when he's involved in revenge, and he wouldn't be involved with it by the time he got married.

Except that, besides the flashback of when he was a kid, Sasuke has ALWAYS been involved in revenge. We have no idea if he has any other modes, except for violent-revenge. Itachi died, and Sasuke found another reason to keep hating.

It is not universal idea, but I think a marriage/relationship should involve two equals. Sasuke does accept others as equals, he has a tendency to try to destroy his rivals. His wife would be treated as inferior, or as a rival. Not saying Sasuke couldn't change, but then it would be a completely different person instead of the Sasuke we've met.

I guess that is why I ship for NaruSaku. If they develop a deeper romantic relationship, they would still be the same characters (or would only require modest growth that fits into the story). Relationships involving Hinata and Sasuke *could* happen, but would require drastic personality transplants to make anything long-term work.

Edited by RedDelicious, 24 January 2010 - 07:48 PM.

[socermania2]

In part 1 it might have been, but I can give another example with US cosplayers, pre chapter 296 I saw more sasusaku and naruhina cosplay couples, but since then the sasusaku and naruhina shipper cosplayers have dropped way below the narusaku shipper cosplayers. 437 didn't cause any increase in naruhina cosplayers, but I'm seeing more and more narusaku couple cosplayers both at anime cons and cosplayers online.

The majority of narusaku fans aren't vocal- when a pairing you like is assured canon, why bother. I felt that way in the majority anime/manga series I've followed over the years, about the only thing that would draw me out to comment was when I saw the all to common bashing of the strong willed female part of the couple I shipped. Kishimoto just has created a number of characters that are so well crafted that I've been drawn in and my creativity was sparked as well. But the majority of readers understand the manga tropes and know what Kishimoto is doing. They enjoy the path to love Naruto and Sakura are on so they are content to just sit back and read. I'm rather certain that the majority of readers who like het pairings around the world like narusaku. They just don't feel the need to say anything when the story is going the way they like. I know a fair number of Naruto readers that feel that way.

You see so many more sasusaku and naruhina fans being vocal online because their pairings can't and won't happen. Same for the yaoi ships which vastly outnumber in fans the het ships online (especially amongst the Japanese fans). The most popular ship of all is Iruka and Kakashi and they hadn't even interacted in one scene until the destruction of Konoha arc! Plus Kakashi and Iruka are definitely both het guys. Kakashi's an overt het perv (reading het porny novels in public, in front of preteens no less...) and Iruka is a secret one (the reaction to Naruto's sexy no jutsu)

That can also go the same way. There are people who like SasuSaku and aren't vocal about it.

But, I think NaruSaku is the least vocal I liked NaruSaku since the beginning, but only joined recently because of the Sakura hate

If NaruSaku happens, you know the world's going to be in a sh**storm

I can already see the death threats

[catsi563]

And yes, Sasuke has made Sakura cry many times. But did he ever do so by calling her out? By saying she's worthless? By insulting her? No. She was an emotional teenager. Of course she cried a lot. We've never had any proof that he would sink to such a level.

And I quote. Frankly your ability is below Naruto --Click here to view--

[Derock]

And I quote. Frankly your ability is below Naruto --Click here to view--

And watch, we will expect a quote like this: "Well, he's just stating the obvious but still secretly 'loves' her."

[Gravenimage]

And watch, we will expect a quote like this: "Well, he's just stating the obvious but still secretly 'loves' her."

I know most S/S fans believe that even if Sasuke acts all cold, emo and hurt Sakura plenty of times deep inside he secretly loves Sakura *face palm* . It's the same thing with Naruto some N/H fans think although he's always chasing Sakura and spending time with her, asking her out on dates and he tried to peek at her. Deep inside of him he secretly loves Hinata *head desk*

Edited by Gravenimage, 24 January 2010 - 09:03 PM.

[crazyefra]

I remember a while ago after 437 that a N/H fan said that hinata would be a new love interest for naruto and said that he went six-tails because he loved her. After that I just laughed so much

Edited by crazyefra, 24 January 2010 - 09:07 PM.

[Froot]

Does Sasuke know Naruto loves Sakura?

If Sai, oblivious when it comes to emotions, can see it, then I'm sure a guy who's been around them most of their lives can see it, too; Granted, he's oblivious to emotions as well unless it comes to anger and contempt, but Sasuke's still a smart guy. He has to have seen Naruto's attempts to ask her out or how protective he was in the Gaara fight.

Because, let's say he does magically get redeemed in the end. Let's say Naruto manages to convince him to give up his already-established life of darkness and vengeance and brings him back to Konoha. And, let's say, Sakura goes back on everything she's said and done and still pursues him. Would Sasuke see that and think he doesn't deserve to take Sakura's love and steal it from his best friend? If it were up to him, would Sasuke choose to betray Naruto all over again? (That's assuming Sakura will still have Sasuke.)

SS fans assume that if Sasuke is ''saved'' he'll automatically fall in love with Sakura and she'll throw away all her development, and they'll go off to make Uchiha babies. But if Sasuke was really changed, then he wouldn't take away something Naruto's worked so hard for.

The more I type, the less likely to happen SasuSaku seems, and by effect, NaruHina, too.

[Miss Soupy]

Does Sasuke know Naruto loves Sakura?

If Sai, oblivious when it comes to emotions, can see it, then I'm sure a guy who's been around them most of their lives can see it, too; Granted, he's oblivious to emotions as well unless it comes to anger and contempt, but Sasuke's still a smart guy. He has to have seen Naruto's attempts to ask her out or how protective he was in the Gaara fight.

I definitely think Sasuke knew Naruto had a soft spot for her. Sasuke and Naruto understood each other pretty well back then, so I don't think Sasuke would miss that. I also think that is part of the reason he specifically told Sakura how hard Naruto fought to save her. Not only did he recognize Naruto's need for acknowledgment, but realized how it also related to his feelings for Sakura as well. Beyond that though, I'm not sure how much Sasuke would care.

Because, let's say he does magically get redeemed in the end. Let's say Naruto manages to convince him to give up his already-established life of darkness and vengeance and brings him back to Konoha. And, let's say, Sakura goes back on everything she's said and done and still pursues him. Would Sasuke see that and think he doesn't deserve to take Sakura's love and steal it from his best friend? If it were up to him, would Sasuke choose to betray Naruto all over again? (That's assuming Sakura will still have Sasuke.)

It would take a lot for Sasuke to hurt Naruto like that, I agree. He would have to be reaaaaally in love with Sakura to even consider it, which he isn't. That means he would have to choose to try, after being brought back, while knowing Naruto would get hurt. Not likely. For Sasuke to be involved with Sakura, Naruto would have needed to move on from her.

SS fans assume that if Sasuke is ''saved'' he'll automatically fall in love with Sakura and she'll throw away all her development, and they'll go off to make Uchiha babies. But if Sasuke was really changed, then he wouldn't take away something Naruto's worked so hard for.

The more I type, the less likely to happen SasuSaku seems, and by effect, NaruHina, too.

Has anyone really brought up (to a NH fan) that NH can't survive without SS? I wonder what they would say, or how exactly they believe it could happen without SS. Since I can't really see how it would work otherwise.