54175 replies to this topic

[Kasimir38]

Blonde, for example?

Edited by Kasimir38, 26 January 2018 - 11:03 PM.

[DrK]

Did a GIS for Hinata with red hair and it somehow pulled up happy family SS fanarts, now I'm violently ill.

[jak123]

Did a GIS for Hinata with red hair and it somehow pulled up happy family SS fanarts, now I'm violently ill.

Your GIS must hate you then because I got a few Hinata with red hair. Then one of Hinata dressing up as Sakura asking Naruto if he will love her now... Is Naruto actually happy with Hinata?

 

Also, I learned something interesting.

 

[Nostradamus]

Watching a video on Kreia from Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic II. Here's a quote from her that summarizes why NaruHina happening because of Kishi's pity feels so wrong.

 

 

It's also why giving Naruto a bunch of powerups at the end, as well as explaining the advantages he had at the beginning due to Uzumaki blood, only served to undermine Naruto himself so greatly. He was supposed to be the dead last, the loser who failed the genin test three times. It's why him learning the Kage Bushin technique resonates so greatly, as he overcame his own defeats and came out stronger than if he had simply passed. Remember, having Kurama was originally a double-edged sword as it affected his ability to control chakra as well as the damage it did to him when in tailed-modes. Naruto being able to contain the 9-Tails became cheapened when it was revealed that he was only able to do so due to his heritage, along with other beneficial Uzumaki traits. Naruto learning to work with Kurama felt great and like the Kage Bushin it meant something. The god-mode powers Naruto was given at the end of the series lacked this, and like Kaguya felt out of place to the rest of the story.

 

But back to NaruHina. With Hinata being given her husbando, it ultimately denied her the character growth she so desperately needed. She remained the same little girl she always was, chasing after Naruto even when she swore she wouldn't anymore. Her lack of focus ultimately hurt her, as it removed the struggle from her pursuit. Naruto just ended up with her at the end of the manga despite everything that pointed to him shacking up with Sakura. Then The Last came along, which served to invalidate Naruto's feelings for Sakura to remove her as a threat, all while trying to establish Hinata had already won years before without knowing.

 

And if we go off my previous analysis that Hinata believes she has to defend Naruto from everything, their relationship only seeks to weaken him. It's not Hinata who is getting Boruto to understand his father's (supposed) greatness, it's the experiences Boruto has outside of their family that will ultimately mature the little poop and restore his relationship with his father. Again, Hinata's problem is being solved by someone else saving her the trouble and means to grow, likewise it's solving the problem for Naruto to continue validating the behavior that created the problem in the first place.

This is why I hate in fiction whenever things or in some cases even people(characters) are given to others without them working for it.

The whole Naruto being the reincarnation of Sage's son and it's his destiny to achieve peace and unite everyone is just garbage.

It completely renders the hero's journey meaningless because no matter what he would've done, he would have ended up in the exact same place. Because destiny.

 

Oh and are you a Kreia fan or KOTOR?

 

I'm writing a 1 million ways to die in Konoha, with Hinata as the only character in it. She shall be revived and killed off in a different way over and over again.

Might I suggest you watch White Bear.

[HalfDemonInuyasha]

Once Again I will go on to say how SH------IT of a romance Naruto ended up being by comparing it the "god tier" couple in Cardcaptor Sakura Clear Card.

 

WATCH THIS!!!!  This brings genuine tears of joy to your eyes and wraps a fuzzy warm blanket around your heart!!!!   Was that kitttening TRASH HEAP "The Last" able to pull THIS OFF?

 

As I keep saying, amazing how romance between two 10-13 year olds is done FAR better, and in a much shorter period of time, than by mid-teens and adults in something as long as Naruto.

[VanitasDS76491]

This is why I hate in fiction whenever things or in some cases even people(characters) are given to others without them working for it.
The whole Naruto being the reincarnation of Sage's son and it's his destiny to achieve peace and unite everyone is just garbage.
It completely renders the hero's journey meaningless because no matter what he would've done, he would have ended up in the exact same place. Because destiny.
 
Oh and are you a Kreia fan or KOTOR?
 

Might I suggest you watch White Bear.

