Phantom_999

Surprising. Not that she doesn't deserve it (this isn't counting the western NUTCASES after all) but then again there are plenty of "strong" females in many manga and anime so I guess it depends on what you define as strong I suppose

Exactly. I want a well written, healthy romance too if the element is even going to be incorporated. Sexiness, wish fulfillment, entitlement and the like has nothing to do with it, I want genuine bonding and emotional openness without unhealthy clinginess in those types of relationships. It seems though many don't ever think of that or make lame excuses or half @$$ed attempts to justify their shallow reasons as close bonds or emotional openness.   

It's funny that Naruto is only series I know of that actually did that. There could be more but yeah we see now the disastrous consequences of changing plot trajectory especially last second. Granted there was so much else wrong with the War arc and it could have been done better and I attribute it to Kishimoto being wishy washy about the concept of war and giving unnecessary drama to characters he wasn't focusing on anyway with bringing back the dead on both sides etc. etc. Granted there were good and bad moments admittedly on that plot point but it was still mostly unnecessary though in the grand scheme of things. Ninjas just have to deal with death and lack of closure even with their loved ones sometimes. And even if it is, there are other ways to do it besides resurrection. Again that is just my opinion on it.

Kishimoto ultimately was playing Yes man to the authorities that were gaslighting him saying what a great heroine Hinata was and that she was more popular than Sakura because she is a submissive housewife type of girl that Naruto deserves and even go as far as to say that she is popular in the west because of a few youtuber otaku wannabes (I don't need to list them because everybody here knows whom I'm talking about, but feel free to input their names if you wish). Obviously they DID NOT do their research because they were ultimately hearing what they WANTED to hear and so that validated their personal views of Hinata too, ending with them pushing and pushing until Kishi said yes and it was because he just did not want to deal with the stress of it all anymore. He was finally hit with the consequences of writing manga consuming his life when his father passed away and he wasn't even there at his death bed so he just caved in and thought he was giving the fans what they wanted because it was what all his others editors ever since Yahagi left to be editor in chief for Jump Square, were telling him. "Hinata Hyuga is the greatest s** doll wife for Naruto and Sakura Haruno is a ball busting, emasculating she-devil that shouldn't deprive Hinata of her happiness and should get it on with her abusive neglectful crush." You can tell of of this is true because the writing in the movie doesn't add up, since it wasn't Kishi writing it. It wasn't even anyone familiar with Naruto from what I remember, as it contradicted Chapter 1/ episode1 of all things in the franchise. And well, here we are.

In case it wasn't clear even from the get go, the entire series is an after thought in an attempt to squeeze out more money out of the franchise with Kishi showing no emotional investment in it's writing even before it started. Even the initial writer I feel did not want to do it as more than as a jumpstart to his career as a manga author if not artist at the same time before he does his own work. you don't feel any passion in the series even at its highest points. That may be just me since I don't read it but I just read the summaries and obviously I don't glean anything from that alone but the summaries don't feel appealing enough to compel me to read it either.

I have the impression that Pierrot pays for bots to defend Boruto. This happens because recently there has been a discussion on Twitter that everything in the Boruto anime is canonical, and there are no fillers, based solely on the statements of the writers that everything is endorsed by Kishimoto, which supposedly makes all events canonical. They seem to ignore the fact that Pierrot conveniently erased elements from "The Last" when necessary. Additionally, there is a group of people that appears to be composed of bots, excessively defending the Uchiha family with questionable arguments, and even resorting to using novels that sometimes resemble fanfics.

 

When I visit the profiles of these individuals, it feels like I've entered a fantasy world, where Sasuke's personality seems to have come out of some generic shoujo anime. The majority of these profiles were created exactly in 2017, the year when the anime came to an end and the couple in question faced a lot of criticism.

