687 replies to this topic

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

I will say it Again "I do I understand what you are saying" is not the same as I agree  its that simple  then Naruto goes to say but my body moves on its own Sasuke was telling Naruto to not trow away his life for someone like Sakura and Kakashi that he has to stay alive  the whole purpose of Naruto's line is to refute Sasuke's whole opinion because Sakura and Kakashi were precious to him   it wasn't about Naruto thinking that they are useless at all or even thinking about that in the first place it was about him protecting what is precious to him unlike Sasuke   also you are discarding his expression he was angry at Sasuke , furthermore Sakura's line "Sasuke is right but thank you Naruto"  while Sakura thinks that Sasuke is right she thanked Naruto for saying that he deem them important she wouldn't have tanked Naruto in the first place if he meant that they are indeed useless that is ridiculous  this wasn't about Naruto acknowledging them as useless or not such a thing was never stated by him . Also what you guys are saying  goes against what he said 2 chapters ago and he praised them  their abilities so its OOC for Naruto to think that in the first place  
 
But here is how Naruto thinks they are useless . Now Will you look at that he thinks Kakashi is great 

Sasuke at first was explaining that he and Naruto were important and if one of them dies, it's the end of humanity, and on which they cant let themselves to save Kakashi and Sakura all the time and giving the enemy opening and then he procceeds speaking about he should not care about Sasuke and Kakashi.
Naruto says that he understand but cannot let his friends being killed because they're important using the same phrase Sasuke told him when he fought Haku.

Also Naruto was angry at the fact Sasuke would let them die.

Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 11 June 2014 - 10:27 AM.

[Apollo]

I really hated this chapter. Mind you Kaguya was just fantastic but in general I hated how sakura and kakashi were treated. Personally i would have ratheer they fell into the genjutsu rather than being bashed constantly by king sasuke <.<

Edited by Apollo, 11 June 2014 - 10:28 AM.

[Sakamaki Izayoi]

If you really think about it. Everyone's development is all tied back to Naruto. Even Sasuke's. Why? Well, it is as simple as saying "he is the main character."

So I guess everyone, except for Naruto, lacks their own light and they all just satellite Naruto. Some closer to others.

Think of Naruto like a big solar system. The planets are most important characters and their moons which are minor characters. With Naruto, the big YELLOW Sun, in the center of it all.

Hmm...this would also tie back into the Heaven and Earth concept. Fridge Brilliance ho!!!

(BTW, Sasuke can be Uranus)

You're right on the part that somehow they're linked to Naruto but not all development is linked to him.
Sasuke had his moments that weren't linked like when he fought Itachi and the whole revenge thing while Naruto was after him.
But Sakura had none, what about her personal developments?
Hatred, her own personal goal which doesnt exists.

I would even dare to say that Ino got better development than Sakura with way less screentime and the only downside is the Sasuke nonsense.

[FireFox]

You're trying to be complex and twist the moment in favour of brining Sakura into a positive light, although i expect bias but it's a NS forum so is expected.
Sasuke at first was explaining that he and Naruto were important and if one of them dies, it's the end of humanity, and on which they cant let themselves to save Kakashi and Sakura all the time and giving the enemy opening and then he procceeds speaking about he should not care about Sasuke and Kakashi.
Naruto says that he understand but cannot let his friends being killed because they're important using the same phrase Sasuke told him when he fought Haku.

I'm not being anything in here so cut that out i can say the same thing for you guys  i'm not twisting anything you guys are doing that by saying Sakura was hart broken by what Naruto said when after that she tanked him you guys are not making sense with this in here and make Naruto OOC . 

 

Again how did Naruto admit that they are useless or not important just because he understands that he's one of the Two Key to bringing down Kaguya ? Even you just now said  he Understands that he can't die but you are not explaining to me how him knowing that he's one of the Two Keys makes him think of them as useless ? I will bring Neji in here again when he said that Naruto is the key to their strategy but that didn't made the others useless did it now ? The point wasn't about him understanding admitting that  they are useless (which is false even in this chapter not to mention 2 chapters ago) but not to risk his life for them because he's to important which Naruto disagreed with that  . 

 

And as long as you guys keep saying that i will continue to use this of how Naruto thinks that they can't do anything or are useless . Now this is the real Naruto not the OOC one you make him to be .

Edited by NarutoFireFoxUzumaki, 11 June 2014 - 10:52 AM.

[FireFox]

LOL that was hilarious   it would have been perfect if someone shoot Sasuke in the head in the end LOL XD

Edited by NarutoFireFoxUzumaki, 11 June 2014 - 10:55 AM.

