534 replies to this topic

[sushi.]

 

Well from what I have seen she is defensive of her fellow kunoichi's feelings and their skills, an admire of Tsunade, gets annoyed by Gai and Lee's antics, but may have feelings for Lee. 

Unrelated..does that help you interpret this moment? We don't know how she copes with grief. Either Kishi missed the opportunity to flesh her out, or there's not much sadness to show.

Edited by sushi., 14 February 2014 - 04:10 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Well this is hard to see how it all plays out. Regarding the brothers, I remember I was like "Oh.....ok...." when they could just use them for Juubi. Didn't mind Hachibi one, but this one seem like a safe bet, which was disappointing. Thankfully, yes I said it, Madara changed all that and have Naruto dying. Thanks, Kishi. Boy, am I evil.

I don't even know if we even going to get more insight with them, since they were said not being normal and actually have some close relationship with RS, so yeah. I actually remember that they explained that people tried to eat Bijuus' parts, only to die ASAP. But yeah, if there's any more details, I'm open for it. If not, oh well, it was a one time deal.

That said I don't know what's going to happen. It's really hard to determine. One route can actually be satisfying to many, good or passable; the other is good but leave many scratching their heads; the other is possibly something people may complain unless someone do a good explanation. So yeah, I'm lost with this one.

[catsi563]

Hmm so after some thought Id say the most likely scenario is Obito gaining control and either ejecting black zetsu or dominating him in some fashion. He then passes the last of Kyubi to naruto with a few last words for Kakashi in  the process.

 

Naruto revives to Sakura and Minato has a few choice words quite possibly confirming his feelings for her in the process--bench scene revisited? possibly

[redragon88]

@Inferno180

 

You are not realizing that your claim about the brothers still having Kurama's chakra is just baseless speculation. You don't have any evidence that's the case. You just personally want it to be so.

 

Are you really just going to ignore the panel showing Naruto yanking out that part of Kurama's chakra in the tug-of-war with Obito?

 

Just to be clear I do believe the brothers' spirits are still inside the tool, but that's it. Apart from you personally wanting them to have Kurama's chakra what actual reason are you providing for it to be so? Naruto took that chakra, the rational think to believe is that the brother's don't have it anymore.

 

Having an infinite supply of chakra doesn't have to do with anything. Suppose that a bottle that contains infinite water is in box A, then you open box A, take out the bottle, and move it to box B, now box B is the one with that infinite water. It's the same with Naruto taking back the chakra (the water bottle) that Gin and Kin stole from Kurama.

 

That chakra wasn't theirs to begin with, so it's only logical that they could loose it through the original owner taking it back.

[Inferno180]

Well this is hard to see how it all plays out. Regarding the brothers, I remember I was like "Oh.....ok...." when they could just use them for Juubi. Didn't mind Hachibi one, but this one seem like a safe bet, which was disappointing. Thankfully, yes I said it, Madara changed all that and have Naruto dying. Thanks, Kishi. Boy, am I evil.
I don't even know if we even going to get more insight with them, since they were said not being normal and actually have some close relationship with RS, so yeah. I actually remember that they explained that people tried to eat Bijuus' parts, only to die ASAP. But yeah, if there's any more details, I'm open for it. If not, oh well, it was a one time deal.
That said I don't know what's going to happen. It's really hard to determine. One route can actually be satisfying to many, good or passable; the other is good but leave many scratching their heads; the other is possibly something people may complain unless someone do a good explanation. So yeah, I'm lost with this one.

Again Madara blind using sussano, yeah I'm not going to complain about the fact if the brothers energy really is all that's needed to save naruto then I'd just swallow it up at this point. To me the pot says instant hero healing kit, open ASAP if hero is dying.

The real funny thing of this chapter though is that it presented a case of double irony, possibly triple
First irony is the yin kurama plan backfired
Second irony is Madara spit out the tools which will be used against him in some way
Third possible irony is reliant on the first, that obito make be able to mess with black zetsu having yin kurama now.

Really it's a simple way to look at things, naruto has 2 sources of energy to draw from, the only way anyone ends up reviving naruto is if both yin kurama cannot be rescued and if the pots are otherwise empty as some think they are.

The priority of things is as followed for what will happen if and when, also with regards to Madara just growing more powerful.

Also obito,while it seems like he is gone now, Kishi isn't just going to make him go thud and motionless, obito needs one act of redemption, something to strike back at Madara even lying down lost control of his body. If this should be preventing Madara gaining the left rinnegan or yin kurama, obito needs one last impactful task, weather this be gaining control of yin kurama, using one last rinne tensei on naruto, or destroying the left rinnegan, that's how he can make an impact.

