4869 replies to this topic

[TwilightLink20xx]

Hey, if someone gets the raws to her and us quick enough, I'd love to get that started, lol. She would be a great translator for the releases, though, her translations have always been spot on.

And yes, the Baka/fool/idiot is meant to be endearing. She sees him as a fool for loving her, but she genuinely cares about him. It's more of "yes, he's a fool, but he's my fool" xD. Assuming she loves him right now like she claims she does, of course. (don't worry, I'm confident she does)

Edited by TwilightLink20xx, 08 January 2010 - 04:05 AM.

[Gravenimage]

I like to think she uses "baka" as an endearing term

You're right it leads me to believe that Sakura is using reverse phycology on Naruto calling him "baka" will be like calling him" cutie" or even handsome. But nevertheless I think she calls him baka as a sign of affection in a tsundere way.

[ciardha]

I figured that, sorry if I seemed like I calling was calling you out Derock, just felt like correcting you.
And personally I'd say the 3rd most important female would be Ino for being the main female character's best friend, seeing as she can also influence many things.

In part 1 that was true, but in part 2 Sakura has surpassed Ino in skills as a kunoichi, and they've both taken a romantic interest in different guys so they are no longer childish fangirls chasing after a boy that had no interest in either of them. The close friendship bond does have an importance to both of them but Tsunade has taken the place of second most important female in the manga. Ino and Sakura both have a bond to Shizune, Ino and Shizune are probably on about the same level of importance to the story. Ino certainly is of more importance to the story than say Hinata or Tenten.

[Derock]

A secondary character is someone who pops in front time to time or remains obscured in the background. That practically sums up Ino and Temari. Tsunade falls more into the place of a primary character.

I think Derock meant that Tsunade's the second most important female. Is that what you meant?

I wonder, then, who is the 3rd most important female? I'd say Mizukage or Temari, but I don't know...

I figured that, sorry if I seemed like I calling was calling you out Derock, just felt like correcting you.
And personally I'd say the 3rd most important female would be Ino for being the main female character's best friend, seeing as she can also influence many things.

Froot got it. However, I'm not sure how the tiers of the characters, especially for the females, are working right now because now Tsunade is now comatose and the question lingers on will she wake up or not. If Ino had more screentime in the past, then I can say she's 2nd tier and be right next to Shikamaru at best. But now... its hard to tell. Hell, even Shizune, I'm having problems where she is right now. Its confusing for the other characters besides Naruto, Sakura and Kakashi are main protagonists while Sasuke is heading for main antagonist route. But with these characters I know exactly where they are in the tiers (Team Taka, Madara and Akatsuki, Kages, Shikamaru). And since Killer Bee is still around, I was hoping for Karui and Samui being in at least near 2nd tier. But I doubt it.

[Miss Soupy]

@Miss Soupy

In general though, the thing about Sakura's character is that Kishimoto has shown her development. She starts off as a rather superficial girl, writing Naruto off as an annoying boy who gets between her and Sasuke, and being more caring of her appearance then abilities. She changes throughout the series, not just in her abilities but her attitude towards her teammates- especially Naruto. She's clearly developed and matured, and the fact that she was willing to accept that she couldn't continue believing Sasuke would come back (especially at Naruto's expense) and to shoulder the burden of killing him is evidence of this change.

I think the scene where she ran towards 4-tailed Kyuubi Naruto saying "Stop this, you don't have to do this, I'll save Sasuke for you!" was indicative of her growing feelings towards Naruto as well, and that she believed that she too should shoulder the burden of bringing Sasuke back (and in fact foreshadowing and linking to the recent chapters).

I think she probably blames herself for her hurting Naruto, which is why she's a bit emotional and not thinking very clearly with regards to killing Sasuke herself though.

Oh and P.S Anyone saw the omake in the latest Naruto Shippuuden ending? It kind of smacked of NaruSaku. Even more hilariously, it directly ribs at the double standards in the way some fans view Hinata and Sakura

Yeah, I agree. My point was that Sakura is harder to like sometimes because her whole point was change, but she started off pretty lowly in the manga. For those unwilling to give her a chance to develop, she was probably disliked from the beginning to present. By now, there isn't much reason for the intense dislike, though I realize recent developments haven't exactly helped.

