54213 replies to this topic

[Canadian_DJ]

In order for Obi/Rin to be a complete parallel of NS Rin must have feelings for Obito too. I'm going to stick with my theory that she realized her feelings for him shortly after the boulder incident. The part when she was gazing into the stars must be her thinking of her feelings for Obito. I think Sakura knows she loves Naruto but she still hasn't realize how much she loves him because what's preventing her are the small remains of her feelings for Sasuke. If Naruto experiences a life and death situation it will be the last straw to break away any feelings she has for him and truly embrace what she feels for Naruto just like Rin, only difference he won't die. This could be where Kishi is heading otherwise what will be the point of him keep bringing Obito's feelings for Rin at this point of the manga?

This!!!^^

I never said you said narusaku was the most popular. I was just pointing out that you forgot that these are private events, anybody can set up an "event," but it isn't solid proof you would use in a debate.
 

 
It doesn't matter if the source is from WSJ. The problem is not the source. The problem is that it is a poll.
 
Have you heard of the famous 1936 Literary Digest Poll? Reputable, respected newspaper, with the most accurate predictions regarding the elections, somehow managed to get the election results completely wrong in 1936. Alfred Landon, the Republican, lost to Franklin D. Roosevelt
 
Why was it wrong? Selection bias and nonresponse bias. The people who were polled were people who owned telephones, which was very expensive back in the day, and we all know by now that most of the wealthy vote for the Republicans. Secondly, only 24% of the intended 10 million people surveyed actually responded.
 
Similarly, the people selected (well, voted) in these WSJ polls are not an accurate reflection of people who read Naruto. The people who voted in the polls were people who bought the magazines legally, and bothered to fill out a form. Therefore WSJ polls have a selection bias and nonresponse bias, and may or may not represent the true opinion of all the fans in Japan. (Other food for thought would be whether a person was allowed to vote for more than one character, or whether a person could have bought more than one magazine and voted for the same character several times).
 
There is a reason why big companies spend millions of dollars on research -- even if it means paying the participants just for their opinion on the colour of their cereal boxes. A poll is not the epitome of true public opinion research, therefore you can't say my statement "suggests nothing is accurate." I am not suggesting nothing is accurate. I am suggesting this flawed understanding of statistics (by the fandom in general) is flawed.
 
The reason I am telling you this is because I want you to understand the flaws these polls carry, and how easily they can be used by the antis the same way. Take this Crunchyroll poll for example -- Sakura is voted as one of the most annoying characters.
 

 
Unless the poll was conducted by randomly selecting a >10% of the population of Japan, the "votes" you counted don't accurately reflect the Japanese fandom at all. Therefore my argument is not debunked.
 
I am saying that based on flawed polls, if we assume is correct, can just as easily indicate that Sakura's popularity was a result of the fact that she was in the manga for the first few polls, ie she had a head start, while Hinata had the disadvantage of not being in the manga. I may not be a Hinata fan, but I guarantee that if you throw that argument into a pairing debate with other people, someone will point this out.
 
I apologize if this may seem to be very forthcoming, but I'm not pointing out a difference of opinion we have. I'm pointing out that the truth is, these poll results we have is neither statistically valid or reliable.

Yeah its alright :)

And well honeslty, what your saying is right and im not denying that-regarding your theory about 'accuracy' but seriously, thats just not solid proof especially especially considering how popular sakura, shikamaru, naruto, kakashi, sasuke and all those top ten's are, but since sakura is the heroine of the series ofcoarse shes gonna have better votes! Thats just how it is! Hinata isn't to be compared to sakura at all! She's an insignificant side character-I repeat insignificant side character, so no, its not a matter of disadvantage, what your saying about hinata and her "advantage" doesnt matter so at the end of the day plus, that can easily be said for shikamaru and lee who have appeared at the same time as hinata, and yet beat her through the roof just like sakura. So no, your argument is completely invalid. Also, the WSJ is the official, most accurate and the poll that masashi kishimoti dealed with of the manga NARUTO, whether you, me or any fan likes it or not. I dunno why your making things confusing but like seriously, what your saying just-I cant-your trying to say that the popularity poll of the official WSJ is wrong...or not accurate or whatever, but seriously, sometimes its just not good to look to deep into things when its right there. And no matter what arguments that are presented, there's absolutely no denying that hinata's popularity is anywhere near sakura, naruto, kakashi, sasuke, shikamaru and all of those top 10 characters of naruto. Absolutely no way.

Edited by Canadian_DJ, 04 July 2013 - 01:27 PM.

[redragon88]

Since the topic has to do with rin obito relationship theres a small debate going on one of the fellow ns fan.

 

http://chatte-georgi...giana-rieriebee

 

http://kaylathebookt...giana-rieriebee

 

its a friendly one however there is one  thing that bother me about the conversation.

 

is the second link what the person said at the bottom.

