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The NEW NaruSaku Debate Thread


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#28641 Khaleesi

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 01:30 AM

Evidence suggests that he didn't ever explain the difference between Naruto and Kurama, the only thing he did was make the law. That is supported by that guy that Iruka saved Naruto from at the beginning of the series. Do you remember what he said to Naruto? He said "You ARE the Nine Tailed Fox" not "you are his container". This falls in line with how the villagers treated Naruto.

When it came to down to it, in regards to Naruto, he failed miserably. He failed Minato as well. Hashirama would never have stood for how Naruto was treated, seeing as how his wife was the jinchuriki, you can be damn sure that Minato would not have stood for it, and Tsunade didn't stand for it at all, which she proved time and time again.

No, honey. Hiruzen could say "the kyuubi is selled on Naruto, Naruto is Minato's son, he's not the Kyuubi. But for the new generation i don't want them to treat him like kitten. I know how the Jinchurikis are treated. So, better the new generation don't know about it."

But that woulden't make that generation stop hating him or look down on him. That's not how it works. Jinchirukis are viewed with the same eyes everywhere. You are puting to much hope on humans' understating.


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#28642 Naruko

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 01:36 AM

Is anyone else wondering if Kishimoto already confirmed NaruSaku? Kushina said to find a girl like her mother, right? There's no denying Sakura and Kushina are alot alike. Then, we had Minato confirm that Sakura was like Kushina. There has to be something behind this! In a way, NaruSaku IS confirmed. If you ask me, this is one of the biggest pieces of development they've had. I may be wrong (which I'm not), but why even have Naruto's own father confirm NaruSaku if NH/SS would end up happening? Anyone else agree?

 

All I have to say is: if you don't wan't to be lynched, don't say that to any NH/SS crazy fan.

 

Kishimoto hasn't confirmed it yet, though he built up a better development for that couple, what means it has a bigger chance of happening than any other. 


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#28643 Swagkura

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 01:39 AM

Is anyone else wondering if Kishimoto already confirmed NaruSaku? Kushina said to find a girl like her mother, right? There's no denying Sakura and Kushina are alot alike. Then, we had Minato confirm that Sakura was like Kushina. There has to be something behind this! In a way, NaruSaku IS confirmed. If you ask me, this is one of the biggest pieces of development they've had. I may be wrong (which I'm not), but why even have Naruto's own father confirm NaruSaku if NH/SS would end up happening? Anyone else agree?

Their practically on the edge of becoming canon, won't be too long now before the big moment :smug:
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#28644 Sedna

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 01:47 AM

Their practically on the edge of becoming canon, won't be too long now before the big moment :smug:


We might even get a steamy bedroom scene! *drool*
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#28645 Kyaerai

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 02:06 AM

Ew...
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#28646 Gojira

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 02:11 AM

BZ has Kishi's personality.Trolling!I'm sure his favourite character is BZ.

His favorite characters are apparently Chouji and Killer B


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#28647 Sedna

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 02:15 AM

Ew...


I bet half of the members would love a bedroom scene ;)
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#28648 ns.Believe.It

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 02:33 AM

Minato's wish, as stated previously, was that Naruto be regarded as a hero, not in the future way down the line for beating pain and doing all the stuff that he did now, but as a child simply for being the Jinchuriki and living with a burden that was forced upon him. Sure, Hiruzen can't control the thoughts and emotions of those around the Leaf, but at the very least, he could have explained to the village the difference between the prisoner and the jailor. Had he at least taken the time to explain that difference, and that Naruto was not Kurama, then perhaps the villagers would not have treated him he same. Sure, they may have been wary, but with their knowledge of Naruto, coupled with the wishes of Minato, they might not have treated Naruto like the dirt at their feet. Furthermore, they would definitely not have passed their misguided sense of hate to their children, and Naruto might have at least had one friend growing up. The secrecy law that was passed by Hiruzen only added to the effect of suspicion towards Naruto being the Nine tails.

You don't get it, do you? If there is something that threatens the lives of people and you say to people 'Don't worry. Its safe' even though that something is considered dangerous, people aren't gonna listen to you even if you are the President of that country. If there is a bomb ticking away and you say to people 'Don't worry, this bomb is not that powerful and there are still 30 minutes before it goes out. So chill' people aren't gonna relax! They'll run away as far as possible from that place because they consider their lives and safety more important. That is human nature.