Given that fact Madara is well Madara, he will get that rinnegan no matter what so that remains constant unless obitos act of rebellion is destroying the rinnegan, then this is the only factor to take priority over all scenarios.

As for the contents of the pot, well I'll say that too.

There is also a requirement, not only narutos recovery but also return to have enough power in aiding Sasuke to take down Madara.

Yin kurama recovery scenario: aka the ideal scenario. Let's face it, in the manga minato has been unfortunate, couldn't save obito, rin, or Kushina, now seeing the fact black zetsu took what they see as the only opportunity to save naruto, it's going to set him in a rage most likely. However as also said before with regards to the ironies, something happening to give the heroes a chance to recover yin kurama. This can occur if for some luck Madara cannot absorb yin kurama into himself without the gedo mazo form, the heroes quickly subdue black zetsu, or obitos last act of rebellion against Madara comes in this form by controlling yin kurama back to minato. This recovery fulfills both requirements if yin kurama is restored, the original plan works just having been hindered.

The potluck scenario: the realistic scenario. In this one, it's going from the stuff Madara dropped last chapter, this occurs if yin kurama is sealed by Madara. Someway occurs that let's the heroes sense the extra energy in the pots. In this scenario the pot and gourd have the brothers still inside or their chakra at least. The naruto recovery group or team guy moves towards each other and manage to get the brothers (or energy at least) out and this leads to narutos recovery. If the brothers are involved, their involvement is suspected to be very short lived as they get quickly subdued, drained of their kurama chakra for naruto, then Madara most likely "kills" them so as edo tensei beings they don't reform, it's for the sake of the story and moving things along, if they are involved nothing will keep them around for long, they had their use as a plot device to bring the ten tails in without killing naruto and now they are the reverse, the thing to save him. This scenario fulfills the requirements of reviving naruto and returning him to power but without a tailed beast support, he still has the power to bring down Madara with Sasuke but this scenario goes in line with the sages words of all tailed beasts returning to one form and then taking new ones later on.

The empty pots: the commonly thought trait,Basically things in this one occur mostly by the yin kurama retrieval but the pots are just empty, yet they somehow lead to madaras defeat, this is the common or middle ground one because it's an aspect of if naruto is still on the ground or recovered but in someway, it ultimately depends if the pots are empty reducing narutos potential living sources to 1, the tools become madaras defeat, but this is unlikely. This trait occurs in the following:

Empty pot 1 scenario, this involves a yin kurama retrieval but in someway the pots are conveniently placed tools to defeat Madara, this one involves a healed naruto but comes into play later in the fight. The pots are a resorted tool to seal away Madara, but the empty pots trait is unlikely to occur.

Empty pot 2 scenario: yin kurama is taken by Madara, as the pots are empty naruto is otherwise doomed, the pots themselves bring in a sacrifice event because naruto has nothing else to save him at this point. The pots are again as in the before scenario, used in someway to defeat Madara.

The following only occur if both Madara takes yin kurama and if the pots are in fact empty, basically Kishi reduces the situation almost to failure is the only options someone needs to go for the others to succeed. These scenarios bringsnaruto back, but doesn't give him the power he had before. These can only occur if the 2 kurama energy sources are taken/ not present for naruto to use.

Sacrificial scenario: obito, this is much more likely if even needed to occur, this revolves around obitos redemption. Obito pulls one last rinne tensei, using his dying life and last energy to save naruto. This makes sense and meaning for obito being the former villian but also the means to send him out right, give naruto his life back in a sense. This revives naruto but without the power

Sacrifice scenario: sakura, the story breaking scenario, the ones fans and haters beg for: yes the one we don't want to occur, luckly much reason is given to why it is this far and unlikely to occur. First off if both kurama energies are not around and second, it makes perfect sense for obito to use a last rinne tensei prior to this scenario involving sakura, this scenario is very unlikely and even if it came this far, it could only occur if she actually did have chiyos technique. Even then this a very unlikely and plot damaging event, reducing ns elements to just one moment if a fond farewell and making nh utterly terrible and hinata just not stand able at this point. Yes a ns event would ultimately ruin what nh even has making it barely stand able already, it would make it the most overly convinent and undeveloped pairing ever, hinata not even a character, just a plot device and that's just sad if it came to this point. Team 7s scenario is ruined, as is narutos hope of trying to finish everything with his friends, it's just another f u from fate when it comes to this stuff, again like his parallels naruto doesn't succeed with the girl he has loved a lot so yeah This scenario revives naruto but doesn't help in power returning. It also upsets much if the story but only if her death is for good.