[redrose3443]

@ Dαrkrєrsŧ

 

I think the main reason why Sakura's development depends on the boys, is because that's the only place she's needed to grow and has experienced hardship at. Kishi portrayed her as a normal girl, the only "lost" she suffered was Sasuke leaving. Both her parents are alive and safe, while Ino just lost her father and is a third part of Ino-Shika-Cho. She's needed for them to complete their best attack and her teammates aren't always powering up every so often.

 

Sakura's main problem is not matching up to the boys. She made it her goal to be a worthy member of the team, not because she had to, but because she wanted to. She could have been satisfied with her current powers and the fact that she was able to heal the SA and keep Naruto alive, but she's not. Her combat abilities are lacking compared to Naruto and Sasuke and she is of no help atm.

 

Sasuke, Naruto, and Kakshi all had their own personal baggage that helped them grow, but Sakura didn't which is why her development is mainly based on T7.

[Gojira]

I don't get Naruto's remark or why it would Sakrua feel better (I get the reference ofcourse I just don't get why it would make Sakura tear up its not like she was there to hear that or anything)

[Inferno180]

I can't believe I'm the only one who thinks that NS moment is the last thing I want right now.  
 
And what a classic H&E reaction. No convincing, no reasoning, and the "if-you-don't-agree-you-are-kitten" posts.

I don't call it a ns moment, more like an anti SS moment where naruto says he understand sasukes point but otherwise says he still saved them because he cares about them. That protecting comrades is more important than simply just getting the job done with their abilities, like naruto said. He understood sasukes deal but was not going to embrace his mindset when he was following the first deal Kakashi told them about never abandoning comrades and otherwise bringing up the bridge event as a means to say this is when you protected me when I was useless so for all reasons, my body just moved on its own.

[FireFox]

I don't get Naruto's remark or why it would Sakrua feel better (I get the reference ofcourse I just don't get why it would make Sakura tear up its not like she was there to hear that or anything)

Well you see when Naruto first says "I Do" she's shocked because she didn't expect of all the people Naruto to be the one to agree with Sasuke's philosophy i would say she felt betrayed  but that was not the case as we go to the next page Naruto refutes that completely and then you see Sakura teared up because she was relieved and  moved by Naruto's words because he supported them . It wasn't about she being there or hearing that P1 S/N talk it was about  Naruto's words what he meant they were still clear that's why she thanked him . 

Edited by NarutoFireFoxUzumaki, 11 June 2014 - 11:29 AM.

[Tsuki Hoshino]

Sakura's sad faces this chapter are killing me. 

seriously...

I think whats really bothersome is everyone getting upset at her for being upset that the guy she knew as a kid, the guy she thought was so cool is a complete bastard. That the boy who risked his life for a fellow comrade has turned into Sasuke. It IS SAD. Especially considering her dream was to have team seven complete, for her to be able to stand besides the two of them as equals and that as of this second is an impossible dream. 

For a split second she thinks NARUTO agree's with Sasuke and the look she made nearly killed me. 

The last two chapters seem have been all about crushing Sakura's spirit one way or another and its painful to watch. 

I don't feel upset or angry at her for being disillusioned, because what else is she supposed to do at this point? there is nothing she can do. I still think that because of the way things are going Kishimoto is going to build her back up because after tearing her down so much its the only way to go. 

Also, look at how much Sasuke cares about Team 7...oh wait. you can't because HE DOESN'T. Well, at least he's honest about his lack of feeling. 

Also, Kaguya is a yandere towards Chakra. Cute. 
 

Edited by Tsuki Hoshino, 11 June 2014 - 11:30 AM.

[narusaku256]

Well, can we really stop this debate? I mean it is not in nature of Naruto to deem anyone useless and based on what I read, he just understood Sasuke's point but preferred to stick to his ideology. The point is....we got a 'Thank you' from Sakura to Naruto which is atleast better than her frowning upon Sasuke. What's more...she even shed a tear for Naruto

[FireFox]

Sasuke this chapter toward SS 

[MoonStar]

I don't get Naruto's remark or why it would Sakrua feel better (I get the reference ofcourse I just don't get why it would make Sakura tear up its not like she was there to hear that or anything)

 

I originally interpreted it as Naruto knowing that Sasuke was only going to save him, and so he chose to stick close to Sakura and Kakashi but after rereading I'm not so sure. That was a very vague exchange.

Edited by MoonStar, 11 June 2014 - 11:51 AM.

[Kanae]

Kishi really could give two f**cks about Sakura. She could easily thrown the kunai to save Obito. No she does nothing. 

 

 

I love Sakura but I dont see anything happening for her. I feel really bad for her. 