 

Again the whole moving on argument is a misconception when a person is moving away from you it dosen't always mean its them moving on to another love interest. In naruto case he didn't move on from sakura just because of that panel in the summit arc. Especially in the current chapters naruto still shows feelings for sakura he smiles at her in a way and he replied to wards the girlfriend comment. 

 

what do you guys think?

 

People will always try their best to make arguments that satisfy their desires. This is no different.

 

It happened with the countless discussions about whether Kushina was more similar to Sakura or Hinata, and yet in 631 it was proven that Kishi was going for the obvious by having Minato associate them thanks to their temper.

 

Whether Rin still loved Kakashi to the end is just speculation. Obito is simply assuming that's the case since that's what he's always known about Rin's feelings. And I personally find it ridiculous to call Obito's feelings for Rin a foil when Minato immediately tells him to not give up on getting Rin's affection.

 

Is Minato supposed to be the enemy of love now? That seems to be the case for some ever since 631.

[MangaReader]

It happened with the countless discussions about whether Kushina was more similar to Sakura or Hinata, and yet in 631 it was proven that Kishi was going for the obvious by having Minato associate them thanks to their temper.

You know what's funny about this...the hypocrisy after it happened. Like you said, the Hinata fans believe she was more like Kushina then Sakura was, after the reveal...BAM!!! The NaruHina fans then decided to read too much in Tsunade's words that Naruto was more like his mother then his father, thus they believe Hinata is more like Minato. Now the claim against NaruSaku is Kushina X Kushina, which is utter crap but hilarious to read about XD

[sushi.]

You know what's funny about this...the hypocrisy after it happened. Like you said, the Hinata fans believe she was more like Kushina then Sakura was, after the reveal...BAM!!! The NaruHina fans then decided to read too much in Tsunade's words that Naruto was more like his mother then his father, thus they believe Hinata is more like Minato. Now the claim against NaruSaku is Kushina X Kushina, which is utter crap but hilarious to read about XD

It's no surprise Naruto is similar to both Minato and Kushina.

 

Maybe..just maybe it's because they made him together.

 

Because they're his parents for gods sake.

Edited by sushi., 03 July 2013 - 04:58 PM.

[redragon88]

It's no surprise Naruto is similar to both Minato and Kushina.

 

Maybe..just maybe it's because they made him together.

 

Because they're his parents for gods sake.

 

Children take characteristics of both parents?! My mind has been blown.

 

While Naruto's hot-blooded side is from Kushina, his serious determined side is definitely from Minato. And to be honest it seems Naruto also takes some of his goofiness from his dad. Remember that overly ridiculous long name that he gave to the Naruto-Sasuke combo attack? I bet if Kushina was there she would've immediately told him how stupid it sounded.

[MangaReader]

It's no surprise Naruto is similar to both Minato and Kushina.

 

Maybe..just maybe it's because they made him together.

 

Because they're his parents for gods sake.

WHOA!!! That's nuts (jk)

 

These theories fans make up are good for laughs

[Inferno180]

 

People will always try their best to make arguments that satisfy their desires. This is no different.

 

It happened with the countless discussions about whether Kushina was more similar to Sakura or Hinata, and yet in 631 it was proven that Kishi was going for the obvious by having Minato associate them thanks to their temper.

 

Whether Rin still loved Kakashi to the end is just speculation. Obito is simply assuming that's the case since that's what he's always known about Rin's feelings. And I personally find it ridiculous to call Obito's feelings for Rin a foil when Minato immediately tells him to not give up on getting Rin's affection.

 

Is Minato supposed to be the enemy of love now? That seems to be the case for some ever since 631.

 

Its not only that the similarities of Sakura and Kushina were highly obvious, its that it took an extra 150 chapters till it sunk in just to reveal it. So Naruto takes after both Minato and Kushina, yes that is obvious but the dominant thing we tend to see is yes, the Minato porition. Even then for those saying Minato is wrong, NS is just a kushina kushina, etc, there are many things we can do to fit this, if Naruto takes after Kushina then Sakura has her own qualities being similar to Minato, therefore it fits. If we go by naruto having qualties of both Minato and Kushina, if Sakura is another Kushina then this gives Naruto freedom with his minato aspects to work with Sakura's kushina aspects.

