19964 replies to this topic

[alexander]

After seeing the interview I have to say, Kishi, you underestimate tsunderes, they usually are likable, no matter what you do, lol. It's interesting how Kishimoto says that Sakura was supposed to be unlikable, and yet Sasuke took that role easily.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

After seeing the interview I have to say, Kishi, you underestimate tsunderes, they usually are likable, no matter what you do, lol. It's interesting how Kishimoto says that Sakura was supposed to be unlikable, and yet Sasuke took that role easily.

Yes cuz he forced sasuke too much and give him powers from nowhere that is annoying, he is annoying i think he did this on purpose for us to hate him because he will be the last villain.

[sushi.]

Yes cuz he forced sasuke too much and give him powers from nowhere that is annoying, he is annoying i think he did this on purpose for us to hate him because he will be the last villain.

No, it was not from out of nowhere. It was from Tobi and shoot me if I'm wrong, but I think he took something from Itachi too. Tobi was manipulating him.

And keep in mind, once Naruto get a power-up, Sasuke must get one too. Only then, they can be equal.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

No, it was not from out of nowhere. It was from Tobi and shoot me if I'm wrong, but I think he took something from Itachi too. Tobi was manipulating him.

And keep in mind, once Naruto get a power-up, Sasuke must get one too. Only then, they can be equal.

Tell me ONE battle that sasuke didnt win if wasnt with some hidden technique that he automatic learn and because of it he wins the battle.
Naruto defeated Pain with a rasengan and clone jutsu.

Sasuke was always one step ahead of naruto without training.

sasuke never defeated anyone on this shippuuden if wasnt by some asspull technique or luck.
Sasuke is so weak that if u remove his sharing lee would rape him in a 1v1.

Edited by dovahkiin, 20 July 2012 - 12:07 AM.

[sushi.]

Tell me ONE battle that sasuke didnt win if wasnt with some hidden technique that he automatic learn and because of it he wins the battle.
Naruto defeated Pain with a rasengan and clone jutsu.

Sasuke was always one step ahead of naruto without training.

Cannot.

But that's how rivals are. Sasuke is sometimes one step ahead of Naruto, other times it's the other way around. Like now, I think that Naruto is currently the more powerful of the two.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

Cannot.

But that's how rivals are. Sasuke is sometimes one step ahead of Naruto, other times it's the other way around. Like now, I think that Naruto is currently the more powerful of the two.

i think not because of that "Complete asspull susano and that rinnegan"
How a simple doujutsu can give u enough power to face a bijuu on one to one with equal power.

and it's so powerfull that is ridiculous at the same time how can this clan be destroyed by the hands of two people.

Edited by dovahkiin, 20 July 2012 - 12:10 AM.

[xxRomanceGirlxx]

i think not because of that "Complete asspull susano and that rinnegan"
How a simple doujutsu can give u enough power to face a bijuu on one to one with equal power.

and it's so powerfull that is ridiculous at the same time how can this clan be destroyed by the hands of two people.

I feel similarly. If you look at Naruto, who almost always went through training to get stronger, Sasuke always get's stronger without real, difficult training(unless you count his training with Orochimaru but even then, it was caused by forbiddddden jutsu or drug enhancement). Honestly, what pissed me off the most was when Sasuke got the Mangekyo. I know Itachi was being a caring brother but Sasuke got that ability without actually earning it. He didn't deserve that ability at all!

Edited by xxRomanceGirlxx, 20 July 2012 - 01:05 AM.

[Verilance]

I feel similarly. If you look at Naruto, who almost always went through training to get stronger, Sasuke always get's stronger without real, difficult training(unless you count his training with Orochimaru but even then, it was caused by forbiddddden jutsu or drug enhancement). Honestly, what pissed me off the most was when Sasuke got the Mangekyo. I know Itachi was being a caring brother but Sasuke got that ability without actually earning it. He didn't deserve that ability at all!

That is part of the point... everything Sasuke has is not through hard work and determination as Naruto did but through "the easy path" which still has him dancing to other peoples music.

[Dalton.T.R]

Yeah, but isn't the villain supposed to have it the easy way, and the hero busts all his teeth out just to get a little more powerful? Kinda seems that way most of the time.

[narulsaku]

Well, there you have it. And if the words came straight out of Kishimoto's mouth that Sakura's purpose is as a love interest for the main character, then she was never for Sasuke to begin with. Ergo, NS is canon. Yay.

well did you have doubts, on NS.

