357 replies to this topic

[Dreamer]

Got a picture of a Priss.

Awesome, What about Deckard and his Blaster?

[Derock]

I am behaving. Maybe you should mind your business and not tell me what to do? That would be nice.

How about watching your tone of your post, since it was highly disrespectful, especially to those whom don't want any more conflict. That will be nice if you don't want any more trouble.

We know you're frustrated about the reveal (most of us are) but it doesn't mean to take it out on others whom are currently positive about the whole deal.

[Evil Potato]

How about watching your tone of your post, since it was highly disrespectful, especially to those whom don't want any more conflict. That will be nice if you don't want any more trouble.

We know you're frustrated about the reveal (most of us are) but it doesn't mean to take it out on others whom are currently positive about the whole deal.

Wait, why are yaw upset about the this revelation???? I really don't see who else it could be... and it would be much worse if Kishi just had some random guy we never heard of under the mask. As for myself, I'm really excited about this, I just hate it for Kakashi. I know this is probably the only thing in the manga that could break him.

[alexander]

Wait, why are yaw upset about the this revelation???? I really don't see who else it could be... and it would be much worse if Kishi just had some random guy we never heard of under the mask. As for myself, I'm really excited about this, I just hate it for Kakashi. I know this is probably the only thing in the manga that could break him.

This. Putting an random person would actually be worse. "there you go! Tobi was actually an character the readers never saw before, isn't that interesting?" Besides, I couldn't think of anyone else from the main cast to be Tobi after Kishimoto revealed that he isn't Madara.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

This. Putting an random person would actually be worse. "there you go! Tobi was actually an character the readers never saw before, isn't that interesting?" Besides, I couldn't think of anyone else from the main cast to be Tobi after Kishimoto revealed that he isn't Madara.

i disagree with you, would not be worse because putting obito screwed a lot of things and i doubt he will explain the problems of naruto's cronology.
like i said before putting obito as tobi would allow kishi to develop kakashi but the bad part is he failed to play it well until now.

[Verilance]

actually it screwed up nothing as it was kishimoto's intention all along. the only problem is the face on Hokage mountain anything else has never been manga canon anyway as such Kishinoto can explain it all away if he even cares too.

I was never a Tobito fan in fact I hate the fact that it ruins a character I loved but I am going to wait until Kishimoto does his backstory (which he will do) before I waste anytime and effort whining about it

[HalfStarStudios]

How about watching your tone of your post, since it was highly disrespectful, especially to those whom don't want any more conflict. That will be nice if you don't want any more trouble.

We know you're frustrated about the reveal (most of us are) but it doesn't mean to take it out on others whom are currently positive about the whole deal.

See, maybe if people actually payed attention to what I was saying, they would know i've said that i'm not mad about who Tobi is. I'm glad Obito is Tobi. This is what is pissing me off.

[Darth Krypt]

See, maybe if people actually payed attention to what I was saying, they would know i've said that i'm not mad about who Tobi is. I'm glad Obito is Tobi. This is what is pissing me off.

Dude, its your tone more than anything else. The only qualms I have about Obito being Tobi is that its far too obvious. Even the name is just an anagram of each other. Well I guess he can't really prevent that given the circumstances. I mean he gave one eye to Kakashi, and then a villain with one eye sharingan shows up.

[ciardha]

Wait, why are yaw upset about the this revelation???? I really don't see who else it could be... and it would be much worse if Kishi just had some random guy we never heard of under the mask. As for myself, I'm really excited about this, I just hate it for Kakashi. I know this is probably the only thing in the manga that could break him.

I'd always counted it as one of the more likely of the theories and as someone that is both a writer and a examiner of literature I am excited for much the same reason you are, but for me, it's about seeing how Kakashi overcomes such an overwhelming emotional challenge, considering what a symbol Obito had become for him. You know it's a flipped parallel, Obito has suddenly become to him what Sasuke is to Naruto in part 2 of the manga. Obito begins as personality wise symbolically like Naruto in part 1, while Kakashi begins like Sasuke, now it's flipped Kakashi is like Naruto in part 2 of the manga, while Tobi is like Sasuke in part 2 of the manga.

[Gravenimage]

I'd always counted it as one of the more likely of the theories and as someone that is both a writer and a examiner of literature I am excited for much the same reason you are, but for me, it's about seeing how Kakashi overcomes such an overwhelming emotional challenge, considering what a symbol Obito had become for him. You know it's a flipped parallel, Obito has suddenly become to him what Sasuke is to Naruto in part 2 of the manga. Obito begins as personality wise symbolically like Naruto in part 1, while Kakashi begins like Sasuke, now it's flipped Kakashi is like Naruto in part 2 of the manga, while Tobi is like Sasuke in part 2 of the manga.

That's Kishi for you he loves parallels so much.

