4870 replies to this topic

[IchaIcha]

No no! I love reading long statements! Please continue if you have more And thanks for the welcome!

Anyway~

After reading your post I realized that I missed out on a few facts about Naruto's feelings towards Sakura. I completely forgot about part one. (*tells myself* Look before you leap!) Hm... although its not directly confirmed, its true that Naruto might actually love Sakura. I keep an open-mind towards that fact because its highly possible. I can't really argue against your statement because most of your points are latched on with solid facts, but I do have my own interpretation to his relationship with her. I do believe that Naruto likes her, but its hard for me to understand his "love" for her. This intimacy he was feeling towards Sakura has altered into an understanding or caring feeling, after his encounter with the hospital scene. Instead of his crush growing into love, I always thought that he became a more passive and supportive person towards her. But for Part two, its hard for me to tell what Naruto's intentions are (considering his "dating" attempts ) To me... I thought Naruto asking Sakura on dates was just a strategy to show that he has not changed or it was a way to hide his depression. BUT--I do believe that Naruto has feelings towards her. Its undeniable.

Its hard for me to see their get-together though. Here are my reasons (Its an old post, I don't know if I still side with it )

[Ani]

Its true Naruto never said "I love you" to Sakura, but you can tell he loves and cares about her deeply. Maybe thats one of the many reasons why I can only see him with Sakura.

But yeah, its only Sakura's feelings we're really unsure about. Neither pairing is canon, really. We're only 2/5 through with the manga. And Kishi said he wants them to have kids. So I wonder when thats going to happen. Maybe when we're 4/5 done with the manga.

[Nick Soapdish]

Debate threads merged since they seem to have converged topic-wise.

[Nate River]

I never said SasuSaku and NaruHina HAD to happen. They don't have to and neither does NaruSaku. I just listed ways NaruHina was possible. I never said it was 100%, cause I know it's not.

Hm did you know in the databook it doesnt say ANYTHING about Naruto's crush on Sakura? But it does talk about Sakura's crush on Sasuke. And who wrote the databook? Kishi did. So perhaps Kishi doesn't really think into Naruto's feelings much? ;D

Well, your right in that none of those pairings have to happen. Until Kishimoto decides he's done, anything is technically possible. On the other hand, doesn't the data book also say that Hinata's feelings only amount to heroworship? I admit to not having read it, but according to several NaruSaku debaters that I trust, it does. Thus, reliance on it cuts both ways. If its valid to refute NaruSaku, then it's valid to refute Hinata's feelings as well. If desaix is right about the ghostwriter thing, the there is reason to suspect its not completely accurate. In any case I never use the thing in debates anyway. Part of the reason is obvious, (1) I haven't read it. But the other thing is that I hear people consistently site to it with interpretations that don't seem to fit well with the series. If it did say that Hinata was only heroworshiping Naruto, it doesn't seem to mesh well with 282, which makes it looks more like a crush than anything else. In any case, for those that have read it, I have a question: how often is it updated and when did the last update occur? If the time has been significant, perhaps some of the information is stale.

I explained why I believe Naruto's feelings for Sakura aren't like Sakura's feeling for Sasuke. Kishi even said her feelings for Sasuke were genuine. Kishi also said the "NaruSaku date" WASN'T a date. [In an interview] No need to continue on that. I don't think Sasuke loved Sakura. To me the "Thank You" scene was that he didn't know how to respond to Sakura's confession. So he left her with a word of graditude. Lets look at the databook:

-The love that Sakura felt for him, was enough to fulfill his loneliness.
However, just as we'd expect, he couldn't give into those feelings.
(was a little liberal on the kotaeru part though, could also say "answer to those feelings", but the above translation fits more naturally)-

On the first point, I agree with this poster to an extent. My interpretation is that at the beginning she had a stereotypical teenage crush. She was in love with the looks, mystery, and eveything that she thought he was. It's difficult to truly love someone you know nothing about. I do agree they were considerably more genuine toward the end of part 1, though they probably have receded somewhat in part 2, given the length of the time skip and Sasuke's current actions.

Sasuke might have given in eventually if he had stayed, but saying SasuSaku then occurs presumes Sakura's feelings remain constant. What could have happened is pretty open ended, but it doesn't matter because he did leave. However, I think everything changed once Itachi kicked his butt. Killing Itachi was always his primary goal, but after losing that fight it appears to have become his absolute obsession. Everything has now become irrevelant except the achievement of that goal. 308-310 clearly indicate nothing else matters except killing Itachi.

People often sight his need to revive his clan as a reason that he will eventually come around to Sakura. But recent issues indicate that even that appears to be unimportant to him. Giving up his body means he can no longer do this, and he seemed quite willing to give it up if it meant success. There is no indication in this scene that he was bluffing and it is consistent with his previous actions at the end of part one. Namely, running to his villages worst enemy despite pleas from his teamates not to so.

