31746 replies to this topic

[TouKen4Life3g]

 
Right, but he did not say that was the sole reason. It does push the pairing, in a sense of what happened in 614/615 to remind you "Hey, this is the plan", but that's not the sole purpose of the death. That's my point.

I tend to think it is. I mean it was a weird transition when Naruto got close to Madara and Obito, only to start over. It was suggesting that the next time we see them, it's going to be something crazy, but after series of flashback, it's back to the drawing board. Hell, the earlier mention don't even feel it happened. Granted that's one of the many problems of the arc, but the part is it don't feel anything rewarding. Tacked on if you may.

[TouKen4Life3g]

It doesn't take away from Kishi's initial idea. One of the problems is that when we think he is doing something clever, he never reflects upon that; rather we are overthinking. Scene is clear for us to know what he is illustrating at times, but others seems like we are reaching and quite honestly, majority of the fan base is the victim of it. It's one of the major problem of his writing because we don't know where he was going at it in a bad way. There's change of path and twist. His twist is often convoluted despite how it can be predictable which is ironic. Itachi is the prime example. Obito felt like a reach with the idea that he somehow grew tall and obtain a deep voice in a year or less.

 

Pacing among them but there are a lot of problems that it feels like a bible at this point. The series essentially just become another action series with a mindless intention rather than being smart about it. It's like a summer film, now that there are two type of entertainment. Naruto falls under like Transformers more so than Fast series or Comic Book based. Have it ended at Obito only, the war wouldn't be that bad. And it's hard to excuse the rest of 100 chapters worth of absurdity.

[Phantom_999]

You know what's ironic about saying that?  You may well be over analyzing things yourself. you take what is written and shown to us in the story and put up your own interpretations to it. You say that Naruto was hinted to reciprocate Hinata's feelings in the manga when there was no indication of it in his inner monologues or his actions. You say that Sakura's interactions with Naruto are only platonic, when she displayed no such affectionate behaviour to any other male character except Sasuke who actively scorned her. You say that Hinata is not all about Naruto when her inner monologues are full of Naruto-kun this, Naruto-kun that, or about how she wants to be like Naruto and wants to show her worth TO HIM, and no one else. you say that Sasuke and Sakura are not in an abusive relationship when 1) Sasuke did not ever care about her self esteem issues and rarely if ever offered positive encouragement towards her, 2) nothing indicates that their relationship is a healthy and meaningful one, as even the comedy moments between them are just PLAIN SAD, and 3) F.Y.I. leaving for a decade and not even bothering to contact your spouse or child nor even let them know where you are or how you're doing is considered neglect and neglect is considered form of abuse too. 

Edited by Phantom_999, 27 July 2017 - 06:36 PM.

[Yyubie]

Incorrect!! , False!! , I disagree!!. So far that is pretty much the only thing this person do , disagreeing with everyone , busy trying to correct everyone's opinion , busy defending the ending the last boruto and it's anime saying how good it is. Whenever someone express their opinion this person try to correct it ... why the need and the persistent??

 

It's just like for example there are 2 religion , religion A and religion B. I'm in religion A and i come to religion B society and tell them all "Hey your religion is fake and false , your god never exist and your way of teaching is wrong , you should all abandon religion B and join religion A just like me".

[The Doctor forever]

Incorrect!! , False!! , I disagree!!. So far that is pretty much the only thing this person do , disagreeing with everyone , busy trying to correct everyone's opinion , busy defending the ending the last boruto and it's anime saying how good it is. Whenever someone express their opinion this person try to correct it ... why the need and the persistent??

 

It's just like for example there are 2 religion , religion A and religion B. I'm in religion A and i come to religion B society and tell them all "Hey your religion is fake and false , your god never exist and your way of teaching is wrong , you should all abandon religion B and join religion A just like me".

Because we ARE WRONG, that is how I am seeing it no matter what we say I mean if I said that what Hinata did in the whole Pain attack was stupid and dumb.

 

She would say I am wrong that this was all planned to show the readers that out of all of Konoha Hinata deeply loves Naruto hence why she is the only one to do anything while the others watch this shows the readers the love Hinata has for Naruto and that Naruto will see this and love her.

 

I can see why Evil100 left so has ultranx as well, soon all of us will be gone and in that way she will have won, its sad but I can see it, I can see this forum slowly dying off.

 

Say like I did a review on The Last like the nostalgia critic would do, she would say how wrong it is and how this is Naruto got with Hinata, again if it was done in the manga there would be no need for the Last at all, or something alone the lines did you watch the film.

