749 replies to this topic

[Nate River]

Fandom. How? Well, fandom overly praise her.

Um, that's totally conclusory. What I am asking is how do they overly praise her? Everyone is just kind of agree without explanation.
 
[

Statement: One of the main problems of female characters is the fact they never left a strong impression, ending with a whimper or something that the negative outweigh the positive such as Sakura's seal power-up to begging, Tsunade's girl power segment against Madara to lose badly, and so on.
 
Agree or disagree?

Strong impression isn't a positive or negative thing. Sakura definitely left a strong impression when she begged. It just wasn't a good one.

The girl-power segment, that was awful and not because she lost. First, she wasn't the only one to have her rear kicked. They all got their rear kicked. At least she kept them alive even though it required a convoluted method that depended on a massive Deus Ex Machina, but she did keep them alive. So that was pretty important even though none of those characters did anything important for the rest of the series. They live because of her. We have to endure Gaara The Novel because of her. Okay, maybe it wasn't so great.

No, it sucked because he reached for the low hanging fruit. Just like when Ei instantly discredited himself when he said Naruto's opinion didn't matter, Madara does the same by calling her a weak woman.

I get it if the character is, by design, a sexist. Madara never was and its feels like that was tossed out to artificially boost what followed. Tsunade can look awesome without the lazy-ass Que by the author. The audience already wanted the guy to lost and if we didn't then more effort is required by the author that stupid line. We're not that dim, Kishi.

That said, I partially-agree. Stuff like that didn't help and having them when more fights probably helps them, but the real issue was doing a bad job of plot integration with those characters and screwing it up when he did involve them. See 693 for an obvious example.[

[catsi563]

Well for myself.

 

Hinata remains the most overrated in both fandom and story.

 

the character is utterly irrelevant to the story. She is 1 dimensional with her sole plot point being Naruto. there isnt a single plot point where she has relevance beyond Naruto. and worse, even the major plot moments she is involved with could easily be done to the same or greater emotional effect by numerous other character with more relevance to the plot.

 

Fandom wise the character is so over done attributed to godess like powers and feats of heroism well beyond the feats attributed to other females in the series. She takes on an almost Wolverine level of signifigance among her fans that is entirely undeserved. More to the point she is boosted above her status in the manga by fans that read deeper and stretch and twist the meanings of her appearances to mean far more then the appearance actually entails.

​her famous proud loser speech as a prime example is often given far more credence to the realtionship with Naruto then it actually has. The reality is the speech while a good character moment was nothing more then a small step for Naruto to acknowledge her as a person and friend. But nothing more. However the moment is saturated by her fandom with incredible depth and narutos looking deep into her heart and soul so that the blood promise is what links them together across the stars.

 

As stated above story wise the character does not have a single relevant plot point beyond Naruto and her crush, and all her major moments are moments that could be done to the same or better effect with a different more relevant character.

 

the conclusion is that the character is redundant and worse irrelevant to the story. She is overrated because she could be removed from the story and the story of Naruto wouldnt skip a beat in the slightest. But her fandom has inflated her relevance and importance to quite frankly absurd levels.

the Sai Sasuke arcs relevance to Team 7 like most of the story was wasted material. it should have been a moment for Sai to be introduced as Sasukes eventual replacement on Team 7 as he learns more humanity and about feelings.

​Meanwhile Sasuke moves on with Taka still friends with team 7 but developing in another direction.

 

Sadly the ending rendered the arc like many others irrelevant to the pairings at the ending and thusly wasted material.

Edited by catsi563, 03 March 2016 - 01:28 AM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Thanks, I have to add "positive" after "strong." That's what I really meant.

[Namikaze Clan]

Statement: One of the main problems of female characters is the fact they never left a strong positive impression, ending with a whimper or something that the negative outweigh the positive such as Sakura's seal power-up to begging, Tsunade's girl power segment against Madara to lose badly, and so on.
 
Agree or disagree?

Agreed. I can't think on any females that left a huge mark or change in the series.

Who knows? Maybe Sarada can fix that.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Agreed. I can't think on any females that left a huge mark or change in the series.

Who knows? Maybe Sarada can fix that.

It only took an overrated main character, overrated and overstay its welcome Uchiha, and dream of Hokage (that one has like 0.1% to make it important) to maybe just maybe have a decent female.

[rocci]

Agreed. I can't think on any females that left a huge mark or change in the series.

Who knows? Maybe Sarada can fix that.

Ofc she will.
She's a female sasuke after all.

[NeonRanger]

Kishi mentioned in the Gaiden interview how he had to read a book about female characters to come up with a decent one, which is really sad. 

 

With that, I agree; he truly cannot write females for crap, which is they are hated more than the males in this fandom. Every female in Naruto that had an impact one chapters, regressed in the next. 

 

The he only female character that hasn't been ruined was Konan. 

Edited by NeonRanger, 03 March 2016 - 02:37 AM.

