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The NEW NaruSaku Debate Thread


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#30881 ramenanmitsu

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 02:11 AM

 
The same way he treated Sasuke. Remember, Sakura would be the one who Naruto would be concerned about and chasing after. I wouldn't change the situation, only the fact Sakura would be the antagonist, not Sasuke. Why would it be different? Naruto's acting towards Sasuke is not only because he's Sasuke, it's because of what he has done in the story. If Sakura was the one to do those things, I can safely assume she would be at the same situation in Naruto's eyes.


Yes, I agree. But my main point is that he'll be less forgiving. That's what I received from reading the manga anyways.
 

Unforgivable...Anything his comrades do will ever be unforgivable to Naruto. Being Sasuke to do those things or not, that's the kind of person he is. He forgave Obito, who killed his parents and friends too, why not forgive Sasuke, who attempted killing Sakura? But as I said, forgiving is not the same as accepting and now I'm adding that understanding isn't the same as accepting too. There's disapproval in Naruto's eyes when he's saving Sakura from Sasuke. He doesn't approve that hatred. And he will never do, even if it's coming from Sasuke. 


Of course he won't approve. He's not a villain. But approving is different from accepting. He understands who Sasuke is and he accepts the way he is by still interacting with him like he used to. The way Naruto interacts with Sasuke is the same as he did in part one. Kakashi and Sakura are a lot more wary of him. They don't trust him and act as if they're back to good old team seven. You don't see Naruto acting like that. He acts like Sasuke's murder attempts on Sakura never happened. To me that's accepting who Sasuke is and going on with it.
 

Now you have no proof of what you're saying. I'm based on what Naruto said. He said he can't confess to someone if he couldn't keep a promise. He didn't mention achieving goals, he mentioned the promise. Oh, and good luck with that, Hawaii is awesome. 

Yes, you're right. My words were observation that disagreed to your observation. He said that he cannot confess to Sakura because of the promise. There was no indication that that is because Sakura's important to him. That part was your observation.

And thanks, I've already achieved it long ago and Hawaii was awesome :D
 

If Naruto asked "Are you alright?", she would still interfere in their fight later and she would still be in danger. The only way of keeping her away from danger would be telling her to stay away from it. 


And my point was, if the reason he talked to her was because he was worried as you say, he would have said, "Are you alright? Please don't get in the fight between me and Sasuke because it's dangerous".

His tone was condemning. And not words of how he would usually act if he were worried.
 

Training is different from being able to actually do something at the exact moment. A great example of stupidity was Hinata trying to kill herself fighting with pain and putting everyone in danger because Naruto went 9 tails. Thank God Minato saved the day. If Hinata trained later, it would be great, but doing that at a moment she couldn't do a thing was completely unnecessary and a waste of her own life. 


That was stupid, I agree. But I'm not saying she should have fought Pein. I'm saying that even if there is someone else doing the job for you, it doesn't give you the excuse to lay back and do nothing. For example, Hinata. Her guards protect her all the time and they're probably stronger. It doesn't give her the excuse and do nothing about her current situation.

Sakura would have been more admirable if she didn't just stop with, "there's nothing I can do" but went with "I must keep up with them! I'm a member of team seven too!"

If you keep on putting limits on what you can and can't do, your development stops there. Hence, that moment I thought Sakura's development stopped.

No it's not logical because Naruto can't save everyone at once like she can and with her healing abilities, she can heal herself and be able to fight even being a medical ninja. That's logic. 


Can't Naruto use his abilities with Kage Bunshin? If he can, he should be able to that regeneration technique to everyone at once.
 

Don't you understand that that was a very confidential fact? That it was not something you could go and tell someone even if that someone is important to you? Why does that affect NS? 


I agree. It's not an information that you can just tell anyone. However, Sakura is not anyone, she's the member of team seven. She has as much right to the knowledge as much as Kakashi and Naruto. I would've agreed with you if the order to keep it a secret was given by Tsunade or the Konoha Council members. But no, it was just decided by Kakashi who is the teacher and Naruto obeyed it.
 

