4869 replies to this topic

[ciardha]

ehh Ciardha, you are pretty much doing the same thing the SS/NH shippers are doing, which is to twist Kishi's words to fit your pairing.

He was vague about the pairings; he didn't reveal who Sakura loves more. He said Naruto is close, but still she...for Sasuke. Which essentially means, Sakura still has issues with her emotions towards Sasuke, but Naruto is also close to her heart. The last thing I want to see is NS fans going around flaunting a review that revealed very little about the pairings >.>;

You notice I put interpretations in parenthesis didn't you? Then explained why that interpretation made more sense-

1) It fits with what else Kishimoto says about how he was writing Sakura as in that scene- "An honest and surprisingly determined girl" and that he thought he was writing her as heroic.

2) it fits with what you see in the manga as well if you aren't automatically biased against Sakura. (Something Kishimoto was annoyed enough from some readers letters to make commentary on, and as a result will make Sakura even more overtly heroic in her actions and even moreso the central heroine- that she already was- of the story.)

[fireandice]

@ciardha

I agree, about the whole Sakura loving Sasuke thing, fans are too quick to jump on Kishimoto supposedly saying that she does really love Sasuke.

Now, even if that's EXACTLY what he said, shouldn't it be obvious this doesn't mean she doesn't have feelings for Naruto? What Kishi was clarifying was that Sakura's choice to kill Sasuke was actually because not that she hated him, but she loved him enough to want to stop him from continuing such a destructive existence. And I think what she said after her confession was even more telling "Of course I'd come all the way here, you're always thinking about Sasuke and putting yourself in danger! I just want you to come back to Konoha with me!" <--- Sure, she loves Sasuke more than Naruto (Not.)

And, IMO, naturally Kishimoto wouldn't want to reveal spoilers integral to the story in the fanbook, hence I see no reason why we can assume that well, oh "Sakura still loves Sasuke!!! That means at the end of Naruto she'll end up wif Sasuke n they'll revive teh Uchiha clan n it'll be Naruhina yay!"

Personally, I feel Naruhina fans who were rather sanctimoniously bashing Sakura for "lying" to Naruto (which they did after that mistranslated statement about Sakura loving Sasuke came out) were just infuriated at the possibility that Sakura scuttled Hinata's chances. It annoyed me, as with the double standards about how Sakura "didn't do anything for Naruto" whereas Hinata "sacrificed her life for him" (in a rather massively unhelpful move, considering had Minato not been there, thing's would've been alot worse with the Nine-tails loose and out for revenge ). Some of these people were earlier bashing Sakura for being "full of fail" because she got kicked by the Cloud nin -___- (she can't do anything right for them...)

Kishimoto's purposely been keeping whether Sakura and Naruto will end up together not entirely clear cut, while slowly but surely developing it. For instance, he had Yamato get cut off when he was about to talk abt Sakura's feelings when he went four-tails.

Edited by fireandice, 03 January 2010 - 03:44 PM.

[Gravenimage]

You notice I put interpretations in parenthesis didn't you? Then explained why that interpretation made more sense-

1) It fits with what else Kishimoto says about how he was writing Sakura as in that scene- "An honest and surprisingly determined girl" and that he thought he was writing her as heroic.

2) it fits with what you see in the manga as well if you aren't automatically biased against Sakura. (Something Kishimoto was annoyed enough from some readers letters to make commentary on, and as a result will make Sakura even more overtly heroic in her actions and even moreso the central heroine- that she already was- of the story.)

You're awesome at analyzing the manga and Kishi's words you're probably one of the best Naru/Saku analyst I've seen.

[ciardha]

You're awesome at analyzing the manga and Kishi's words you're probably one of the best Naru/Saku analyst I've seen.

Mizura's much better than me. Read her famous narusaku manifesto.

[Cupcake-chan]

Personally, I feel Naruhina fans who were rather sanctimoniously bashing Sakura for "lying" to Naruto (which they did after that mistranslated statement about Sakura loving Sasuke came out) were just infuriated at the possibility that Sakura scuttled Hinata's chances. It annoyed me, as with the double standards about how Sakura "didn't do anything for Naruto" whereas Hinata "sacrificed her life for him" (in a rather massively unhelpful move, considering had Minato not been there, thing's would've been alot worse with the Nine-tails loose and out for revenge ). Some of these people were earlier bashing Sakura for being "full of fail" because she got kicked by the Cloud nin -___- (she can't do anything right for them...)

Okay, so here is the thing: I'm a NS fan and to me it also seemed and looked like Sakura was lying. She couldn't even look Naruto in the eye when she was confessing, and then when he accused her of lying she snapped. And even if she hadn't been lying, she shouldn't have used Naruto's feeling to manipulate him into getting what she wanted, even if it benefits Naruto as well. What kind of friend would do that? A really bad one.
Sakura is actually one of my favorite characters, and when she was confessing, it just made me so angry, because she confessed out of the blue. And she also should know that Naruto doesn't go back on his word, so she wouldn't be able to convince him to stop searching for Sasuke.
Basically, what I'm trying to say is that she should have said the truth to Naruto, and maybe, he wouldn't get too mad at her. But she ruined everything by confessing, and in the end... Sai's the one who tells the truth and then Naruto passes out.
And when's Naruto gonna act like a man? I mean, first he beggs then he cries and then passes out? I mean... his... actions are really getting on my nerves.