[The Doctor forever]

Lastly, I see Evil constantly liking posts. They may not be posting, but they have hardly left the forums. 

Because he gets PM's from people and he just comes back to answer and see what is going on, but make no mistake he is gone now.

[ThroughWithLove]

Overthinking is entirely a reader's fault, and of no blame of an authors.

 

It is when the author introduces ideas with no intent on following through with them. This manga does that . . . A LOT.

Edited by ThroughWithLove, 28 July 2017 - 03:29 AM.

[ThroughWithLove]

 

So largely, we see that Sasuke is largely absent in part 2. As we know, saving Sasuke is part of Sakura's desire, but it's overshadowed by Naruto, so her role is triviliazed, which is why Sakura doesn't participate in the final battle, with Naruto overshadowing her.  Then the focus on the Uchiha (Which kind of drags down the plot, as people note), doesn't play a part with Sakura either, instead furthering Sasuke's story. Nor does she have flashy or overly useful powers, alnd her abilities are used by Tsunade. And her intelligence is overshadowed by Shikamaru.

 

 

Actually, that tag and disable style Kabuto used in part 1 was pretty nifty and seemed like a sneak peak of what we could expect from an elite medical ninja. No need for massive chakra reserves or hax eyeballs when you can utterly debilitate your opponents with chakra scalpels. Throw in toxins, viruses and life-threatening bacteria and Sakura could've had some truly badass technical fights as opposed to merely being able to . . hit things extra hard.

Edited by ThroughWithLove, 28 July 2017 - 03:46 AM.

[lupina]

I find it funny that, despite is has been stated numerous times that NH was not planned/shown and only established in "The Last", there are still people out there who think that the outcome of events (NH made Canon) turned their own Interpretation of the relationship between Naruto and Hinata in the Manga Series into a "Fact".

They Claim that they "knew it all along", "saw the Patterns", while saying that People who saw much more obvious "Patterns", wich are well established tropes/themes in storytelling/writing, are just "overthinking".

 

I wonder how long this will keep going.

The "Clerith" vs "Cloti" debate in FF7 (despite Aerith being dead and Cloud/Tifa living together, share a room and raising children) lasted ... 20 years?

 

 

Edited by lupina, 28 July 2017 - 09:36 AM.

[VanitasDS76491]

Because we ARE WRONG, that is how I am seeing it no matter what we say I mean if I said that what Hinata did in the whole Pain attack was stupid and dumb.
 
She would say I am wrong that this was all planned to show the readers that out of all of Konoha Hinata deeply loves Naruto hence why she is the only one to do anything while the others watch this shows the readers the love Hinata has for Naruto and that Naruto will see this and love her.
 
I can see why Evil100 left so has ultranx as well, soon all of us will be gone and in that way she will have won, its sad but I can see it, I can see this forum slowly dying off.
 
Say like I did a review on The Last like the nostalgia critic would do, she would say how wrong it is and how this is Naruto got with Hinata, again if it was done in the manga there would be no need for the Last at all, or something alone the lines did you watch the film.

Ya that makes me if wonder if that's analyzer goal but we can't let them win.

[ThroughWithLove]

 

But half the ideas you point out aren't ideas. It's you really, really over-reading that there is an idea here.

 

They're subplots, but I used the term ideas to see if you would deny that they were even that. Good to know the importance of akatsuki rings and the need to preserve them was never an idea. Must've imagined them. 

Edited by ThroughWithLove, 28 July 2017 - 03:38 PM.

[HalfDemonInuyasha]

 

Actually, that tag and disable style Kabuto used in part 1 was pretty nifty and seemed like a sneak peak of what we could expect from an elite medical ninja. No need for massive chakra reserves or hax eyeballs when you can utterly debilitate your opponents with chakra scalpels. Throw in toxins, viruses and life-threatening bacteria and Sakura could've had some truly badass technical fights as opposed to merely being able to . . hit things extra hard.

And stuff like that is why I get SO irked when people call (early) part two Sakura "useless" or try to call Tsunade the "weakest" Kage (usually giving Ay the title of "best" Kage) despite the constant show of how dangerous medical ninjutsu can be; being able to cripple or even kill opponents with a mere touch. The very fact that it's not something so flashy or "cool-looking" actually lends itself to being more dangerous by being more unexpected. Even Shizune, someone who sadly got completely shoved into the background like a number of others, was someone who even Kabuto showed slight fear of with her use of her poisonous technique (like the needles and gas) knowing that he would die with just a single breath of her poison gas and only barely blocking her poison needles with his headband. Even Ay admitted that Tsunade's power with her chakra enhanced strength surpassed his own Raiton-enhanced strength when she actually broke through the perfected Susano'o, and who knows how much of Konoha's populace would have died from Pein's attack were it not for Tsunade using her stored up chakra, through Katsuyu, to continuously heal people.

