12811 replies to this topic

[Aizen-Sama]

Hey look, the actual photos inside Sakura and Sasuke's home:

 

 

Lol that's hilarious!

 

 

 

 

Sasuke want just excuse, whenever they were in the same room, the first thing that happened was they'd get into a cat fight about Sasuke. 

 

Sakura didn't spend time crying in shippuden because of Sasuke, she cried because he wasn't turning out to be what she wanted him to be. Sakura never, not one canon time, thought about what Sasuke wanted, only what she wanted from him, the same as Hinata in regards to Naruto. She only ever thought about herself in regards to Sasuke, she never, ever loved him. When it came to him, only she mattered. That's why NS was truly the best ship, because they wanted the other to be happy, even if it cost them. Sakura's "love" for Sasuke was not love, it was a shallow and selfish obsession, where she self-inserted her into his life, when he clearly didn't want her there. She forced herself on him at every turn, when he never wanted her and never wanted to hear from her, 693 proves that.

 

Like I said, InoSai is only indicative of Ino moving on and maturing into someone that isn't a scumbag as a function of NS, as it shows that Ino moved on while Sasuke was single and available, not while he was taken. As it is now, Ino is a disgusting person because she settled for Sai because of the canon fact remarked by both Sakura and Ino, that he looks like Sasuke. She's self-inserted herself into Sasuke's pants via Sai, and its truly sad. 

 

Sakura loved Sasuke but I agree that her obsession with him is amplified more by her self-esteem issues, that she actually wants to be with a guy who treats her like kitten.  However that wasn't the point I was trying to make.  The point is that Sakura was not in love with Sasuke because of Ino.  It's different with Naruto because it's canon fact that Naruto only loved Sakura because of a rivalry (according to the Last & Kishimoto) .  No such thing was ever said about Sakura's love for Sasuke & her love for him was treated as pure until the end even though we know it's not.  Let's agree to disagree.

 

[Narufan85]

Because you keep missing the point, and I don't see the point in repeatedly wasting my time; 

 

 

Naruto tells other people not to lie, while lying. Naruto kittenes at Sakura for "Lying" when he has ALWAYS been lying to her and everyone else.

Thats what makes him a scumbag and her his victim.

Everything else you say will always fall flat in light of that. ALWAYS. 

 

 

Just a question, a completely sincere question because I think it will help a lot with understanding your perspective. And to preface, it has nothing to do with my feelings or arguments about whether or not Naruto is a scumbag.

Do you think Sakura is at fault/crappy/problematic at all by 700+1? I get that you place Naruto's problems on a much higher level, but I feel like all of Sakura's actions are excusable in your eyes. That's fine if that's what you think, I'm just trying to better understand your position with regards to these ongoing debates.

 

Edit to add: I think this question comes across as snarky and it's really not meant to be that way at all. It's totally sincere. We're coming at these issues from very different places and I'm just trying to get a better read on yours.

Edited by Narufan85, 27 April 2015 - 02:31 AM.

[rocci]

Sakura problem is, her love for sasuke degrading her character.
It's pathetic.

[Shashank95]

Why? because number one Sakura didn't pretend to have feelings for someone while secretly trying to cause a rift, get in-between or make trouble for said person out of RIVALRY. She did not misrepresent herself, she did NOT FOOL EVERYONE around her just to cause jealousy or one up her rival. 

Different standards? no there are no different standards, Naruto is just a lying a**hole who convinced everyone around him that his feelings were GENUINE and that he was suffering because Sakura didn't love him back. In the meantime she comes off as the villain and he comes off as the poor kicked puppy when in fact its the other way around.

I don't understand why you seem to think they're on the same ground but no mater how you try to spin it, The canon Naruto is a lying hypocritical POS that stood on a false moral high-ground the entire story. 

Sakura on the other hand is his victim as much as she is the fandom and kishi's punching bag. 

Its disgusting. Its literally disgusting that not a single kittening person in her life, From
Tsunade to Kakashi, Sai, Shizune, her parents, Ino or even Naruto whether Naruto was her "Friend" prospective love interest, cared enough about her to give her the slap in the face she needed to wake up and save herself. 

But of course she can't be saved from this fate, because Kishimoto won't allow it, nor will he allow her to escape in death. 




