31720 replies to this topic

[Catra]

dont forget they can always reboot it, comics have been reset/rebooted/retold with twists all the time. people will always have their favorite stories they enjoyed.

[ultranx]

Let's not go their please and thanks. I do see the problem with LOK because I was confused by the development of the pairing as I saw zero in that pairing.

You can not change people sexuality by a filp of a coin.

wasn't trying to change anyone's sexuality, I just am one of the few that sees the bad thing of introducing that stuff in a kids show. do you want kids to want to be gay or lesbians right away and make it less likely for kids to get with different genders, or do you want things to be normal like before where they get older and decide for themselves without outside influence? I mean even if its a low chance, it does raise the chance of lowering the amount of normal male/female couples and children born in the us, and we don't want what happens in japan to happen here. maybe I'm thinking too much about it but yeah....

 

 

 

Because god forbid we acknowledge the fact that not everyone is straight, right? How terrible.

did I say that? no, I said I'm not into that kinda thing but am okay with people that like it even if I don't approve in it, that's you being a jerk and not reading my entire comment correctly and judging me

Edited by ultranx, 06 February 2016 - 09:33 AM.

[James S Cassidy]

dont forget they can always reboot it, comics have been reset/rebooted/retold with twists all the time. people will always have their favorite stories they enjoyed.

And they did with the new 52. That's what I don't get...So many universes it is a typical Superman and Lois Lane which is fine. So many hundreds of stories with Superman and Lois. I have no problem with Superman and Lois nor Superman and Wonder Woman, but they make one comic universe where Superman and Wonder Woman get together and everyone loses their minds.

Why? It is one universe. If they want Lois and Superman again, read one of the other universes.

[VanitasDS76491]

 

"I guess also technically Superman and Wonder Women too, but then people are screaming for them to break up forever and have Clark with Lois....and they are probably going to get their way"

 

why did superman and wonder women even become a thing in the first place? all the retcons in dc are insane and retarded, heck I don't read the comics but I read enough on the wiki, do those writers have no shame turning a superboy into a villain from losing his universe and then right when he changes his ways and they put in "oh we promise to not torture you to turn you into a villain again" with their self insert writer selves then retcon  that and torture the guy making him become a villain again then seal him in the source wall? SERIOUSLY!??? see this is why marvel is better than dc, and why I prefer anime and the comic cartoons/movies over comic books. there was never a problem with the original superman backstory, I would have been fine if it stayed the same with the fortress and crystals and the lois thing, but they just had to blow him out of proportion because he's so popular right? sigh...

 

 

 

holy cow you like most of the couples I do, narusaku, kataang, pokeshipping ashxmisty, tommyxkimberly, wesxjen,   takatoxrika,androsxashley, soraxkairi. I prefer davisxkari, I'm the odd one out in that case, also dbz gohanxvidel(everyone likes gohanxlime why? 0.0 ) megaman geoxsonia/megamanxharp note(why does everyone like him with luna, she's a freaking yandere...), keikoxyusuke, sonicxamy, g gundam domonxrain, kiritoxasuna(I like the show for kirito's personality and the concept of the show, but the harem crap I'm not into whatsoever),pokemon ranger benxsummer, mmbn lanxmayl, danny phantom dannyxsam, power rangers jakexgia, digimon marcusxyoshie, kenichixmiu, meliodasxelizabeth. I'm not a big shipper more like I support them and that's it xD

 

Thanks for that Yusuke and Keiko is a good one since I just got back into series and am on ep 85 of series in so far my favorite arc the chapter black arc with one of my favorite villains Sensui better than anything Naruto has producted. Gohan and Videl were one of the best parts of the buu arc cause they had development over the whole arc especially during the start when they first met and  teaching her to fly. At least Wes and Jen from Time Force had a reason for why they couldn't be together. Lan and Maylu is a good one as a Danny and Sam,

 

[Catra]

im more comfortable with superman and lois. but i've heard a lot of bad things about this new superman i choose not to read them anyway. see people? you dont HAVE to read em. you can just wait for another reboot. me though, im perfectly happy right now with the dceu (or cinematic verse) for now. worst case scenario dawn of justice is gonna be ironman 2 all over again.