This why chosen ones story suck unless you know what your doing like avatar and star wars did it right. Naruto being a chosen one comes in to late and amounted to nothing.

[Nostradamus]

This why chosen ones story suck unless you know what your doing like avatar and star wars did it right. Naruto being a chosen one comes in to late and amounted to nothing.

There's nothing wrong with stories that from the beginning start with the whole destiny route. But when your story starts the path of an underdog that has to work for everything he has and will have, but later on decide that it was all fate then it's rubbish.

Now there are ways around this, for example even though you pick later on the fate path, you can still have the hero struggle with everything he does. It's his/her destiny to achieve This Whatever This Is, but nothing is actually given to him or her. Going this route wouldn't nullify what you did in the beginning.

Edited by Nostradamus, 27 January 2018 - 06:28 PM.

[jak123]

This why chosen ones story suck unless you know what your doing like avatar and star wars did it right. Naruto being a chosen one comes in to late and amounted to nothing.

Yeah, while I hated the pairings immensely, the whole introduction of the Kaguya and chosen one of the Sages shouldn't have happened. Naruto and Sasuke didn't need those Sage Powers because they were strong enough as it is and the final baddie should have been Madara. The whole War Arc was a mess. And it's funny because some of the best parts excluding fight scenes, was the interaction between Sakura and Naruto like when she revived him.

[RulesofNature]

Oh and are you a Kreia fan or KOTOR?

 

I got KOTOR I off of Steam around New Years (though I haven't played it much since it seems to like to crash in the Undercity). I really wanted to see what the big deal about Kreia was, so I ended up watching a 2 hour video about her and was hooked. She is a great character, and I feel that when you apply Avellone's views on the Force TLJ only serves to show they destructive cycle of the galaxy continuing.

[Nostradamus]

 

I got KOTOR I off of Steam around New Years (though I haven't played it much since it seems to like to crash in the Undercity). I really wanted to see what the big deal about Kreia was, so I ended up watching a 2 hour video about her and was hooked. She is a great character, and I feel that when you apply Avellone's views on the Force TLJ only serves to show they destructive cycle of the galaxy continuing.

I see. Well the old kotor games have problems on modern systems, if you want I can tell you what to do in order to make it more stable.

Speaking of TLJ, I do need to talk about it in its thread.

[RulesofNature]

I see. Well the old kotor games have problems on modern systems, if you want I can tell you what to do in order to make it more stable.

Speaking of TLJ, I do need to talk about it in its thread.

One of the most beautiful things about TLJ is how the how/why Rey's so powerful and skilled with the Force completely destroys the intended message that by being a "nobody," Rey's strength comes from herself and not her lineage. It's comical how quickly it falls apart. Here's the abridged version.

 

1) Rey's strength with the Force is the Force trying to balance the darkness that is Kylo Ren. It's not Rey's own inner strength at work here, it's the will of the Force giving her power. In essence, this removes her nobody "status" as she is the one the Force is choosing to be their champion out of all the Force sensitives in the galaxy.

 

2) Kylo's abilities are boosted due to the legendary Skywalker bloodline. Since Rey is supposed to balance Kylo, Rey is being empowered by the Skywalker bloodline by proxy.

 

3) According to one of the writers on Twitter, Rey learned Jedi abilities and how to use a lightsaber by looking into Kylo Ren's mind during her interrogation during TFA. She copied Kylo Ren's abilities. This is not a new thing either, this was originally tweeted in 2016.

 

4) The previous point has since been expanded on through tweets. It was part of the Force bond between Rey and Kylo Ren that allowed this, which was created during the interrogation scene... by Snoke. So, Rey only learned Force abiltiies by copying them from Kylo Ren's mind after Snoke bridged them.

 

So, Rey learned her abilities because she was able to copy them from Kylo Ren due to the actions of Snoke. On top of that she is being buffed by the Force so that she can fight Kylo Ren, who himself is buffed by his lineage. Despite all this, they want her to be seen as someone who is strong not because of her own lineage, but because of her own strength.

