515 replies to this topic

[MangaReader]

this better not be sakura's only fight.....

Then Kishi really is trolling us...

[ciardha]

You have my permision.

Mine too, perfect example of a western reader that doesn't understand how to read manga. It's what makes visiting forums so exasperating to me sometimes. Sakura is just thinking how colossally wrong her crush on Sasuke was. Memories of feelings are powerful things in manga, and in Kishimoto's even moreso than usual. That guy doesn't know he brought to the surface bad stuff Sakura is working through. Sakura thought she had banished even the memory of her feelings for Sasuke. Anyone old enough to have had even a past friendship with someone who betrayed them, turning out to be a very different person than you thought they were, (Or for us adults another situation- a coworker that at first seemed decent enough, but turned out to be a very hurtful person...) should be able to immediately relate to what Sakura is sorting through. You say to yourself that you are over and done with them, but it's not that simple, you've suffered harsh psychological damage, recovering from that isn't simple, and it's that much harder if you have some happy memories of them...

NHer needs to reread chapter 469-70. Naruto says Sakura was "lying to herself" not outright lying. No one says Sakura is lying about being in love with Naruto, not even Naruto, in fact Naruto is accepting of her being in love with him by chapter 470, he just thinks she is still fangirling over Sasuke as well. Sai makes it clear that's it's memories of her feelings about Sasuke that Naruto is sensing, that who brings joy to her heart is Naruto. Kishimoto said point blank Sakura was being 100% truthful about being in love with Naruto and believing that she had banished even the memories of feelings for Sasuke from her heart. Like I said above, the later isn't so easy to do. One only has to look at the Sanin. Tsunade never had any kind of attraction to Orochimaru at all- and came to dislike and distrust him long before Hiruzen and Jiraiya did. Tsunade says she "never liked or trusted" Orochimaru, but she was in the same denial Sakura was about her memories of her feelings. Tsunade never really had to face her denial like Sakura did, but when Orochimaru was killed it was obvious the team mate bond was still there concerning him for both Tsunade and Jiraiya, and in her last conversation with Jiraiya it was Tsunade who brings up a fond memory of Orochimaru and themselves as Genin. This is after years and years and with much less emotionally entangled feelings connected to it.

Sakura is feeling deeply ashamed, thinking her powerful memories of feelings means something is seriously wrong with her, memories of old feelings of love are especially painful and hard to work through, she may even think with self-loathing that she still harbors feelings for someone who never liked her, someone who has turned into someone basically completely consumed by the darkest evil, Kakashi's comments to her certainly didn't help alleviate her anxiety, he really should have been clearer, but Kakashi has his own intense bonds to his old favorite student- his threat was empty and Sasuke knew it even before Kakashi uselessly tried to reason with a person willingly embracing a very violent psychosis. That's why Sasuke was completely contemptuous to Kakashi. Note, he wasn't that way to either Naruto or Sakura. Sakura he knew was a threat, if not now, she was very close to being able to kill him to protect Naruto, save the world, and save Sasuke from himself- like a rabid dog . Naruto though, was the only one Sasuke actually listened to, the only one who did get through to him.

Sakura has chosen Naruto and loves him with all her heart entirely separate from what she's sorting through about Sasuke

[Yoshimoya]

In fact, the more I analyze it, the more I think this could help our pairing in the future.

Hah. Yes, that tends to happen when you personally support something and want to see it happen.

You over think it to the point that you make yourself believe it is actually true. But seriously, that didn't help our pairing. Sorry.

[Paptala]

Here's the thing though. Take it at face value and the point is that Sakura doesn't like having feelings for Sasuke. Earlier on, I've heard SasuSaku fans claim she had come to terms with loving him after their confrontation in the Kage Summit Arc. Well this scene clearly states otherwise. Based on previous build-up, the fact remains that her feelings ARE changing. It's just a lot slower than we want.
The bottom line is that this one panel that everyone's freaking out over just proves two things.

1.) Sakura has lingering feelings for Sasuke.
2.) She is distressed by those feelings.

There, that's a neutral perspective, no over-analyzing. Does that look like SasuSaku to anyone?

Couldn't agree more It is not a positive thing for the pairing that Sakura is not happy to be in love with Sasuke - it is Sakura's feelings for Sasuke being once again being presented as a negative thing.