 

as for the batman v superman part, well i got a feeling this isn't going to be a "who'd win in a fight" battle, but who stands for what, batman testing superman to see how much he can take before he snaps no pun intended. I've always been a dc fan first when it comes to comics. i respect marvel, but i think they've gotten a little arrogant after avengers and guardians not to mention their fanbase who think they can do no wrong and thing "quantity>quality"

[rocci]

@catra
The same goes with dc fan.
It just a petty fanboy war.
Just enjoy the ride.

[Catra]

im not saying dc's innocent either. they do stuff im not happy about either. no company is perfect.

[rocci]

As long as they gave us a good entertainment, I'm good with it.

[Catra]

in fact i just finished the dawn of justice prequel comics and thought all 5 chapters were interesting which raised good questions. they really put superman into modern times now.

[James S Cassidy]

im more comfortable with superman and lois. but i've heard a lot of bad things about this new superman i choose not to read them anyway. see people? you dont HAVE to read em. you can just wait for another reboot. me though, im perfectly happy right now with the dceu (or cinematic verse) for now. worst case scenario dawn of justice is gonna be ironman 2 all over again.

 

as for the batman v superman part, well i got a feeling this isn't going to be a "who'd win in a fight" battle, but who stands for what, batman testing superman to see how much he can take before he snaps no pun intended. I've always been a dc fan first when it comes to comics. i respect marvel, but i think they've gotten a little arrogant after avengers and guardians not to mention their fanbase who think they can do no wrong and thing "quantity>quality"

Bold: This is exactly my point. People only "HEARD" it was bad, but never read it themselves. Let me just show you some good moments with Superman and Wonder Woman and I want you to tell me if they are truly that bad or if this writing is that bad. And honestly, if I were to ask, if Lios was in that same position would you think the scene was better or worse?

Examples

Here is one where Superman fought Doomsday and nearly died. When they captured Doomsday and put him away they were afraid he was going to escapse and Superman was worried he wouldn't know if he could take him again. Wonder Woman offers her support to him.


In this scene Wonder Woman asked the League what to get Superman for his birthday. She found him the one thing he could never have to had very little of....time. Time for just himself.



Not every moment is just them making out. Here is them taking on Zod and his underlings with Wonder Woman being a bad ass,

The things I keep hearing form people about Superman and Wonder Woman is that the "it's too easy, there is no drama, and it is not as interesting," but I see plenty of interesting moments where for one it is not this "white knight" trope. Yeah, Superman does save Wonder Woman a few times, but Wonder Woman also saves Superman a few times and that's what I love the most. Very rarely, if at all, does Lois play a pivotal role like that and provide support for Superman beyond the "I believe in him."

A lot of us here love NaruSaku because they see them as the ultimate battle couple...well, same thing here. With Wonder Woman being equal to Superman in many ways and in some other ways better, they fight battles together as a couple and take on things that no one else can. I don't see Lois doing any of this. I don't see Lois giving Superman time or using her abilities to get Superman something he truly wants.

and I am not trying to do this to say Superman and Lois is bad....I am just saying that there is good to Superman and Wonder Woman being together that people just won't give them a chance to. The three moments I put above are just a small sample of what I mean and to me, it is the DC version of NaruSaku with Superman and Lois being somewhat NaruHina. I know what some of you will say "*GASP* How DARE you compare Lois and Clark to NH. They are not the same." They kind of are if you think about it. What is NaruHina? A girl who is obsessed with a guy who is seen as a hero and is relatively useless to him in battle. What is Superman and Lois? A girl who is obsessed with a guy who is seen as a hero and is relatively useless to him in battle.

Now the differences between them is obvious. While Hinata should be capable of being useful in a fight, she isn't, but Lois has no powers to fight these guys so this is why I don't expect her to fight or groan when she becomes a damsel in distress. Depending on the story I have read, Lois is either this supportive girl who truly loves Superman and would rather give up her life to save him despite having no powers or Lois has been shown to be a headstrong, hero worshiping, writer who cared more about the story than Superman's life.

This is the fault of the writer, not of the characters really.