[VanitasDS76491]

[quote name="jak123" post="960767" timestamp="1517078145"]Yeah, while I hated the pairings immensely, the whole introduction of the Kaguya and chosen one of the Sages shouldn't have happened. Naruto and Sasuke didn't need those Sage Powers because they were strong enough as it is and the final baddie should have been Madara. The whole War Arc was a mess. And it's funny because some of the best parts excluding fight scenes, was the interaction between Sakura and Naruto like when she revived him.[/quote] 
Thats why I said avatar that's a chosen one story right and aang's journey over the three books. Agreed underdog stories are good enough on their own like rocky and captain America from the mcu.
[/quote]

Yeah, while I hated the pairings immensely, the whole introduction of the Kaguya and chosen one of the Sages shouldn't have happened. Naruto and Sasuke didn't need those Sage Powers because they were strong enough as it is and the final baddie should have been Madara. The whole War Arc was a mess. And it's funny because some of the best parts excluding fight scenes, was the interaction between Sakura and Naruto like when she revived him.

Ya naruto and sakura were the only good things in the war or one of the good things. Agreed only in my version of naruto kaguya is in it but she's already dead in it as a massive prologue before even exist dealt with kaguya and her clan and all were evil save a sister kaguya had.

[winter-serenade]

A lot of people say that shipping the heroine and hero together is cliche, but I can't help it because their so compatible with each other. That's one of the things I love about NaruSaku, the compatibility.

[SlyNinjaKnight]

A lot of people say that shipping the heroine and hero together is cliche, but I can't help it because their so compatible with each other. That's one of the things I love about NaruSaku, the compatibility.

 

Same thing for me with Harry Potter. The relationship between Harry and Hermione was so much better than Ron/Hermione or Harry/Ginny. 

[DrK]

 

Same thing for me with Harry Potter. The relationship between Harry and Hermione was so much better than Ron/Hermione or Harry/Ginny. 

Yeah, I am not a big HP fan at all, but I feel like Rowling had no clue how to do romance. Those pairings had kitten-all going for them. Even Harry with the Asian girl would have been better.

 

It's like writers go out of their way not to do main x main even when it would obviously work out for the best. Why shouldn't the most significant female character be the one to stand by the hero? They're going to have the most experiences together as a matter of course.

 

Hermione was obviously the one who connected to Harry the most. There wasn't any indication that she loved him but there was nothing like that with Ron either until what, book 7? Nor were their interactions really good at all. Their childish arguing actually brought out the worst aspects of both characters, while both of them were obviously great towards Harry. It just seems like Rowling decided it arbitrarily because she didn't know how to write romance, sort of like Toriyama's pairings in Dragon Ball. Not that any of these even compare to the travesty that is NaruSaku not happening, but yeah.

[Niky]

Hello guys, are you well ?

Yeah, I am not a big HP fan at all, but I feel like Rowling had no clue how to do romance. Those pairings had kitten-all going for them. Even Harry with the Asian girl would have been better.

 

It's like writers go out of their way not to do main x main even when it would obviously work out for the best. Why shouldn't the most significant female character be the one to stand by the hero? They're going to have the most experiences together as a matter of course.

 

Hermione was obviously the one who connected to Harry the most. There wasn't any indication that she loved him but there was nothing like that with Ron either until what, book 7? Nor were their interactions really good at all. Their childish arguing actually brought out the worst aspects of both characters, while both of them were obviously great towards Harry. It just seems like Rowling decided it arbitrarily because she didn't know how to write romance, sort of like Toriyama's pairings in Dragon Ball. Not that any of these even compare to the travesty that is NaruSaku not happening, but yeah.

 

On the contrary, I think this was an editorial choice in Harry Potter’s Books.

Harry is THE ABSOLUTE PROTAGONIST, the only HERO.

 

Everything in the books is meant to exist in relation to him.

 

So, Ron is the HARRY’s best friend, Cho Chang is the HARRY’s first, transient, experience of love; Hermione is the HARRY’s conscience and wisdom; Dumbledore is HARRY’s mentor; Draco is the HARRY’s bug (not enemy); Ginny is the HARRY’s girl; Voldemort is the HARRY’s evil enemy… etc. etc.

 

Every character cannot and must not exceed its limit, overcome the protagonist, evolve itself to top (Ron and Draco are emblematic of this).

 

Two are the exceptions: Hermione and Snape.