Canonical material is ALWAYS ignored, that's how we got here. The Last ignored much of Naruto's source material, and Boruto now does the same thing with IT, despite the fact that the title character never would have existed if not for "The Last". Here is the thing, what is ignored is always subjective to what people WANT to see. You hear fans arguing all the time for instance that any filler scene with Sakura  is ONLY filler and should never be a valid argued for but then they take filler moments with Hinata and attribute that as part of Kishimoto's literary genius. Let's not forget they twist facts around to suit them, such as no matter HOW romantic the implications are with Naruto and Sakura in certain moments they only see each other as brother and sister. Then the Last says that Naruto DID love Sakura but it was shallow selfish as an attempt to win against Sasuke, so he mistook it as genuine love for her. So even if it is not bots, this delusional, demented fan base and the individuals WRITING the series currently certainly give the impression.

There is, actually and I say this completely without bias. 1.Sasuke never leaves the village. 2. Erase all of the kitten he did towards Sakura during part 2 especially in the later parts. 3. Develop them from then on out. The stupidest kitten is not only did SasuSaku happen out of left field, it was built on the foundation of Sasuke breaking Sakura's hear by leaving in the first place and after became so indifferent to her that he has no second thoughts about killing her if she gets in his way. This may be a tough pill to swallow for us a community but it has to be said . Sasuke and Sakura would in no way be as unbelievable as they are now in the narrative if Sasuke never left in the first place and did not show all of that negativity to Sakura that would considered abusive if circumstances were different. in fact his attitude is abusive too even in part 1 but if there was development in that department then it would at least look better. I ultimately support the relationship between Naruto and Sakura because of what was shown, and not only personal preference so that has to be a two way street. IF Sakura actually had any positive development with Sasuke, then it wouldn't be an issue. But no, the authorities that confirmed their relationship took it as an easy way out for Naruto to get it on with  his "dutch wife" Hinata Hyuga and she must be his first and only love so they invalidated his feelings for Sakura and essentially a major part of his character. It ended up making him look as shallow and unsympathetic as the attempted gaslighting on what his feelings for Sakura were and we all know that is fact.

Kishimoto didn't try to gaslight anyone, It was Hinata's fanatics in WSJ, Studio Pierrot that see how hyped up she was in the west that gaslighted HIM AND ATTEMPTED TO GASLIGHT EVERY fan that actually read the story. They thought that the populace that appreciated Hinata Hyuga as a "submissive dutch wife" wife as much as them was WAAAAY bigger than it actually was and appealing to her was the ticket to make Naruto sell even more internationaly and stroke their egos on how how much the Hinata Hyuga community loved Hinata Hyuga. See how badly that back fired, and I just laugh at the irony of it. Kishimoto isn't some manipulative maniac with a hidden agenda, he is a man exhausted and and tired of spending so much time drawing this one series and just wanted to end it because he realizes how much time it took away from him that could be spent with his family instead which really hit him when his father passed away and he was still scribbling away in his studio. Albeit, I still wouldn't put my faith in any manga brand with his name in it anymore, but objectively everyone has to realize he was not the problem or reason with Naruto's decline, it was greed and obsessive vicarious lust for a fictional side character that actually had no impact on the plot. 

I know I haven't posted anything here for a long while, because like I said debating on Naruto is not making me happy anymore, so I just stopped caring. But there is one thing that we all know when objectively speaking. Shown in " The Last" Naruto did not debate or argue with Sakura when she said that he only wanted her as a trophy girlfriend to win from Sasuke, in fact he respected her opinion to not make a fuss on it and has ALWAYS considered, respected and empathized with Sakura's feelings, especially before the movie. In contrast when Hinata rejected him to go with Toneri in that exact same movie he gave up on and said "EFF everything, I have nothing going for me in my life because Hinata doesn't love me" not even considering there was a reasoning for her behavior and change of heart. So again, which love shows maturity and acceptance and which love is petty selfish and possessive. And when you think about how it was meant to portray the opposite way around, it is just down right laughable.