Again, because the manga is centered on NarSas relationship, it doesn't mean anything to the romance subplot, since the bromance has nothing to do with it. If there was actual romance between Naruto and Sasuke, you could say it's non-mutual, but the bromance doesn't nullify Naruto's romantic feelings for Sakura, one thing has nothing to do with the other. 


Yes, as you say it doesn't nullify it. It just makes it look insignificant.
 

I get your example pretty well, but the only reason for NS to be weak that I see you referring to is related to the magnificence of NarSas relationship that "makes NS non-mutual", which I don't agree with. 

Actually, The reason I don't like NS that much anymore is for two reasons. The first is this bromance, which I think all will go well if Naruto ends up living happily ever after with Sasuke. And nobody else. Secondly, Sakura should focus her life elsewhere. There is an unfair balance that makes this pairing look terribly one-sided. Sakura is centered around her teammates who doesn't have anything to do with her. It's natural for me to wish that she gets a life of her own away from Naruto and Sasuke.

Edited by ramenanmitsu, 02 September 2014 - 03:57 AM.

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#30882 Illnevergiveup3

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 02:20 AM

Well, I just had to do this :chuckle:

Cuteness

ahhhh!!! My eyes!!! It burns!!!

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#30883 Kyaerai

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 02:22 AM

Right at this very moment Hinata is planning Sakura's murder.
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#30884 TouKen4Life3g

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 02:22 AM

I like this week's comment:

 

"I love How to Train Your Dragon, so I'm praying that the sequel will be released in Japan!"



#30885 Naruko

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 02:31 AM

Yes, I agree. But my main point is that he'll be less forgiving. That's what I received from reading the manga anyways.
 
Of course he won't approve. He's not a villain. But approving is different from accepting. He understands who Sasuke is and he accepts the way he is by still interacting with him like he used to. The way Naruto interacts with Sasuke is the same as he did in part one. Kakashi and Sakura are a lot more wary of him. They don't trust him and act as if they're back to good old team seven. You don't see Naruto acting like that. He acts like Sasuke's murder attempts on Sakura never happened. To me that's accepting who Sasuke is and going on with it.
 
Yes, you're right. My words were observation that disagreed to your observation. He said that he cannot confess to Sakura because of the promise. There was no indication that that is because Sakura's important to him. That part was your observation.

And thanks, I've already achieved it long ago and Hawaii was awesome :D
 
And my point was, if the reason he talked to her was because he was worried as you say, he would have said, "Are you alright? Please don't get in the fight between me and Sasuke because it's dangerous".

His tone was condemning. And not words of how he would usually act if he were worried.

I'll edit this post and answer to the rest of your post after my appointment with the doctor. I'm on my phone so I can't save it on my computer. Talk to you later!
 

 

Omg, are you writing all those stuff on the phone? What are you?  :argh:

 

Why would be less forgiving? What difference would that make? 

 

You mean Naruto would accept the hatred and not try to change it? I don't think so. At least that's not what I get from the manga. He is accepting Sasuke completely now because at least until now he hasn't shown any hatred anymore. If he tried to attack the village, things were going to be different. Naruto forgives quickly, that's how he is, not Sakura or Kakashi. If it were Sakura instead of Sasuke, it would be the same thing. Naruto's forgiveness is not biased. 

 

I said it's a proof that he still cares about that promise they made, which is right. There's proof that he cares about her in almost every chapter please  :hehehe:

 

Ikr? Try Bahamas next time. It's great too.  :eager:

 

But she was obviously all right o.O. Remember that chapter when Naruto falls in the water and Hinata worries about him, then Sakura tells her to not worry because it would need much more to hurt him? Pretty much that.... And I still don't see what relation Naruto and Sasuke's rivalry has with the romance subplot. One doesn't disrupt the other. 


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#30886 Khaleesi

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 02:43 AM

First of all, thanks for wanting to debate with me. And I really like how calm you are.