On the date, as I have explained before, I've never argued that it had independent significance or that whatever happened (if anything) amounted to a true date. It's more of a bench mark then anything else. A sign of just how far NaruSaku has come. In the most recent issue, he again used the word date. In the beginning Sakura was quite violent in response to such a suggestion (she threw him over the Naruto bridge in the Wave Country arc). Now the use of the phrase doesn't invoke that same reaction. That's a significant change. Does it prove she loves him? No, but I think it shows just how far they have come and how much her perception of Naruto has changed since the beginning of the manga. This poster seems to write it off as totally irrelevant, which I don't think is the case. Does anyone have a transcript of that interview because I bet this person is taking Kishi's statement farther than it actually goes.

Kishi left it open minded. You know if Sasuke really couldnt give into those feelings, does that mean that he was forcing himself not to give in? So maybe perhaps he DID feel something for Sakura after all? I dunno.. Just a thought.

Well, I think he at least like her as a friend, but his course of actions from Itach on suggest that's all it was. But as I've said before, there arent't too many debaters who argue Sasuke felt absolutely nothing.

As for "I like people like you" - I'm not a NaruHinaTARD. I'm a NaruHinaFAN. There's a difference. But don't you just LOVE the fact you can't see Naruto's face when he says "I like people like you" D

"I always thought of you as a dark, shy, weirdo...But a person like you, I really like!" - Quoted from the manga. Again, this wasn't to show Naruto loves Hinata. It provided a base that may develop. Naruto realized what he thouht about Hinata previously was wrong. "I never knew Hinata was so incredible!"

"When you cheered for me, there was an impact on my heart." - Hinata said that [or along those lines] while talking about how she admires Naruto. However, 282:

"My feelings...What should I do?" Her heart was beating as well. "doki doki" means "heartbeat" What feelings COULD she have been talking about? Feelings of admiration? WHAT? Nah. She did that already. Love? Perhaps.

A common feature of many debates I have witnessed is that posters (on all sides) have a tendency to take evidence farther than is warranted. I think this is especially true of the 282 quote. This quote suggests a crush and it is probably a bit much to say they are in love, just as it was to say a bit much to say Sakura loved Sasuke at the beginning of part 1.

But regardless of whether it is love or not, I don't think it matters. For there to be NaruHina, Naruto has to go along with it as well. With the exception of a few words there is little evidence that indicates that this is the case. The "I like people like you" is a common site, but the telling thing is that this is where the evidence ends. The 282 quote only reflects Hinata's feelings; it says nothing of Naruto. What evidence other than the brief exchange during the Chuunin exams exists to suggest anything of Naruto's feelings? The fact that the series has progressed over 150 issues since that point is significant. While Naruto, Sasuke, and Sakura, have had development regarding their feelings for one another, Hinata has had two cameo appearances and Naruto has not said or done anything that suggests his feelings are any different than they were during the exams.

Thus, the question is why wait so long? Why sit around and consistently develop the NaruSakuSasu triange and do virtually nothiing with NaruHina? 282 was a good opprotunity, but the scene just ended after she fainted. Why not add a little more if he intends to develop this relationship? It would have been easy to send Team 8 instead of Team Gai during the Gaara arc, but he didn't. Team 8 has received to least amount of exposure among the rookie 9 + team Gai in all of part 2.

This poster does not do this, but I'll cover it anyway. To anyone who suggests the Chuunin exams show that Naruto loved her at that time: does it not seem odd that the relationship has had so little time devoted to it since then? In addition, if Hinata had a crush/loved him during the chuunin exams, why has she received no attention since then? This also means her feelings have remained unchanged and undeveloped since that point. Thus, you have two people who stand in the exact same position they were in 150 episodes ago, with one character only appearing twice since Chuunin exam interaction.

It's okay if you see no reason for NaruHina to happen. I feel that way about NaruSaku. It depends on how you look at things.

Here you go again about the whole SasuSaku thing. My essay wasn't even about SasuSaku. It was about NaruHina. Sure I threw in some stuff, but it wasn't the main point. Stop talking about SasuSaku. Look at it this way:

Part 1 - NaruHina, SasuSaku

Part 2 - NaruSaku, [SaiSaku?]

Part 3[or the next arc] - ???

Don't brush off NaruHina so easily. Naruto is far from over.

Boy I just love it when you NaruSaku-ers get so defensive. xDDDDD

Well, I think the label of part 2 is quite illustritive. Where is Hinata? If there is relationship or a significant possibility of one, I would expect to see Hinata's name somewhere. Part 2 started on 245 and we are now at 313,. In that time, all she has had is one brief cameo. Moreover, Hinata appears to have lost her role in their series. She hasn't been important since the Chuunin exams and has had no impact on part 2.

And on Part 1, I don't dispute that there was emphasis on SasuSaku (though i dispute what your list implies), but there was also significant NaruSaku, from beginning to end. From "the thing I hate is Naruto" in the beginning to her begging him to return Sasuke and then telling him not to worry when he fails.

[Smiter]

Really enjoyed reading your post, Shriner. Plenty of thoughts to mull over. I do agree that the relationship between Naruto and Hinata has had very little focus and growth, and it is - thus far - one-sided.

