FireFox

Yeah, it would probably have helped if Naruto actually showed some vulnerability on his part towards Sakura. But he saves those kinds of moments to use on behalf of Sasuke.

 

He's always trying to save everyone and do everything by himself. How is Sakura supposed to fall in love with him if he's so strong that he doesn't need her?

 

I mean, it's not like Sasuke did that either, but SS "works" under a different dynamic. Which obviously has nothing to do with true love.

LOL True!!! Sasuke is also the the Main Heroine didn't you know?!  .  

I somewhat agree but Its not much of a matter of how strong you are "insert Yamato's line" but a matter of sharing your feelings it goes both ways, I always say that this is the downside of NS bc they cared to much about each other protecting each other's feelings that they are afraid of sharing them and that in the end it hurts them bc they suffer and do stupid things, if the confession was played differently/rationally it could have worked. The confession was so confusing that he had to explain it in an fuking interview bc even the people around him didn't understand wtf was going on. I'm still of the opinion if NS were the happened they first needed a serious and open discussion or a confession but it never got to that point bc well we know how that turned out to be. 

Yeah I stab you, you love me more such a wonderful dynamic  .    

I found some people mention a meaning behind Kishimoto having the confession scene during snowfall, and i think the first answer sums up the meaning of snowfall in Japan.

https://www.quora.co...tarting-to-fall

Vulnerable love, sentimentality, sadness, ending. In a sense, Naruto’s rejection and him saying she was lying could've ended his chance of getting with Sakura. Sakura’s alleged love for Naruto was in it's vulnerable stage, so to speak. The setting makes a bit of sense now.

I don't know if he ruined his chances with Sakura, but he obviously hurt Sakura seeing as she rushed off to do something suicidal, feeling like she had no other options.

 

She had picked Naruto over Sasuke again just like she always did but Naruto never noticed. He admired her growth as a medic and kunoichi but didn't believe her when she said she had grown out of wanting to be with Sasuke? It's not really fair to her to make that kind of determination. Sakura certainly did believe that this was what was best for her. That much is clear, she wasn't only trying to protect Naruto. What kind of person is Naruto to tell her she has to stay true to feelings that she has for someone who is basically evil?

I think its more complicated than that its not so simple, there's a reason why we say that the writing and the set up is confusing as fuk and we can barely make any sense of it .  Naruto and Sakura both hurt  each other I'm not excusing anyone in here, Naruto for the obvious reasons you've stated but Sakura's actions are confusing as fuk too. She obviously still loved Sasuke but she lied to Naruto about it saying she doesn't love him anymore (she wasn't honest about this part), but then we are getting told that she knew Naruto wouldn't accept abandoning Sasuke and she was prepared to kill him and herself in the process. You see its writing like this that makes her look like she was just trying to manipulate him but still her actions didn't make any sense at all,  a confession wasn't needed in the first place in that way to bring Naruto back to the village bc she still didn't had her feelings sorted out she could have just told Naruto that she cared more about him then Sasuke which at that time was absolutely true, and if Naruto accepted her confession under those circumstances it would still be a bad writing bc it would be forced. What I'm trying to say is looking at this objectively is that the writing doesn't correlate with their actions and its why this arc and this scene is such a clusterfuk no matter how you look at it literary it doesn't make any sense .  

And here we come to the part about the meaning of the snowfall in Japan and if it correlates with the confession scene. You can interpret this in so many ways for one it can mean that Sakura's vulnerable love for Sasuke in slowly changing/ending bc the circumstances of the confession itself also includes Sasuke and how he hurts her that's one thing  the other thing is bc Sakura is in her vulnerable state she lowers her shield toward Naruto releases her feelings she wants his love his comfort someone she can trust not to hurt her, here I'll even put up a quote here "True love is about vulnerability, allowing someone to see that you want and need them in your life, and trusting them not to hurt you" . I can go on on in so many ways but here's the thing it doesn't really matter and here's why . For one if we to believe what Kishimoto says at that time (I don't trust this fuk at all but anyways) that he wanted to show Sakura as an honest girl so from that scene we get that Sakura wasn't honest only about her not loving Sasuke. Second thing again Kishimoto's words that Sakura still loves Sasuke but Naruto is close which means that Sakura indeed has feelings for Naruto. And third of all Naruto when asked by Sakura he never ever denied that he doesn't love he was only surprised by her sudden confession as he put it. So taking all of this into consideration even with the confession turning out like it did can we really say it ended NS for good!? As written it did NOT! Why? Bc the narrative was leading toward NS and it was heavily implemented in the story, and we were still given NS scenes which can not in any way be considered as "red herrings" from a written pov it makes no sense whatsoever despite the constant paring bait which ruined the story in the end. You can say however that its from this event that the story took a wrong turn and the writing declined immensely in other words it turned to s*hit bc the author simply didn't care anymore and he sold out to the fanbase. So you see its complicated as fuk and I still can't make out for sure just wtf he was thinking creating this bs bc the writing was all over the place as the events and the characters actions didn't make any sense at all, it was just a major clusterfuk .               