 

Even then the biggest thing we argue by the parallels is not merely by the similarities in team dynamics, interaction, goals, fates, etc. One of the things that just makes more sense in the parallels is not merely attitudes, its mainly how they acted. Its just too obvious that there is a big sense of parallelism in the naruto world, even unrelated to the pairing stuff, I mean the Senju's will of fire and the Uchiha's curse of hate, carried by Naruto and Sasuke, those are two parallels, another is the passing of teacher to students, been done countless times in this series, hiruzen, asuma, jiraya, tsunade, even Itachi in a way to Sasuke for temporarily siding with the village. But among the pairings, NS has just too many of them to go on now, and this is just parallelism not the actual development which is the true thing that matters and even then 630 recently did display a good ordeal of how Sakura understands Naruto along with past chapters like the kazekage rescue, serach for sasuke, 4 tail event, etc. So many events that guide NS exist without even needing to resort to parallels, but parallels just bloster it more. If the parallels occured once or twice, not much, but now we get a scene of Obito's past towards Rin and how he loved her much like Naruto and Sai for Naruto's feelings towards Sakura in 457, so just what are we to expect here now? 631 was not enough proof of Sakura-Kushina parallels? Kushina's backstory not enough? What about the countless times team 7 was said to be the neo-sannin? Seriously, parallels exist in this story, its obvious. This stuff mentioned, all comes in the manga, yet where do we ever and I mean ever see a parallel even towards the hyuga clan? When did Hinata ever get a relation event towards someone else in a backstory? Know who actually has a parallel from the hygua clan? Neji, he died in the same sense of sacrifice as his father did towards someone of his own close family. the way Neji's dad died in place of his brother (hinata's father) is the same sense of sacrifice of Neji towards Hinata. So its funny, neji, who is dead, has a parallel and still Hinata has not one clear one. These ways we see how naruto and sakura act or what happened to them, often it relates towards either the sannin, team minato, or minakush and we get the end result. They tend to all equal out to NS having relations with these in tremendous ways. I'm not upset at the stuff we have, the development is the best part and so is the way they treat each other, but the parallels just keep coming, and thats good too. Not to mention even with all the development, NS still has a ton of loose ends which need to be addressed and thats a good thing too, more to answer means more development.

[Cherry-Bloss93]

 

This can be the case in the upcoming chapters for sakura.... 

 

If by this then you mean that you think that Sakura might confess to Sasuke again in the future chapters to get him to come back, then I think not. She already confessed once, and that was when she was a lot weaker emotionally/mentally, and I would see it as a huge character regression if she were to confess again to Sasuke. I think that the fake smile in 635 (I think) was meant to show the depletion in her romantic feelings for Sasuke.

[Inferno180]

If by this then you mean that you think that Sakura might confess to Sasuke again in the future chapters to get him to come back, then I think not. She already confessed once, and that was when she was a lot weaker emotionally/mentally, and I would see it as a huge character regression if she were to confess again to Sasuke. I think that the fake smile in 635 (I think) was meant to show the depletion in her romantic feelings for Sasuke.

Sakura if anything, you can expect her to act more like she did in 631, being cautious and unsure of Sasuke. Most likely the answer to 540 will come up. Sakura always had a key development between naruto and Sasuke and part of it was how on the naruto side, she wanted to help and was helped by him and the issues with Sasuke. Basically one key element is exactly what led to the land of iron events and helped bolster her understanding and gave reasoning to her 630 speech, she is caught in a conflict of all naruto has done and cares for her and Sasuke for her ideal feelings of him but also the negative things he has done. It's not only the manga but some extended scenes like ep 74 when she focuses on the picture of team 7 and she hears yamatos input of how much she cares for naruto is all that matters, I feel that is a really good scene because it shows how sakura knows what naruto does for her and makes her think what she can do for him. It's the speech of 630 again that many of us feel resonates with itachis speech to naruto about how Kushina helped minato become hokage. It's because itachi told naruto to trust in his friends and sakura was speaking exactly how she knows that everyone should not depend on naruto, it's to depend on each other. Ns just has a lot to it. Again 631 sealed Kushina with us no matter how its argued, while sakura does not love naruto yet, she does have close genuine feelings and in the near future these may rise to the surface.

[FrenchMyToast]

 

If by this then you mean that you think that Sakura might confess to Sasuke again in the future chapters to get him to come back, then I think not. She already confessed once, and that was when she was a lot weaker emotionally/mentally, and I would see it as a huge character regression if she were to confess again to Sasuke. I think that the fake smile in 635 (I think) was meant to show the depletion in her romantic feelings for Sasuke.

 

Agreed. I really see no point in a confession from Sakura at this point. I believe the fake smile was the result of her realization that Sasuke will never be "good"/Team 7 will never be reunited again. And I really hope she isn't naive enough to think that a love confession will affect Sasuke in any sort of way. It didn't work 4 years ago, so it probably won't work now. 

 

Also, people need to remember that the only characters that have feelings for another and haven't confessed yet are Naruto and Karin. I really want Kishi to wrap up the pairings already! Ughh... 

[TouKen4Life3g]

 
Agreed. I really see no point in a confession from Sakura at this point. I believe the fake smile was the result of her realization that Sasuke will never be "good"/Team 7 will never be reunited again. And I really hope she isn't naive enough to think that a love confession will affect Sasuke in any sort of way. It didn't work 4 years ago, so it probably won't work now. 
 