While I don't think NaruSaku is completely 100% certain to happen (hey, anything can happen, such as one (or both) getting killed off), I do believe that it has a LOT of development and interaction in comparison to NaruHina. Even allowing for the fact that both Naruto and Sakura are teammates and main characters, there is still precious little for NaruHina to draw upon. As Shriner said, their relationship has been at a virtual standstill ever since the Chuunin Exam arc ended.

IchaIcha, I promise I shall write a long post tomorrow morning after reading your post! It's 10:33pm right now and I am a little tired after work. It'll probably take me hours to write, checking references and so on. XDD

But thank you on your comments on my post. While I am very much a hardcore NaruSaku fan, I and many others here (and on NarutoForums) believe in trying to keep a balanced view of the manga.

[Nick Soapdish]

Uhh... this may be a bit late, but I just wanted to make a note.

^ Good idea, actually. I tried to join so I could make some points, but there are so many SasuSaku fans that even if you make good points, it'll be disregarded in two minutes, and they'll just return to agreeing with each other.

Yea I noticed that most NaruSaku arguments just got ignored anyway, that's part of why I didn't want to join. Also they have this topic on chapter 311 that I think is hilarious, cause they keep debating about wether or not the scene were Sai was talking to Naruto and Sakura was NaruSaku or just friendship. Its funny because the important part to pairings in that chapter wasn't Sai talking to them, but when he read the book saying if you use the -kun or -san suffixes with people you won't become any closer to them, which kinda hurts both SasuSaku and LeeSaku.

(this note is from PhoenixBlood at the NSvsSS forum)

I just wanted to post a little defense for the NSvsSS forum in response to some of the comments that were made in this thread.

Pyroneko, I'm sorry to hear that you were dissatisfied with the forum. However, I searched through the whole debate section and didn't find any posts by you, so I then checked the opinion/rant section and found one thread (SasuHina/NaruHina) in which you posted. I also noticed that your one post was specifically commented for good points. Maybe not every single one of your points was addressed directly, but it seemed to me that at least parts of it or the overall concept was each time. Just because "SasuSaku-ers" weren't convinced and continued to counter with their beliefs does not mean your posts were forgotten. I'm sorry you got that impression. And actually browsing through all the threads, it seems the number of active NaruSaku-ers is slowly catching up, it's just that we (SasuSaku-ers) have some frequent posters that may make it seem more unbalanced than it really is. Again, I'm sorry that you were dissatisfied, but I'm not sure what we could have done differently to please you other than be converted by your arguments.

Random Nobody, again, I'm sorry you also got the impression that NaruSaku arguments were being ignored. What I mentioned above about compliments to Pyroneko's post is a common occurence in the debate/opinion threads, so I don't really see how that is ignoring NaruSaku arguments. It sounds to me like it's acknowledging that NaruSaku-ers makes good points. We have been trying to advertise in several places to bring in more NaruSaku-ers (although I have already mentioned that it seems that the debate/opinion threads seem to be slowly gaining a better balance of active members from each fandom), but whenever I try to advertise, it seems to be met with such negative comments as you and Pyroneko have responded with. Which I feel is not only is an inaccurate portrayal of our forum and the intentions behind it, it also discourages other NaruSaku-ers from joining, which would help remedy the imbalance which happens to be one of your complaints.

Also, since I'm guessing you didn't take too close of a look, a nice demonstration of the spirit of this forum tha you may have missed is the fact that despite how much I dislike NaruSaku and don't think it will happen, I (and other SasuSaku-ers) have on several occasions switched sides and helped out with defending NaruSaku just to keep things more balanced and to prevent NaruSaku-ers from feeling overwhelmed or ignored. And if that is not proof enough that we are trying to accomodate your fandom, then I don't know what would be.

--

It's disappointing to me that a forum that was created for members of opposing fandoms to get to know each other, through (no bashing allowed) debate or off-topic threads and contests, has its intentions misunderstood. I was excited when I first checked out this forum because I thought I had finally found a place that, through encouraging interaction rather than separation of the "opposing" fans, can perhaps help reduce the animosity that seems to spring up between opposing pairing fandoms.

I hope to have at least cleared up some of the misconceptions with this post and to have better illustrated the intentions behind the forum. Thank you for taking time to read this, and I hope to see more of you come join us and only add to the fun at NSvsSS because really, that's what this should all be about.

~phoenixblood

But it's so ... so pink!

I already wear glasses ... well, contacts usually. I've gotta be careful with my eyesight.

Personally, I appreciate the invitation. But I've been debating on pairings threads for over a year now and I really think that I need a break from it. And I'm almost certain that I wouldn't be able to avoid temptation if I joined. I'm trying to content myself with just the occasional debate-style post on these threads instead.

[blessed_devil]

An anti-NaruHina rant by me...sort of.

