9679 replies to this topic

[Phantom_999]

Well Naruto gets dibs on Sasuke and Madara for sure But Like I said Sakura should definitely kill Kabuto or something to Skyrocket her popularity and actually become a heroine
My 100th post FINALLY

[bthug]

Congrats on the 100th post Phantom_999

Yea I realize sasuke trying to woo her is out of the question it was just something fun to throw out their. The whole scenario I put out their was just for fun.

I also doubt her jumping in the Naruto vs sasuke fight....Maybe she might try something in the beginning and get f**cked up, or Kakashi or Naruto tells her to stay out of it.

[Phantom_999]

Thank you very much bthug and yeah I know it was for fun no way you would think Sasuke likes romantically Sakura unless you are trying to delude yourself

Edited by Phantom_999, 10 May 2011 - 08:00 PM.

[Fliss]

Yeahhhhhhhh I think it's safe to say SasuSaku is dead. I mean, is it really believable that Sakura would ever take him back and fawn over him again after everything that's happened?

[bthug]

Yep now we just have to beware of Naruhina, which to me has that like .1 percent chance, that scares me.

You know what would be a good arc of just a few couple of episodes...If Naruto goes of the deep end ( like he's doubting himself, whether he is right and starts to act or think bad) and it's up to Sakura to bring him back to the light. I have read a little about Dark Naruto, but I feel like it was short lived and so much more could have been done, even focus it around Narusaku, like I mentioned it above, leaving it up to Sakura to bring Naruto back.

[Otaru]

This will never happen.
Dark Naruto is done.

[ciardha]

Yep now we just have to beware of Naruhina, which to me has that like .1 percent chance, that scares me.

Not a chance, never was. Kishimoto was quite annoyed at the naruhina shippers in 2009, enough to publically make irritated comments about their letters to him that trashed Sakura and praised Hinata to the skies. Go reread chapter 3. A narusaku ending was set up right then and there. Hinata is nowhere to be seen, she is a minor support character who Kishimoto even visually let you know she has accepted narusaku happily (chapter 450) and is beginning to move on from her attraction to Naruto (chapter 489) and Naruto has no feelings for Hinata, even after her confession, which did nothing to change his opinion of Hinata to being a "weird, shy girl" (chapter 505) Naruto still loves Sakura and has accepted her confession of love (chapters 470 and how he sees Sakura in his mind- chapter 505)

[bthug]

Not a chance, never was. Kishimoto was quite annoyed at the naruhina shippers in 2009, enough to publically make irritated comments about their letters to him that trashed Sakura and praised Hinata to the skies. Go reread chapter 3. A narusaku ending was set up right then and there. Hinata is nowhere to be seen, she is a minor support character who Kishimoto even visually let you know she has accepted narusaku happily (chapter 450) and is beginning to move on from her attraction to Naruto (chapter 489) and Naruto has no feelings for Hinata, even after her confession, which did nothing to change his opinion of Hinata to being a "weird, shy girl" (chapter 505) Naruto still loves Sakura and has accepted her confession of love (chapters 470 and how he sees Sakura in his mind- chapter 505)

That is very good to hear, now we just have to have faith in Kishi to not have a cliffhanger pairing...I know Dark Naruto is done, but it would have been cool to see something like that (where Sakura has to rescue Naruto), it could still happen but again I highly doubt it.

[Super Boom]

Not a chance, never was. Kishimoto was quite annoyed at the naruhina shippers in 2009, enough to publically make irritated comments about their letters to him that trashed Sakura and praised Hinata to the skies. Go reread chapter 3. A narusaku ending was set up right then and there. Hinata is nowhere to be seen, she is a minor support character who Kishimoto even visually let you know she has accepted narusaku happily (chapter 450) and is beginning to move on from her attraction to Naruto (chapter 489) and Naruto has no feelings for Hinata, even after her confession, which did nothing to change his opinion of Hinata to being a "weird, shy girl" (chapter 505) Naruto still loves Sakura and has accepted her confession of love (chapters 470 and how he sees Sakura in his mind- chapter 505)

Well stated. To me, the only thing that had me worried about a NaruHina ending was the immense fanbase. I mean there's a lot of NaruHina shippers out there considering how few appearances she's had in the manga.

Interestingly enough though, I've heard some NH fans use that fact to their advantage with the Dragonball comparison, and how few appearances Chi-Chi had before marrying Goku. To be fair though, I don't really think any of the heroines in that series were very prominent. Heck, I feel like even Bulma only had major appearances in two arcs. But I haven't read/watched Dragonball in about a decade, so I guess I can't really make a prominent point with that anyway.