From what I've seen on Twitter, they're entering into this state of self-denial where they are feverishly trying to ignore the canonical depiction of Sarada by reassuring/deluding themselves into believing that the anime is the "true" canon and that SP's edits to Sarada's design are official.

 

It's depressing how far the remnants of this fanbase have fallen. They only help to corroborate with my theory that this series will be cancelled this following year. I mean, when you take into light of Ikemoto's lack of artistic aesthetic when it comes to replicating Kishi's style(a criticism that has been increasing in volume for months), the glacial pacing of the plot(and the humdrum quality of the plot itself), the cast of mostly unlikeable characters, the recycling of old plots,  and the fact that the remaining fandom is currently in an uproar whether they should leave this fandom with all of the baiting and switching that Ikemoto and SP are doing over their "cherished" ships, it's hard to imagine this series lasting much longer. Then you have to consider that Boruto isn't making nearly as much money as Shueisha believed, nor are any of their "dedicated" fanboys/girls overseas actually contributing financially to help them gain any substantive revenue(because why buy a manga/anime when it's free - legally or not - online). And of course, there's the death knell sounded by the Editor-in-Chief who seems to have already given up on Boruto and is looking to Black Clover to be the new Naruto.

Nothing has changed they always had that mindset this insane delusion that SS was somehow "the greatest love story" the epitome of "true love" since the beginning  if anything their situation has worsen, but again I'll say you reap what you sow. When even the author says  that SS are not happy and they can split up in any moment in the future, I mean what does it it take to understand that SS is the ultimate garbage ever written it doesn't work in any way and it just happened bc of convenience for NH? I just can't understand this Naruto fandom I really really can't  . 

Edit:

Fun fact Gintama predicted Boruto way before it happened I should have fuking knew 

https://youtu.be/pcn1M2yV234?t=73

It's a case of being written in ignorance, not comprehending that ramifications or implications of the scene. And after a point, that's the Naruto series in a nutshell. Beneath the shonen exterior we have a bunch of messed up characters that would need various forms of psychiatric counseling at minimum, as this is a series built upon unhealthy relationships portrayed in a positive manner.

 

Hell, considering Boruto opened with some dude saying he would end the ninja world I can't help but feel that Naruto ultimately failed in his attempts at changing the system. It's still going on, creating suffering for others and we have some bloke coming out of nowhere to end it. It would even make you consider why aren't cheering for this guy rather that Boruto who seems to be about upholding the system (traditionalist Japanese social values aside). This pretty much sums up my thoughts on this.

 

 

Just replace Ben with the disillusioned Naruto fanbase and soon to be Vader with Naruto. The lava is SP's and Boruto's continuing problems handling the series.

Honestly I'll pay to see that or put them in an electric chair, they seriously need a massive reverse brainwashing and then some *sigh* .

Its a fact that Naruto failed in every single thing and it failed in the most miserable and pathetic way and there's nothing erasing or changing that, its continuation is like creating the spawn of the Satan destroying everything on its path whit absolutely no given fuks whatsoever that's how I feel   

Oh man I even visualized it!!! I wish this whole franchise falls into a lava pit and burns into ashes like it never even existed .

I liked to have anime dubbed because, really, why not? If I could have a copy of an anime that offered but dubbed and subbed and not just purely subbed, then I get more bang for my buck.

And honestly, unless the dubbing is really bad, it can also add it's own uniqueness to it. Look at my favorite anime One Punch Man and Overlord. The English dub is awesome and they even followed through with somethings like having Christopher Sabat voice the piccolo like enemy which the subbed one did the same with the VA for piccolo in DBZ.

People care too much for subbed in my opinion. "It has to be subbed, otherwise it is not the pure anime and turns it into kitten." Okay, but they dub American movies in Japanese all the time and including TV shows.This "otaku" mindset that it is either subbed or bust never got to me. I rather enjoy it and relax. People get too crazy over something so insignificant.

Of course, you do find rare times where the dub is actually better than the sub.

The next time people talk about "keeping it in Japanese because that is the true version." Tell them to play FF7 in Japanese and see what they say.

