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#2041 Shadow Wolf

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 06:27 PM

You guys ran the poor lad away. Derock had a pretty amazing LAP though, but you all brought up really great points. It's unfortunate people don't see Sakura the way we do and actually appreciate her character, because I'm certain Kishi doesn't develop her to get all of this ridiculous hate that she gets. Meh, whatever

 

Huh? What? Run away? Who knows... I don't intend to make people run away. I just try to help the use some logic XD. Then again, as I mentioned in one of my posts: some people do this for the sake of trolling, and I find it difficult to ignore a person who bashes a character like that. In any case, I always like the fact that many people stand in the character's defense. ^_^

 

Haha, sometimes I think that before joining this community people ought to pass some kind of "How well do I know NS" or "A real NS fan?" test. That would help to sort out the haters. :zaru:

 

I'm not sure, I mean, some people come here to learn about NS after all. How about a FAQ section?



#2042 Beastbomb

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 06:28 PM

Aww, the basher left. I feel asleep while we were debating :(

Edited by Beastbomb, 02 June 2013 - 06:29 PM.


#2043 Slextrem

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 06:31 PM

Basically, what it comes down to is selective reading. If people are going to pick and choose what they take seriously in the manga, then there's no helping them. I can rant at them until I'm blue in the face, but if they aren't even going to take Sakura's panel-time seriously, that's going to get me no where. It's unfortunate, but that's just how it is.

 

Anyway, I don't understand why people are criticizing Hyakugou so much. Sure, it's similar to what Tsunade uses, but only three people in the Shinobi world have been able to accomplish a seal like it:

The First Hokage's wife Mito,

The grandchild of the First Hokage, Sannin, founder of the medic corp, and Fifth Hokage Tsunade,

Haruno Sakura.

 

That's not an embarrassing line of predecessors to be "copying".


Edited by Slextrem, 02 June 2013 - 06:34 PM.


#2044 T XD

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 06:36 PM

Basically, what it comes down to is selective reading. If people are going to pick and choose what they take seriously in the manga, then there's no helping them. I can rant at them until I'm blue in the face, but if they aren't even going to take Sakura's panel-time seriously, that's going to get me no where. It's unfortunate, but that's just how it is.

 

Anyway, I don't understand why people are criticizing Hyakugou so much. Sure, it's similar to what Tsunade uses, but only three people in the Shinobi world have been able to accomplish a seal like it:

The First Hokage's wife Mito,

The grandchild of the First Hokage, Sannin, founder of the medic corp, and Fifth Hokage Tsunade,

Haruno Sakura.

 

That's not an embarrassing line of predecessors to be "copying".

It's either they don't know about these information or ignore them or know and ignore them... No surprise :fu:


Edited by T XD, 02 June 2013 - 06:36 PM.


#2045 StriderC

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 06:36 PM

Basically, what it comes down to is selective reading. If people are going to pick and choose what they take seriously in the manga, then there's no helping them. I can rant at them until I'm blue in the face, but if they aren't even going to take Sakura's panel-time seriously, that's going to get me no where. It's unfortunate, but that's just how it is.

 

Anyway, I don't understand why people are criticizing Hyakugou so much. Sure, it's similar to what Tsunade uses, but only three people in the Shinobi world have been able to accomplish it:

The First Hokage's wife Mito,

The grandchild of the First Hokage, Sannin, founder of the medic corp, and Fifth Hokage Tsunade,

Haruno Sakura.

 

That's not an embarrassing line of predecessors to be "copying".

THIS. The jutsu she's learned outside of medical jutsu isn't even something that can be easily copied/learned. Takes precise chakra control to pick it up and even Shizune couldn't do it. Just shows how amazing Sakura is and how far she's able to go. 

 

As for the bolded, that's basically what it comes down to. Selective reading and extreme bias. -_-

 

 

 

Huh? What? Run away? Who knows... I don't intend to make people run away. I just try to help the use some logic XD. Then again, as I mentioned in one of my posts: some people do this for the sake of trolling, and I find it difficult to ignore a person who bashes a character like that. In any case, I always like the fact that many people stand in the character's defense. ^_^

 

 

I'm not sure, I mean, some people come here to learn about NS after all. How about a FAQ section?