I did see the new shippuden ending, and it was really cute! I loved seeing all the characters as kids; even little Oro was cute... >.< Sakura and Naruto looked adorable<3 I loved when Jiraiya pushed Naruto towards her in that teasing yet romantic way X3

[Gravenimage]

Oh yeah I have seen it and it was more like they were bashing Hinata more than Sakura. That's how they view Hinata she's popular just by saying" Naruto-kun" or blushing whenever she sees him or thinks of him. I personally think that's not how a fan should like a character or his favorite character. For example I like Sakura because of her attitude and personality she's honest and she's full of determination. I'm not going to say I like her because she hits Naruto it will be a dumb to like a character like that on contrary to Hinata. She's a side character and the fans treats her like she was the lead female or even like she was the main character of the manga they would even think the manga is really called" Hinata" and not Naruto.

Edited by Gravenimage, 08 January 2010 - 01:28 PM.

[Froot]

Hey, if someone gets the raws to her and us quick enough, I'd love to get that started, lol. She would be a great translator for the releases, though, her translations have always been spot on.

That way we could be sure there'd be no bending or words or things left out. It would be the next best thing to being able to actually read Japanese!

And yes, the Baka/fool/idiot is meant to be endearing. She sees him as a fool for loving her, but she genuinely cares about him. It's more of "yes, he's a fool, but he's my fool" xD. Assuming she loves him right now like she claims she does, of course. (don't worry, I'm confident she does)

That's what I thought, too, in a kind of endearing/teasing way exactly like how you'd call a close friend "dummie" or something of the sort. I tease my friends all the time, and they tease right back. I remember back in the chapter (the number escapes me) how Sai was analyzing Naruto's nickname for Sakura and Sakura's lack of a nickname for Naruto. I'm not 100 % sure, but I think "chan" is something like "little" or "young" in Japanese, right? So if I'm correct it's almost like Naruto is calling her Little-Sakura, which is totally adorable

Another suffix with no exact English translation, chan has a variety of ways to be used. In general, it is a very soft and affectionate suffix.

Whereas Sai said Sakura's lack of suffix for Naruto indicated their closeness, not disrespect. I don't know much about Japanese suffixes in general, but I think it means that she is comfortable enough around him that she doesn't feel the need to address him as anything other than his given name. Of course, that doesn't mean that Naruto isn't comfortable enough around Sakura; He just likes giving her nickname as you would give a close friend a nick name.

Soon after Sai asked Sakura why she didn't have a nickname for Naruto, she said she could call him Naruto-baka. I really do think it's an endearing term.

But nevertheless I think she calls him baka as a sign of affection in a tsundere way.

And I agree.


The new ending is adorable I love the symbolism of Sakura being in the dark when Sasuke was around, but then it switched to Naruto, and she was in the sun. Then the moment where it switched from dark to light, and she ran to her group of precious people (where Sasuke was nowehere to be seen) and Naruto was up front, waiting for her... I think the anime team loves us now

[ciardha]

You're right it leads me to believe that Sakura is using reverse phycology on Naruto calling him "baka" will be like calling him" cutie" or even handsome. But nevertheless I think she calls him baka as a sign of affection in a tsundere way.

It's been a common teasing flirting word for Japanese girlfriends to boyfriends since at least the late 1940's- you can see it even in Ozu's films of that period. It's definitely an flirtatious teasing action when Sakura does it in the nickname chapter. Japanese readers would have immediately picked up on that.

[Gravenimage]

It's been a common teasing flirting word for Japanese girlfriends to boyfriends since at least the late 1940's- you can see it even in Ozu's films of that period. It's definitely an flirtatious teasing action when Sakura does it in the nickname chapter. Japanese readers would have immediately picked up on that.

I know about that and the Japanese picking on that flirting teasing. Sadly the rest of the world doesn't think so they believe Kishi is writing his manga base on western culture when that's clearly wrong. He has been writing his manga base on the Japanese culture like every single manga there has ever been released in the past.

Edited by Gravenimage, 08 January 2010 - 03:33 PM.

[ciardha]

I know about that and the Japanese picking on that flirting teasing. Sadly the rest of the world doesn't think so they believe Kishi is writing his manga base on western culture when that's clearly wrong. He has been writing his manga base on the Japanese culture like every single manga there has ever been released in the past.