I get what you're saying but don't get me wrong I'm never of the opinion that sub is always better then dub when it comes to animation, its just a matter of preferences if the sub is better then the dub I'll watch it and likewise with the dub . For an example I like DBZ dub version more then the sub one and Rurouni Kenshin is one of the few where I liked both the sub and the dub version.

As for dubbed TV Shows I only have trauma from the Turkish series they do in here and its all over TV 24/7 . 

Also I forgot to mention that there is Gintama dub version but only of the 4th season if you want to watch it,

http://kissanime.ru/...intama-2015-Dub its good but in this case I prefer the sub more  . 

Ugh....it makes my head hurt. This is why I always said Sasuke is a product of the plot. He is whatever the plot needs him to be. This is especially evident when Sasuke had the perfect chance to take out Konoha to "make them pay" for what they did to his clan and it just so happens that Itachi comes out of nowhere and now Sasuke needs answers from him. Like, really? You had all the answers before. Obito told you exactly what the massacre was about and you knew the truth from even Danzo. So why all of a sudden do you need answers from Itachi and the Hokage when they basically said "Yes, Sasuke, you are justified in what you feel. You didn't fail the village, the village failed you" then all of a sudden he is like "Oh, well that is great. Now I can begin my plan to destry-I mean take over Konoha as Hokage and rule the world."

Why? Why would you need to do that Sasuke? Because the plot needed him to fight Naruto first. If Naruto wasn't there to protect the village, then the plot has to miraculously have Sasuke change his entire view until he comes face to face with Naruto despite the fact that he had a perfect and opportune chance to take out Konoha while the main force was away.

Sasuke ended being a plot object of convenience rather than a character.

As for Gintama....I really wish Ginatama was dubbed because I really like the series too. It is such a great anime. It's like if you mixed Bleach with One Punch Man all the while making fun of DBZ.

 

I feel you bro it pretty much goes both ways, it feels like Sasuke became the plot and and the plot object of convenience/plot device at the same time, does this even make any sense!? 

You know when you say convenience it pretty much reminds me of Sasuke visiting the Uzumiki shrine, Naruto who was a freaking Uzumaki didn't even get to go there not sure if he even knows that place exists but Sasuke did!? FUKING HELL!!! I mean really like you couldn't introduce this earlier at some point in the story and make Naruto learn some freaking Fuinjutsu!!? Fuking Ridiculous!!! 

Speaking of the Hokages they pretty much fall into the category of Sasuke wankers Naruto barely spend any time with them or got any recognition as a future Hokage candidate and I couldn't believe they were praising him for literary doing nothing! Again  FUKING HELL!!!! Was that even necessary!? Its things like this that pisses me off its just so..........ugh!!! I can't deal with this kitten anymore  . 

Yeah exactly its makes it unique XD.  I get that although I prefer the sub and would recommended it to anyone bc the VA's makes it that much more unique, the only downside is that its pretty hard to follow the subs bc they explain literary everything and it doesn't let you focus completely so sometimes you have to pause in order to read it  which is a drag, and its why I presume you wish it was dubbed!?  .  

Yup, Sasuke is not Naruto's and Sakura's friend, he is their toy. their man doll

I'll never understand why Naruto and Sakura were made to be so obsessed with Sasuke and I never liked the dysfunctional "dynamic" of T7 from the beginning, it never really did made any sense more so bc it was always revolved around Sasuke, and I always asked myself this question "What did Sasuke really do to deserve this obsessed devotion from Naruto & Sakura!?"  The answer is pretty simple he did absolutely nothing except belittle them both (for Sakura it was even worse) and their whole obsession with him and their "bond" as a team is based on shallow reasons, just bc Sasuke was the genius prince charming with a pedigree and everybody freaking loved him! Naruto made him his rival and Sakura made him her "love" trophy (she even turned her back to her bff Ino bc of it, who was the first person to accept her for who she is) bc they both wanted someone to acknowledge them in order to validate themselves. No matter how you spin it their "bond" was never really developed beyond the one of being toxic to them, and in the end they were both destroyed bc of it, they never did really grown up and any character development they had was completely striped off, they were reverted back to an even more miserable versions then their childhood ones. I loved Naruto and Sakura bc they were so similar to each other yet different and they shined the best especially when Sasuke wasn't around they were their true selves and they weren't afraid of it.

But no one was immune to Sasuke and his holiness, even Sai was shoehorned as nothing but Sasuke's replacement and he was a better friend and a team member to both Naruto and Sakura and most importantly they functioned so much better as a team they dynamic was great if not perfect. The same thing could be said about Taka who accepted Sasuke for who he really was and understood him the best they never forced him for anything, their bond was twisted but it worked on some twisted level, though later on he destroyed that too and they were given the boot too in the end especially Karin. 