 
 SHE IS! ISN'T SHE? i think she's cute, asffdagfa

 

That's a good question. I am actually not sure. If she was abducted, I'm sure he will. But if she betrays.....I'm not sure to be honest :/ Naruto had no mercy to people like Mizuki or Kabuto becoming bad. It's hard for me to distinguish a clear line from who he will fight for or against because Sasuke's position is very different from the others.

It's because their types of relationship were different. I'm sure you could do things for a certain couple of persons, not everyone but more than one. Mizuki/Kabuto played "the good guy" with him and then showed their true intentions, that's why is different, There is not a real bond. Even with Kabuto, Naruto couldn't believe it at first. (lmao, okay staph)

I disagree that changing Sasuke is Naruto's purpose. It's more like forcefully wanting to bring him back because Naruto is Sasuke's brother. "I'll bring you back even if I break your arms and legs". He's never done his TnJ even when he had the chance like the Kage summit. He more or less accepts Sasuke the way he is. And that's what makes Sasuke different from Nagato, Obito, and Zabuza. Towards the three villains he was very angry and probably be furious if they tried to kill Sakura like Sasuke did. But when it comes to Sasuke, he's more accepting even if he nearly killed his own teammate. Therefore, I make my conclusion that Sasuke's importance are way above the others. When it's about Sasuke, it's not about changing him but more like accepting him.

Nagato, Obito and Zabuza were "bad" first, when he met them. Sasuke was "good" first, when he met him. Naruto saw Sasuke falling into darkness. How would you feel if something bad happens to someone important to you? and what if you were there? wouldn't you think at least one time that you could do something? Now, when we think about the other three... They were forgiven for him after hearing their stories and watching them trying to do one last good thing. If Naruto would have know them before falling into darkness, things could be different. 

Regarding making Sakura happy: that was part one. Not anymore. She prefers Naruto to stay safe with her than endangering his life to bring back Sasuke. To which Naruto said that bringing back Sasuke has nothing to do with her and their promise. Sakura has long stop being a factor.

 

Mostly agree, but i still think the promise afect him in some way. "I couldn't keep my promise", "Everytime we have news from Sasuke, i see Sakura-chan sad..."

Yes, he said that. Because at first it was about bringing him back for Sakura and Sasuke himself. He wanted to help him. But now, he understand why he joined Akatsuki and why he's obsessed with revenge. So, it's true, Sakura's promise is on second place, even third. Now is about remembering him their bonds, the importance of friends. It's not that the promise doesn't matter anymore, it's just that he prioritized this reasons.

Actually, I think it should be the other way around. Who should Naruto concern himself more? His friends or the guy trying to hurt his friends? This is not real life, but if I were Naruto I'll prioritize my bond over the friends who care for me rather than someone who is constantly trying to hurt me. Either way, I'm not blaming Naruto for what he's doing. I am just saying that I lose all interest in the NS pairing because well, Sakura is listed among the "others". I just can't bring myself to think that kind of a pairing is attractive where there's no mutual partnership.

 

I really got what you say. Like i said before, i think Kishi should fix this before making NS canon. I will prioritise the persons that i have closer than the ones who are trying to hurt us. But like Naruko said, focusing on Sasuke right now doesn't make his love for Sakura lower.

He has priorities. Picture this: You have 2 friends, one is at your side, the other is walking to a path of thorns. What is more important to focus on? That's the way he see it. (This only explain one aspect)

That's only the positive things you've pointed out. What about the hospital scene where Naruto scolded Sakura "not to get in between their fight" which he didn't say anything to Kakashi? What about Kage summit arc, where Sakura has decided that all she can do is have faith in them and watch them behind the sidelines. What about the rookie meeting where Sakura realized Naruto was hiding something from her. When it comes to Sasuke, Naruto will shut her out and make her believe that there's nothing to do about it even though she's a team seven member as well. Sakura is used as a literary device to emphasize how great Naruto/Sasuke is and their bonds (this is done by showing that she can never fit in, never be as important, and never be as strong as the other two).