I will be the first to admit that I've never truly cared about whether Sakura gets more power-ups or not, partly because I'm not invested in power-levels and partly because she's powerful enough as is for a human girl, imo; but I have a hard time believing Kishi isn't going somewhere with this.

 

This is Sakura's self-esteem taking hit after hit in each chapter due to Sasuke's words. It has to bounce back eventually, she has earned it; after all her hard work, there's no way Kishi will let her stay down by the end of this fight. Not when this has always been such a big part of her character and of her development.

 

And for it to bounce back, she has to feel useful again; and as such, do something important in whatever measure or capacity might be available to her. 

 

It's just a matter of time, imo. The story itself calls for it.

Edited by Kanae, 11 June 2014 - 11:53 AM.

[rikakim94]

Guys, I think it's more than just "you're useless"

I think what Sasuke was insinuating was that should it come to it, let them die. That was what he was getting at when he said 'understand'? Naruto was affirming that he understood what Sasuke was getting at--and he understands that it's important that the two of them don't die and do whatever it takes...

 

BUT, in situations where people he loves (despite whether or not they can do anything in the situation) his body will move on its own... something that Sasuke once understood, having done it himself. 

 

That makes Sakura's shock all the more understandable. She knows she can't really do anything here, and while Naruto before was like 'teammwork!' I think the gravity of the situation isn't lost on anybody. Sure it hurts that they're not of help--and I don't really blame Sakura or Kakashi for it at all, in fact I'm far more interested in them than Naruto and Sasuke for it. I think what was more shocking and frightening was to hear that if it came to it, they'd be a sacrifice.

What Sasuke is saying is true--between Kakashi and Sakura dying over Naruto and Sasuke's chance to save humanity, of course they should be 'sacrificed'. They can't contribute, and they can't risk being burdens to the two that can do something. Still, relief that Naruto can't just cast them aside... of course she'd be grateful.

 

Like others, I really felt for Sakura this chapter. I don't want to see it continue like this--I want her to do something. She's amazing, but she's always being compared against really unfair odds. The only thing I wish is that she'd stop coming to expect anything of Sasuke. That guy isn't worth it. I'm so looking forward to this fight being over and having him hightail it away from Team 7, away from Konoha, off with Karin whom he doesn't deserve at all, and do his own thing. Get his toxic presence away--I don't care if you're reincarnated brothers the SasuNaru bond has sucked so bad all Part 2. 

 

The only Sasuke is Part 1 Sasuke. 

 

I already dropped the manga at this point because of this i can not continue reading a manga were the main female herione gets treated like utter crap almost every. single. chapter.Its basically fan service to the the haters at this point. You know it really really really confuses me does kishi really cares about sakura or how he treats her or he just writing this manga for the sake of sasuke? I mean he is the driving point of this manga at this point. Naruto just tags along with whatever he says whether if it hurts sakura or not or team 7 in general. Its not looking good at all this is the core reason why i do not expect anything from kakashi or sakura at this point other than commenting on sasunarus ability or whatever. Speaking about sasunaru bond this bond was terrible through out part 2 and it became a lot worse this chapter proves it that its a intoxicating bond that does none to benefit team 7.

 

Overall I just want this manga end already its just not worth it anymore. When every chapter passes by all i see sakura getting treated like crap,boring pacing, unnecessary sasunaru bond thats toxic to the group and so on.  

 

The only reason why i keep up with this site for news is to see any improvements of this manga has made so far and other stuff, but sadly no consistent improvement has been made so far. 

 

Until i see good news i won't look at this manga not even a glimpse from this point and onward and i'll try to keep my word this time since the disappointment has already got to me BIG TIME.     

Edited by rikakim94, 11 June 2014 - 12:06 PM.

[BlueStarSaber]

As for the people complaining that Sakura is been useless I gave up a long time ago. Everytime they read a chapter they think they're reading Fairy Tail or OP where female characters are toe to toe with the male characters. But this is not Hiro Mashima's manga or Oda's manga, its freaking Kishimoto's manga Naruto. You can't expect Sakura pulling an Erza or a Rukia so please stop you're whining and look at things in a positive light. Like the fact that she's right there with Naruto and not dreaming with the rest (I agree with James about all of them been useless right now).

 

I wouldn't really say Oda makes his women toe to toe with Men in the manga in fact most seem to be really weak compared to most of the guys.