 

 

Almost every time she mentions Sasuke, there was an inner monologue relating her beating Ino. Their chuunin exam fight was predicated on their rivalry for Sasuke's kitten. Ino didn't give up on Sasuke, her ending up with Sai is proof of that, not proof to the contrary. As I said a while ago, InoSai is only indicative of Ino moving on and maturing into someone that isn't a scumbag as a function of NS, as it shows that Ino moved on while Sasuke was single and available, not while he was taken. As it is now, Ino is a disgusting person because she settled for Sai because of the canon fact remarked by both Sakura and Ino, that he looks like Sasuke. The sad thing is that the poor bastard probably doesn't know that's the case.

Would you two please STOP!!!!!!!!!!

 

I mean damn, Dafuq's the matter with you..??

 

It's bad enough that our fandom stands alone on the precipice and we are bombarded by fiends from all around. But now we're imploding on ourselves.

 

It doesn't matter whose fault it is, who was right and who was wrong. No matter how many times you go back and forth, nothing's gonna be resolved.

 

So please just stop it. Stop destroying our favorite characters memories with your claims. It's bad enough seeing NH and SS canon but it's even worse seeing ardent NS fans fighting like rabid dogs over who gets the blame for the destruction of NS   

[AHK]

Because you keep missing the point, and I don't see the point in repeatedly wasting my time; 

Naruto tells other people not to lie, while lying. Naruto kittenes at Sakura for "Lying" when he has ALWAYS been lying to her and everyone else.
Thats what makes him a scumbag and her his victim.
Everything else you say will always fall flat in light of that. ALWAYS.

Lol once again, "because you keep missing the point, and I don't feel like repeatedly wasting my time;"

The problem is people are so quick to slam Naruto, yet they give sakura a free pass knowing full well that her love for Sasuke is the same as what Naruto's was retconed to be. Not only that, but they're hypocritical enough to say that Naruto never loved her, but Sakura loves Sasuke, and that Naruto's feelings couldn't progress into something more, while hers could. Not only that, but people forget that of the two scenarios, the only one with canon evidence to support then statement "love borne from rivalry" is Sakura, not Naruto. They're quick to call Naruto a scumbag, but Sakura is immune to it even though she did the same thing. The only difference between Naruto and Sakura is that she succeeded in her motivation to beat Ino. That's it.

Naruto's feelings could have started off the same as Sakura's but at the same time could have grown, so he might not have ever lied in the first place. She did the same thing that Naruto did, yet only he is slammed because of the double standard that exists, and the inherent sexism in this manga in regards to the feelings of men.

In reality, Sakura berates bim for loving out of a rivalry, and kittenes at him about it, when she is guilty of the same thing. That's what makes her a scumbag (just as he is), and it makes Sasuke her victim, as well as Naruto, as he went off to potentially die for to bring Sasuke back for her.

Everything you say will always fall flat in light of that. ALWAYS.

Edited by AHK, 27 April 2015 - 02:42 AM.

[Tsuki Hoshino]

 

Just a question, a completely sincere question because I think it will help a lot with understanding your perspective. And to preface, it has nothing to do with my feelings or arguments about whether or not Naruto is a scumbag.

Do you think Sakura is at fault/crappy/problematic at all by 700+1? I get that you place Naruto's problems on a much higher level, but I feel like all of Sakura's actions are excusable in your eyes. That's fine if that's what you think, I'm just trying to better understand your position with regards to these ongoing debates.

 

Edit to add: I think this question comes across as snarky and it's really not meant to be that way at all. It's totally sincere. We're coming at these issues from very different places and I'm just trying to get a better read on yours.

Of course she's crappy and problematic, degrading and pathetic, depressing, embarrassing and a number of other things but she will never be the piece of kitten Naruto is. 
 

Lol once again, "because you keep missing the point, and I don't feel like repeatedly wasting my time;


Naruto's feelings could have started off the same as Sakura's but at the same time could have grown, so he might it have ever lied in the first place. She did the same thing that Naruto did, yet only he is slammed because of the double standard that exists, and the inherent sexism in this manga in regards to the feelings of men.

In reality, Sakura berates bim for loving out of a rivalry, and kittenes at him about it, when she is guilty of the same thing. That's what makes her a scumbag, and it makes Sasuke her victim, as well as Naruto, as he went off to potentially for to bring Sasuke back for her.

Everything you say will always fall flat in light of that. ALWAYS.