[narutouzumaki50]

Speaking of Sakura being able to withstand genjutsu, what if Madara managed to successfully cast his Infinite Tsukuyomi and the whole shinobi world got affected except for Sakura. She then helps Naruto and Sasuke snap out of it. That will prove Sakura to be a very important character. Sakura hasn't done really significant things but if she is able to do this her rank of importance as a character would skyrocket. She does have the potential to do epic things being in Team 7. I hope Kishi not putting Sakura in too much limelight is because he's reserving her to do some great things at the end like what I have suggested.

Wow ur thinkin like me! Except i want her to help naruto instead since sasuke is already a genjutsu user....

[ciardha]

Well stated. To me, the only thing that had me worried about a NaruHina ending was the immense fanbase. I mean there's a lot of NaruHina shippers out there considering how few appearances she's had in the manga.

Interestingly enough though, I've heard some NH fans use that fact to their advantage with the Dragonball comparison, and how few appearances Chi-Chi had before marrying Goku. To be fair though, I don't really think any of the heroines in that series were very prominent. Heck, I feel like even Bulma only had major appearances in two arcs. But I haven't read/watched Dragonball in about a decade, so I guess I can't really make a prominent point with that anyway.

Goku didn't have any feelings for Bulma that way, he was completely naive about romance at that time, his love was food not any girl at all. The Dragonball pairings had nothing to do with any fanbase pressure, it was what the Toriyama decided to do. I don't know of even one manga (and I've been reading manga since 1982) where the fanbase pressured a writer into changing pairings. Manga writers write the pairings they want beginning to end, and editors don't bother the writers about that, other than they tend to encourage writers to get the couples the writer has been developing, together in some permanent (and preferably happy) fashion at the end of the story. They don't impose that on the writer just encourage it.


The only thing fanbases can affect is fan service images (which have nothing to do with the storyline). More popular characters get more fan service. Editors pressure writers of popular series to extend their stories for a longer period than the writer might want to do, and that's only indirectly because of fans, if a fanbase isn't large enough, no matter how passionate that fanbase is, editors will encourage a writer to wrap up a series earlier than they might want. (that happened to Nobuhiro Watsuki with Gun Blaze West in 2001, and Buso Renkin in 2006. The later was popular enough that it was animated- it started out polling well, but faltered over time, until Watsuki was told it was canceled but they allowed him to wrap it up.

You don't have to worry about Naruto coming to an abrupt end any time soon- it's still phenomenally popular not just in Japan but all over the world. Which is why Pierrot keeps making Naruto movies too.

[ShippudenGirl]

Yo, DB is my manga! Lol, Bulma is 4 years older anyone and neither had any sort of attraction to the other. Besides, Goku had epic kids so I was down with him hookin up and getting married, lol! I don't think Kishimoto would pull any romantic elements from DB/DBZ to Naruto, I mean, ya literally only here an "I love you" once in the english dub [ep. 297?] (which was freaking adorable, lol). Anyway, I don't believe Kishimoto's pairing choice won't be influenced by the fans. It's been set.

[The Tax-Man]

Goku didn't have any feelings for Bulma that way, he was completely naive about romance at that time, his love was food not any girl at all. The Dragonball pairings had nothing to do with any fanbase pressure, it was what the Toriyama decided to do. I don't know of even one manga (and I've been reading manga since 1982) where the fanbase pressured a writer into changing pairings. Manga writers write the pairings they want beginning to end, and editors don't bother the writers about that, other than they tend to encourage writers to get the couples the writer has been developing, together in some permanent (and preferably happy) fashion at the end of the story. They don't impose that on the writer just encourage it.


The only thing fanbases can affect is fan service images (which have nothing to do with the storyline). More popular characters get more fan service. Editors pressure writers of popular series to extend their stories for a longer period than the writer might want to do, and that's only indirectly because of fans, if a fanbase isn't large enough, no matter how passionate that fanbase is, editors will encourage a writer to wrap up a series earlier than they might want. (that happened to Nobuhiro Watsuki with Gun Blaze West in 2001, and Buso Renkin in 2006. The later was popular enough that it was animated- it started out polling well, but faltered over time, until Watsuki was told it was canceled but they allowed him to wrap it up.

You don't have to worry about Naruto coming to an abrupt end any time soon- it's still phenomenally popular not just in Japan but all over the world. Which is why Pierrot keeps making Naruto movies too.

You said that fanbases can only affect service. Then you say fanbases can affect the length of the series, which is correct. Uh...

Other than that confusion, ^^^...'nuff said.

[ciardha]

You said that fanbases can only affect service. Then you say fanbases can affect the length of the series, which is correct. Uh...

Other than that confusion, ^^^...'nuff said.

Ah, meaning only the first directly by letters, poll results, etc... Popular characters get fanservice, that's all that comes from that. The later indirectly- if a series doesn't attract enough of a fanbase/loyal readership it can cause a series to get canceled- no matter how passionate that small fanbase is with their letters.