My point is, if written right, there is nothing wrong with Superman and Wonder Woman getting together and because there are so many universes why can;t one have them together and be that couple? In the end, it is not the story, but the fans that piss me off. The fans who won't shut up and just enjoy the ride because everything HAS to be to their specifications. If it was bad writing, then yes I can see your point, but if a fan is just kittening because he wants Superman and Lois and that's all that matters even if Superman and Wonder Woman would make better story telling....then I have no respect for them and tired of the pairings wars ruining stories I love all for the sake of "we have to please the fans."

Like you said, read something else if it really bothers you that much. Watch All-star Superman or read Modern Age Superman where all your favorite fantasies comes true and leave New52 with Superman and Wonder Woman.

(Now, I have to admit, recently in New52 Superman has been a REAL JERK to everyone lately all because he lost his powers. He treated everyone like kitten because he lost his powers and this was influences because the fans wanted it this way. So if Superman seems like crap and as you said you "heard these bad things" it is because the fans got involved with the story and they changed it up to be more compelling, but sometimes just changing it for the drama is not a good thing)

Edited by James S Cassidy, 08 February 2016 - 12:48 AM.

[TheFirstEvil100]

I know many of us now hate the shy girl thing now thanks to Hinata, but for me I will always remember when it was done in such a good way with Willow Rosenberg from Buffy who was a wallflower but later became the most powerful witch in the world, that is a shy girl done right who became a bad ass.

 

"Let me tell you something about Willow; she's a loser. And she always has been. Everyone picked on Willow in junior high, high school, up until college with her stupid mousy ways. And now... Willow's a junkie. The only thing Willow was ever good for, the only thing going for me, were those moments—just moments—when Tara would look at me and I was wonderful. And that will never happen again."

―Willow becomes fueled by grief and magic after Tara's death

[ultranx]

 

gonna repost my comment here for reference: 

why did superman and wonder women even become a thing in the first place? all the retcons in dc are insane and retarded, heck I don't read the comics but I read enough on the wiki, do those writers have no shame turning a superboy into a villain from losing his universe and then right when he changes his ways and they put in "oh we promise to not torture you to turn you into a villain again" with their self insert writer selves then retcon  that and torture the guy making him become a villain again then seal him in the source wall? SERIOUSLY!??? see this is why marvel is better than dc, and why I prefer anime and the comic cartoons/movies over comic books. there was never a problem with the original superman backstory, I would have been fine if it stayed the same with the fortress and crystals and the lois thing, but they just had to blow him out of proportion because he's so popular right? sigh...

 

 

 

now are you telling me to read something with that kind of crazy crap? sorry, I'll stay out of it, the whole reason I stay out of comics is the continuity  and multiple universe craziness to the point its ridiculous, my comment on marvel is at least they don't do stuff like this if they reset and at least they're not shameless enough to have a universe with themselves in it where the characters meet them then lie to the characters' faces. even if I don't read comics I will give marvel props for that.  

 

also I never said I hated the wonder woman superman thing, I'm neutral, I just asked the simple question: how and why did them as a couple become a thing? I just didn't see why it needed to be changed from lois , as people say" if its not broken don't fix it" but also I disagree with the obsessed thing about lois, lois is still better than hinata, lois doesn't worry about superman thinking he's not capable or say his name over and over all the time like freaking naruto-kun and lois risks her life all the time either trying to help superman without being a heroine by other means or working on some case as a reporter, and there have been times when she has had powers. also lois didn't even get as bad as hinata did, the series wasn't turned into lois lane instead of superman.

[TouKen4Life3g]

Well, this is why I don't get into comics. Nothing wrong with them, just seems like I will get lost faster than Star Wars lore.

[NeonRanger]

I think James is trying to say people judge without not showing there bias, and that it prevents the writers from getting deep into it. Pretty much the fans are what prevents the story from going with the flow and changing it all together; especially when a series gets extremely popular and becomes a franchise.

A lot of people meet complained about Wonder Women x Superman as a couple, and preferred her with Batman. And I do see Lois x Super as another NH. Of course they are not the exact copy, but there are similarities. Lois should have more other than being romantic support?