Saving throw in sakura sacrifice: however this scenario also fortunately has a saving throw, if there is in someway sakura gets revived quickly maybe if obito does this as a way of giving naruto a chance he himself lost or breaking that cycle of hate, preventing naruto in turning like he did because if the girl he loved having died, if obitos last act is reviving sakura, this in turn prevents naruto from going down the same dark road. Tsunade could potentially do this too but it would only open the hokage fight of naruto and sasuke afterwards. This scenario is a dual revival and does preserve the story, but only adds more drama however it's better in my opinion to keep it shorter and just move into the fight using the two high priority reasons.

The insane theory: hinata makes naruto come back to life by just loving him, yeah no need to explain everything wrong with this one.

So yeah, things are prioritized to happen like this next chapter, most likely.

[Inferno180]

@Inferno180
 
You are not realizing that your claim about the brothers still having Kurama's chakra is just baseless speculation. You don't have any evidence that's the case. You just personally want it to be so.
 
Are you really just going to ignore the panel showing Naruto yanking out that part of Kurama's chakra in the tug-of-war with Obito?
 
Just to be clear I do believe the brothers' spirits are still inside the tool, but that's it. Apart from you personally wanting them to have Kurama's chakra what actual reason are you providing for it to be so? Naruto took that chakra, the rational think to believe is that the brother's don't have it anymore.
 
Having an infinite supply of chakra doesn't have to do with anything. Suppose that a bottle that contains infinite water is in box A, then you open box A, take out the bottle, and move it to box B, now box B is the one with that infinite water. It's the same with Naruto taking back the chakra (the water bottle) that Gin and Kin stole from Kurama.
 
That chakra wasn't theirs to begin with, so it's only logical that they could loose it through the original owner taking it back.

But then you are assuming that either Madara gets beaten so easily with simple words from the as using the pot and sakura ends up dying for nh to go canon conveniently like that? Unless we get a dual revival? I can easily counter by saying what makes you think this is the convenient way to just beat Madara? This is what your argument leads to if the pots really are empty. Either the pots have something or they have nothing and if they have nothing this means Madara gets beaten very easily or the moment was just simple humor to hurt guy and lee.

Edited by Inferno180, 14 February 2014 - 07:39 PM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Won't it be absolute hilarious if Madara is defeated in this volume by that pot? I know I'll laugh...then rage...

[redragon88]

But then you are assuming that either Madara gets beaten so easily with simple words from the as using the pot and sakura ends up dying for nh to go canon conveniently like that? Unless we get a dual revival? I can easily counter by saying what makes you think this is the convenient way to just beat Madara? This is what your argument leads to if the pots really are empty. Either the pots have something or they have nothing and if they have nothing this means Madara gets beaten very easily or the moment was just simple humor to hurt guy and lee.

 

The pot defeating Madara?

 

 

In that we can 100% agree.

 

Maybe the pot can be used to temporarily stop Madara in his tracks, but we all know that he'll simply go "kitten please, I'm a God" and brush it off like nothing. That's why he so easily dismissed the tools as he spat them out, Madara knows that they aren't a threat.

 

We were bound to see the ninja tools sooner or later, since Samui and Atsui are trapped in one of them. It would've been sad for Darui to say that they would find a way to get them out only for them to be forgotten forever.

 

Maybe the pot can be used to trap Black Zetsu, or to hide Naruto. We could think up many possibilities, but I think I'll just leave it to Kishi to surprise me.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Well it's already established that the pot can be countered, so do it now will be a bad time in terms of sealing. But if you want to do else, well, be sure it's an art of surprise.

[redragon88]

Well it's already established that the pot can be countered, so do it now will be a bad time in terms of sealing. But if you want to do else, well, be sure it's an art of surprise.

 

Can you elaborate?

 

@Inferno180

 

You should try and just wait for Kishi to show us how he'll handle everything. Right now it seems you're just focusing on how things can work out according to your personal scenarios.

 

Would you have imagined a couple of months ago that Sakura would be sticking her hand inside Naruto, pump his heart and start giving him CPR?

 

Give yourself a little wiggle room to expect the unexpected. Maybe the way to defeat Madara is something cool that we never saw coming. And wouldn't that be a good thing? The best kind of story telling is the one that can surprise you in a good way.

 

They could get Dark Kurama back from Black Zetsu somehow, maybe Obito stops Black Zetsu from giving Madara Dark Kurama, or maybe he uses rinnegan on Naruto. Maybe the pot is involved in temporarily stopping Madara or Black Zetsu, or maybe it's used in another way.