This is why I say the best way to describe Sasuke is CANCER nothing more nothing less.   

Aimed towards kids 13-17 year olds....read by 30-40 year olds.

Its a fuked up situation what can I say. I even heard that they draw The Salad exposing her panties don't know how much true that is, but if it is its disgusting and this kitten needs to burn and rot in hell.     

Isn't Kishimoto going to say anything about this? It's HIS creation, and he never sexualized kids like this. I heard things like that made him uncomfortable. This is kittening sad...

If he cared he wouldn't have ended the manga the way he did and insult the readers with his interviews, he obviously doesn't care he only cares from where the money flows he made that clear himself. Also Kishimoto said a lot of things in the past only to debunk them later, I don't believe anything this man says or does anymore he's a lying hypocritical SOB.  

It's hard to really be salty, because there's no way these idiots would have produced anything good regardless of the pairings Kishi went with.

 

Because it's hypocrisy

 

The pro-enders know very well that the real Hinata doesn't fit with Naruto. So what do they do? They turn her into Sakura because Sakura's personality fit well with Naruto. Pierot seems to understand too that why's they've been doing their hardest to turn her into a tsundere. It's bad if Sakura yells and hits Naruto but it's perfect if Hinata does those things. It's the same thing when NH fans would change things from the manga. Like the 450 hug. I remember the day when the chapter was released that NH fans changed Sakura and made Hinata the one hugging Naruto. Truth be told NO ONE and I mean NO ONE likes Hinata's original character (from NH fans, pro-enders and even Pierot. They only want a tsundere but it has to be Hinata not Sakura),

Basically This!!! But we aren't just arguing about the parings but mostly how this story as a whole was ruined  there's a big difference. Also its for this exact same reason they don't make Naruto and Sakura interact bc they have no other way but to make it natural and we all know how that would be like and the kittenstorm it will cause so they can't have that   .

 

Who the F is this beetch ?? Oh BORUTOSS MUM!! WUUZUMAKI HINATA!!

My christmast has just been stain.

 

Source is from tumblr and apparently that is legit from the newest chapter.

Omfg the SALT on tumblr. "Boruto being stronger then Sarada is Bs." most of it seems to be from SS shippers.

I took a small peek and they are even fighting who's worse between SS and NH and Sakura and Hinata when they are both in the same kitten boat  lol they are so toxic and pathetic  .  I thought we were supposed to be the "salty" ones  . Serves them right you reap what you sow  . 

 

That's funny. He can't be there for his kids, but he dedicated his whole life to save Sasuke. Being orphan it's not an excuse when he clearly knew obssession love.

You're totally wrong its not like Naruto ever wondered why doesn't he have parents like all the rest of the kids while sitting in that park on that swing while watching the parents picking up their children and play with then I mean he totally wasn't hurt by that his face says it all  .

It's all because they don't want to admit that NaruHIna was a bad choice. They don't want to admit that NaruHIna kittened up everything that made Naruto great because they stopped everything to focus on her. That is the god honest truth and they refuse to admit this.

They refuse to admit that Hinata took the focus away from all of it.
They refuse to admit that Neji died to play cupid to NH.
They refuse to admit that NaruHina is just so toxic to the story and this is what caused it's downfall.

They are so up their own arses over how "romantic" NH is and how it fullfills all their fantasies that they don't care about anything else.

To them...NH is the only thing that matters...and changing that is apparently a sin against God herself.. "You must like NH or you will go to hell."

I'm aware of all of that James, you know its kind of funny bc they are like a broken record trying to defend this crap, its like they are trying to brainwash you. They usually just say look everybody is happy and fulfill their dream: Naruto became the hokage brought Sasuke back and achieved peace, Sasuke finally found peace and married Sakura, Sakura married Sasuke the end rinse and repeat.

Seriously I don't know which of these is worse or whether to cry or laugh 

I'm glad I went to elaborate means so that even I was tempted to look into that cesspool of a comment page, I couldn't.  I don't need whatever meager faith I harbored for this fanbase destroyed any further.

Trust me don't you ever dare to do it that comment section is CANCER my eyes are still bleeding  . 

I think at that point he still cared some for manga. Imo his interviews are basically what he thought and what he was told to say. But the guy still sold over, so no sympathy from me!

 

Judge: You tortured and tried to kill the woman you don't care for?

Milan: *shrugs* I was just trying to express what I feel for her!

Judge: By mentally torturing her? And didn't you say you don't care for her?

Milan: Well.......you.....see......

Kishi: Objection! My client has nothing more to say on this subject your honor!

Judge: Very well. Do you have anything more to say as accused attorney before the verdict can be decided?