Anyway, people don't bother to try to wonder about Wonder Women x Superman like they don't bother with Narusaku. They don't need to ship it, but understand how we believe it fit into the story flow.

Not only that but for some reason only in the Naruto fandom people are willing to forgive any villain or flawed character with the exception of Sakura? I never meet a fandom that harbors such a hate for part 1 Sakura that they successfully manage to destroy her character overall. With The Last and NNS4, Sakura was reduced into a secondary character NH cupid. She doesn't even have any special movesets or significant moments in the Game, they removed all NS and SS moments, which shows you how much they lover her character (they don't need to like SS, but ch. 685 was important for Sakura's desire to help Sasuke, same with ch. 663 and her desire to help Naruto).

Yet in the Game during Naruto's death scene, they added filler of HINATA (not even Sasuke, and CC2/SP wanks SN to the bone) reaching out for Naruto's hand telling to not give up on your dreams.

Hinata also got a couple of Special movesets, with Naruto and the Hyuugas. I would have been fine if not for the fact we have nothing for Sakura. Even in adventure mode NH was present as well as a moment where Sakura/Ino were trash talking about Naruto while Hinata was supported him. CC2 just actually reverted Sakura back into her part 1 self! It was apparent in 693, 99, but in The Last, Sakura was still nice around Naruto. The game now has her pointing out all the bad kitten about him, and in the end just promote even more people to hating her.

James, is right, I never meet a fandom that would go so far for a secondary like Hinata, to the point where Sakura became a secondary. And sadly it won't be the last fandom.

I've seen a lot of GrayLu / Gruvia shippers on Hiro's account harassing them about which ship should be canon. I've also seen fans international and JP harass KyoAni because they choose to post a pic that was RinHaru. Also it was rumored how Kubo deleted his twitter because fans where harassing him about some character death? I know he deleted, and it involved twitter reaction, but I didn't know what. He made a new one, happily.

Fans can really be aggressive over ships and fav. Characters. Naruto so far is the only fandom where I ever experience death threats, depression, and headaches. But now Bleach is already head up there with there ship wars, and I'm already being harassed because I ship NaLi, even though I like NaLu, same with Free! with MS. It's no wonder why companies/ publishers appease to the majority...being in the minority is horrible.

Edited by NeonRanger, 08 February 2016 - 02:50 PM.

[db84x]

Guys comic only entertainment, why just because we have different pairing we must hate each other.  DC done same with Shuheisa did, made more ways to get more money with art and creativity. 

[Konoha'sCrimsonFox]

Guys comic only entertainment, why just because we have different pairing we must hate each other.  DC done same with Shuheisa did, made more ways to get more money with art and creativity. 

 

Where's the reboot of story a pairings besides TL? DC never copied Shuiesha because they are not biased to cater to one pairing and one universe

Edited by Konoha'sCrimsonFox, 08 February 2016 - 06:25 PM.

[James S Cassidy]

now are you telling me to read something with that kind of crazy crap? sorry, I'll stay out of it, the whole reason I stay out of comics is the continuity  and multiple universe craziness to the point its ridiculous, my comment on marvel is at least they don't do stuff like this if they reset and at least they're not shameless enough to have a universe with themselves in it where the characters meet them then lie to the characters' faces. even if I don't read comics I will give marvel props for that. 

I am telling you that everything you said is wrong and you either need to actually start reading the history of comics, stop using wikipedia, and/or just not say anything at all.

I am sorry, but what you just said is just...stupid. When has that happened in DC and two when hasn't Marvel kittened up their own continuity for the sake of bullcrap reasoning or done exactly what Marvel does now? Do you know there is a Marvel multiverse? You're right, you don't read comics nor have you seen anything that Marvel has done to butcher their own characters sometimes or caused their own death only to rejuvenate them in some weird way. Captain America Steve Rogers was shot and killed in one issue and they retconned it so that those "bullets" displaced him in time instead of killing him so he relives his own life again. It basically Superman Doomsday, but a lot less weaker and no epic battle.