LOL I was kidding about the running away comment. :P I'm unaware if he was trolling or not but I didn't appreciate his comment when it came to Sakura/NS. He pretty much bashed her IMO, so of course, like many, I responded. It was nice seeing so many defend her though. 



#2046 Akashi

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 06:37 PM

I'm not sure, I mean, some people come here to learn about NS after all. How about a FAQ section?

Well in that case we need some kind of filter, lol. Too bad AI is not even close to being able to detect trolls. :umm:



#2047 sushi.

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 06:44 PM

I think a FAQ would be too much, but an introduction would be great. Like the ones on NF, they always have info about the ships in the fanclubs.


ナルサク


#2048 Shadow Wolf

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 06:51 PM

THIS. The jutsu she's learned outside of medical jutsu isn't even something that can be easily copied/learned. Takes precise chakra control to pick it up and even Shizune couldn't do it. Just shows how amazing Sakura is and how far she's able to go. 
 
As for the bolded, that's basically what it comes down to. Selective reading and extreme bias. -_-
 
 
LOL I was kidding about the running away comment. :P I'm unaware if he was trolling or not but I didn't appreciate his comment when it came to Sakura/NS. He pretty much bashed her IMO, so of course, like many, I responded. It was nice seeing so many defend her though.


It becomes even more impressive when you consider the fact that Sakura is just a normal girl (which is another reason as to why I also like Lee).

Oh, and yeah, I had the idea that you were just joking. I'm... kinda bad at portraying when I'm joking and when I'm serious, though (I'm also bad at getting many jokes, but I'll save that for later XD)
 

Well in that case we need some kind of filter, lol. Too bad AI is not even close to being able to detect trolls. :umm:


I'm not sure. I mean, we want to welcome any kind of people (and by this, I mean people who have other interest, maybe ship another couple, or don't ship any couple whatsoever). We actually don't know if they are trolls or not until they begin posting (innocent until proven otherwise). And considering the fact that the mods do a good job in taking care of them whenever necessary, along with the fact that most of the people here not only know how to handle said trolls but also provide answers with a good amount of research... then we don't need much else to handle them. Its best to find ways to make new people feel welcome. I mean, don't take this as if I'm disapproving of your idea or anything. I actually find it interesting, to be honest. I guess what I want to say is that we should not worry about trolls.

I think a FAQ would be too much, but an introduction would be great. Like the ones on NF, they always have info about the ships in the fanclubs.


I guess. My idea of FAQ is to cover the basic stuff, but your idea makes more sense. :smile:

Edited by Shadow Wolf, 02 June 2013 - 06:53 PM.


#2049 T XD

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 07:00 PM

The raw is out, right ? If it was posted here, I searched and couldn't find it. If it's not, I hope someone will post it here XD


Edited by T XD, 02 June 2013 - 07:00 PM.


#2050 StriderC

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 07:02 PM

It becomes even more impressive when you consider the fact that Sakura is just a normal girl (which is another reason as to why I also like Lee).

Oh, and yeah, I had the idea that you were just joking. I'm... kinda bad at portraying when I'm joking and when I'm serious, though (I'm also bad at getting many jokes, but I'll save that for later XD)
 

I'm not sure. I mean, we want to welcome any kind of people (and by this, I mean people who have other interest, maybe ship another couple, or don't ship any couple whatsoever). We actually don't know if they are trolls or not until they begin posting (innocent until proven otherwise). And considering the fact that the mods do a good job in taking care of them whenever necessary, along with the fact that most of the people here not only know how to handle said trolls but also provide answers with a good amount of research... then we don't need much else to handle them. Its best to find ways to make new people feel welcome. I mean, don't take this as if I'm disapproving of your idea or anything. I actually find it interesting, to be honest. I guess what I want to say is that we should not worry about trolls.