Spoiler! --Click here to view--

First of all, in canon (sort of some really short version of Mizura's extremely long essay):

To me, it’s all but a question of SasuSaku versus NaruSaku. I have disregarded NaruHina ever since Part 2. Firstly, they’ve barely interacted for more than thirty minutes of their lifetime. Yes, I’m sure of that. When Hinata was first introduced, Naruto called her a “dark-haired weirdo who always seemed to be looking at [him].” So they’ve probably never talked. They did talk once before Naruto fought Neji. That’s it. After that, there was a series of arcs. Before Naruto left, they didn’t talk either. Hinata fainted before she could talk to him. Even in post-time skip, there was nothing except for Hinata fainting again. So no, Naruto will not “realize that he’s been in love with Hinata all along”. There's nothing happening in there.

People think that Hinata has this big impact on Naruto’s life just because she was one of the first to acknowledge him. I for one believe that she didn’t give Naruto “true” acknowledgement, but rather, she admired him because she was able to relate to his being an underdog. This is why she never helped Naruto when he was down. She wanted to be like him: someone who can get back up on his own. Hinata wasn’t Naruto’s first “true” acknowledgement. Team 7 was. They were the first ones who openly acknowledged his existence. And that’s what truly mattered to him.

Hinata and Naruto don’t share the same pain either. Those two were both insulted for being losers, yes. It enrages Naruto – he works for recognition, too. But it wasn’t his most deepest, darkest pain before. Loneliness is his true pain. The pain of having nothing. He showed it to Gaara as he was crawling towards him on his freaking chin in order to protect the people who saved him from the pain of loneliness (Iruka and Team 7).

The only two pains Hinata used to share with Naruto back then are gone now. The pain of being a loser and the pain of not being acknowledged. Is Naruto still a loser? Well, to Sasuke, maybe, but to everyone else? Nah. Does Naruto still need to be acknowledged? Hell no. He even felt sorry for Gaara because he had so many people who cared about him while Gaara didn’t.

Naruto’s new pains are the pain of losing Sasuke and the pain of being a Jinchuuriki. Hinata has never even mentioned anything about Sasuke and even less about the Kyuubi. Basically, Hinata lost her relevance to Naruto’s life. Everything she “could be” for Naruto, Sakura already is. She is just like Inari, Zabuza, Neji, Gaara, and Tsunade: people who were redeemed but aren’t main characters.

Wait a minute, so what was the point of her crush on Naruto? Just like Neji and Gaara’s admiration to Naruto. Just like Inari and Zabuza and just about everyone else that gets redeemed. Her admiration to Naruto (vowing to do her best, too) has caused her to fight against Neji and to believe in herself. Her theme was to show the readers that if you believe in yourself, you can be strong and become a whole new person. She has her own life and her own background story. Getting Naruto’s heart isn’t even one of her goals. She wants to get acknowledgement from the Hyuugas. She has been redeemed because of her admiration on Naruto; therefore, her crush isn’t really pointless even if she doesn’t end up with Naruto.

About their relationship (this one is all original and by me):

No, their relationship doesn’t make me want to have them end up together, either. Where’s the fun in there? It’s so calm. It’s so comfortable. The only thing that the people are looking for is the blushing and the amorousness. Nope, sorry, not interested. Go watch a shoujo anime or something. You’ll get what you want. Of course, you can like it for the sweetness, but shounen mangas don’t usually center on sweetness and romance. That’s why most of the shounen couples are paired up for comic relief and such. So if Kishimoto wants the series to continue to the children, he has to at least be able to make the couples either “entertaining” or “cool”.

A relationship with Naruto and Hinata would be extremely boring in my opinion. Naruto would be held back from his energetic attitude and everything’s really all going to end up as fluff with these two. In order to get them to “click”, Hinata has to be more like Sakura.

On the opposites attract thing/the Yin & Yang thing, too many differences cause instability. And what I can say is, Naruto and Hinata do have too many differences to really have a long-term relationship. Naruto is loud, brash, and energetic. Hinata is quiet, timid, and shy. Naruto needs someone who can keep up with his fiery attitude or else he’ll feel the need to look for it. Sorry, but Hinata just doesn’t fit his style and would hold him back too much unless she starts acting more like.. well... Sakura.

[MBKon]

ONly way I see NaruSaku happening is if Sasuke dies...Have you ever heard of the saying opposites attract...

Not to mention that Sakura only feels that way about Naruto because she feels sorry for him/has not actualy been around Sasuke enough for her old self to comeback out...

Just a few words: Proof, 'but they don't wear well.'

Sakura is such a jerk. After being a complete ass to him her entire life, she suddenly decides she likes him. Hinata was there first, Sakura. Go away.

And what did Hinata do? Stand back and watch it, she didn't help him at all.

NOOOO!! Not Sakura! I hope he ends up with Hinata. She deserves him more.

Why does she deserve him?

I could see Naruhina happening if the go on a mission and Itachi kidnaps her...or something.

Why would he kidnap her*

proof that it will never be narutoxsakura
spoilers?
http://www.cinnamons...aku_special.jpg

You guys should watch the fillers with naruto and hinata and any otehr appearances with them both in the same place, it really points to naruhina

Two words: Opposites attract.