[Tsuki Hoshino]

Inb4 Kishi writes a Konan book or someone else does

[SlyNinjaKnight]

Statement: One of the main problems of female characters is the fact they never left a strong positive impression, ending with a whimper or something that the negative outweigh the positive such as Sakura's seal power-up to begging, Tsunade's girl power segment against Madara to lose badly, and so on.
 
Agree or disagree?

 

Totally agree. All of the major female characters, including Hinata, had so much potential but they all fell so flat on their faces (thanks to Kishi and the studio). All of Sakura, Tsunade and Hinata's power-ups just became convenient plot points/abilities to try and have them stand alongside Naruto and Sasuke. To me, one of the few highlights in the War Arc was when Sakura activated her seal, allowing her to stand alongside Naruto and Sasuke (at least for a little bit). It showed that she had grown from the weak little fan girl into a strong ninja, without having to use a bloodline or a demon sealed inside her. But of course Kishi and the studio couldn't have someone upstage Naruto or Sasuke (especially Sasuke), so he gave Naruto and Sasuke their super power ups to make them into living gods.

[TouKen4Life3g]

 

Totally agree. All of the major female characters, including Hinata, had so much potential but they all fell so flat on their faces (thanks to Kishi and the studio). All of Sakura, Tsunade and Hinata's power-ups just became convenient plot points/abilities to try and have them stand alongside Naruto and Sasuke. To me, one of the few highlights in the War Arc was when Sakura activated her seal, allowing her to stand alongside Naruto and Sasuke (at least for a little bit). It showed that she had grown from the weak little fan girl into a strong ninja, without having to use a bloodline or a demon sealed inside her. But of course Kishi and the studio couldn't have someone upstage Naruto or Sasuke (especially Sasuke), so he gave Naruto and Sasuke their super power ups to make them into living gods.

Not only that, Sakura continues to angst and such. Her final moment in combat stage is crying.

 

Cry-ing

 

C-r-y-i-n-g

 

 

 

 

What!

[Tsuki Hoshino]

I think she was crying because she realized no matter what she ever did she'd always suck compared to them. 

Those tears were Sakura giving up and resigning herself to fate

The were the tears of a dying women  

 

[TouKen4Life3g]

I agree. It's really not hard to understand. The series is allergic to women.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Statement: Team Taka was really not needed in the long run.

Agree or disagree.

[NeonRanger]

Kishi said that Taka wasn't originally planned; his editors told him that Sasuke needed a team instead of going solo.

 

Plus they just disappeared after Team 7 reunited, and since the ending.

 

So I have to agree.

 

Which is sad because before that, there was potential, just like Sai and Yamato. But they were also unpopular as well, which surprised Kishi because he assumed people would warm up to Sai's character. 

[Tsuki Hoshino]

Statement: Team Taka was really not needed in the long run.

Agree or disagree.

 

I don't even know how to answer this i'm so mixed up. On the one hand, what importance did they really add to the story? on the other hand, without them and Karin there would be no baby momma Drama

Plus, clearly they added to Kishimoto's 15yr red herring. 

They would have had more relevance to the story if Sasuke had decided to keep his little band of misfits together as his Neo-team 7. He didn't chose team 7 but he did chose Team Taka....

 

Kishi said that Taka wasn't originally planned; his editors told him that Sasuke needed a team instead of going solo.

 

Plus they just disappeared after Team 7 reunited, and since the ending.

 

So I have to agree.

 

Which is sad because before that, there was potential, just like Sai and Yamato. But they were also unpopular as well, which surprised Kishi because he assumed people would warm up to Sai's character. 

I Liked Sai...and Yamato   Sai: the better friend than Sasuke got shafted. 

 

[rocci]

Statement: Team Taka was really not needed in the long run.

Agree or disagree.

Agree and disagree.

Agree that they didn't add something to the plot.
Disagree because they could add something to the plot.

The same thing happen with sai and Yamato. And pretty much all konoha rookie that not shikamaru team.

[Nate River]

Statement: Team Taka was really not needed in the long run.

Agree or disagree.

Wasn't needed in the short run either.

[Namikaze Clan]

Karin was somewhat useful due to her sensor ability but the other two? You could havve tooken them out and nothing would have changed. Nothing

So agreed

Edited by Namikaze Clan, 04 March 2016 - 01:45 AM.

[Narufan85]

Statement: Team Taka was really not needed in the long run.

Agree or disagree.

 

Agree. I think Taka could have been taken in some interesting directions, but like much of the Part II story, it was all in service to Sasuke. I would have been fascinated, for example, to have seen some interaction between Naruto and Karin that touched on their clan. But *shrugs* that would have meant exploring a clan that wasn't the Uchiha.

[catsi563]

Yeah much as I love team taka and karin in the long run thanks to the story and its atrocious ending they like many things were rendered irrelevant.

 

I will usually fiercely defend Karin and Team Taka. But the simple fact of the ending like it was just made them barely a foot note.