I guess. My idea of FAQ is to cover the basic stuff, but your idea makes more sense. :smile:

LOL Precisely why I like Lee actually. I admire characters like him and Sakura. Too bad Ten Ten didn't get much because she too could of ended up on my fav list if he had utilized her better than he has in the manga but I guess she's just sort of a filler character when it comes down to it. It's unfortunate of me to say but that's how it feels. He completely glazed over her fight with Temari...

 

And the fact that she pretty much is a regular girl makes her achievements all the more impressive. On a team with a guy with the Kyuubi, and ridiculous transformations along with amazing jutsu, and a guy who's pretty much mastered his sharingan, has mutiple high powered jutsu, and all that jazz, she's done quite amazingly well for herself, and I feel like the seal is just the beginning of her utilizing many amazing jutsu. If he gives her Sage mode, I'd feel like she'd be just about even with her team, and to have such a feat speaks volumes considering she's a female, and in a manga run by high powered males, is amazing, and she's normal. Doesn't get any better than that. :D 

 

LOL I sometimes have a hard time recognizing trolling tbh, but anything else isn't too hard to pick up on. :D 

 

As for the FAQ, I think there should be something that pretty much introduces NS like Sushi said, and it highlights important/key facts of their growing relationship. Like the PoAL, Sakura's change of view when it came to Naruto. Stuff like that. 



#2051 Akashi

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 07:09 PM

I'm not sure. I mean, we want to welcome any kind of people (and by this, I mean people who have other interest, maybe ship another couple, or don't ship any couple whatsoever). We actually don't know if they are trolls or not until they begin posting (innocent until proven otherwise). And considering the fact that the mods do a good job in taking care of them whenever necessary, along with the fact that most of the people here not only know how to handle said trolls but also provide answers with a good amount of research... then we don't need much else to handle them. Its best to find ways to make new people feel welcome. I mean, don't take this as if I'm disapproving of your idea or anything. I actually find it interesting, to be honest. I guess what I want to say is that we should not worry about trolls.

I don't mind pro-SS or pro-NH fans as long as they're being polite / posting reasonable anti-NS arguments / avoiding bashing and trolling. :smile:



#2052 Cherryblossoms

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 07:10 PM

So did I. Well, at least I was in part of it. What a battle.

Looks like we weren't really needed lol



#2053 TouKen4Life3g

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 07:16 PM

Looks like we weren't really needed lol

Nope, thanks to the Powerpuff Girls.

I mean friends. Sorry.

#2054 KnS

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 07:36 PM

Exactly. They're unbelievably critical of her character.

 

A pro-Hinata/anti-Sakura bias is one thing, but the whole argument went off the rails with "the bored dismissal that [Naruto] gives to Sakura's confession."  :argh:   Naruto went through a lot of different emotions during Sakura's confession, but no matter how you slice it, "bored dismissal" was not one them.  A statement like that doesn't betray a simple bias, it betrays a blatant denial of the facts.

It's not a crime to dislike a character -- even Sakura.  Prefering Hinata?  That's okay too.  Each of us are attracted to and affected by different things about different characters, and those preferences are going to lead us to subjective bias at times.  Again, no crime there.

The problem creeps in when a fan cannot acknowledge their bias, or admit they are unwilling to apply their standards for character behavior consistently.

The argument spanning the last few pages of this thread was also off the rails when Sakura -- and only Sakura -- was judged for allowing Sasuke to fight with them, and for setting aside everything he's done to her and others in that moment in order to face a common enemy.  It was immediately presumed that her willingness to do this was all because of romance and fangirling, even though no such behavior or intention is in evidence.

As several others pointed out, she simply followed Naruto's lead and it's ridiculous to judge Sakura harshly based on her willingness to fight alongside her old teammate -- and likely only temporarily while the battle conditions are grave -- especially when Naruto chose to do so first.