It's not necessarily a great thing for NaruSaku either, mind you, but it is definitely not some great plus for SS either, imho. Because Sasuke still isn't any more likely to start reciprocating Sakura's feelings regardless.

I'm sorry. We're just going to have to agree to wildly disagree. These two statements are fairy ridiculous to me, sorry. One, it is not and never has been Sasuke's nature to 'holla' at a girl. For his character to pull a complete 360 like that, would make the manga and Kishimoto's skill at writing it laughable. And two, SasuSaku can not be a threat if there is no pairing to begin with. One sided love/affection =/= a threatening canon pairing.

I agree - a lot of people, myself included initially, are forgetting that each pairing has another character involved that needs to reciprocate feelings before it is canon. Sakura is confirmed to be in love with Sasuke, Hinata is confirmed to be in love with Naruto, and Naruto is confirmed to be in love with Sakura.

How is it that SS and NH are suddenly end game, while NS despite being on the same exact standing at this point, is considered dead?

this better not be sakura's only fight.....

I agree - I want to see Sakura kicking more butt! Kishi began to deliver in this chapter, and he needs to keep going with it!

[hotwyr]

Sorry, I don't have time to write a proper reply oh and btw: I'MMMM BAAAAACK!!!!

*ahem* back on topic.

1) sakura ELBOWED the zetsu clone into the ground, epic much?

2) for everyone saying that we're picking at the little details, i say: Kishi draws every single LINE in this thing, if there's a detail there, he's put it in on PURPOSE

3) Sakura feels guilt about her love for Sasuke IMO... where that takes us.. we'll see.

4) I REALLY wanna see more of naruto's powers, i think this "fight" with the kages isn't gonna be a physical one though With Naruto's new fangled powers he has more of an understanding of what people are FEELING. With that he'll become wiser with words again, just my opinion.

5) Naruto is the only manga i bother reading anymore It seems that every chapter Kishi is keeping us hooked, keeping us interested while still keeping the story line moving and it seems to be avoiding the stereotypical "filler" panels or chapters to stretch it out. I think Kishi wants to do the end of this justice. Well done Kishi I'm definitely enjoying your work, and if anyone wines about sh*tty chapters, i say GTFO Every single chapter is gold.

My 5c

LATEEERS!!!

[Sakura Blossoms]

I agree - a lot of people, myself included initially, are forgetting that each pairing has another character involved that needs to reciprocate feelings before it is canon. Sakura is confirmed to be in love with Sasuke, Hinata is confirmed to be in love with Naruto, and Naruto is confirmed to be in love with Sakura.

How is it that SS and NH are suddenly end game, while NS despite being on the same exact standing at this point, is considered dead?

Very excellent and crucial point made.

[Catwho]

All right, this thread and chapter have drawn another NaruSaku lurker out of the woodwork.

My take on 540 --Click here to view--

Sakura had a crush on Sasuke, a suki love that has remained unrequited for 540 chapters. She is not proud of the way she acted and the choices she made when she was a silly child, and having an adult suitor (albeit a not-very-serious one) who thinks so highly of her saying that anyone she has loved must be a great guy is the height of irony. Sasuke is a lot of things, but he is not and never will be "a great guy." To use a TV trope, he's passed the Moral Event Horizon already.

Sakura can't disagree with cast-suitor to his face, because it's not a discussion you have with one of your patients, so she just goes "Ha..." a noncommittal way of agreeing without actually saying you agree in Japanese.

This is not a NaruSaku moment. Nor is it a SasuSaku moment. It is a Sakura moment, one in which her character develops just a bit more.

[Yoshimoya]

I'm sorry. We're just going to have to agree to wildly disagree. These two statements are fairy ridiculous to me, sorry. One, it is not and never has been Sasuke's nature to 'holla' at a girl. For his character to pull a complete 360 like that, would make the manga and Kishimoto's skill at writing it laughable. And two, SasuSaku can not be a threat if there is no pairing to begin with. One sided love/affection =/= a threatening canon pairing.

Eek. I knew I shouldn't have used the word 'holla' and talk like a hormonal teenager. My bad on that part -.- made my argument seem stupid I guess.
If SasuSaku doesn't threat NaruSaku whatsoever then what does? When I say SasuSaku I mean their overall relationship and feelings. I guess I should say more like... Sakura's feelings is the obstacle in the road for NaruSaku. She can't decide between the two?

Idk my head is hurting now lol... I feel like I'm irking you. Hah. I probably am. My bad.