Do you know nothing of love?

You don't. The rest of the saying? 'But they don't wear well.'

Naru-Hina is a far better Pairing than Naru-Saku, scince the latter doesnt have a certain idiot being forced on us with said idiot being pointed out that the whore loves a bunch.

Also, Hinata acctually gave a **** about Naruto even before he got "uber", only Naruto is too damn stupid to realise that given the chance, he might acctually be able to boink her. But like I said, he's dumb as a mule. A Loudmouth Moron and a Shy Moron seems like a more plausable pairing if anything.

Sakura only started liking Naruto after he got "uber" and had to go through leaps and bounds to get her to like her, and even then she continues to like some idiot who treats her like **** and does nothing for her, and STILL continues to mistreat Naruto on occasion. Stupid ******* worthless whore. Itll be one of the most disgusting relationships Ive ever seen. Itll be worse than FF8's(Pointing that out for no real reason >_>).

Knowing Kishi however, I wont be surprised if it does end up being Naru-Saku.

What is this? American Ghetto? And it's good to hear that you acknowledge NaruSaku the way NaruHina should be acknowledged.

doubt it

Sakura and Sasuke will probably end up with eachother

It's always been a trend of Shonen to have the theme that love conquers all, and first loves are best loves (see Goku and Chichi)

Besides, that would make a not so happy ending for a main character, Sasuke, and it's a law of Jump for all main good guys to have a happy ending.

..Um hum. Just like there are always Happy endings IRL. Besides, Sasuke is a villain.

A lot of peopel keep saying that NaruHina works, there needs to be a change. Well, duh. NaruSak was impossible from the get-go, too, and change is pretty much the central theme of naruto (Obviously for awhile, but arguably overall). And seeing as Hinata did make chunin, she did change some. Smart writing from here on could easily make it work.

NaruSaku development started at ch. 3. And had more screen time than NaruHina. Nuff said.

I'm dissapointed Aethos, Only this much stupidity on NaruHina arguements this time?

[MBKon]

Sakura a slut!!!

How dare she try to steal Naruto from little sweet Hinata.

Learn How to spell.

But seriously now, doesn't it seem like Hinata's only purpose at this point is to be a potential love interest for Naruto? Female lead? Sakura. Byakugan user? Neji. Aside from potentially being the main's girl, what other use is there for her? Catering to the submissive girl fetishists?

Don't you just love how NaruHinas ALWAYS kill a characters personality?

[Daniee]

I could see Naruhina happening if the go on a mission and Itachi kidnaps her...or something.

Eh? Does Hinata have a bijuu sealed in her? Maybe that's why the Hinatards think she's all-powerful...

proof that it will never be narutoxsakura
spoilers?
http://www.cinnamons...aku_special.jpg

A doujinshi is proof that NaruSaku will never happen...? I love how they even listed "spoilers" as if all that has already happened...

You guys should watch the fillers with naruto and hinata and any otehr appearances with them both in the same place, it really points to naruhina

LOL Fillers...
Even when they're in the same scene in the manga, all it points to is Hinata stalking or fainting

Two words: Opposites attract.

Do you know nothing of love?

I love it how NaruHina fans think "opposites attract" is a proven fact or something... It applies to a small number of people, of which Naruto isn't a part of because he's not attracted to Hinata.

It's always been a trend of Shonen to have the theme that love conquers all, and first loves are best loves (see Goku and Chichi)

Shonen is mostly "friendship conquers all"...and for the second one, Naruto has always loved Sakura...so what makes SasuSaku more special while using that logic?

Sakuras a slut!!!

How dare she try to steal Naruto from little sweet Hinata.

You can't always get with the person you want. That's life. Sakura "stealing" Naruto from Hinata doesn't make her a "slut"... Besides, it's Hinata's fault for never doing anything. Sakura would be merely beating her to the punch.

But seriously now, doesn't it seem like Hinata's only purpose at this point is to be a potential love interest for Naruto? Female lead? Sakura. Byakugan user? Neji. Aside from potentially being the main's girl, what other use is there for her? Catering to the submissive girl fetishists?

Hinata's purpose has always been to illustrate the "you can change if you believe in yourself" theme.

[Random Nobody]

ONly way I see NaruSaku happening is if Sasuke dies...Have you ever heard of the saying opposites attract...

Not to mention that Sakura only feels that way about Naruto because she feels sorry for him/has not actualy been around Sasuke enough for her old self to comeback out...

hmmm...the saying opposites attract? Nope haven't heard of it. I've heard of the saying opposites attract but they don't wear well though

Oh and Sakura isn't liking Naruto out of pity, otherwise she never would have started liking him in Part I.

Sakura is such a jerk. After being a complete ass to him her entire life, she suddenly decides she likes him. Hinata was there first, Sakura. Go away.

Sakura's been treating Naruto bad his whole life? Thats interesting cause I could have sworn she spent most of her youth being picked on for her forehead until Ino came along and helped her. Also it seems like she didn't start picking on Naruto until he started making advaces at her.