Again, Spider-Man's ONE MORE DAY comic book. Where Mary Jane makes a deal with the devil to reset Peter's life. The one comic EVERYONE HATES from Marvel and was so much hated that Marvel had to force the story to be retconed out of existence.
 

also I never said I hated the wonder woman superman thing, I'm neutral, I just asked the simple question: how and why did them as a couple become a thing? I just didn't see why it needed to be changed from lois , as people say" if its not broken don't fix it" but also I disagree with the obsessed thing about lois, lois is still better than hinata, lois doesn't worry about superman thinking he's not capable or say his name over and over all the time like freaking naruto-kun and lois risks her life all the time either trying to help superman without being a heroine by other means or working on some case as a reporter, and there have been times when she has had powers. also lois didn't even get as bad as hinata did, the series wasn't turned into lois lane instead of superman.

 

 You say you're neutral, but then go on to praise Superman and Lois saying how it always should be that and how it should never change, but why not? Why not give me a reason why they SHOULDN'T go for SM/WW? What reason do you have for why CAN'T this happen?

"If it ain't broke don't fix it?" Maybe you should tell Marvel that who can't seem to let their characters stay in relationships for long and even put together characters for little to no reason at all. I keep beating a dead horse, but Spider-Man has been getting a lot of punishment lately.

"Lois doesn't worry about superman thinking he's not capable or say his name over and over." Neither did Wonder Woman, but there are some comics where Lois cared more about the story than she did about Superman...or even Clark. Since you don;t read comics, let me give a more common one...Superman the movie with Christopher Reeve. That Lois Lane, while her actress was amazing, was actually selfish. I remember her going up on the Eiffel Tower with a hydrogen bomb and terrorists all because she wanted to get the good story and kept expecting Superman to save her to the point that she willingly attempted to kill herself just so she could prove Clark Kent was Superman.

As for losing faith in him or worrying about or what he was capable of...I could argue she gave up on him in the comic series when he fought The Elite and he was thought to be dead. Superman left her a note saying "Believe Always Believe" and even then she seemed to lose faith. Now some could argue it was a rouse, but at the same time...why would it be a rouse and who as she fooling?

But this is a moot point since that anyone who loves another person in such a strong way will always worry about that person even if they were Superman. That is what love and caring does.

"lois risks her life all the time either trying to help superman without being a heroine by other means or working on some case as a reporter," Not all the time. Again, going back to the Superman vs The Elite, it was Lois who lost faith, it was Lois who did nothing, but as I said....she is not a superhuman being so it is understandable why she couldn't do anything. AS I SAID, this is unlike Hinata who had the power to do stuff and yet did nothing. The difference are obvious, but the premise of the relationship are pretty much the same. Lois hero worshipped Superman before she even knew of Clark Kent. There has never been a story where she fell in love with Clark Kent...

Man of Steel is probably the only story I know where Lois falls in love with Superman before he is a famous hero, before he becomes the hero everyone loves. She even was willing to sacrifice her great story she worked hard on because she knew "The world was not ready." This doesn't happen often in the comics especially in the pre-crisis era.

"And there have been times when she has had powers" Yes, but they usually were only temporary. One especially she was just altered by Superman himself in All-Star Superman and she really didn't do anything with them than have a romantic day with Superman on the moon and truth be told he was dying....somewhat. In one comic she was in that she got powers, can't remember the name exactly, she got superpowers and found out Clark was Superman and was willing to tell the whole world because she wanted to be the one who wrote the ultimate story.

"the series wasn't turned into lois lane instead of superman." Actually, Lois got her own spin-off comics from time to time. So did Jimmy Olsen. It's like Naruto the Last only...imagine if Kishimoto wrote "Hinata: A Naruto series." Superman took a backseat in that one.
 

 

 

I think James is trying to say people judge without not showing there bias, and that it prevents the writers from getting deep into it. Pretty much the fans are what prevents the story from going with the flow and changing it all together; especially when a series gets extremely popular and becomes a franchise.

A lot of people meet complained about Wonder Women x Superman as a couple, and preferred her with Batman. And I do see Lois x Super as another NH. Of course they are not the exact copy, but there are similarities. Lois should have more other than being romantic support?