[pharix]

Is it true they have restaraunts where women hit men or something? I can see a female hitting a male for doing something stupid, flirting, or something else, but hitting just for the fun of it?

I don't know about that but there's tsundere cafes (lol)

[TerrorKing]

I don't really think there's any reason to doubt NS. I mean, sure, I'll always keep an open mind and acknowledge that Kishi could make NH and SS or any other pairing that isn't NS the end game. However, that just wouldn't make any sense. It's his choice of course, but we don't have to like it.

Still, ther are many reasons why NS has a big chance of becoming canon. Take for example, the JiraTsu and MinaKushi parallels. No, they're not perfect parallels at all, but I strongly think that the similarities are stronger than the dissimilarities. Why? Because a lot of them are outright stated in the story itself.

Like when Jiraiya comments that Sakura is like a mini version of Tsunade and when Yamato told Naruto about the time that Jiraiya almost died because he got caught trying to peep at Tsunade, while Naruto was comtemplating doing the very same thing, only with Sakura. To me, this shows that, not only does Naruto and Sakura have similar personality traits to Jiraiya and Tsunade, they also share a similar relationship.

Then there's Naruto meeting with Kushina where she states that he should find someone like her. This is meant as a way of making the audience comtenplate what females in the Narutoverse most closely resembles Kushina and of course, the answer is Sakura.

Then there's Minato. When Kushina tells about how she didn't like Minato at first, Naruto immedietely objects and says something like "But why. He was so cool". This is meant to show us that Naruto instantly identifies with his dad and his desire to prove himself worthy to everyone.

Then there's the fact that, in the end, Tsunade did end up reciprocating Jiraiya's feelings, or at least, it was strongly hinted at. However, by then, it was unfortunately too late as she never got the chance to tell him. This ties into one of the central themes of the story about how "The current generation will always surpass the previous generation" i.e. where Jiraiya and Tsunade failed to get together, Naruto and Sakura will suceed.

There are dissimilarities of course. Like how Jiraiya seemed a lot more tsunderish to Tsunade, like insulting her breast size (or was that only in the anime? I can't really remember?) or the fact that, unlike Sakura, Tsunade's past was way more tragic or of course the fact that there was never a JiraTsuOro love triangle. The difference is that these dissimilarities are merely shown. They're not emphasized in any way or commented on. The only example I can think of is when Kushina tells about how she was bullied because of her hair colour and Naruto immediately assumes that Minato saved her, but then Kushina basically tells him that "Nah. I handled that myself".

So anyway, that's my take on why the JiraTsu and MinaKushi parallels matter. They're far from being the best and most solid NaruSaku evidence there is, but I still think they count for something, otherwise Kishi wouldn't have bothered to point them out.

Oh and btw, this is what I meant when I said that "Cherrypicking isn't always bad". I was basically a combination of a poor choice of words, as well as me being very tired and stressed out.

But yeah, cherrypicking is definetaly bad and you shouldn't do it.

[Transformers03]

well did you have doubts, on NS.

I don't really think there's any reason to doubt NS. I mean, sure, I'll always keep an open mind and acknowledge that Kishi could make NH and SS or any other pairing that isn't NS the end game. However, that just wouldn't make any sense. It's his choice of course, but we don't have to like it.

Still, ther are many reasons why NS has a big chance of becoming canon. Take for example, the JiraTsu and MinaKushi parallels. No, they're not perfect parallels at all, but I strongly think that the similarities are stronger than the dissimilarities. Why? Because a lot of them are outright stated in the story itself.

Like when Jiraiya comments that Sakura is like a mini version of Tsunade and when Yamato told Naruto about the time that Jiraiya almost died because he got caught trying to peep at Tsunade, while Naruto was comtemplating doing the very same thing, only with Sakura. To me, this shows that, not only does Naruto and Sakura have similar personality traits to Jiraiya and Tsunade, they also share a similar relationship.

Then there's Naruto meeting with Kushina where she states that he should find someone like her. This is meant as a way of making the audience comtenplate what females in the Narutoverse most closely resembles Kushina and of course, the answer is Sakura.

Then there's Minato. When Kushina tells about how she didn't like Minato at first, Naruto immedietely objects and says something like "But why. He was so cool". This is meant to show us that Naruto instantly identifies with his dad and his desire to prove himself worthy to everyone.