Yeah, when I was a teen and twenty-something I started reading Japanese novels, reading every book I could find about Japan (and quickly learned which ones were ignorant ones by racist westerners too stuck on Japan being our enemy in WWII, and which ones would give me true insights via westerners eyes.) Then Kodansha started translating books by Japanese people into English, right around the time I started college and my university library luckily had someone on staff who was as fascinated by Japan as I was so I read many more books.... I learned to speak and read basic Japanese (2 year program, learned around 100 kanji and to speak basic Japanese from a instructor who actually was Japanese. I also made friends with many of the Japanese students participating with a university study program with the university I attended, even became attracted to one and he to me, and went together while we attended the university.

I had soaked in so much of what I had learned in by the time I was watching the fansubs of Fushigi Yuugi done by Tomodachi in 1997 (she was known for putting lots of Japanese cultural notes in- something I loved seeing) but a number of times I was like "why did she note that, what's not obvious about that? About the only things I missed were funny references to Japanese comedy shows- something not available to Americans- even in the later 90's. Even anime subtitled was hard to come by still in 1997. You basically could only get it via fansubbers on the internet. Tomodachi was one of the best, she focused on shoujo anime, which also was basically still unavailable in 1997, even the dubbed Sailor Moon had a tough time even getting put on in many US markets in 1996-7. It was the word of mouth fandom popularity of Fushigi Yuugi that finally busted the doors down for shoujo anime and manga in the US. Viz heard about how popular FY was and bought the rights to the US translation of both and the rest is history....

I did that so I could really understand the manga and anime I liked- not view it through my cultural window, but the framework it was coming from.

Edited by ciardha, 08 January 2010 - 06:21 PM.

[Gravenimage]

Yeah, when I was a teen and twenty-something I started reading Japanese novels, reading every book I could find about Japan (and quickly learned which ones were ignorant ones by racist westerners too stuck on Japan being our enemy in WWII, and which ones would give me true insights via westerners eyes.) Then Kodansha started translating books by Japanese people into English, right around the time I started college and my university library luckily had someone on staff who was as fascinated by Japan as I was so I read many more books.... I learned to speak and read basic Japanese (2 year program, learned around 100 kanji and to speak basic Japanese from a instructor who actually was Japanese. I also made friends with many of the Japanese students participating with a university study program with the university I attended, even became attracted to one and he to me, and went together while we attended the university.

I had soaked in so much of what I had learned in by the time I was watching the fansubs of Fushigi Yuugi done by Tomodachi in 1997 (she was known for putting lots of Japanese cultural notes in- something I loved seeing) but a number of times I was like "why did she note that, what's not obvious about that? About the only things I missed were funny references to Japanese comedy shows- something not available to Americans- even in the later 90's. Even anime subtitled was hard to come by still in 1997. You basically could only get it via fansubbers on the internet. Tomodachi was one of the best, she focused on shoujo anime, which also was basically still unavailable in 1997, even the dubbed Sailor Moon had a tough time even getting put on in many US markets in 1996-7. It was the word of mouth fandom popularity of Fushigi Yuugi that finally busted the doors down for shoujo anime and manga in the US. Viz heard about how popular FY was and bought the rights to the US translation of both and the rest is history....

I did that so I could really understand the manga and anime I liked- not view it through my cultural window, but the framework it was coming from.

You're awesome you know so much about the Japanese culture I bet you could translate manga too. Because we really need fair people who can translate manga the right way, you know what I mean how many people have been messing with the translations in the Naruto manga when it comes to pairings or hints of N/S.

About the culture thing for example if I was Japanese and a manga artist I would obviously write my manga base on the culture of my own country not on another country which I may not know much of. I don't know if they are any mangaka who write their manga base on western culture or are there any?

Edited by Gravenimage, 08 January 2010 - 06:30 PM.

[ciardha]

You're awesome you know so much about the Japanese culture I bet you could translate manga too. Because we really need fair people who can translate manga the right way, you know what I mean how many people have been messing with the translations in the Naruto manga when it comes to pairings or hints of N/S.

About the culture thing for example if I was Japanese and a manga artist I would obviously write my manga base on the culture of my own country not on another country which I may not know much of. I don't know if they are any mangaka who write their manga base on western culture or are there any?