 

The point is that we have different routes to take the plot in, and some of them we might not even be aware of. So don't close yourself to a singular scenario, give yourself room to think of more and also to be surprised with stuff you never saw coming.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Well they never really explain how can you but if you go back to the chapter where they all team up to stop Kin from rampage. Raikage said they can counter it but it's best to get him off-guard and lost control. It ended with Ino controlling him and then get sucked into the pot. Look, it is possible that this trick could be only for this moment to ambush for a moment, knowing that Madara can't be touched, or it can be used for something else, or it can be used for much later.

[Hiraishin]

We were bound to see the ninja tools sooner or later, since Samui and Atsui are trapped in one of them. It would've been sad for Darui to say that they would find a way to get them out only for them to be forgotten forever.

Yeah, I always thought about that. I wondered if we'd ever even see the ninja tools again, since they hadn't been brought up in so long and found it sad how Darui said that yet it almost seemed like they would be forgotten. I want to see them again, just cause. Who knows, maybe they'll be able to help in the fight against Madara.

Edited by Hiraishin, 14 February 2014 - 09:01 PM.

[Inferno180]

 

Can you elaborate?

 

@Inferno180

 

You should try and just wait for Kishi to show us how he'll handle everything. Right now it seems you're just focusing on how things can work out according to your personal scenarios.

 

Would you have imagined a couple of months ago that Sakura would be sticking her hand inside Naruto, pump his heart and start giving him CPR?

 

Give yourself a little wiggle room to expect the unexpected. Maybe the way to defeat Madara is something cool that we never saw coming. And wouldn't that be a good thing? The best kind of story telling is the one that can surprise you in a good way.

 

They could get Dark Kurama back from Black Zetsu somehow, maybe Obito stops Black Zetsu from giving Madara Dark Kurama, or maybe he uses rinnegan on Naruto. Maybe the pot is involved in temporarily stopping Madara or Black Zetsu, or maybe it's used in another way.

 

The point is that we have different routes to take the plot in, and some of them we might not even be aware of. So don't close yourself to a singular scenario, give yourself room to think of more and also to be surprised with stuff you never saw coming.

 

There is always time for the unexpected to occur, but what I'm getting on is there has to be probable cause in what exactly heals naruto but also provides enough power in facing madara, I mean we can all say he gets rinne tenseied or somehow Sakura knows chiyos techique but in the end that just wouldn't solve everything.

 

I'm getting at there has to be something that not only revives naruto but also puts the pot and gourd madara spit out to use and it definitely has to go beyond sealing him because,  this isnt some preference of mine, its taking in how X can occur if Y must happen as well. The whole concept of the pots being empty, this envisions just making the whole ordeal about stopping madara overly simplified, this is the guy who soloed all the tailed beasts and made this ridiculous plan to come back to life only to be stopped by the simply tricking him is saying his name? Its hard to even believe it could be used like this. Maybe they use the pot to trap black zetsu or yin kurama, thats a possibility, but considering what was thrown in there, if it was used to enable the ten tails revival and now people expect them to just be gone or not have anything to help naruto yet the other characters like samui are still in there, that makes a flawed odreal that despite being edo tensei the brothers were somehow destroyed within the ten tails yet samui and her brother were not? Kishi has re-written stuff with the whole mechanics of chakra from time to time, I mean he put in 2 failsafes on naruto's own seal with kurama one in which minato and another in which kushina helped him, he put the brothers in so naruto and friends could fight the juubi without having him lost kurama sooner. Its things like this that just make it overly suspicous that in the situation right now, if minato, obito, and the others are unable to take back Yin Kurama espcially considering Madara just landed there, well it seems the next likely solution is what madara dropped. Either way the pot and gourd will be used in someway to save naruto despite containing anything or not. Its just events like this that occur that seem like a big suspicious over other assumptions like sakura, kakashi, or obito sacrificing themselves.

 

I mean if the pots really are empty, then something has to be done with them but it cannot lead to madara's defeat by simply stuffing him in one of those. Until we actually see if something is done with the pots, its unknown, but im just saying, its just too susipious to have this come out after the original plan failed. Even furthermore when theres just a lot of evidence and reason saying that if sakura sacrificed herself, it would break a lot of stuff for the story and hurt a lot of things. All I can see the pots being used for is if the yin kurama recovery event is possible and if the heroes pull off one victory before madara gets the rinnegan. I mean he is almost at full power, things are just going his way but another deal is yes, obito. Obito isnt just going to die, he needs one last act of redemption at least. There are many viable theories right now, but the most potential are basically as I said before, either he gets yin kurama back quickly or the save was ironically dropped by madara. If things came to a sacrifice though, again just sakura dying for good would cause a lot of problems, but if she was revived, this would be averted, if we got a dual revival, I mean Sakura's security is not only her role, its the development and just stuff like the kushina shadow thrown in, I doubt it would be only built in to show her as a girl like kushina who coincidentally dies like her on naruto's birthday.