Jinchurikis were feared by everyone because they were like a ticking bomb. It wouldn't have mattered if Hiruzen had declared Naruto as safe and ask people to consider Naruto a hero. They wouldn't have done so. Treating Jinchurikis like normal people had become almost taboo-like in the ninja world. One person's opinion would not have changed this!

 

One more thing. Hiruzen could never have made public announcements about Naruto being the Jinchuriki. Were you even serious when you brought this argument?! Jinchuriki Kushina about to give birth was itself kept a secret because the seal would be weaker when giving birth and if this information was known to all, Kushina and the village could be in danger. It was Hiruzen's duty to protect Naruto after his parents died. For Naruto's protection he wasn't even named Namikaze but Uzumaki instead so that people wouldn't know he was the son of the Fourth Hokage and Minato's enemies wouldn't come after Naruto. If Hiruzen had made loud proclamations that Naruto was the son of the Fourth Hokage and a Jinchuriki, baby Naruto and Konoha would have been in constant danger from enemies. Naruto couldn't have protected himself because he was a baby. Hiruzen only wanted to protect Naruto and keep the village safe. 


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#28649 Atheck

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 03:16 AM

It's hard to believe people are STILL calling her useless.

 

What criterion is it that they use to support their argument of Sakura's actions having no impact on the story? They need to stop to think on what would have became of Naruto and the outcome of this fight if there was a lack of participation on her end. Naruto's ailing body - by itself - wasn't going to endure long enough without oxygen if Sakura never involved herself with her medical expertise. Who do they think was capable of taking over Sakura's role during that bleak ordeal? Tsunade? Shizune? Some anonymous medic who happened to be amongst the crowd of fodder? Tsunade and Shizune were both out of chakra, moreover, for such a delicate procedure, they would have needed someone with the diligence, training, and personal conviction to keep Naruto's heart pumping. I'm not implying that the various other medics on the battlefield were somehow incompetent, but for something this delicate, in a combat situation where the Alliance needed every available man they could muster to help against Spiral Zetsu, the only one that could be spared to help Naruto was Sakura.

 

In a scenario like this one where the medical personnel has such a close relationship with their patient, it helped strengthen their determination to keep him stable long enough to be resuscitated. And before anyone brings up Hinata's "heartfelt" desire to be beside Naruto in his time of need - all while leaving her own team to fend for themselves, one should add -  there wasn't much that she would be able to do besides act as moral support. Contrary to what Studio Pierrot might have underhandedly revised about Hinata's character in order to try and paint her as this dark horse medic who's been secretly learning enough about healing techniques to rival Tsunade's disciple (oh, and the only other person that has been shown to have been taken under the wing of the Slug Princess is Shizune, sorry Ino), Hinata has never been shown to have any knowledge or capability in the field of restoration. Offering some ointment for a few minor cuts and pulling a shoulder back into joint is not the equivalent to what Sakura and Tsunade's profession entails. Hell! Kakashi seems to have a better understanding of medical techniques when he showed that he could surgically close a wound in his stomach. 

 

The significance of Sakura's presence in the Kaguya fight should be self-explanatory. With the possible exception of Hashirama, there is no one else in the Alliance with reserves of chakra large enough to create portals in Kaguya's dimensional worlds. Who do they think could have replaced "usless" Sakura with in that particular instance? It would need to be someone who not only has the reserves to help sustain a Space-Time portal to a faraway dimension, but the exactness and accuracy of control so there isn't any excess chakra wasted that could be preserved for additional prolonged attempts. You're not going to find anyone like that from the Rookies or the various other shinobi from other nations. Tsunade was the only other shinobi who's shown to be capable of transferring chakra, unless you include Onoki transferring his jutsu powers to his bodyguards and Raikage (though he probably lacks the chakra reserves necessary to create and/or sustain Obito's portal anyway)

 

At this point, Sakura is a chakra monster. There are only a handful of characters that can match her stamina now. Anyone else would have been ill-suited to attempt the rescue mission. Furthermore, her strength is almost unmatched. She manages to land a punch on Kaguya's horn and it's still only just powerful enough to force her back down in front of Naruto and Sasuke - that's a testament to Kaguya's resilience. Few others have the kind of momentum behind their techniques to accomplish what Sakura did. 

 

I would say that Sakura has done plenty to distinguish herself from the common soldier. It may not be as glamorous or substantial as her teammates' roles, but she's made herself into an exemplary figure of the Alliance using her power alone. 