On the other hand if a series has a major fanbase/readership it can cause an editor to pressure a writer to extend a series longer than they planned. Toriyama had that happen with him on Dragonball, Yuu Watase with Fushigi Yuugi (part 2 and the Eikouden cowritten novels came from the series popularity- originally she was going to end it at the end of part 1, and she said her original plan was for Miaka and Tamahome to have the ending she eventually gave to Suzano and Tatara instead.

In this case I think the editor was right, Watase's writing is actually deeper and stronger in part 2 (and I really like part 2's Miaka- she takes more of a mature leadership role the whole way, and Taka is a much nicer and mature minded guy than Tamahome). It also gives the readers a glimpse at how Yuu has matured and now stands up for her best friend the way Miaka did for her in part 1. The editor didn't force her, just pointed out how it might make a better story and it was, the editor let Watase decide how to play the story out- gave her a challenge and she showed she was capable of doing it.

Watsuki stated he was relieved his editor let him end Kenshin while it's popularity was still high, not pressuring him to draw it out until it's popularity dropped. Rumiko Takahashi has never publically stated she was pressured that way, but it kind of shows in her writing for both Ranma 1/2 and Inuyasha. There's a middle period of both series where within the manga volumes not much happens to develop either plot or characters and storyline types repeat rather often with only minor changes. Then suddenly in the last three or so volumes of both series the storyline and character development returns with a vengeance. Her current series Rinne, hasn't been as popular, although popular enough to still be one of the lead stories in Shonen Sunday, so maybe her editor won't push her to draw this one out. I haven't heard of any anime company signing on to animate it so far, as well. I know I've read it and while it's an entertaining read, it doesn't draw me in like Ranma, Inuyasha, Maison Ikkoku, her Mermaid Trilogy, etc... did.

Edited by ciardha, 11 May 2011 - 05:59 AM.

[Jenskott]

I don't know of even one manga (and I've been reading manga since 1982) where the fanbase pressured a writer into changing pairings.

It is true it is uncommon.

Nonetheless, I have heard Takahashi's editor forced her to change the official couple when she was writing Urusei Yatsura. Ataru and Shinobu were supposed to be the official couple and Lum the spoiler mucked things up. You know if that is true?

Other than it... Yes. Usually fan pressure affects the length and the fanservice of a manga. And nothing more.

And it is because that some mangas are artificially stretched out and the story doesn't finish when it should.

Interestingly enough though, I've heard some NH fans use that fact to their advantage with the Dragonball comparison, and how few appearances Chi-Chi had before marrying Goku. To be fair though, I don't really think any of the heroines in that series were very prominent. Heck, I feel like even Bulma only had major appearances in two arcs. But I haven't read/watched Dragonball in about a decade, so I guess I can't really make a prominent point with that anyway.

The DragonBall comparision doesn't hold water. Toriyama never developed a Goku/Bulma romantic relationship, so he could pair Goku up with whoever. Kishimoto has shown his main character falling in love with one girl and ignoring another even after she confessed her feelings.

And I have a hard time believing NH fans want NH follows the Bulma/Goku steps. So they want never seeing a romantic development between them before and after the marriage? And Naruto weds Hinata out of duty or obligation and not out of love?

Toriyama did the couples he wanted, not the ones the fandom wanted.

[ciardha]

It is true it is uncommon.

Nonetheless, I have heard Takahashi's editor forced her to change the official couple when she was writing Urusei Yatsura. Ataru and Shinobu were supposed to be the official couple and Lum the spoiler mucked things up. You know if that is true?

Haven't heard that story, but Takahashi is far more closed mouthed than most mangaka. Even in her interviews when talking about past manga series of hers, she doesn't say much. She revealed more during Inuyasha's run than any of her other series, but even then it wasn't anything like most other mangaka both older and younger do.

UY is kind of disjointed compared to her other multi volume series though, and if she was pressured that might explain why she basically left Ataru pretty much unchanged as the pervy, greedy, unlikeable character he starts the series as. In her other series- even comedies like Ranma, we see character development with Ranma and Akane. Shinobu is basically the early shonen tsundere type that in that genre that the guy's attraction to her becomes the catalyst for his becoming a better, maturer person. Lum is a mix of squealing fangirl, tsundere, and sexy fan service female in one to Ataru.

Maybe Takahashi had a pervy editor that liked lot of fan service. Shinobu was a farly normal girl, that Takahashi didn't really do fan service on. There's the point- if you look at it from another direction, that Shinobu is way too good and positive for a guy as bad as Ataru. Takahashi might have subtly been making that point- why should a nice, intelligent girl have to deal with a boy as awful as Ataru. Shinobu makes a foolish choice at first, but then moves on. Hmm, would be nice to know if that's what Takahashi might have been doing.

Edited by ciardha, 11 May 2011 - 08:06 AM.