 

Frankly, on Harry/Hermione pairing and its fandom Rowling coasted until the end (and I was a Ron/Hermione shipper, but not happy with the ending outcome…) but Hermione, with this editorial scripting, didn’t have a chance to become HEROINE, namely an equal to Harry.

 

Snape was a possible dangerous rival for Harry’s popularity (in the adult fandom only) and I think it was difficult keep him and his interesting story and background at bay.

 

And don’t get me started on the Gryffindor glorification… It seemed the only house present in Hogwarts (because it’s the PROTAGONIST’s house). Slytherin was remembered more like its enemy and rival than other (I loved so much Hufflepuff...).

 

Mah!

Edited by Niky, 28 January 2018 - 01:44 PM.

[jak123]

Yeah, I am not a big HP fan at all, but I feel like Rowling had no clue how to do romance. Those pairings had kitten-all going for them. Even Harry with the Asian girl would have been better.

 

It's like writers go out of their way not to do main x main even when it would obviously work out for the best. Why shouldn't the most significant female character be the one to stand by the hero? They're going to have the most experiences together as a matter of course.

 

Hermione was obviously the one who connected to Harry the most. There wasn't any indication that she loved him but there was nothing like that with Ron either until what, book 7? Nor were their interactions really good at all. Their childish arguing actually brought out the worst aspects of both characters, while both of them were obviously great towards Harry. It just seems like Rowling decided it arbitrarily because she didn't know how to write romance, sort of like Toriyama's pairings in Dragon Ball. Not that any of these even compare to the travesty that is NaruSaku not happening, but yeah.

I read that Rowling's original ending was going to be Harry/Hermione, but she got lazy at the end. It could be compared to NaruSaku because throughout the 7 books, it was always Hermione and Harry having this development (Harry being the one to hold her petrified hand, Hermione, Harry having the secret of that time device, Hermione being the most worried about Harry going up against a dragon and then embracing him in the tent where he was waiting for his turn). It was supposed to culminate at the part where they dance together alone in book 7 after Ron abandons them where they finally realize they are in love with each other. So the Ron and Ginny thing was supposed to happen, but then they would break up with them and get together. Yeah, you are right though, Harry had more development with Cho than he ever did with Ginny. Honestly, the Ginny thing came out of nowhere and could be effectively compared to NaruHina. They barely interacted aside from book 2, but apparently Harry is just magically in love with her all of a sudden. Do you think Rowling learned to write romance from Kishimoto? Because it sounds very similar.

[jak123]

A lot of people say that shipping the heroine and hero together is cliche, but I can't help it because their so compatible with each other. That's one of the things I love about NaruSaku, the compatibility.

See that's why I don't like the word "cliche". Even if something is used a lot, it can be written well enough to still be good. I think you are hindering yourself if you think something might be cliche or fit some sort of trope.

[T XD]

J.K. Rowling admitted as soon as possible that she shouldn't have paired Hermione and Ron, saying she should have put Harry and Hermione together. I forgot what she said in details, but that's in general from what I remember.

 

Unlike a specific mangaka that we all know well. Our ears and eyes are still waiting for this moment of his... That if it will ever come.

Edited by T XD, 28 January 2018 - 07:30 PM.

[HalfDemonInuyasha]

There's nothing wrong with stories that from the beginning start with the whole destiny route. But when your story starts the path of an underdog that has to work for everything he has and will have, but later on decide that it was all fate then it's rubbish.

Now there are ways around this, for example even though you pick later on the fate path, you can still have the hero struggle with everything he does. It's his/her destiny to achieve This Whatever This Is, but nothing is actually given to him or her. Going this route wouldn't nullify what you did in the beginning.

Yeah, like despite Anakin or Luke being the "chosen one", look at the crap they had to go through before they achieved said "destiny". A lot of people seem to forget that just because something "grand"
could be predestined for a person, that doesn't mean the journey for them will be easy nor the destination all good.for them. Heck, another loophole is that even if something may be predestined, who's to say that the person will even make it to said destination, much less in the "perfect" way? All it is saying is that that is where the person would eventually end up, but it doesn't really say anything about their journey, so there's still a possibility that they might not make it all the way to said destination, lol.