Kishi: It was true love your honor!

Judge & Jury: True love?!

Kishi: Yes!

Judge: Very well. Jury, did you decided on the verdict?

Jury: We did your honor!

Judge: What say you then?

Jury: We find the accused......

 

Outside of the Courtroom. Large amount of reporters surrounded Kishi asking questions.

 

Reporters: What happened? Was the accused found guilty? How long will he be jailed?

 

With big grin on his face, and a suspicious looking suitcase in his hand. Kishi responded....

 

Kishi: TRUE LOVE WON!!!

 

Inside of courtroom. Milan was siting on a bench with weird expression on his face...

 

Milan: WTF JUST HAPPENED?!

I think it was after the Pain arc that he stopped giving any kitten, after that everything just started falling apart . At this point who knows why but honestly I don't even care anymore  .    

THAT WAS JUST SO..............BEAUTIFUL!!! IT HIT ME RIGHT IN THE FEELS!!!

I don't know what to make of Sasuke's encouragement of Naruto. It could be that Sasuke is worried about Sakura, that he has faith in Naruto's ability, or he's encouraging Naruto because he knows how important Sakura is to Naruto. Or it could be a combination of these. This is one case where I really have no clue, though. Sasuke in this era of the manga is harder to figure out.

You have to look at the context here for both Naruto and Sasuke, for Naruto it became all about saving his precious one Sakura and going out of his way to do it so this is indisputable a NS,  as for Sasuke it was about sacrificing himself for the BOTH of them so its put in the context of T7, at this point you can say Sasuke did care for them bc he saw T7 as a substitute for his family and he didn't want to see that massacre again but ultimately they were just a hindrance to him something they couldn't replace. 

The rest is spot on as you described it  . 

I have only one word to describe him CANCER!!!

He's a CANCER to the story, CANCER to all the characters around him, CANCER to the plot. The constant need to bring everything and everyone down just so he can shine not to mention all the arspulls involving him was just utter crap, he had the potential to be a good villain but in the end his character was just a waste of time and space thrown down into the sewer where all of this story belongs.   

If you never have Naruto love Sakura, like have him treat her the way Goku treated Bulma, and never have Sakura likewise start to love Naruto, it could have been totally fine. That would be a really interesting setup actually.

 

Instead the ending turns what was largely a good story into total crap. Character motivations make no sense in retrospect. And they had to be made OOC to even be able to end the manga. Let's imagine Naruto does still love Sakura in chapter 699. Can the manga end there? No. Let's imagine that Sasuke doesn't suddenly start loving Sakura for no reason. Again, no. Sakura still cares about Naruto and so is conflicted? No. Development thrown out in favor of deus ex machina BS.

 

While if he ended the story the way he originally was supposed to: Naruto confesses to Sakura. Sakura accepts it. Sasuke smirks and walks away. Everyone is in character and more importantly not f***ing miserable. And the things complained about in this thread, rather than being stupid and pointless, would look masterful. Kishimoto threw his life's work into the trash.

That would be interesting it would be a fun casual smooth sailing hehehe  . I used to have tons of headcanons about the series but not anymore its not worth it  . I wished Naruto's character was done a bit different like when he returned with Jiraiya mastering fuinjutsus and wind jutsu, his core personality still a goofball like it was but when in battle or mission act more serious kind of badars  kind of like a mix of Goku and Kenshin or even Minato. Instead we got Naruto being a complete moron in and out and Kishimoto over glorifying his pet Sasuke *sigh* .    

LOL True that XD. One thing I think we all understand was that there was no logic in this manga to begin with it was thrown out of the window just like that bc Kishimoto and Logic don't go well you know that word is not in his dictionary  .

You know for that reason I previously brought up that UT 2011 OVA video bc it shows that it could have been done better if anything else the ending would have made sense and to tell you the true I prefer the NaruSasu battle in this video (more ninja like) then the useless rushed alien battle crap we got in the manga and that NS scene I don't need to say more. All I can think of is he didn't care the fuking bastard didn't care he bluntly admitted he sold out just by changing the heroine bc NH Hinatards hated her here in the west what a fuking idiot  .

Anyone remember this UT OVA 2011!? 

NS executed perfectly in here IC.  See I always thought the ending will be something like this more so bc it was done by the ripoff sellout "artist" himself, at that time this was a pretty realistic outcome and totally IC  according to the manga we all saw/read it for what it was. Sure the manga would still had its flaws that's indisputable but still a much better outcome then the crap we got with the free jail off card, pointless drama, retcons and Alien Kaguya  . This here shows he was capable of it more or less but no in the end we all read it wrong he says   .