 

I mean for the most part, however things turn out, the chances of sakura sacrificing herself are very slim but the events of naruto's recovery are all viable, from simply breaking yin kurama out to give to him to otherwise making use of what madara spit out. there has been wiggle room in my theories, its just based on priority if one thing occurs then obviously the others wont. Its just like how before this, some people thought sakura would sacrifice herself despite kurama's unmentioned plan at the time. While it seems like there is a bigger chance, I say again the stuff madara dropped, its giving us a direct notice that something else may occur over using the pots thus rendering the possibility for her sacrificing herself unneeded again.

 

I mean if the pots are empty, I can only see them being used as a temporary means to seal madara way for a couple of chapters if the stuff of rescuing yin kurama is really the path. They could remove madara temporarily while saving naruto. Otherwise its the pots are full and they get the energy out of them. Something has to lead to naruto getting recovered and its just too easy to dismiss the pots he spit out being used for nothing.

Edited by Inferno180, 14 February 2014 - 09:35 PM.

[Otaru]

We should stop talking about Kin/Gin brothers lol    We're gonna be nuts before wednesday.

 

Do you guys have the same feeling as me about jinchuuriki ?

I have this feeling there will never be a jinchuuriki anymore.

[Inferno180]

We should stop talking about Kin/Gin brothers lol    We're gonna be nuts before wednesday.

 

Do you guys have the same feeling as me about jinchuuriki ?

I have this feeling there will never be a jinchuuriki anymore.

 

You mean we weren't nuts about NaruSaku already (in a good way)?

[Chatte]

All I'm saying is no matter how this is done, don't exclude the possibility of Sakura doing some sort of sacrifice for Naruto... In the end, it was foreshadowed. We should wait and see how Kishi is going to play it instead of arguing among ourselves.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

All I'm saying is no matter how this is done, don't exclude the possibility of Sakura doing some sort of sacrifice for Naruto... In the end, it was foreshadowed. We should wait and see how Kishi is going to play it instead of arguing among ourselves.

It wasnt.

And i think someome said that in the raw there was no "sacrifice" term i guess but that's not the point.

The only thing that was foreshadowed on Sakura over and over was about helping Naruto and not being useless to him.

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 15 February 2014 - 12:41 AM.

[xxRomanceGirlxx]

I'm trying to stay out of this argument on the pots ... it feels like there's not enough information to definitely say how Naruto will be revived or what use the pots will have in the future. The whole scene, even if it was played for comedy, was giving me the sense it was important and might prove to be Madara's downfall. Whether that's getting Naruto back on his feet or sealing remains to be seen.

 

Eveyone here has had some pretty good arguments, but none of them don't seem concrete yet. I suggest we just wait it out and see if Kishi gives us more hints in the coming chapters.

[LuckyChi7]

I'm trying to stay out of this argument on the pots ... it feels like there's not enough information to definitely say how Naruto will be revived or what use the pots will have in the future. The whole scene, even if it was played for comedy, was giving me the sense it was important and might prove to be Madara's downfall. Whether that's getting Naruto back on his feet or sealing remains to be seen.
 
Eveyone here has had some pretty good arguments, but none of them don't seem concrete yet. I suggest we just wait it out and see if Kishi gives us more hints in the coming chapters.

True, but I'm wondering Kishi will pull another 30 pages like he did with Chapter 647. I think that would be interesting to see again. Don't know if that'll happen in this volume or during the Madara fight. As far as the argument goes, I'm still sticking to my theory Yin Kurama. Until the chapter comes out, we'll see.

Though I think the real question would be how this volume will end. There are three chapters, and I see these two possibilities occurring:

1. Naruto and Sasuke reawaken and Infinite Tsukuyomi activates.

2. Infinite Tsukiyomi activates, neither one is up. Except Naruto and Sakura are stuck together. Almost like how Road to Ninja happened.

Edited by LuckyChi7, 15 February 2014 - 12:49 AM.

[Chatte]

It wasnt.

And i think someome said that in the raw there was no "sacrifice" term i guess but that's not the point.

The only thing that was foreshadowed on Sakura over and over was about helping Naruto and not being useless to him.

How can you say it wasn't when we had the farewell words?! No matter how it was put in words, Chiyo referred strictly at Sakura taking that sword for her.