[pharix]

I'd always counted it as one of the more likely of the theories and as someone that is both a writer and a examiner of literature I am excited for much the same reason you are, but for me, it's about seeing how Kakashi overcomes such an overwhelming emotional challenge, considering what a symbol Obito had become for him. You know it's a flipped parallel, Obito has suddenly become to him what Sasuke is to Naruto in part 2 of the manga. Obito begins as personality wise symbolically like Naruto in part 1, while Kakashi begins like Sasuke, now it's flipped Kakashi is like Naruto in part 2 of the manga, while Tobi is like Sasuke in part 2 of the manga.

this is part of what I don't like about it, it's such a severe character flip

that and the fact that he somehow became an adult for the Kyuubi attack etc ...

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

I'd always counted it as one of the more likely of the theories and as someone that is both a writer and a examiner of literature I am excited for much the same reason you are, but for me, it's about seeing how Kakashi overcomes such an overwhelming emotional challenge, considering what a symbol Obito had become for him. You know it's a flipped parallel, Obito has suddenly become to him what Sasuke is to Naruto in part 2 of the manga. Obito begins as personality wise symbolically like Naruto in part 1, while Kakashi begins like Sasuke, now it's flipped Kakashi is like Naruto in part 2 of the manga, while Tobi is like Sasuke in part 2 of the manga.

well like i said before, obito was nice because of kakashi stuff but he played it bad, he screwed the cronology that a part that we dont know how obito got an adult and become so strong in one year and did what he did, how obito started the war that he was supposed to be dead.

[Dreamer]

If Obito can travel through dimensions then he could of leaped back in time although it's a crazy theory, The shock of seeing Rin killed could of triggered an inbalance in Interdimensional shift upon wakening his sharingan. But

[James S Cassidy]

Okay, look I understand people are pissed about the chronology of the story with Obito, but do we really have to start throwing fits now? Can't we wait til Kishi gives an explanation first?

He might give us a really cool explanation that makes total sense or he could screw it up. Either way, at least give him a chance to explain it. I also don't mind little retcon, as long as it doesn't mess with the story too much. Miner details are fine, but when it comes to bigger stuff...well, it is not so easy.

I just think you should wait a little, dovahkiin. When Kishi explains himself and you till feel it is weak, then you have every right in my book to voice your disapproval.

Edited by James S Cassidy, 04 September 2012 - 12:58 AM.

[Nate River]

Okay, look I understand people are pissed about the chronology of the story with Obito, but do we really have to start throwing fits now?

Yes.

Can't we wait til Kishi gives an explanation first?

No.


Seriously though, my biggest hang up was motivation and the evolution of the sharingan. Motivation, well wait and see. Sharingan, given that one of the last pictures of Obito shows two tomoe, I don't think he can fix this one to my satisfaction.

I do have a number of thoughts:

(1) @ CODUS N: I think it's the opposite. I do not think Obito will help Sakura get over her indecision. Her parallel is Rin. There is no evidence that Rin was indecisive about anything. Rin knew nothing of Obito's feeling and you cannot blame her for not responding to that which she was unaware. Kakashi tells her not Obito. If he uses it on NaruSaku, then it's going to be on Naruto's lack of action. Obito might plant the seed or give Naruto a full blown kick to the groin. The only "mistake" I see in ObitoRin is Obito's failure to say anything until it's way too late. He waited until right before the mission that killed him and got interrupted trying to do it.

The lesson is for Naruto because he is refusing to act.

(2) @ tricksie: I agree with much of what you said. For all the people talking about how sad his past was...well...color me unimpressed. The only thing tragic that was shown was how he died. Other than that it's the girl he likes having feelings for someone else and Gai handing him his butt. That's all we have. If that's his motivation for becoming Tobi and Moon's Eye, then Obito is a small, small man. Now THAT would be a complete destruction of his character. I would have a tough time with that unless the lesson to be shown is completely different than I think it's going to be. Destroying Kakashi's image of his friend like that would be fun, but it doesn't fit Kishimoto's modus operendi. Therefore, I think it's obvious we have only hit the tip of the iceberg and that the chapter was setting up number 600.

I think what happened was:

Rin's dead and Obito blames Kakashi. There are many ways this could have happened, so I won't speculate on the how. All I can say is I am very confident of that much. The main question I have is when did it happen. A day later? Week? Month? Year? If it's a long time then the question becomes what was he doing for all that time? I speculated that maybe he was out on his own suffering great distress with no one to help him. I could understand why he'd despise Kakashi even if it wasn't his fault. I am not as sure about this part of it. I would like it to be there because the more he goes through the more I can understand the total 180 he takes. Because even if she dies, I don't understand why he doesn't come back and kick Kakashi's ass if he survived the mission and nothing else.

Rin dying is not enough to get me from point A to point B. I can't buy she died so he needs to rob the world of free will. I suspect there are additional intervening factors. For starters where did he learn what he knows and why did he pass himself of as Madara?