[ShippudenGirl]

I'm gonna ignore the little pairing thing for now and skip over. There's so many ways someone could take Sakura's image of Sasuke (I personally see it as her regretting having ever had any feelings, romantic wise, for him.)

[The Tax-Man]

Eek. I knew I shouldn't have used the word 'holla' and talk like a hormonal teenager. My bad on that part -.- made my argument seem stupid I guess.
If SasuSaku doesn't threat NaruSaku whatsoever then what does? When I say SasuSaku I mean their overall relationship and feelings. I guess I should say more like... Sakura's feelings is the obstacle in the road for NaruSaku. She can't decide between the two?

Idk my head is hurting now lol... I feel like I'm irking you. Hah. I probably am. My bad.

Meh let's just wait. She probably moved on and is regretting the past, but maybe not. Besides, it's no fun without conflict, is it?

And the Sasuke and Hinata part, I felt, was Kishi just milking us and actually juxtaposing (Is that the word?) the conflicts on both sides. Putting them side-by-side. Well... not really CONFLICT, but you get it. Anyway, I've only seen this when the truth is actually being kicked in the face. Just like when a ball and bearing have to come together, they'll show how the ball is jagged and the bearing is rusted. Bad example, but good technique to delude some while making others smile.

Edited by The Tax-Man, 26 May 2011 - 04:17 AM.

[MangaReader]

My sense of comedic value still makes me believe Kishi just drew Sasuke in because we haven't seen him for some time now

[The Tax-Man]

Wow... Why didn't I think of that?

[Ani]

Dang, so many posts were made by you guys it took forever to catch up.

So proud of Sakura being all smart and kicking butt in this chapter. And only time will tell what happens next in the manga that could be a plus for NaruSaku. We'll just have to find out.

[Super Boom]

Hah. Yes, that tends to happen when you personally support something and want to see it happen.

You over think it to the point that you make yourself believe it is actually true. But seriously, that didn't help our pairing. Sorry.

Alright, before I respond to this, let me apologize in advance if I sound overly critical.
First off, you missed my point in the post you quoted. Kishi has no reason to bring up Sakura's guilt over loving Sasuke in that infamous panel. He also had no reason to introduce that love-letter ninja other than to give us an inside look at Sakura's feelings. And for umpteenth time, they were not happy feelings. This isn't over-analysis, it's painfully obvious. The only possible reason Kishi would introduce Sakura's feelings back into plot would be to resolve them on some level. And Sakura looking sad with Sasuke in the background is hardly a resolution.

Second, after reading some of your previous posts, I have to ask, are you really a NaruSaku shipper? To have your faith swayed so easily by ONE PANEL seems completely absurd to me. If you want to jump ship, go right ahead. But stop trying to take us down with you, as this ship isn't even close to sinking. I highly recommend reading ciardha's earlier post; it pretty much completely illustrates the context behind the panel.

Finally, since you're bringing my personal shipping opinions into the mix, let me tell you a little story. Only a few years ago, I actually was a pretty avid NaruHina shipper. I would look at obvious the NaruSaku hints and just wave them off, no matter how important they were to the characters' development. After a while, NaruSaku just became impossible to ignore. Logic and Reason finally took over, and I saw how this is the only pairing that even remotely makes sense.
My point in bringing this up is that it's perfectly fine if you want to jump ship. I did it and came out unphased. But before you do, I highly recommend you consider the context of the entire manga, how Naruto and Sakura's characters have evolved, and all the previous evidence of their blossoming relationship, and tell me, is one panel really enough to make you abandon ship?

Edited by Boom...Winning, 26 May 2011 - 04:26 AM.

[The Tax-Man]

Alright, before I respond to this, let me apologize in advance if I sound overly critical.
First off, you missed my point in the post you quoted. Kishi has no reason to bring up Sakura's guilt over loving Sasuke in that infamous panel. He also had no reason to introduce that love-letter ninja other than to give us an inside look at Sakura's feelings. And for umpteenth time, they were not happy feelings. This isn't over-analysis, it's painfully obvious. The only possible reason Kishi would introduce Sakura's feelings back into plot would be to resolve them on some level. And Sakura looking sad with Sasuke in the background is hardly a resolution.

No one says it like you. No need to overreact, people. It is obvious that she still holds feelings for him. Before this, we were all saying that, now we suddenly say she forgot about him? It would be stupid to not have it resolved and over with. I admit I didn't exactly think about it that way, but I agree that a resolution is needed. I still go by my side-to-side thing though.