Edited by Atheck, 23 August 2014 - 03:45 AM.


#28650 merryGOflava

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 03:38 AM

(don't know if this has been said yet but)

 

Okay! guys! You know how Kishi has been drawing Sakura's hair in her face lately!?

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what  if he's doing this so Naruto can push her hair to the side! *_* and make it like the older version of herself!

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#28651 Sedna

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 03:41 AM

(don't know if this has been said yet but)
 
Okay! guys! You know how Kishi has been drawing Sakura's hair in her face lately!?
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what  if he's doing this so Naruto can push her hair to the side! *_* and make it like the older version of herself!
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Never thought of that.
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#28652 Nate River

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 04:02 AM

This is just wrong. Hiruzen had the power but he couldn't prevent Naruto from being psychologically tortured? Naruto's greatest pain was that he wasn't treated like a human but more like a pest by the people of Konoha. It may be true that Hiruzen was the most powerful person in Konoha but that doesn't mean he had the power to control how every person in the village felt about Naruto. Hiruzen was not a dictator to force people to alter their emotions!  It was Miinato's wish that the truth about Naruto should be kept a secret. Minato was trying to protect his son and Hiruzen was just doing what Minato wanted. 
 
Hiruzen always tried his most to help Naruto and ease Naruto's pain of loneliness. Even though Naruto, as a kid ,was an obnoxious prankster, Hiruzen never punished him but instead understood why Naruto acted so. Hiruzen gave Naruto the chance to become a ninja to prove himself. He convinced Iruka, who had suffered similar pain as as a boy, to look after Naruto. Iruka has been one of the most important people in Naruto's life. Hiruzen then appointed Kakashi to mentor Naruto. Naruto became a ninja with a strong will of fire partly due to Hiruzen's efforts and this helped Naruto form newer bonds with Team Seven which eased his loneliness.
 
Hiruzen has done his best to help Naruto and this is why he is one of the people that Naruto respects the most.


I'm relunctant to dump on him over this because its just a giant hole in Naruto's back story. The same could be said of Kakashi (who was Minato's student), Asuma, or any other adult ninja. Mizuki was the only ninja truly bothered by it. None of them did anything and Naruto nevers asks about it.

The offenders are mostly unidentified villagers. It's really a giant dodge.

#28653 AHK

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 04:46 AM

No, honey. Hiruzen could say "the kyuubi is selled on Naruto, Naruto is Minato's son, he's not the Kyuubi. But for the new generation i don't want them to treat him like kitten. I know how the Jinchurikis are treated. So, better the new generation don't know about it."

But that woulden't make that generation stop hating him or look down on him. That's not how it works. Jinchirukis are viewed with the same eyes everywhere. You are puting to much hope on humans' understating.

 

The current generation might not like him, but at the same time if he had explained to him the difference between the Jinchuriki and the beast, they could have realized that Naruto was preventing the outbreak of Kurama. In this way, they could consider him a hero, and hate the beast inside him. They may have still hated the beast, but with the understanding of his burden, they might not have passed down their propensity to ostracize Naruto to their children.

You don't get it, do you? If there is something that threatens the lives of people and you say to people 'Don't worry. Its safe' even though that something is considered dangerous, people aren't gonna listen to you even if you are the President of that country. If there is a bomb ticking away and you say to people 'Don't worry, this bomb is not that powerful and there are still 30 minutes before it goes out. So chill' people aren't gonna relax! They'll run away as far as possible from that place because they consider their lives and safety more important. That is human nature.

Jinchurikis were feared by everyone because they were like a ticking bomb. It wouldn't have mattered if Hiruzen had declared Naruto as safe and ask people to consider Naruto a hero. They wouldn't have done so. Treating Jinchurikis like normal people had become almost taboo-like in the ninja world. One person's opinion would not have changed this!

 

One more thing. Hiruzen could never have made public announcements about Naruto being the Jinchuriki. Were you even serious when you brought this argument?! Jinchuriki Kushina about to give birth was itself kept a secret because the seal would be weaker when giving birth and if this information was known to all, Kushina and the village could be in danger. It was Hiruzen's duty to protect Naruto after his parents died. For Naruto's protection he wasn't even named Namikaze but Uzumaki instead so that people wouldn't know he was the son of the Fourth Hokage and Minato's enemies wouldn't come after Naruto. If Hiruzen had made loud proclamations that Naruto was the son of the Fourth Hokage and a Jinchuriki, baby Naruto and Konoha would have been in constant danger from enemies. Naruto couldn't have protected himself because he was a baby. Hiruzen only wanted to protect Naruto and keep the village safe. 