[Nefertieh]

Dude, its your tone more than anything else. The only qualms I have about Obito being Tobi is that its far too obvious. Even the name is just an anagram of each other. Well I guess he can't really prevent that given the circumstances. I mean he gave one eye to Kakashi, and then a villain with one eye sharingan shows up.

It was a red herring within a red herring. Initially everyone thought he was Obito, having a similar name and all, then it all settled down when he proclaimed himself as Madara. Then the prevailing theory was Izuna, Madara's brother. However, having him as Obito serves as a much more emotionally powerful character to the story.

It seems pretty obvious Tobi is not purely Obito.

[KnS]

Sharingan, given that one of the last pictures of Obito shows two tomoe, I don't think he can fix this one to my satisfaction.

I'm not sure which picture you mean or if I understand you correctly. In the second to last panel, the close up of Obito, only two tomoe are showing but it looks as if the top one is hidden by his eyelid. No?

The lesson is for Naruto because he is refusing to act.

I agree. If the Obito -> Rin -> Kakashi romance drama is dragged out in front of Naruto, it is an organic concept -- about feelings -- so he's got a good shot at figuring it out and realizing he needs to confess to Sakura before he misses his chance.

Rin dying is not enough to get me from point A to point B. I can't buy she died so he needs to rob the world of free will. I suspect there are additional intervening factors. For starters where did he learn what he knows and why did he pass himself of as Madara?

Obito's apparent intended assault on free will is really interesting considering the "form over substance" argument he and Kakashi had in the Gaiden. It gives new meaning to Obito's Gaiden line, "If that's not being a true shinobi... then I'll crush that idea of a shinobi!!"

[Codus N]

Yes.



No.


Seriously though, my biggest hang up was motivation and the evolution of the sharingan. Motivation, well wait and see. Sharingan, given that one of the last pictures of Obito shows two tomoe, I don't think he can fix this one to my satisfaction.

I do have a number of thoughts:

(1) @ CODUS N: I think it's the opposite. I do not think Obito will help Sakura get over her indecision. Her parallel is Rin. There is no evidence that Rin was indecisive about anything. Rin knew nothing of Obito's feeling and you cannot blame her for not responding to that which she was unaware. Kakashi tells her not Obito. If he uses it on NaruSaku, then it's going to be on Naruto's lack of action. Obito might plant the seed or give Naruto a full blown kick to the groin. The only "mistake" I see in ObitoRin is Obito's failure to say anything until it's way too late. He waited until right before the mission that killed him and got interrupted trying to do it.

The lesson is for Naruto because he is refusing to act.


I think what happened was:

Rin's dead and Obito blames Kakashi. There are many ways this could have happened, so I won't speculate on the how. All I can say is I am very confident of that much. The main question I have is when did it happen. A day later? Week? Month? Year? If it's a long time then the question becomes what was he doing for all that time? I speculated that maybe he was out on his own suffering great distress with no one to help him. I could understand why he'd despise Kakashi even if it wasn't his fault. I am not as sure about this part of it. I would like it to be there because the more he goes through the more I can understand the total 180 he takes. Because even if she dies, I don't understand why he doesn't come back and kick Kakashi's ass if he survived the mission and nothing else.

Rin dying is not enough to get me from point A to point B. I can't buy she died so he needs to rob the world of free will. I suspect there are additional intervening factors. For starters where did he learn what he knows and why did he pass himself of as Madara?

I agree. That scenario is also something that's been on my mind for a while. But I also wouldn't be surprised if he said a few scathing words to Sakura as well. And yes, our blonde knucklehead seriously need a big kick to the balls on this one and who's better than Obito for that??

In any case, Rin's death and the other reason Obito's doing this are definitely closely tied. But as for him gaining the MS, I always thought that they both gained it since day one. Kakashi & Obito respectively at the Kannabi bridge. It's true that their sharingans only had 2 tomoes at the time, but there's no doubt the mental stress and trauma had been ingrained into their eyes since then.

After all, why would Kishi show Kakashi crying in his sharingan eye only??

http://www.mangahere...27/c243/19.html

If that's not foreshadowing, I don't know what is.

The next step they had to complete was the 3rd tomoe. My guess is, Kakashi never knew about MS until he met Itachi. After a bit of digging, he found out that the MS required a distressed mental condition for it to be activated. Of course, he didn't know what this so "abstract" was really about. He probably started remembering Obito's death at one point during his regular training session and accidentally used it. Basically, the memory of Obito's death was the trigger. Not only that, the sharingan gives you photographic memory, no??

As for Obito, it is likely Madara found him and realized he already gained the prerequisite for unlocking MS. All he needed to do was to train his sharingan and evolve it to the 3rd tomoe. After that, he just needed to give him the final push.

[Gravenimage]

At least the mighty 600 will be release on Wednesday only one day away.

[Branden]

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Look at that! Obito doesn't screw around, when he said he is going to crush the ninja world he ment it!