[VanitasDS76491]

Well, if they predicted this via their interpretation, and the story shows it's true... I mean, it does turn it into a fact? And those who read a different but interpretation that turned it into false could have very well occurred by overthinking? And that breaking tropes is not a bad thing?
 
I'm not sure if you're complaining that they're right because of facts you disagree with, or complaining that the facts make them right. 
 

 
This isn't about winning, there's nothing at stake.

Um Ya there is cause you keep posting this crap and people going to leave and the site will die and this is the only place real NS fans can go and love our ship. Also you can't be NS cause no sane NS fans like the ending.

[Nate River]

Um Ya there is cause you keep posting this crap and people going to leave and the site will die and this is the only place real NS fans can go and love our ship. Also you can't be NS cause no sane NS fans like the ending.

 

Two things: First, I have already asks people to stop dictating to others what a true fans is. What you said is just a variant of that. Do not do so again. If you, or anyone else, goes down this path again I will formally warn you and boot you from the thread. At a minimum. 

 

Even if he were not a NS fan it would be irrelevant. Our policy has been that fans from opposing fandoms are welcome.

 

I think he has put up with a bunch of crap, needlessly, and been respectful in doing so. If he can take the slings, you can tolerate a dissenting opinion.

[Kagomaru]

I've been putting her on Ignore for days now and if you guys don't want to suffer the aggravation of listening to the same circular arguments from her (because face it, she isn't actually listening to the counter arguments), I suggest you do the same.  And Nate has a point.  It doesn't matter if she is actually an NS fan or not, because regardless of that, the fact remains that the arguments that she uses against N/S are faulty, illogical and riddled with liberal reinterpretations that do not jive with what is actually in the manga.  To say nothing of her evasion when the citations of interviews that blatantly contradict her assertions are concerned.  Just concentrate on refuting the arguments(which posters have been doing beautifully,btw) or simply ignore her.

 

A single member shouldn't be given the power to affect your enjoyability of this awesome site.

 

But I'll say this Analyzer, you are a troll.  No one who uses an opening post that broadly claims the members of this site "delusional" is looking to be rational nor hospitable to the denizens of said-site and you've done little to curb that initial impression of yourself. Especially when you go on to every - and I mean "every"- thread that even remotely talks about Naruto and Sakura (you've even gone on a thread that just mentions sitcoms that remind you of the characters; freaking SITCOMS!)just to argue about how inane/implausible/ridiculous it is.  This isn't even about whether or not Naruto and Sakura were the planned pairing in the series anymore,  you've taken it a level where you want to stifle conversation that even MENTIONS the two of them together in any context by trying to argue "It doesn't matter!  They didn't happen in canon!  The ending proved that!  Get over it and accept that SS/NH is awesome!"
.  

On top of that, you haven't even said one positive thing regarding the pairing since you got here or even why you like it. Not a single thing. And you sincerely wonder why people question you on your inclinations?

 

I won't call any further attention to it after this post, but I think I speak for most in this thread by saying: You aren't fooling anyone and you aren't swaying anyone with your reasoning. And frankly, the fact that Boruto is currently bombing in the Japanese market already destroys all credibility to your argument that what Kishimoto and SP did was a good decision for the series.

 

That's it.  Beyond this point, I'll no longer address you.

Edited by Kagomaru, 29 July 2017 - 02:57 AM.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Something occur to me and see if you can refresh my memory:

Naruto was portrayed as a lonely boy who was hated by everyone. By the last arc of part 1, it turned out that he has Shikamaru, Chouji, and Kiba as friends; just lonely when it's their time to go home. Would you say that's a retcon in order to make that team seem like "brothers to the end" vibe?

[ThroughWithLove]

I've been putting her on Ignore for days now and if you guys don't want to suffer the aggravation of listening to the same circular arguments from her (because face it, she isn't actually listening to the counter arguments), I suggest you do the same.  And Nate has a point.  It doesn't matter if she is actually an NS fan or not, because regardless of that, the fact remains that the arguments that she uses against N/S are faulty, illogical and riddled with liberal reinterpretations that do not jive with what is actually in the manga.  To say nothing of her evasion when the citations of interviews that blatantly contradict her assertions are concerned.  Just concentrate on refuting the arguments(which posters have been doing beautifully,btw) or simply ignore her.