Treating Jinchuriki normal did not just become taboo, it was always a practice to treat them like animals. Why? Lack of understanding. Your example is the best way to consider this. You spoke of a time bomb, Naruto was not a time bomb, especially as a child. He was completely different. He was a jailer to a prisoner. Just because a prisoner has committed a crime, it does not mean that the ones that guard him are guilty by association. Had Hiruzen had the foresight to explain this, Naruto might not have been ostracized.

 

Also, yes I was serious. Considering that the entire Leaf knew that he was the Jinchuriki right from the start anyway, not including the next generation. He didn't have to bring up the 4th or Naruto's lineage at all, he could have easily skirted around that (which he actually did). Especially since no one knew that Naruto was Minato's kid anyway, with a few exceptions. 


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#28654 redrose3443

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 04:59 AM

I seriously hope the animators don't try to screw over Sakura again. They always change her outfit, hair length, and body portions just so she looks less attractive and that's so annoying.


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#28655 Khaleesi

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 05:11 AM

 

The current generation might not like him, but at the same time if he had explained to him the difference between the Jinchuriki and the beast, they could have realized that Naruto was preventing the outbreak of Kurama. In this way, they could consider him a hero, and hate the beast inside him. They may have still hated the beast, but with the understanding of his burden, they might not have passed down their propensity to ostracize Naruto to their children.

Treating Jinchuriki normal did not just become taboo, it was always a practice to treat them like animals. Why? Lack of understanding. Your example is the best way to consider this. You spoke of a time bomb, Naruto was not a time bomb, especially as a child. He was completely different. He was a jailer to a prisoner. Just because a prisoner has committed a crime, it does not mean that the ones that guard him are guilty by association. Had Hiruzen had the foresight to explain this, Naruto might not have been ostracized.

 

Also, yes I was serious. Considering that the entire Leaf knew that he was the Jinchuriki right from the start anyway, not including the next generation. He didn't have to bring up the 4th or Naruto's lineage at all, he could have easily skirted around that (which he actually did). Especially since no one knew that Naruto was Minato's kid anyway, with a few exceptions. 

Again, that's too much hope. Humans just will not understand the difference even if someone explain to them. For those people are the same. Naruto did the only thing that would change their minds. Showing them that he's different.


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#28656 AHK

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 05:15 AM

Again, that's too much hope. Humans just will not understand the difference even if someone explain to them. For those people are the same. Naruto did the only thing that would change their minds. Showing them that he's different.


They might not understand, you may be right. But that doesn't mean Hiruzen shouldn't have tried to get them understand. Had he tried, they might have understood, and if they didn't, then that's completely on them. Hiruzen didn't try however, so he is partially responsible for the mistreatment of an orphaned child whose parents died to save the very people that mistreated him. Hiruzen failed both Minato and Kushina in that regard.

Edited by AHK, 23 August 2014 - 05:16 AM.

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#28657 Khaleesi

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 05:26 AM

They might not understand, you may be right. But that doesn't mean Hiruzen shouldn't have tried to get them understand. Had he tried, they might have understood, and if they didn't, then that's completely on them. Hiruzen didn't try however, so he is partially responsible for the mistreatment of an orphaned child whose parents died to save the very people that mistreated him. Hiruzen failed both Minato and Kushina in that regard.

I think the only ones who really understood about the Jinchiruki deal might were the shinobis, even if not all. At least a part. But not the village. No, then again you are implying that he didn't say a thing about how a selled bijuus works. It's unbelieveble that he didn't explain what happened. I think he really did. "Our fourth Hokage and his wife Kushina gave their lifes and saved the village. They even decided to sell the kyuubi inside their own child. (...)" Do you really think, someone like Hiruzen wouldn't make a BIG speech about it? 


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#28658 Uzumaki9000

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 05:37 AM

Off topic: I don't know what will NH/SS fans and Sakura haters do when NaruSaku becomes canon. 



#28659 Gojira

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 05:57 AM

Off topic: I don't know what will NH/SS fans and Sakura haters do when NaruSaku becomes canon. 

Same way they reacted to 631 and RTN only to a much more severe degree


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#28660 Illnevergiveup3

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 06:15 AM

do y'all think Kaguya is finally defeated or is still too early?

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