Also, people need to remember that the only characters that have feelings for another and haven't confessed yet are Naruto and Karin. I really want Kishi to wrap up the pairings already! Ughh... 

I seriously think the pairing will get simplified in the next arc. Thank you, Obito.

[FrenchMyToast]

I seriously think the pairing will get simplified in the next arc. Thank you, Obito.

 

It's already pretty simple right now though. 

[TouKen4Life3g]

 
It's already pretty simple right now though. 

Whoops. I mean next volume. I really wonder why have Sakura have negative development for Sasuke before Obito's twist. Hmmmm....

[FrenchMyToast]

Whoops. I mean next volume. I really wonder why have Sakura have negative development for Sasuke before Obito's twist. Hmmmm....

 

Maybe Obito seeing Sakura (who parallels Rin) move on from Sasuke (who parallels Kakashi) will give him some hope? I dunno. It's a longshot, but it would be nice...

[TouKen4Life3g]

 
Maybe Obito seeing Sakura (who parallels Rin) move on from Sasuke (who parallels Kakashi) will give him some hope? I dunno. It's a longshot, but it would be nice...

I just think the parallel can work by having Sakura supporting Naruto. We learned that Obito has two big failures: Rin and Hokage. Hokage is taken care of since their first battle. Now, Rin is next.

[Inferno180]

Next volume the main focus is the new threat of Obito as the Jinchurki, something tells me Madara may try to control Obito himself, that is still possible. Sasuke's intents should pop up too. I don't think Sakura will get any major harm, I mean she is too important to the story, she cannot die and there would be no point of that now espcially since the rinnetensei was used up. But yeah at this point, the parallels are there, this alone is a lot without even the development NS has. I mean the sannin one, yeah thats obvious. Team Minato, yeah its there too due to team dynamics. When we reach the pairing parallels though, with NS and MK many would say Kushina's backstory is just modeled easily after Sakura, okay lets see more, then we see the similar ways in which Minato rescued Kushina, just like Naruto saved Sakura, okay then Kishi is just repeating the stuff. Now we get too 631 with Minato making the Sakura-Kushina parallel, and finally now we get an Obito/Rin one just like Naruto and Sai in a flashback of 457 with him going on about why he cannot confess to her just like Obito was told not to give up by Minato. Either kishi is lazy in design or he means these parallels for a good reason.

[arian_rad]

I just think the parallel can work by having Sakura supporting Naruto. We learned that Obito has two big failures: Rin and Hokage. Hokage is taken care of since their first battle. Now, Rin is next.

Yeah, perhaps when naruto gets wounded during his battle with obito and Sakura immediately helps him and said something such as " don't worry, I'm looking out for you". I think this could happen.

[Miiami]

I want to talk about Kushina/Kushina case. This is really funny argument against Naruto/Sakura, because if they are similar it does not mean that they can't get together. Why did Tsunade fell inlove with Dan? Because he was just like her:

 

 

"This person he is like me." This is what triggered Tsunade to fall inlove with Dan.

 

On many occasions we saw that Naruto and Sakura are similar, Naruto liked pranks, and what did Sakura say? "I love these kinds of things!!"

 

Also:

 

 

 

 

When people have nothing in common their relationship eventually break, common likes/dislikes and etc. is what keeps people together, that's why you sometimes hear people say "I can't be with him/her we have nothing in common!".

 

Next time someone says "Lol its kushinaxkushina", thank them for noticing the similarities Sakura and Naruto share, tell them that Tsunade fell in love with Dan because they were similar.

 

Also why did Naruto fell in love with Sakura?

 

 

Because they were similar, Naruto just like Sakura wanted her to acknowledge him.

 

 

This is the kind of look that Naruto gives to Sakura, not Sasuke. Basically the first pairing that gets introduced in this manga is NS, and we see that the words that Naruto said with Sasuke's body really had an impact on Sakura, only thing is that she didn't know that it's Naruto, she thought that it's Sasuke and this pretty much proved that Sakura mostly cared for Sasukes looks, because the one that was able too see what her heart wants was Naruto.

[Cherry-Bloss93]

I just thought of something - what if before Minato leaves he teases Naruto and Sakura about giving him grandchildren?! Just imagine the flustered reactions from them lol - I think I would die from cuteness overload

Edited by Cherry-Bloss93, 04 July 2013 - 01:53 PM.

[arian_rad]

I just thought of something - what if before Minato leaves he teases Naruto and Sakura about giving him grandchildren?! Just imagine the flustered reactions from them lol - I think I would die from cuteness overload

I'm just thinking that when Minato leaves we might get the BIGGEST narusaku moment yet. I can imagine a million things he would say. He could even tell Naruto "take care of something that I couldn't take care of, because she reminds me of your mom" or something cheesy like that. Just imagine. War outbreak. Minato is HUGE.