 

A single member shouldn't be given the power to affect your enjoyability of this awesome site.

 

But I'll say this Analyzer, you are a troll.  No one who uses an opening post that broadly claims the members of this site "delusional" is looking to be rational nor hospitable to the denizens of said-site and you've done little to curb that initial impression of yourself. Especially when you go on to every - and I mean "every"- thread that even remotely talks about Naruto and Sakura (you've even gone a thread that just mentions sitcoms that remind you of the characters; freaking SITCOMS!)just to argue about how inane/implausible/ridiculous it is.  This isn't even about whether or not Naruto and Sakura were the planned pairing anymore,  you want to stifle conversation that even MENTIONS the two of them together in any context by trying argue "It doesn't matter!  They didn't happen in canon!  The ending proved that!  Get over it and accept that SS/NH is awesome!"
.  

On top of that, you haven't even said one positive thing regarding the pairing since you got here. Not a single thing. And you wonder why people question you on your inclinations.

 

I won't call any further attention to it after this post, but I think I speak for most in this thread by saying: You aren't fooling anyone and you aren't swaying anyone with your reasoning. And frankly, the fact that Boruto is currently bombing in the Japanese market already destroys all credibility to your argument that what Kishimoto and SP did was a good decision for the series.

 

That's it.  Beyond this point, I'll no longer address you.

 

He says positive things about the pairing, but it always sounds superficial. The way he describes it, NS comes off as a crack ship.

 

I think the mod is right in that we shouldn't dictate what a true NS fan is since one can like NS for whatever reason. I for one don't really "ship" NS in the traditional sense; as I've made clear in many threads, I shipped the plot. In my mind, NS was nothing more than one of many logical extensions to the plot. And so in my mind, my ship sank long before chapter 700.   

 

That being said, I think the mod is mistaken if he's speaking from the standpoint that we are not allowed question the chances of somebody legitimately coming out of nowhere to make 300+ post defending NH on an NS site. That, to me, is suspicious as hell.   That and  I used to do exact same routine  in my younger days (see The Sophist Troll).  Honestly, there was a time where I was so loathsome that I trolled the guy who wrote the Training for the Job fic despite liking NS. Something I don't take pride in and sincerely apologize if the author of that fic is reading this thread. Had to learn a multitude of harsh life lessons since then.

 

Anyways, I have no intention of ignoring our good friend, Analyzer. He's actually been a nice change of pace here, IMO, and the only time I get irked at an online post is when it's mindless spam or obscene images.

Edited by ThroughWithLove, 29 July 2017 - 03:29 AM.

[VanitasDS76491]

Can we not do this: You must not like the ending to be an NS fan? They are mutually exclusive things.
 
I also cannot force, make anyone, nor do anything to run off someome from an internet site. I am only posting text.

Ya and your posts are pissing off everyone and soon they'll leave the site dumbest.
Really what give it away that I loath the ending, the dumb rectons, forcing hinata in the main light to late into the game and making her useless after that. Naruto being made a jackass that just uses people to get what he wants.

[VanitasDS76491]

Two things: First, I have already asks people to stop dictating to others what a true fans is. What you said is just a variant of that. Do not do so again. If you, or anyone else, goes down this path again I will formally warn you and boot you from the thread. At a minimum. 
 
Even if he were not a NS fan it would be irrelevant. Our policy has been that fans from opposing fandoms are welcome.
 
I think he has put up with a bunch of crap, needlessly, and been respectful in doing so. If he can take the slings, you can tolerate a dissenting opinion.

Fine I'll stop but I don't like people defending the end of naruto. Ya but people here will probably leave the site if this keeps up possibly I mean first evil 100 left for now.

[tricksie]

 

A single member shouldn't be given the power to affect your enjoyability of this awesome site.

 

 

A single member isn't being given that power. We've had plenty of members who disagree with NS, the ending, etc. As long as they are respectful in their disagreement — to the story and to other members — then they can stay. It's really simple. And the mods are of one mind about this.

 

It's ok to be frustrated, and it's ok to ignore debates that you no longer want to be involved in. Totally ok. But frustrating debates do not always mean s/he's a troll.  

 

If at any point the tone/level/courtesy of this or any conversation on the site veers into name-calling or outlandishness, then we'll step in. 

 

It's also worth remembering that 'Naruto' is still an ongoing series with Boruto. And I sort of half expect some revisits to the old series from Kishi and Co. as anniversaries roll around or through build-up for Boruto. So we can have new fans visiting as well as old fans returning at any point.

 

Anway, take it all in stride. This is still NS's home. No amount of differing opinions will change that.