We're getting way too off topic and I'll answer most of this in private message. --Click here to view--

But thanks for the compliments! Knowing only basic Japanese I'd be painfully slow, but I have a skill in doing what the official translators at Viz (and other US manga/anime translating companies do)- taking the literal (but ungrammatical in English) translations from a Japanese translator and making it grammatical but as close as possible to the original meaning, and having a real sense of the right word to choose because of what I know.

[socermania2]

The anime team is on our side

Love the part in the ending when Naruto is sitting on the bench, and Sakura opens up her hands and whispers "For you..."

Edited by socermania2, 08 January 2010 - 09:11 PM.

[Gravenimage]

The anime team is on our side

Love the part in the ending when Naruto is sitting on the bench, and Sakura opens up her hands and whispers "For you..."

Not quite the animators are only following Kishi in the path he's taking in the pairings department and yes it's going towards the N/S path.

[Jenskott]

Ino certainly is of more importance to the story than say Hinata or Tenten.

That is very accurate. She has always been more involved in the main plot than Hinata, her role is more relevant and her impact in the storyline is greater. You can talk about Naruto -one of the main characters- without mentioning Hinata, but can you talk about Sakura -one of the main characters- without mentioning Ino? No, you can't.

Oh yeah I have seen it and it was more like they were bashing Hinata more than Sakura. That's how they view Hinata she's popular just by saying" Naruto-kun" or blushing whenever she sees him or thinks of him.

Hah! I admit I got a good laugh when I watched that scene. And it is very true. She has become famous by repeating "Naruto-kun" the whole time.

Many of the last previews and omakes have mocked Hinata or put her down. I'm beginning to think the cartoon-makers are getting just so fed up with her obsessed fans like Kishimoto. And it is unfair because she has no blame of a bunch of her fans have overblown her role and thinks she is entitled to something greater.

The new ending is adorable I love the symbolism of Sakura being in the dark when Sasuke was around, but then it switched to Naruto, and she was in the sun. Then the moment where it switched from dark to light, and she ran to her group of precious people (where Sasuke was nowehere to be seen) and Naruto was up front, waiting for her...

It also looked like that to me. I think it was very fitting and very emotional.

That's what I thought, too, in a kind of endearing/teasing way exactly like how you'd call a close friend "dummie" or something of the sort. I tease my friends all the time, and they tease right back.

Exactly. It was not a display of disrespect but from closeness.

[Gravenimage]

I actually feel sorry for Hinata it's not her fault the fans are giving her so much credit.

[firegirl]

what do you guys think of the lyrics to the ending(trasnlated by louchan)

ここにあるのは　君が今まで選んだみちの
答え達よ　ほら自信もって進めばいい
Here are the answers for the road that you have choosen up until now. See, it's fine to proceed with self-confidence,

とても(?)なの 雨上がりの
アスファルトに　虹が架かるように
It's very (?), like a rainbow mounting over the rain soaked asphalt.

LONELY 風が吹いて
A lonely wind is blowing.

FEELING 気がついたよ
Notice my feeling. (Can also be translated as "I notice the feeling".)

答えはどこにも無いけど
The answer isn't anywhere but...

CALL ME 分かってるわ
I understand, so call me. (Can also be translated as "You understand, so call me".)

WITH YOU 愛はいつも
与え合うもの
With you, love is always something attainable.

FOR YOU
For you.

きっと君はいつの日か
この空を飛べるはずだから
Because surely you will one day fly through this sky.

何度つまずいたとしても FOR YOU
No matter how many times you trip, for you.

大切な事は一つ
夢見る事
There is only one important thing, the things you see in dreams.

心だけは閉ざさないでいて
Only my heart will never be closed.

[Devil Keyz]

Oh yeah I have seen it and it was more like they were bashing Hinata more than Sakura. That's how they view Hinata she's popular just by saying" Naruto-kun" or blushing whenever she sees him or thinks of him. I personally think that's not how a fan should like a character or his favorite character. For example I like Sakura because of her attitude and personality she's honest and she's full of determination. I'm not going to say I like her because she hits Naruto it will be a dumb to like a character like that on contrary to Hinata. She's a side character and the fans treats her like she was the lead female or even like she was the main character of the manga they would even think the manga is really called" Hinata" and not Naruto.