Hinata did nothing to help Naruto. Sakura has the excuse of Ignorance. Hinata has the excuse of Shyness. Neither are good excuses but Sakura did something about hers. Hinata is still too shy.

NOOOO!! Not Sakura! I hope he ends up with Hinata. She deserves him more.

Wow, you managed to prove absolutley nothing! Why exactly does Hinata deserve Naruto? Because she had a bad past? She can get in line behind Naruto, Neji, Sasuke, Gaara, Sakura, Lee, and everyone else who had a bad past too. She hasn't done anything for Naruto except fire him up for one of his minor battles.

I could see Naruhina happening if the go on a mission and Itachi kidnaps her...or something.

Right cause Itachi always randomly kidnaps people. Oh, and he also likes to seduce Sakura, stalk people, or one of the millions of other stupid things you've seen him do in bad fanfics.

proof that it will never be narutoxsakura
spoilers?
http://www.cinnamons...aku_special.jpg

You guys should watch the fillers with naruto and hinata and any otehr appearances with them both in the same place, it really points to naruhina

Fillers don't count for anything and neither does a fan comic. Try again later.

Two words: Opposites attract.

Do you know nothing of love?

Seven Words: Opposites attract but they don't wear well

Naru-Hina is a far better Pairing than Naru-Saku, scince the latter doesnt have a certain idiot being forced on us with said idiot being pointed out that the whore loves a bunch.

Also, Hinata acctually gave a **** about Naruto even before he got "uber", only Naruto is too damn stupid to realise that given the chance, he might acctually be able to boink her. But like I said, he's dumb as a mule. A Loudmouth Moron and a Shy Moron seems like a more plausable pairing if anything.

Sakura only started liking Naruto after he got "uber" and had to go through leaps and bounds to get her to like her, and even then she continues to like some idiot who treats her like **** and does nothing for her, and STILL continues to mistreat Naruto on occasion. Stupid ******* worthless whore. Itll be one of the most disgusting relationships Ive ever seen. Itll be worse than FF8's(Pointing that out for no real reason >_>).

Knowing Kishi however, I wont be surprised if it does end up being Naru-Saku.

Okay your first line doesn't even make sense, so I'm not even gonna comment on it.

Oh right, Hinata gave so much of a damn about Naruto that when he was suffering in loneliness like Gaara she did....nothin. "Boink"? Wow and I thought that "Snuggle Buddy" was stupid, but that takes the cake. The word your looking for is sex, unless your a two year old never say "boink" again.

Sakura started liking Naruto when she realized he wasn't just some blonde idiot who was out to ruin her life and that he was actually a great guy who truly understood her, and helped inspire her. Oh and she hasn't fangirled at Sasuke at all post time skip so that part of your argument fails. Oh and stop calling Sakura a whore, at least we don't need to bash Hinata to ship our pairing.

Oh, your gonna get mad at Kishi now are you? Go cry me a river, if you don't like what he's doing with the story then READ SOMETHING ELSE and do go all whiney emo on everybody.

doubt it

Sakura and Sasuke will probably end up with eachother

It's always been a trend of Shonen to have the theme that love conquers all, and first loves are best loves (see Goku and Chichi)

Besides, that would make a not so happy ending for a main character, Sasuke, and it's a law of Jump for all main good guys to have a happy ending.

How do you know everybodys gonna have a happy ending? Stop comparing Naruto to DBZ, there diffrent, Naruto has a PLOT, something DBZ can only dream about having. Oh and how is Naruto getting Sakura gonna gurantee an unhappy ending for Sasuke? He's not intrested in her like that so there's no reason for him to get upset if they get together.

A lot of peopel keep saying that NaruHina works, there needs to be a change. Well, duh. NaruSak was impossible from the get-go, too, and change is pretty much the central theme of naruto (Obviously for awhile, but arguably overall). And seeing as Hinata did make chunin, she did change some. Smart writing from here on could easily make it work.

Your absolutely right, NaruHina could happen with some smart writing. Too bad all that smart writing has already gone towards NaruSaku and SasuSaku.

Well Aethos, you found some....interesting arguments this time.

[Nick Soapdish]

C'mon Aethos.

If you're gonna go mining for arguments from NaruHina fans, try to find some that are a bit more competently put together. They aren't all that hastily drafted and shooting these down is pretty pointless.

[Nate River]

Alright, I just got done taking a six hour test on some pretty obscure legal principles (seriously, why test on common law criminal law when NOBODY uses it anymore) and spending and hour and half in rush hour traffic (I swear I-35 is Dallas's largest parking lot) so I need some release.

I find this amusing because it contradicts itself several times.

ONly way I see NaruSaku happening is if Sasuke dies...Have you ever heard of the saying opposites attract...

Not to mention that Sakura only feels that way about Naruto because she feels sorry for him/has not actualy been around Sasuke enough for her old self to comeback out...