[六道仙人]

my opinion is: I don't think that Naruto has implicity considered Sakura and Kakashi as usuless ones. Also because, not even one minute before this, Naruto praised Kakashi for his genius to save Sakura and Obito. Naruto said he UNDERSTOOD the Sasuke's point of view, not to AGREE with that. They are two different things. It's like when, during the Zabuza saga, Sasuke saves Naruto... In that case Naruto should be regarded as "useless" too, and yet Sasuke's body moved on its own will. The same Naruto yells at him asking why he did a such action, which he was wanting implicitly to tell him that it was not something necessary to the point of sacrificing his own life for a doomed person.
In a nutshell, Naruto isn't agreeing with Sasuke about the fact that Sakura and Kakashi are useless because both of them (Naruto and Sasuke) are those who can save the world. Naruto is just saying that he can understand his POV but then he overwhelms the sense of Sasuke's words and backfires him by pulling out the situation where Sasuke saved him from Haku.
In other words again, the Naruto that Sasuke has saved from Haku was not considered as useless but as a precious person. Just as Sakura and Kakashi are not two people useless for Naruto, but two precious people to him. The same cannot be said for Sasuke, and this is the big difference between them. It seems that Kishimoto has accentuated it in this chapter as well. Someone has said that Sasuke respects more the power than the person himself. And I am more agree than ever with this.

[tekopi]

I agree that Naruto thinks Kakashi and Sakura are useful in making strategies. However, this chapter, Sasuke has explained his thoughts to Naruto, that when it comes down to it, he will sacrifice Kakashi and Sakura because they cannot do anything in this situation. This also includes about their strategy making abilities. And while, Naruto doesn't agree with sacrificing them, he does agree that Kakashi and Sakura can't do anything.

 

Naruto's statements didn't cause mistrust since it was true. But it did hurt her a lot. He was always saying how great she was. That same guy, agreed that she wasn't. I don't blame Naruto, but at the same time I can understand how his statement can hurt Sakura a lot. 

 

 

I think that is what this chapter was meant to show; more and more flaw in Sasuke's decision-making by shooting down people that he sees as weak & useless and didn't give a crap about their actual latent abilities. In a way, this also increase the foundation of what the side-characters has been doing; relating him to Madara. This flaw, in the way I see it, is a part of a long-setup for certain character development, in this case that I see since the moment Sasuke keep on showing this gruesome part of his, is Sakura. Why I bring her name up? Well, because I keep on seeing how she has been twitching and hurting by his bare words, eventhough it was a true facts for this battle of Madara/Kaguya arc. And we know the truth is the hardest to swallow, this is what she had been keep on doing in this battle. And I can't disagree that Naruto does see that Sakura and Kakashi's are unable to fend for themselves right now or even contribute in term of strength. Because that is the truth. However, unlike Sasuke who had been keep on killing people off his priority chart, Naruto put their well-being his top priority unconsciously. Which is why he relates the situation with who Sasuke is in the 'past'. I think in the future, we might be provided with a scene that proving how much Naruto will need them both in term of contributing the slightest idea in tactical, especially from Kakashi since he is a war veteran + former ANBU + well-experienced Jounin.

 

 

She is hurting. But I don't think it is a lot. She does twitch+pure shock+about to be depressed when Naruto said he understands Sasuke point. But it has been cleared the next when she hears his full clarification. I see it as a simple situation, She is depressed and displeased with the 'openly mocking machine' statement, but feeling grateful that the 'clueless obnoxious idiot' still value teamwork above all and value their ability, even the smallest contribution. A pity that it will not in display for quite a moment. To strengthen my simple view, after Sasuke finished his sentence, the next panel was the 'unsatisfied yet that's the truth expression' from Naruto & Sakura. Then Naruto's quote, which lead to 'surprised expression' of her. And closed by Naruto's clarifications & reminiscent, leads to the 'accepting the truth' from Sakura. Thus, seeing how the situation is, I see that Sakura will not be overly hurt by him, not to the point that it will taint her self-esteem.

Edited by tekopi, 11 June 2014 - 12:12 PM.

[Phantom_999]

YAY, Sasuke is sinking SS himself!!!! and Sakura's thank you to Naruto is heart-warming and adorable!!!!
 

I didn't take it as an offence, don't worry. It's just that she could think about her situation of near death with Kakashi rather than her emotions concerning her two boys. I'm not angry at that. I don't mind her being like that, she could just have had one thought about her situation adding to her thought about the 2. Just one panel and I would have been happy. But that's okay. 
 
I know there is nothing she can do, but as I said above, I would have liked her to thought abou her own situation rather than think about Naruto and Sasuke only. But I repeat, that's aokay, I don't really mind, it was just a first impression of the chapter.

 
Then there is no need to type "Sakura is pissing me off" is there?

Edited by Phantom_999, 11 June 2014 - 12:10 PM.

[narusaku256]

A question from me...

When Naruto said, "I do" was it that Sakura's expression were like a shocked person because she thought even Naruto deemed them useless and later got changed due to Naruto's words?

Edited by narusaku256, 11 June 2014 - 12:14 PM.