 

Sakura didn't BERATE him, she teased him while attempting to help him. NARUTO on the other hand kittened at her in-front of all their friends when all he had ever done was lie to her and everyone else making himself look like HER victim when it was the other way around all while assuming a moral high-ground HE never had in the first place.

Sakura never ASSUMED A MORAL HIGH-GROUND. 

Theres where your argument falls apart AHK. 

Sakura, being helpful and constructive VS Naruto being DESTRUCTIVE and a hindrance ON PURPOSE.  for the lulz. 


Allow me to repeat you repeating me;
 Everything you say will always fall flat in light of that. ALWAYS.



You have your opinion, I have mine. 

There is no convincing me and there is no convincing you, so just step aside and let it go. 

Edited by Tsuki Hoshino, 27 April 2015 - 02:50 AM.

[Illnevergiveup3]

lol, let's be real here. Canon fact or not. We ALL know that Naruto truly loves Sakura-Chan. His love for her was just thrown out the window for the sake of them making money. If they thought that NaruSaku was more popular, they would throw Sakura-Chan's 'feelings' for Sasuke out the window they same way. 

[AHK]

Sakura didn't BERATE him, she teased him while attempting to help him. NARUTO on the other hand kittened at her in-front of all their friends when all he had ever done was lie to her and everyone else making himself look like HER victim when it was the other way around all while assuming a moral high-ground HE never had in the first place.

Sakura never ASSUMED A MORAL HIGH-GROUND. 

Theres where your argument falls apart AHK. 

Sakura, being helpful and constructive VS Naruto being DESTRUCTIVE and a hindrance ON PURPOSE.  for the lulz. 


Allow me to repeat you repeating me;
 Everything you say will always fall flat in light of that. ALWAYS.



You have your opinion, I have mine. 

There is no convincing me and there is no convincing you, so just step aside and let it go. 

What? Sakura, in regards to how Naruto felt, developed a god complex and decided that she, and she alone, determined the usefulness of his feelings (LOI) and how he felt. She determined that his feelings, and himself as a person, including his life, were only worth enough to dump off on Hinata. She insulted his intelligence by comparing his emotional understanding to ramen, knowing full well, full well, the real and true implications of the POAL. 

 

She may not have taken a moral high ground, but she decided on a whim that she alone determined how another human felt, so that she could move on to victimize Sasuke. Nothing she did was with the intention to help Naruto, absolutely nothing. She was self-motivated the entire time, and her little "we have to help each other" line to Hinata was proof of that. 

 

Once again, they are guilty of the same thing, and once again, there's where your argument falls flat. Always. 

[Aizen-Sama]

Of course she's crappy and problematic, degrading and pathetic, depressing, embarrassing and a number of other things but she will never be the piece of kitten Naruto is. 
 

 

Sakura didn't BERATE him, she teased him while attempting to help him. NARUTO on the other hand kittened at her in-front of all their friends when all he had ever done was lie to her and everyone else making himself look like HER victim when it was the other way around all while assuming a moral high-ground HE never had in the first place.

Sakura never ASSUMED A MORAL HIGH-GROUND. 

Theres where your argument falls apart AHK. 

Sakura, being helpful and constructive VS Naruto being DESTRUCTIVE and a hindrance ON PURPOSE.  for the lulz. 


Allow me to repeat you repeating me;
 Everything you say will always fall flat in light of that. ALWAYS.



You have your opinion, I have mine. 

There is no convincing me and there is no convincing you, so just step aside and let it go. 

 

I agree with you, the difference between Sakura & Naruto was that in the end, Naruto's "love" for Sakura and all the bashing she received because of it was completely unjustified since Naruto didn't truly love her anyway. 

Sakura gets kittened over so bad, the fandom's hatred of her wasn't even justified and her so-called canon husband doesn't even love her.. The fans & kishimoto will never get tired of bashing her into the ground.

[Narufan85]

Of course she's crappy and problematic, degrading and pathetic, depressing, embarrassing and a number of other things but she will never be the piece of kitten Naruto is. 
 

Fair enough. Thanks for responding in good faith.

I think my problem with this debate is that we have to take The Last and 700+1 seriously. So much of everything after 693 totally changes he characters and their motivations and drastically alters the meaning of powerful moments prior to that. I think that's te mark of bad story telling.