[Jenskott]

Haven't heard that story, but Takahashi is far more closed mouthed than most mangaka. Even in her interviews when talking about past manga series of hers, she doesn't say much. She revealed more during Inuyasha's run than any of her other series, but even then it wasn't anything like most other mangaka both older and younger do.

UY is kind of disjointed compared to her other multi volume series though, and if she was pressured that might explain why she basically left Ataru pretty much unchanged as the pervy, greedy, unlikeable character he starts the series as. In her other series- even comedies like Ranma, we see character development with Ranma and Akane. Shinobu is basically the early shonen tsundere type that in that genre that the guy's attraction to her becomes the catalyst for his becoming a better, maturer person. Lum is a mix of squealing fangirl, tsundere, and sexy fan service female in one to Ataru.

Maybe Takahashi had a pervy editor that liked lot of fan service. Shinobu was a farly normal girl, that Takahashi didn't really do fan service on. There's the point- if you look at it from another direction, that Shinobu is way too good and positive for a guy as bad as Ataru. Takahashi might have subtly been making that point- why should a nice, intelligent girl have to deal with a boy as awful as Ataru. Shinobu makes a foolish choice at first, but then moves on. Hmm, would be nice to know if that's what Takahashi might have been doing.

This is going slightly off-topic, so that I will put my reply on spoilers:

Regarding Urusei Yatsura --Click here to view--

Well, keep in mind I read that in TVTropes.org, so I take that tidbit with a grain of salt until I find a more reliable source. However it would explain why Ataru/Lum never felt like the official couple to me.

I read UY several years after reading Ranma 1/2. Personally I found that series funnier, and the story didn't feel like if the author was artificially stretching it out. Maybe it is because I read the deluxe volumes (thus reading more issues in one go) instead of reading the tankobon. However it didn't felt like if Takahashi was constantly repeating the same jokes and stories (for example, the "Kurama must bear Ataru's children because he woke her up and she is trying turning him into a semi-decent person" and the "Ran wants taking revenge on Lum by turning Ataru into a mentally old man" arcs stopped after a while. Takahashi used them for laughs for several chapters, then she tied those subplots in a definitive fashion, and stopped using those characters for a while. Thus, when they showed up again, the situation was new and the jokes were slightly different), and the pace was quicker.

I still preffer Ranma 1/2, though.

I didn't find Ataru so unlikable, though. True, he was mostly an idiot pervert, but sometimes he was given good traits and Takahashi showed us his softer side (often he clearly stated he would never hit a girl, once he dated a ghost little girl because Sakura talked him into it, but he went on because he didn't want hurting the feelings of that little girl), and at the end of the series he realizes getting himself a harem is an idiotic idea and he doesn't want it anyway if it meants losing Lum...

But yes, he was mostly a lazy, stupid pervert with some redeemable traits. Maybe if Takahashi would have sticked with Ataru and Shinobu he would have evolved into a better character (he wasn't so pervert at the beginning, let's think of it...)

And yes, sometimes you had to wonder just why Shinobu would want putting with his antics and why Lum DID. All in all, Shinobu ended up with a nice boy whereas Lum got stuck with Ataru (enough interesting, UY fics keep the Ataru/Lum couple, buy they use to stick Shinobu with Shutaro, in spite of she lose interest on him halfway in the series after realizing he was just like Ataru)

I am not sure if Takahashi ever completely gave up on her Ataru/Shinobu plans, though. Other than Ataru was more fixated on Shinobu than on the remainder girls he chased and lusted after, in one of the last arcs, Ataru, Lum and Shinobu travel to several alternate worlds and Shinobu found she and Ataru were married and parents in one of the worlds. And she was shocked, but no horrified, unlike Lum who found out her self was married with Rei, and her chidlhood "friend" Ran resented her.

Now, trying reconduct the topic back to NS... No, NH has no one chance. And we will never see Sasuke wooing Sakura. He never showed interest on her when he was somehwat sane, why would he do now he is utterly mad?

[Darth Krypt]

Now, trying reconduct the topic back to NS... No, NH has no one chance. And we will never see Sasuke wooing Sakura. He never showed interest on her when he was somehwat sane, why would he do now he is utterly mad?

Maybe because he's mad he'll do crazy things. Like wooing Sakura. He'll be like, "Sakura, you use to like me right?? Come, help me and I'll let you be my girl!" Crazy people go out of character especially when they are losing and starting to be desperate. Like Kira in Death note. Well I said all this but I don't think it'll happen anyway.

[Kuraudo]

What do you think how will Sakura respond when she sees Naruto for a long time? And when will it be?

Edited by Kuraudo, 11 May 2011 - 02:07 PM.

[Gravenimage]

What do you think how will Sakura respond when she sees Naruto for a long time? And when will it be?

Well first she will get angry and hit him, remember that Naruto wasn't supposed to get involve in the war. After that she will be happy and then she will hug similar to the hug from 450.