[ciardha]

Okay, so here is the thing: I'm a NS fan and to me it also seemed and looked like Sakura was lying. She couldn't even look Naruto in the eye when she was confessing, and then when he accused her of lying she snapped. And even if she hadn't been lying, she shouldn't have used Naruto's feeling to manipulate him into getting what she wanted, even if it benefits Naruto as well. What kind of friend would do that? A really bad one.

Cupcake, you read it wrong. Kishimoto himself points out that reading was a serious misreading in the Jump Festa 2009 interview. I do have to question why you keep using rabid naruhina shipper talking points in these debates even when those arguments are refuted by the manga and Kishimoto himself.

The not looking in the eye thing is bs too, look at every confession in Naruto, other than Rock Lee's to Sakura not one looked the other person in their face while making the confession. Hinata has her back turned to Naruto, Rin is partly looking away from Kakashi, Sakura is looking at Sasuke's back, Dan's subtle confession to Tsunade he's looking off into the distance, When Naruto reveals his for Sakura to Sai he is looking at Sakura's back, Jiraiya and Tsunade's mutual almost confessions neither one looks each other directly in the eyes and in fact Tsunade's face position and eye direction is almost exactly like Sakura's when she confesses to Naruto. Sakura's anger about Naruto accusing her of deluding herself (not consciously lying, cupcake) and strongly reiterating her feelings for Naruto shows those feelings are real. Again I point out to you what Kishimoto said was his intention with that scene- to show Sakura as heroic and a "honest and surprisingly determined girl"

She wasn't "manipulating Naruto into getting what she wanted" go read 474, and look how Naruto explodes when he finds out about his friends vote to kill Sasuke. Sakura guessed he might react that way and would never consent to a death sentence for Sasuke. She chose to act in a way that she hoped would protect Naruto- confess her real feelings of love, convince him to stop chasing after Sasuke because chasing after Sasuke (as Shikamaru said to her) would just lead to Naruto getting killed by Sasuke. She wanted to protect Naruto as well from the trauma of finding out straight out about the vote. She hoped to take on the burden herself, even if Naruto hated her for that. She believed he might. But she loves him and believes with all her heart in his dream of becoming Hokage. Sakura is willing to do anything to insure Naruto lives and does become Hokage. This is what Kishimoto meant by saying he wrote Sakura as heroic in that scene. The total opposite of how you read it. Sai's words about Sakura reforce the heroic self-sacrificing reading. Kakashi's too.

[Miss Soupy]

Okay, so here is the thing: I'm a NS fan and to me it also seemed and looked like Sakura was lying. She couldn't even look Naruto in the eye when she was confessing, and then when he accused her of lying she snapped. And even if she hadn't been lying, she shouldn't have used Naruto's feeling to manipulate him into getting what she wanted, even if it benefits Naruto as well. What kind of friend would do that? A really bad one.

If a friend was planning to do something that might end in their death, you would surely do whatever you could to stop them, even if it included appealing to their emotions. Sakura honestly believed Naruto was in danger by chasing Sasuke so she decided to do whatever she could to protect him and remove the burdens she placed upon him.

Sakura is actually one of my favorite characters, and when she was confessing, it just made me so angry, because she confessed out of the blue. And she also should know that Naruto doesn't go back on his word, so she wouldn't be able to convince him to stop searching for Sasuke.
Basically, what I'm trying to say is that she should have said the truth to Naruto, and maybe, he wouldn't get too mad at her. But she ruined everything by confessing, and in the end... Sai's the one who tells the truth and then Naruto passes out.
And when's Naruto gonna act like a man? I mean, first he beggs then he cries and then passes out? I mean... his... actions are really getting on my nerves.

I have to agree, it does seem like Kishimoto meant to cause the reader to doubt Sakura's words. If he had meant Sakura to look completely truthful, he could have done a much more heartwarming scene. But that wasn't how he wanted things to go. He made most of the characters skeptical, including Naruto. Sakura is shown to either be a liar or misunderstood. However, the confession was a multi-level thing. Not only was Sakura trying to protect Naruto, remove the promise of a lifetime, she was also trying to hide the true purpose of the rookies, hide her own path she knew she might have to take, hide her true emotions towards Sasuke, and try to sound like a convincing girl in love.

Sakura, honestly, wasn't at the point where she could just take Naruto home with her and be with him. However, she was willing to try because she cares about Naruto that much. It is complicated; in a way she is using Naruto's emotions for her, but she is doing so for a good reason. I can't really see reason to condemn her for this, however she could have done much better. Both Naruto and Sakura have problems being truthful towards one another. I think this is something they will be able to overcome, however, and by highlighting their issues they will grow as teammates and, perhaps, grow as a couple.