Markus dealt with the first point. That's not the whole saying, the whole saying actually refutes your argument. Next, it is only a saying, nothing more. However, even assuming that your version of the saying is correct, it is still not very helpful. First, relantionships need common ground. It's difficult to be with someone long term when you share no similarities with them. You either cannot tolerate them or there is nothing to build on. Second, such cliches (this includes the Yin and Yang comparison) are only valid if Kishimoto actually has those in mind when writing out the series. Thus, you not only assume that he is basing his decisions on that saying, but that he is basing them of off an incorrect version of it. You have no proof this is the case, and without such proof any consistency the manga has with such cliches is nothing more than a coincidence.

Sakura is such a jerk. After being a complete ass to him her entire life, she suddenly decides she likes him. Hinata was there first, Sakura. Go away.

No, she didn't suddenly decide she liked him. One of the reasons many people on this particular board like the relationship as much as they do is because her liking of him was born from his constant support and encouragment. It other words, it was earned, not simply given based on perception of the person. He was there when she needed him the most. He did so by doing things like cheering her one during the exams, protecting her from Gaara, giving her the promise of a lifetime when Sasuke left, and so on. It has been a slow, but consistent development. It didn't come out of nowhere.

As far as Hinata being there first, you'll need to be more specific. But I suspect you mean acknowledgement. I think Blessed Devil's post does a nice job with this, so I'll just refer back to that post.

NOOOO!! Not Sakura! I hope he ends up with Hinata. She deserves him more.

And who does Naruto deserve? Your statement suggests that it is Sakura. Hinata's devotion and apparent acknowledgment (from which I assume this statement is derived) can be compared to Naruto's devotion to Sakura.

I could see Naruhina happening if the go on a mission and Itachi kidnaps her...or something.

So could NarutoIno or NarutoTenten. Itachi has about as much motivation to kidnap Ino or Tenten as he does Hinata, which is none. Marcus is right, why would he kidnap her? She has no relevance to their current mission (or any existing plot thread). As I said, she has had no role in the series since the chuunin exams, so I certainly can't think of a reason for Itachi to kidnapper her. I suppose as a counter one might say to use her as a hostage. But that's easy to refute because, there is no evidence that Akatsuki or Itachi know anything about Hinata's crush on Naruto (or that Naruto and Hinata even know each other), so there is no reason to believe they would pick her.

proof that it will never be narutoxsakura
spoilers?
http://www.cinnamons...aku_special.jpg

You guys should watch the fillers with naruto and hinata and any otehr appearances with them both in the same place, it really points to naruhina

Filler's heh...I think they fact that you need to rely on this speaks for itself. As noted in my last post, in the manga there are only two very brief appearances with them in the same place that occur after the Chuunin exams, and Naruto was not even aware she there in one of them. That's a long time for there to be so little exposure. The fillers are not designed as a supplement to the manga, but are used to ensure that the anime does not catch up with the manga and, thus, prevent them from being in a position of either having nothing to go on or having to guess Kishimoto's next move.

Two words: Opposites attract.

Do you know nothing of love?

See first argument.

Naru-Hina is a far better Pairing than Naru-Saku, scince the latter doesnt have a certain idiot being forced on us with said idiot being pointed out that the whore loves a bunch.

Also, Hinata acctually gave a **** about Naruto even before he got "uber", only Naruto is too damn stupid to realise that given the chance, he might acctually be able to boink her. But like I said, he's dumb as a mule. A Loudmouth Moron and a Shy Moron seems like a more plausable pairing if anything.

Sakura only started liking Naruto after he got "uber" and had to go through leaps and bounds to get her to like her, and even then she continues to like some idiot who treats her like **** and does nothing for her, and STILL continues to mistreat Naruto on occasion. Stupid ******* worthless whore. Itll be one of the most disgusting relationships Ive ever seen. Itll be worse than FF8's(Pointing that out for no real reason >_>).

Knowing Kishi however, I wont be surprised if it does end up being Naru-Saku.

This seems to be an opinion masquerading as an argument. If you think that NaruHina is a better pairing, I have no objection. You are entitled to like any pairing for any reason you want. I agree with the second paragraph, that perhaps if he weren't so dense, he might have noticed her apparent crush and there might have been something. However, the fact remains that he is that dense and he did not and has not noticed it so the statement is nothing more than speculation about what could have been and doesn't really provide much support for the NaruHina position. The last statement in the paragraph implies that NaruSaku is not such a pairing, so my question is why isn't NaruSaku plausible as well?

Actually as I said before, your third paragraph (well the first sentence of it anyway) is why many people like NaruSaku. It is because he had to go through those leaps and bounds, he had to earn her respect and friendship rather than simply crushing because she was cool and pretty way Sakura did to Sasuke in first half of part one. As a result, her feelings are regarding are a lot more genuine than her initial crush on Sasuke (though I think her feelings were more genuine at the end of part 1).