Then there's the fact that, in the end, Tsunade did end up reciprocating Jiraiya's feelings, or at least, it was strongly hinted at. However, by then, it was unfortunately too late as she never got the chance to tell him. This ties into one of the central themes of the story about how "The current generation will always surpass the previous generation" i.e. where Jiraiya and Tsunade failed to get together, Naruto and Sakura will suceed.

There are dissimilarities of course. Like how Jiraiya seemed a lot more tsunderish to Tsunade, like insulting her breast size (or was that only in the anime? I can't really remember?) or the fact that, unlike Sakura, Tsunade's past was way more tragic or of course the fact that there was never a JiraTsuOro love triangle. The difference is that these dissimilarities are merely shown. They're not emphasized in any way or commented on. The only example I can think of is when Kushina tells about how she was bullied because of her hair colour and Naruto immediately assumes that Minato saved her, but then Kushina basically tells him that "Nah. I handled that myself".

So anyway, that's my take on why the JiraTsu and MinaKushi parallels matter. They're far from being the best and most solid NaruSaku evidence there is, but I still think they count for something, otherwise Kishi wouldn't have bothered to point them out.

Oh and btw, this is what I meant when I said that "Cherrypicking isn't always bad". I was basically a combination of a poor choice of words, as well as me being very tired and stressed out.

But yeah, cherrypicking is definetaly bad and you shouldn't do it.

I agree with TerrorKing, but I still have my doubts. Here are my doubts:

1) We haven't seen Naruto and Sakura interact with each other since the Summit arc, which was when Sakura's confession happen. It has been well over a hundred chapters since we last saw them together, and frankly that really ticks me off. 'Cause either A) the author is done with the whole love subplot, B) that really WAS the death of Narusaku, or C) he is building up something big. Either way, the lack of Naruto and Sakura interaction really makes me angry, because I always felt they had the best chemistry out of all the characters together (I'm not just talking about the romantic implication). Though I doubt the series will end with Naruto and Sakura never speaking at least one more time.

2) The whole 'looking in your eyes' conversation that Naruto had with Hinata, and Hinata's later proclamation that she is going to try to hold Naruto's hand after the war. In hindsight, the whole 'looking in your eyes' conversation can be taken as Hinata's last minute character resolution, something that seems to be common among many involve in the current war arc. I'm mostly worried about the amount of space that Kishi gave to that scene, heck in the previous chapter Naruto saved both Sakura and Hinata, yet he gave a lot more panel space, and emphasis, on Naruto saving Hinata. That worries me. Hinata's proclamation wouldn't have been that much have of a threat, if it wasn't for that conversation, and the amount of space he gave that proclamation. I swear, Hinata's proclamation seem to have had just as much space as Sakura's closing statement of how they are all going to be their to help Naruto. It was mostly this that made me doubt Narusaku will happen, up to that point I was pretty sure it was going to happen (in fact, I thought it was obvious).

3) I doubt my own bias opinion on this whole subject. Maybe all this 'proofs' and 'evidence' I keep finding online are nothing at all. Maybe I'm seeing things that aren't really there, I'm just convincing myself that all the evidence is pointing to Narusaku to make feel me feel more comfortable. Even though I have looked up Naruhina proofs, and none of it seem as legit as the Narusaku proofs, that could still just me convincing myself that one side of the argument is better than the other because I prefer the first side.

Those are my doubts, but I still think Narusaku has the best chance of happening.

[PachucoDesigns]

Yeah, but isn't the villain supposed to have it the easy way, and the hero busts all his teeth out just to get a little more powerful? Kinda seems that way most of the time.

Which is why Sasuke is not a villain. He is an antihero.

[Dalton.T.R]

Which is why Sasuke is not a villain. He is an antihero.

Not a villain...but an anti-hero...that makes sense. That's understandable. I can completely see what the difference is there. Not really.

[dfammer]

Which is why Sasuke is not a villain. He is an antihero.

An anti-hero is a shady character or malcontent who ends up doing the right thing(like han solo in star wars). Sasuke is an weak angry imature (and cruel),character,remember he almost killed his own team member,Karin( one of the greatest sins a ninja can commit),and made another attempt to KILL Sakura,and would have succeeded if not for Naruto. I don't know what Sasuke is but it is not an anti-hero.

[Dalton.T.R]

An anti-hero is a shady character or malcontent who ends up doing the right thing(like han solo in star wars). Sasuke is an weak angry imature (and cruel),character,remember he almost killed his own team member,Karin( one of the greatest sins a ninja can commit),and made another attempt to KILL Sakura,and would have succeeded if not for Naruto. I don't know what Sasuke is but it is not an anti-hero.