It would have been better if she would have just left Naruto and didn't bother with him since he's oh so eager to shut her out. But no, there are endless panels of her showing worry and concern over Naruto while she barely does anything herself. This is why I think NS is dragging down her character.
I hope I explained myself well. Did you understand what I mean?

 

Yeah, those things really bother me. But i have to say something... When it comes to every type relationship, first comes one-one and then, the others. Something like this: You and I are friends. We have 3 more friends. We have a different relationship with everyone of them and no one of has something to do with ther other. Yes, there are times when i need to analise a situation as a group. But with the one-one's relationship only concern us. Even if we ask for advices, the actions only concern us. Sakura don't need to be there when it comes to Naruto-Sasuke relationship. She has her own relationship as a friend with Sasuke (individual) and a second one being part of Team 7(colective). 

The manga is focused on Naruto-Sasuke relationship. When she decided to have faith in them, it was established 2 things: 

1. She's not going to be in the middle of Sasuke and Naruto relationship as one-one bond.                  Good.

2. She acepted that her voice, just like Kakashi's voice can't reach Sasuke, only Naruto's. And this is only about how Sasuke-Sakura bond is not as stronger SS fans thinks it is. This doesn't affect NS relationship. 

Yes, it seems like she's not doing anything. But "doing anything" toward this problem is the best choice. Why? Because that would be humillating her. Sasuke-Sakura relationship, like Kakashi-Sasuke relationship can only solve their problems/ comes to terms after Sasuke-Naruto relationship is solved.

 
 >I feel ya. We int's are always misundestood as being angry when we're not.

 

YES. And this is not only on internet. Even seeing my face, people think i'm being a kitten, lmao.


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#30887 Naruko

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 02:50 AM

 
 SHE IS! ISN'T SHE? i think she's cute, asffdagfa

 

Shhhtooop it.........  :eager:


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#30888 Khaleesi

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 03:01 AM

 

Shhhtooop it.........  :eager:

*pats your head*


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#30889 TyranntX

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 03:10 AM

on another subject, when will road to ninja hit america? (I.E when is the english dub coming?) because I have heared that its coming soon


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#30890 Khaleesi

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 03:13 AM

on another subject, when will road to ninja hit america? (I.E when is the english dub coming?) because I have heared that its coming soon

it's on the cinema already :v


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#30891 Naruko

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 03:13 AM

on another subject, when will road to ninja hit america? (I.E when is the english dub coming?) because I have heared that its coming soon

 

It came already, didn't it? 

 

Btw

aww


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#30892 Liu bie

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 03:16 AM

I like this week's comment:

 

"I love How to Train Your Dragon, so I'm praying that the sequel will be released in Japan!"

Because probably would  inspire Kshimoto?


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#30893 Don-kun

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 03:23 AM

 
Guess Naruto is not much of the politician kind of person. Even admiring him, everyone knows he's a bit dumb and not much the debating kind. He doesn't listen carefully when someone's talking (like Obito and Kaguya), he won't change his mind. What inspires the others on him is not how persuasive he is when talking, it's the way he thinks and acts. His ideals are admirable and he never changes his mind about them and never gives up. That brings hope to people, but it doesn't mean you're a persuasive speaker or born to be leader. If he turns to be the hokage, that will be because he tried very hard since actually, he's not much of a hokage type, as a lot of people said in the manga. He had to try hard to gain people's acknowledgment.  
 
 
What's "not boring" for you? The debating was hot a few pages ago. 

You kind of lost me since I was making a joke at the diferent personality discution.

#30894 questdrivencollie

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 03:40 AM

it's on the cinema already :v

According to Pepsi, the Viz translated sub is what's playing the cinema.

 

I think the sub fans are rejoicing :)))    (As for me, I actually prefer dubs most of the time...<.<)


Edited by questdrivencollie, 02 September 2014 - 03:42 AM.