And I disagree with your assement on how Sakura currently treats Naruto. She, for the most part treats him as if she genuinely cares about him. For example, when he to four tails, she started crying and saying that he did not have to go after Sasuke anyone and that she would retreive Sasuke for the both of them. She was scared because he was losing himself to the Kyuubi. Afterwards, she's upset at herself because she could't do more to help him out and prevent his current condition. The only times she has been angry and/or violent with him in Part 2 is when he shoves his foot in his mouth or does something stupid (i.e. doing a perverted jutsu in front of woman is not a very good idea).

Sakura and Sasuke will probably end up with eachother

It's always been a trend of Shonen to have the theme that love conquers all, and first loves are best loves (see Goku and Chichi)

Besides, that would make a not so happy ending for a main character, Sasuke, and it's a law of Jump for all main good guys to have a happy ending.

What baffles me with this argument is statement number two. Uh, I'm not sure I understand why a NaruSaku pairing doesn't result in love concurring all, while SasuSaku does. Second, first loves as best loves? Given the NaruHina arguments you made, this statement contridicts your position. Who was Naruto's first (and so far only) love? It was Sakura. Second, to have SasuSaku means that Naruto does not get his first love. NaruSaku means that Sakura does not get hers. Your statement can never be completely satisfied. Besides, even if I were to accept the GokuChichi comparision, that relationship seems closer to NaruSaku then SasuSaku. Goku's personality is a lot more like Naruto then Sasuke (who more closely resembles Vegeta).

First, why does something contrary to SasuSaku mean Sasuke never gets a happy ending? I would think simply killing Itachi would be sufficient (even if Sasuke dies in the process) because that is by far his biggest demon. His recent statements indicate that this is far, far more important than reviving his clan (assuming that he even cares about that right now). Second, your statement reeks of the "Hinata the Consolation Prize" argument. Naruto is a main character. He has been pinning after Sakura a long time and would likely be rather depressed if SasuSaku did happen. So then where is his happy ending? Hinata, right? However, in this scenario she is used a consolation prize so one does not have to feel bad for Naruto not getting Sakura, and, thus, to justify SasuSaku. You might say he may just be happy for them and that is enough him, but then, the same is true of Sasuke with regard to NaruSaku. I don't mean to imply that a happy ending for Naruto requires NaruSaku either, but simply argue that your statement does not require your stated result.

A lot of peopel keep saying that NaruHina works, there needs to be a change. Well, duh. NaruSak was impossible from the get-go, too, and change is pretty much the central theme of naruto (Obviously for awhile, but arguably overall). And seeing as Hinata did make chunin, she did change some. Smart writing from here on could easily make it work.

Either your ignoring Sakura changes completely or you are providing a very narrow definition of the concept of change. I say this because Sakura is a chuunin too. The same Sakura who once stated that she didn't think she could beat Naruto, and who later holds her own when fighting Sasori. The same Sakura who dervided her self-confidence vicariously (from being near Sasuke or Ino) and who now has confidence in herself and her abilities. And finally, the same Sakura who once stated that the thing she hated was Naruto and, now, who cares a lot about him. This compared to Hinata who has made Chuunin. A Hinata who, if you accept the NaruHina argument about her feelings during the chuunin exams, has seen no change in her feelings combined with a Naruto who feelings have not changed. The more accurate comparison between NaruSaku and NaruHina is that between Sakura (for NaruSaku) and Naruto (for NaruHina). While Sakura's feelings regarding Naruto have changed and grown, Naruto's feelings regarding Hinata have gone nowhere.

[Pyroneko 28]

Those are... well those were the most intelligent NaruHina arguments I could find...

0.0 Please, tell me you're joking.

[Nate River]

Well, I wouldn't say pointless, its was a nice break for me, but Nick's right these aren't very good and refuting them isn't difficult.

[Sono]

In light of recent events, I've decided on going over Part II to describe how I feel on why I believe that NaruSaku will end up a couple in the end.

Before I begin, I'd like to say that if you believe that I am biased for only stating facts in Part II because it shows most of NaruSaku moments do know I'm only saying this due to the fact that it's already been spoken for.

Now, as many people will agree that chapter 297 was by far the one leading to why we are arguing today, I disagree. I believe in all honesty it is shown most in chapter 289 with Sai's quote,

"Sakura-San... It's times like this that. Hmm ... How to put it... You're very nice to Naruto-Kun. Where those feelings come from is something that I do not understand. But in a book it said this..."


Personaly, I'd like to see an episode to this and see if he puts emphasis on the word, "Nice". Now, in Sai's tone, he's in a sarcastic mood. Also from future chapters, we see what Sai studies and it's on common emotion. Though this is not fact, and to the way Naruto reacted, I believe simply, Naruto knows what Sai means and does not want to get in the way of Sasuke and Sakura. Or maybe he just was in a pissed off mood at Sai to begin with. This statement could of been taken in many ways, but what -I- belive is that Sai was almost teasing Sakura and Naruto got pissed off, trying not to embarress her.

Someone's probably said before in defence of other couples besides NaruSaku that love is a complicated matter. Which I agree with you on full terms, but what I belive is that since this was such a difficult term, something that Sai of all people couldn't understand meant love between the two. Take this chapter in any way that you will, but I believe what I've stated.