[WhyDoIWatch]

I have a question, would you guys prefer a ending in which Sasuke and Naruto die together like Naruto said and Shikamaru becoming Hokage or NH/SS happening in a way that does't ruin the characters?

[Change]

what if Kishimoto really is some big mastermind? Lol. What if he's making the characters OOC on purpose?

This happening has the same chances as me becoming a billionaire 

Edited by TheMagicConch, 27 April 2015 - 03:11 AM.

[Aizen-Sama]

I have a question, would you guys prefer a ending in which Sasuke and Naruto die together like Naruto said and Shikamaru becoming Hokage or NH/SS happening in a way that does't ruin the characters?

 

I'd rather Naruto & Sasuke die lol.  Sakura should become Hokage though, that would've been more epic. xD

[luffyq1]

I have a question, would you guys prefer a ending in which Sasuke and Naruto die together like Naruto said and Shikamaru becoming Hokage or NH/SS happening in a way that does't ruin the characters?

first option.

[Illnevergiveup3]

I have a question, would you guys prefer a ending in which Sasuke and Naruto die together like Naruto said and Shikamaru becoming Hokage or NH/SS happening in a way that does't ruin the characters?

Naruto and Sasuke dying would be the option for me. It sickens me to see Naruto and Hinata together. It sickens me even more to see Sasuke and Sakura-Chan together, no matter how it's done.

[TsukiChan ♥]

 

Whether Sakura knew Ino liked Sasuke or not is irrelevant.  Sakura did not love Sasuke because of her rivalry with Ino.  If she did, why does she continue loving him even though Ino already has a child with Sai? 

 

 

 

Sakura and Ino's fight wasn't about getting Sasuke's kitten, it was about Sakura surpassing Ino and proving herself to be her equal.  I think Sasuke was just an excuse, because Ino and Sakura weren't talking about who "won" him when they both woke up after the fight.  Instead they became friends again and Sakura continued to like Sasuke.  The one who could be argued about liking Sasuke only over a rivalry would be Ino, who deliberately flirted with him in front of Sakura just to make her mad.  Sakura never did any such thing.

So all the times in Shippuden that Sakura cried over Sasuke was only because she was thinking about beating Ino?  Ino did not appear in Sakura's head when Sakura felt guilty about being in love with Sasuke, when she confessed her love to Sasuke again in 693, or when she blushed when Sasuke poked her on the forehead.  It was only in Part 1 that Sakura competed with Ino for Sasuke's affections, the same way Naruto competed with Sasuke in order to get Sakura's love (except that according to canon, he kept doing it all through Shippuden)

How is Ino a disgusting person for moving onto Sai?  Sure he looks like Sasuke but who cares.  Maybe it's not Sasuke himself Ino liked but just dark mysterious types.

 

We all know that, and I think its because she got the chance to really know Sasuke, unlike the other fangirls, she also got to see sides of him that not a lot of the others girls got to see, and despite all that, loved him...I dont get why cause he treated her like crap honestly, SS would've been better off as a BROTP thing

[NaruSaku fan in Kentucky]

 

Even  Rick Pitino  knows  this makes  no  sense  and he cheated on his  wife. 

[luffyq1]

 

Even  Rick Pitino  knows  this makes  no  sense  and he cheated on his  wife. 

hhahahahahahahaha!

[rocci]

What? Sakura, in regards to how Naruto felt, developed a god complex and decided that she, and she alone, determined the usefulness of his feelings (LOI) and how he felt. She determined that his feelings, and himself as a person, including his life, were only worth enough to dump off on Hinata. She insulted his intelligence by comparing his emotional understanding to ramen, knowing full well, full well, the real and true implications of the POAL. 
 
She may not have taken a moral high ground, but she decided on a whim that she alone determined how another human felt, so that she could move on to victimize Sasuke. Nothing she did was with the intention to help Naruto, absolutely nothing. She was self-motivated the entire time, and her little "we have to help each other" line to Hinata was proof of that. 
 
Once again, they are guilty of the same thing, and once again, there's where your argument falls flat. Always. 

Naruto doesn't object it.
That mean naruto see Hinata love him like he love for ramen.
And naruto only love sakura because of his rivalry with sasuke.
All naruto feeling for sakura for the entirety of the manga is not deep.

[Namikaze Clan]

Question: How many of you guys are going to read the entire spin off? I know some of you said that you were only going to read the first chapter before quitting. But given the cliffhanger, are you sticking around?