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#30895 AHK

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 04:10 AM

SHE IS! ISN'T SHE? i think she's cute, asffdagfa

Easy there pal, little known fact, Minato got jealous real quick lol

Minato farewell next chapter?

Edited by AHK, 02 September 2014 - 04:13 AM.

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#30896 Khaleesi

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 04:12 AM

Easy there pal, little known fact, Minato got jealous real quick lol

aww

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

i don't care, she could be your wife, but she's mine (?)


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#30897 TouKen4Life3g

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 04:14 AM

Because probably would  inspire Kshimoto?

At least I was right that he loved the first one.



#30898 ramenanmitsu

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 04:17 AM

@theunburnt
Sorry my hands are full answering Naruko.
Btw I agree. Even in real life ppl think I'm angry when I'm smiling as best as possibly can.

 
Omg, are you writing all those stuff on the phone? What are you?  :argh:

Yeah, it's kind of hard writing on the phone.

Why would be less forgiving? What difference would that make? 

Why is because Sasuke is more important to Naruto than Sakura is. It would make every difference. I'm not saying it's wrong. I'm saying that's just how I see it.

You mean Naruto would accept the hatred and not try to change it? I don't think so. At least that's not what I get from the manga. He is accepting Sasuke completely now because at least until now he hasn't shown any hatred anymore. If he tried to attack the village, things were going to be different. Naruto forgives quickly, that's how he is, not Sakura or Kakashi. If it were Sakura instead of Sasuke, it would be the same thing. Naruto's forgiveness is not biased. 

I guess we'll have to wait and see then. Because I doubt he'll act any different to Sasuke, whatever crimes he'll commit. He might try to change him, but regardless of the change being made or not he'll accept it.

I've also tried to think hard why I hate this bromance so much. I realized It all comes down to one thing. "Evil wins". As long as the hero forgives you, you can do any kitten but still be as important as the hard working good people. If you're evil, the hero will put all his attention on you instead of the one who cares for him. It gives a huge unfairness to the hard working good people. The hate for this philosophy probably has something to do with my childhood, my father and my mother but I shouldn't discuss it here. So I understand if you don't feel the same disgust I feel towards it.
 

I said it's a proof that he still cares about that promise they made, which is right. There's proof that he cares about her in almost every chapter please  :hehehe:

He cares about the promise but that doesn't equate to him caring about her, which is what I'm trying to say. We don't know WHY he cares about it. It might be because he loves her, or it might be his urge to complete his promise.

And the care he shows towards her isn't much different to the "others".
 

Ikr? Try Bahamas next time. It's great too.  :eager:


Thanks for the suggestion :)
 

But she was obviously all right o.O. Remember that chapter when Naruto falls in the water and Hinata worries about him, then Sakura tells her to not worry because it would need much more to hurt him? Pretty much that.... And I still don't see what relation Naruto and Sasuke's rivalry has with the romance subplot. One doesn't disrupt the other. 

No it's different. The former is contempt, the latter is trust.

I edited my previous thread to answer your question so you can check there ;)

Edited by ramenanmitsu, 02 September 2014 - 04:25 AM.

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#30899 Gojira

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 04:22 AM

I like this week's comment:

 

"I love How to Train Your Dragon, so I'm praying that the sequel will be released in Japan!"

Well its not even showing in theatres where i'm at anymore (for a while now actually) hopefully there is a release date set Japan. Its a huge hollywood movie so i'd imagine it gets an international release.

 

Hell the movie is so well known that on vacation Obama took him and his family to behind the scenes of the movie.....because god forbid he actually does something a president would do. 

 

btw I appreciate the response to the question ramen.


Edited by Pepsi, 02 September 2014 - 04:24 AM.

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#30900 questdrivencollie

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 04:23 AM

Btw I agree. Even in real life ppl think I'm angry when I'm smiling as best as possibly can.
 

Wow, me, too. o_o 

My mom: why do you have that angry look?

Me: Huh? I'm not angry, I was just deep in thought o_o;


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