[MangaReader]

Finally, since you're bringing my personal shipping opinions into the mix, let me tell you a little story. Only a few years ago, I actually was a pretty avid NaruHina shipper. I would look at obvious the NaruSaku hints and just wave them off, no matter how important they were to the characters' development. After a while, NaruSaku just became impossible to ignore. Logic and Reason finally took over, and I saw how this is the only pairing that even remotely makes sense.
My point in bringing this up is that it's perfectly fine if you want to jump ship. I did it and came out unphased. But before you do, I highly recommend you consider the context of the entire manga, how Naruto and Sakura's characters have evolved, and all the previous evidence of their blossoming relationship, and tell me, is one panel really enough to make you abandon ship?

Wow, you being a NaruHina fan at first converting over to the NaruSaku side just strengthens my faith in this pairing, plus I agree with everything you stated. Couldn't of said it better myself

Edited by MangaReader, 26 May 2011 - 04:40 AM.

[Ani]

I think there are a few people on the site who used to like SasuSaku and NaruHina, but then started liking NaruSaku. I was one of them way back when I was first watching the anime. Then after the PoaL, I was starting to like NaruSaku instead. Of course, I love it now and it will always be my Naruto OTP.

[Yoshimoya]

Alright, before I respond to this, let me apologize in advance if I sound overly critical.
First off, you missed my point in the post you quoted. Kishi has no reason to bring up Sakura's guilt over loving Sasuke in that infamous panel. He also had no reason to introduce that love-letter ninja other than to give us an inside look at Sakura's feelings. And for umpteenth time, they were not happy feelings. This isn't over-analysis, it's painfully obvious. The only possible reason Kishi would introduce Sakura's feelings back into plot would be to resolve them on some level. And Sakura looking sad with Sasuke in the background is hardly a resolution.

Second, after reading some of your previous posts, I have to ask, are you really a NaruSaku shipper? To have your faith swayed so easily by ONE PANEL seems completely absurd to me. If you want to jump ship, go right ahead. But stop trying to take us down with you, as this ship isn't even close to sinking. I highly recommend reading ciardha's earlier post; it pretty much completely illustrates the context behind the panel.

Finally, since you're bringing my personal shipping opinions into the mix, let me tell you a little story. Only a few years ago, I actually was a pretty avid NaruHina shipper. I would look at obvious the NaruSaku hints and just wave them off, no matter how important they were to the characters' development. After a while, NaruSaku just became impossible to ignore. Logic and Reason finally took over, and I saw how this is the only pairing that even remotely makes sense.
My point in bringing this up is that it's perfectly fine if you want to jump ship. I did it and came out unphased. But before you do, I highly recommend you consider the context of the entire manga, how Naruto and Sakura's characters have evolved, and all the previous evidence of their blossoming relationship, and tell me, is one panel really enough to make you abandon ship?

O.O My God, what did I say? -.- It seems you have missed some of my points too, but that's okay. Miscommunication there. In fact, your whole response seems like you saw all the bad in my recent posts. *sigh* I seem to be getting on a lot of people's bad sides today. I apologize for any indication that I presented showing that I wanted to abandon ship. Uh. No. That is crazy I've loved and known NaruSaku from the start. I'd rather not continue this since it sounds like we're arguing instead of debating, however, I'd like to clear up one thing. And I gotta say, I'm pretty offended for being accused of it.

I'm not abandoning NaruSaku... I simply debated my thoughts and speculations on all of this. And I get accused of switching couples? Hah. I might as well not debate then huh. Seriously dude, chill out. I seriously hope you get it into your head that I support NaruSaku through and through though. This is the first time I took a more critical approach to NaruSaku and their chance of happening, SasuSaku, and whatnot. And I guess I sounded way too SasuSaku or something...? Hah. Idk. whatever. goodbye. if you want to clear up things that bad about you accusing me of being a narusaku abandoner then pm me, I dont wanna tarnish this post for the others.

[Sakura Blossoms]

Idk my head is hurting now lol... I feel like I'm irking you. Hah. I probably am. My bad.

*laughs and waves it off* You're not, trust me

I just tend to lay out my points in a very straightforward manner whenever I decide to throw my hat into debate

[ShippudenGirl]

Damn, the forum is HOT today! Whoo~ this chapter attracted a ton of attention!