Anyway, people don't bother to try to wonder about Wonder Women x Superman like they don't bother with Narusaku. They don't need to ship it, but understand how we believe it fit into the story flow.

Not only that but for some reason only in the Naruto fandom people are willing to forgive any villain or flawed character with the exception of Sakura? I never meet a fandom that harbors such a hate for part 1 Sakura that they successfully manage to destroy her character overall. With The Last and NNS4, Sakura was reduced into a secondary character NH cupid. She doesn't even have any special movesets or significant moments in the Game, they removed all NS and SS moments, which shows you how much they lover her character (they don't need to like SS, but ch. 685 was important for Sakura's desire to help Sasuke, same with ch. 663 and her desire to help Naruto).

Yet in the Game during Naruto's death scene, they added filler of HINATA (not even Sasuke, and CC2/SP wanks SN to the bone) reaching out for Naruto's hand telling to not give up on your dreams.

Hinata also got a couple of Special movesets, with Naruto and the Hyuugas. I would have been fine if not for the fact we have nothing for Sakura. Even in adventure mode NH was present as well as a moment where Sakura/Ino were trash talking about Naruto while Hinata was supported him. CC2 just actually reverted Sakura back into her part 1 self! It was apparent in 693, 99, but in The Last, Sakura was still nice around Naruto. The game now has her pointing out all the bad kitten about him, and in the end just promote even more people to hating her.

James, is right, I never meet a fandom that would go so far for a secondary like Hinata, to the point where Sakura became a secondary. And sadly it won't be the last fandom.

I've seen a lot of GrayLu / Gruvia shippers on Hiro's account harassing them about which ship should be canon. I've also seen fans international and JP harass KyoAni because they choose to post a pic that was RinHaru. Also it was rumored how Kubo deleted his twitter because fans where harassing him about some character death? I know he deleted, and it involved twitter reaction, but I didn't know what. He made a new one, happily.

Fans can really be aggressive over ships and fav. Characters. Naruto so far is the only fandom where I ever experience death threats, depression, and headaches. But now Bleach is already head up there with there ship wars, and I'm already being harassed because I ship NaLi, even though I like NaLu, same with Free! with MS. It's no wonder why companies/ publishers appease to the majority...being in the minority is horrible.

 

Yeah, exactly. See? You get it. The fandoms are just so bad and it has gotten so much worse since 2011. I have never see so much bloodthirsty barbarians attacks each other so relentlessly and say the most vile disgusting stuff all because they wanted their favorite pairing to happen. And while DC and Marvel have the luxury of a multiverse and can make any couples canon and still give everybody what they want without fear (or they should, but fans still go at them), Manga don't have that luxury UNLESS you do a reboot or a remake of the series like what happened with Evangelion.

Bold: This is SOOOO true and I noticed this almost a  month after the Naruto ending. After Naruto's ending and such, people flocked to Bleach with the Ichiruki or IchiOri pairing flame wars. I bet ten bucks that after Bleach, they will go to One Piece.









 

Edited by James S Cassidy, 08 February 2016 - 06:59 PM.

[TheFirstEvil100]

And this is why I am re-watching Buffy, before the kitten that was Naruto came out I means the people in the show have flawes and people don't piss on them for the mistakes that they made either, oh nd not sob stories for the bad guys as they were evil and they loved it. They loved the kills and people that they killed and its what makes the show sweet as well.

[db84x]

 

Where's the reboot of story a pairings besides TL? DC never copied Shuiesha because they are not biased to cater to one pairing and one universe

 

TL just integrated Kishi original idea into story by eliminate almost all Yahagi idea, angry NS fans made it easy due their burning bridge act. Whatever you complain it wont useful because NS already written off and excluded from Naruto fandom.  DC can reboot pairing because comic fans love it.

Edited by db84x, 09 February 2016 - 01:18 AM.

[Nostradamus]

@James A question if I may. I never read comics books, I never had access to them. My only connection with the DC universe and Marvel universe; was through cartoons, tv shows and movies. My question is "Is Lois Lane as stupid and selfish in the comics books as she's portrayed in the TV show called Smallville?" If you know, of course.

Edited by Nostradamus, 09 February 2016 - 06:24 AM.