@SS3 Goku
Try being more polite to a fellow NS shipper. Calling them a bandwagon jumper because they show doubt isn't exactly making our fandom look very good.

Edited by Miss Soupy, 03 January 2010 - 06:36 PM.

[Miss Soupy]

Whats weird hear is everyone seemes to ignore sakura has had growing feeling for naruto evan sai can see them But you people choose to ignore them

Who is ignoring that? Where did I say Sakura doesn't have growing feelings for Naruto?

[ciardha]

Whats weird hear is everyone seemes to ignore sakura has had growing feeling for naruto evan sai can see them But you people choose to ignore them

No, I don't think Miss Soupy is ignoring that, she may not interpret Sakura to be as deeply in love with Naruto as I do, but she does agree at least that Sakura does care deeply for Naruto and her motive was to protect Naruto. Cupcake chan is the only one I've seen doubt that seriously in the past few pages. So yeah I have some questions about Cupcake chan's reading of Sakura's character when the manga and Kishimoto himself refuted those rabid naruhina talking points. Why continue to misread something when the author himself says it's a misreading.

One only has to look at Naruto's reaction in 474 to see how close Sakura was on how Naruto would react, he rages, hyperventilates, frozen within himself in shock and then passes out.

Edited by ciardha, 03 January 2010 - 07:01 PM.

[ciardha]

ok i can agree with this but you cant ignore sakura has mor than friend feelings for naruto and they are on parr of sasuke or higher

Oh definitely higher- that's right in the manga. Sakura says in 469 she no longer loves Sasuke at all and her heart is now fully in love with Naruto, she strongly stands up for being fully in love with Naruto in 470, and Sai reinforces this in 474 when he says Sakura has moved on from Sasuke and now is in love with Naruto. The only thing Sakura is in denial about is intellectually she's completely moved on from Sasuke, but in her heart is some remnant of her feelings for Sasuke as she saw him when they were Team 7, but even in her heart she knows he'll never be that person again, he's willingly chosen the most dark path and has no desire to do anything but continue on that path.

[RedDelicious]

What Kishi was clarifying was that Sakura's choice to kill Sasuke was actually because not that she hated him, but she loved him enough to want to stop him from continuing such a destructive existence.

Good point. When (almost) all of Konoha wanted Pein/Nagato dead, and were flabbergasted that Naruto wanted to talk to him, that doesn't mean that everyone loved Nagato.

[Miss Soupy]

hear
you make it sound like she is hartless sakura didint have to say anything about narutos feelings

hide her true emotions towards Sasuke, and try to sound like a convincing girl in love.

It is complicated; in a way she is using Naruto's emotions for her, but she is doing so for a good reason.

My point is that Sakura doesn't know who she loves yet. That is my interpretation of the manga. She loves Naruto a lot, but she also hasn't dealt with her feelings for Sasuke. However, she told Naruto she didn't care about Sasuke anymore. That was a lie, so she was hiding her true emotions. She also thought Naruto might choose to go with her back to Konoha. We don't know if she expected much from this thought or not, but you would think she would know Naruto enough to realize he wasn't going to give up on Sasuke. She tried to appeal to Naruto's emotions by doing a confession. However, she only confessed because she knew Naruto was in love with her. It is a form of manipulation, like Cupcake-chan says. But, I am able to forgive Sakura because she is doing it out of love for Naruto. It was risky, and could end up with Naruto disliking her (as Sai said, she was willing to take on his hatred), but in order to protect Naruto, it was worth it. That speaks of true love to me, but I don't believe Sakura realizes it. I would be pleasantly surprised, however, if it turns out she does realize how she feels.

Cupcake-chan is right to have doubts, especially with how confusing the issue was. I don't think it's right to call him/her less of a NS fan because of it. It is not just a 'rabid NH/SS fan interpretation'. Many NS fans have issue with the recent scenes too. Try to be more understanding of other interpretations. I definitely don't agree with every post I see here, even if we are all NS fans. That doesn't make anyone less of a fan because we differ in opinion.

[Miss Soupy]

Than we have to very diffrint opinions sakura said no more mistakes and here lieing would be another and minipulation maby not not strong but she is chooseing naruto over sasuke in my book that naruto is caird for more than sasuke is all the proff i need

Sakura's resolution of 'no more misakes' ties in with her decision to eliminate burdens from Naruto. In this, she succeeded for she did remove the POAL. However, this doesn't mean she cannot overcompensate for something. She focused on her decision to remove burdens, but at the same time she ended up being dishonest. Where she was able to protect Naruto, she lost some of her honesty and some of Naruto's trust.

Of course, she will eventually fix things, but as it is right now, Naruto cannot turn to her because they are working and thinking separately.

Naruto needs to regroup and focus on what his true goals are to be. Sakura needs to deal with her remaining feelings for Sasuke.

[Cloud]

I jest dont like it when people say sakura is jest useing narutos feelings for her benifit when the manga and like you said she is moveing on from sasuke from like SS NH

Nobody is saying that. People are debating. Let the adults talk and correct your spelling or something before accusing somebody of saying Sakura's manipulating Naruto's feelings.

Kthanks.