 

It's not as if there has been no precedent for such.  Regardless of what Orochimaru did, Jiraiya never gave up following him and keeping an eye out for him.  Are we to believe that if Orochimaru had turned away from evil -- briefly or permanently -- that Jiraiya and Tsunade would have rejected him or his help in a situation where his contribution might help achieve success?

Are we to believe that Kakashi is worthy of hate because he's in the other dimension with Obito right now, trying to recover whatever humanity and goodness might remain in him?  If Obito ends up assisting the alliance in any way, should the benefits of his actions be refused because he once did terrible things?

What irks me the most is the suggestion that Sakura did not react as a capable kunoichi with something to offer to the battle, but as a romance-driven Sasuke fangirl -- despite the fact that she stepped up AFTER Naruto had already done so.

Sakura's entire focus was on proving that her skills could compete with those of her teammates, and that she could offer them and the alliance something of considerable value in the fight.  That is a very, very, VERY far cry from Hinata's motivation to rush out and confront Pain, with no strategy or suitable skills and with no tangible or stated goal other than to declare her love for Naruto and die with him.

 

One acting like a powerful ninja, the other acting like a lovestruck girl.  Inconvenient for Sakura haters, perhaps, but that doesn't make it any less true.

 

Just my opinion.

 

P.S.  I don't devalue Hinata's current bravery in battle.  She has grown a lot, and I give her credit for that.  The degree to which her skills, strength, and confidence has developed is, however, still far below Sakura's in my opinion, but that's to be expected.  Sakura is the story's heroine.


Edited by KnS, 02 June 2013 - 07:54 PM.


#2055 Sakamaki Izayoi

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 07:52 PM

I don't mind pro-SS or pro-NH fans as long as they're being polite / posting reasonable anti-NS arguments / avoiding bashing and trolling. :smile:

Me too but it's sad that they dont come to this forum on normal days only when NH/SS gets some fanservice, no one came when 631 come out.


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#2056 Akashi

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 07:55 PM

Me too but it's sad that they dont come to this forum on normal days only when NH/SS gets some fanservice, no one came when 631 come out.

Imagine what might happen when NS is officially confirmed. :pinch: They'll start a revolution! :zaru: Portraits of Kishi burning all over the world. :fu:



#2057 Sakamaki Izayoi

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 08:29 PM

Imagine what might happen when NS is officially confirmed. :pinch: They'll start a revolution! :zaru: Portraits of Kishi burning all over the world. :fu:

I remember an image saying that they would go to Japan and kill Kishi if Nh doesnt became canon, and a lot of NH people sharing that, i was lurking on my normal facebook account it was some friend of mine who shared it.
 


Edited by Dαrkrєrsŧ, 02 June 2013 - 08:29 PM.

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#2058 Slextrem

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 08:31 PM

KnS, you just brought up another reason why I can't stand the criticisms Sakura receives. The double-standards are awful. Like you said, if they're going to nag about Sakura accepting Sasuke for the time being, why not also apply those criticisms to Kakashi, or the rest of the K9? Why is that criticism only applied to Sakura, especially when she was the only female that showed apprehension when Sasuke first arrived?

 

Do these panels mean absolutely nothing?

Sakuraapprehension_zpsd7f7e709.png

Naruto-Chapter63110_zps30ccd5ed.png

 

She's hesitant even while Naruto is approaching Sasuke, (which, as you mentioned, he did before she did.) I just can't wrap my head around it. I really can't.

 

But, that's why I don't "debate" anymore. It'll drive me crazy. :twitch:


Edited by Slextrem, 02 June 2013 - 08:33 PM.


#2059 Akashi

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 08:33 PM

I remember an image saying that they would go to Japan and kill Kishi if Nh doesnt became canon, and a lot of NH people sharing that, i was lurking on my normal facebook account it was some friend of mine who shared it.

Gee, are they desperate. :twitch:

 

I'd love to see how they're going to do it, lol. Good luck, NH people! :ninja:



#2060 T XD

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 08:36 PM

@ Slextrem: It's because they want to read Sakura's panels the way they want, and want to give her a hard time. As for haters... Haters gonna hate.






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