Little more than a cold blooded murderer is what I would call him.

[PachucoDesigns]

An anti-hero is a shady character or malcontent who ends up doing the right thing(like han solo in star wars). Sasuke is an weak angry imature (and cruel),character,remember he almost killed his own team member,Karin( one of the greatest sins a ninja can commit),and made another attempt to KILL Sakura,and would have succeeded if not for Naruto. I don't know what Sasuke is but it is not an anti-hero.

I know full well what an antihero is, dfammer. Apparently you do not. An anti-hero is simply a character with a central role in a story who lacks the traditional elements of a hero. More often than not, this is demonstrated by priority of self-interest before any moral dilemma, yet he is made to change in some way by the circumstances of the conflict in order to overcome an obstacle. Simply, an antihero is usually a character of questionable moral character placed in the role of a protagonist. And if we consider the stories of each of the main characters as their own as well as tied to one another, Naruto is a hero. Sasuke is an antihero.

Little more than a cold blooded murderer is what I would call him.

Which is why I seriously question most people when they say that there are three main roles, three main protagonists, in this story. When they come up with this conclusion for Sasuke, I'm made to think that they see Naruto as the only protagonist, Sakura as a Shaman, and Sasuke as a foil. Meaning, they are not protagonists, but accessories to the protagonist.

Edited by PachucoDesigns, 20 July 2012 - 03:43 AM.

[dfammer]

I know full well what an antihero is, dfammer. Apparently you do not. An anti-hero is simply a character with a central role in a story who lacks the traditional elements of a hero. More often than not, this is demonstrated by priority of self-interest before any moral dilemma, yet he is made to change in some way by the circumstances of the conflict in order to overcome an obstacle. Simply, an antihero is usually a character of questionable moral character placed in the role of a protagonist. And if we consider the stories of each of the main characters as their own as well as tied to one another, Naruto is a hero. Sasuke is an antihero.



Which is why I seriously question most people when they say that there are three main roles, three main protagonists, in this story. When they come up with this conclusion for Sasuke, I'm made to think that they see Naruto as the only protagonist, Sakura as a Shaman, and Sasuke as a foil. Meaning, they are not protagonists, but accessories to the protagonist.

You are such a P$#k you have no Idea what an anti-hero is, why don't you find this new thing called a dictionary and look it up. I guess you failed freshman english(if you took it at all) there's the definition"a protagonist or notable figure who is conspicuiously lacking in heroic qualities" Get it smart ass!

Edited by dfammer, 20 July 2012 - 04:06 AM.

[PachucoDesigns]

You are such a P$#k you have no Idea what an anti-hero is, why don't you find this new thing called a dictionary and look it up. I guess you failed freshman english(if you took it at all)

Yeah, I am a practiced writer, and have had good reception in many different circles. Most of my work implements antiheroes in some fashion or another. I am associated with many professional editors and published novelists. And not only did I take "freshman English," I took all honors English classes, aced them all at the top of my class, and was personally praised by all of my instructors. You can take your dictionary and shove it. I suggest you take a look at some character archetype references. And for the record, virtually every time you respond to me, it is you provoking me. Out of the two of us, I don't think it's me who is the P$#k.

Oh, and just to satisfy your "look at a dictionary" insult:

www.dictionary.com
antihero (ˈæntɪˌhɪərəʊ)

— n , pl -roes
a central character in a novel, play, etc, who lacks the traditional heroic virtues

www.merriam-webster.com
an·ti·he·ro
noun
\ˈan-tē-ˌhē-(ˌ)rō, ˈan-ˌtī-, -ˌhir-(ˌ)ō\
Definition of ANTIHERO
: a protagonist or notable figure who is conspicuously lacking in heroic qualities


www.britannica.com

antihero

antihero, a protagonist of a drama or narrative who is notably lacking in heroic qualities. This type of character has appeared in literature since the time of the Greek dramatists and can be found in the literary works of all nations. Examples include the title characters of Miguel de Cervantes’s Don Quixote (Part I, 1605; Part II, 1615) and Henry Fielding’s Tom Jones (1749). Some examples of the modern, postwar antihero, as defined by the Angry Young Men, include Joe Lampton, in John Braine’s Room at the Top (1957), and Arthur Seaton, in Alan Sillitoe’s Saturday

Edited by PachucoDesigns, 20 July 2012 - 04:27 AM.