What is an underrated NS scene no one talks about?

One from me personally when Sakura remembered herself thanking Sasuke for saving her, and he corrected her saying it was Naruto that saved her, which she didn't really believe at first but then Sasuke assured her he was being honest and that Naruto was so fighting so desperately for her that he showed his hidden strength, to which makes her smile bashfully. And in the anime it made an extended scene of her buying Ohagi (or some sort of sweets) for Sasuke and debating whether she should give some to Naruto to which the flashback happens and then she declares YES SHE WILL. As stated moments like these are overlooked by everyone having wet dreams of Hinata or vicarious wet dreams on how Naruto deserves a shy quiet girl that will never oppose him and how poor, abused Hinata deserves to be with her crush. 

Side note* but I really must say for all the complaining that  done that SP extended scenes to make Hinata look better and Sakura look like a worse tsundere than she actually is animated moments like that tend to be forgotten and overlooked even in this community at times I feel.

I just realized something... if they hate Sakura hitting Naruto... what do they say about Winry throwing a wrench at Ed?

Ed and Al were not ostracized an in their hometown and there was no "cool sexy bad boy rival" for Winry to drool over at first. I assume at least.

Besides overall from what I gather FMA is not as polarizing as Naruto on a fundamental level and the characters are nowhere near as debated. if anything there is just flame wars on which FMA is "better".

With all story ideas. Maybe.

 

How Naruto treats him at first is more person who ruined his life by: killing his parents, having him turned into Kurama's container, and helping Itachi kill the uchiha clan starting his best friends revenge obsession. Who he wants to defeat and just thinks is a rambling lunatic that needs to be stopped.

 

Then that page happened. From that point on, he is the big brother Naruto never had. People forget the first part because of the "coolest guy" moment.

 

Him knowing who he was before may have helped or he would have always just thought of him as a big bro.

 

The problem with Naruto and Obito is its not laid out why and how Naruto's opinion of him changed that the audiences would actually be willing to grasp.

My problem is the double standard of it rather than there being more reasons for Naruto to sympathize with Obito than just a desire of being hokage. Naruto ultimately sympathized with Nagato for wanting to achieve peace but was betrayed by the very person he was seeking an alliance with and had a sadistic choice to make regarding his best friend which said best friend made for him by committing suicide. Gaara was hated and unloved by his entire village, and unlike Naruto, had multiple assassination attempts on him. Naruto ultimately sympathized with both of them, both of them yet did not call either of them "coolest guy" just because they are similar. And in fact Obito had it easy compared to all three of them, he had a family and a normal childhood but ultimately decided life was worthless because he witnessed the love of his life killed by his (last second) best friend which is completely disproportionate to the actions he responded with yet he is one Naruto calls a "cool guy". Naruto understood Nagato and Gaara when he heard about their back stories but he could not forgive Nagato even then, and threatened Gaara that he will kill him if the former tries to take away those he loves even if he acknowledges Gaara had the harder life. Even if it represents Naruto's character development supposedly the execution of it was just terrible since Naruto said that while the same panel displays a full landscape of corpses in the middle of the war. That completely contradicts the meaning of the message if you ask me. Also again, If Naruto was willing to be all loving and all forgiving to the one that ruined his life and created the very first war he experienced just because he was whiny and petty enough to justify the world is rotten and should be molded in the image he wanted just because he never got to kiss his "unrequited love" (because that is all it boils down to in the end), then Naruto had a poor showing of trying to change anything again now didn't he. Sure we are too caught up on Naruto calling Obito the "coolest guy", but honestly the actions he took and the reasoning for it are hardly justified compared to the above examples isn't it. Oh and Obito as Tobi told Naruto about the the truth of the Uchiha massacre. You don't see Naruto calling Itachi the "coolest guy" either.

The fact that Obito wanted to be hokage before excuses his actions in Naruto's eyes? Not believable, and I found it more annoying than anything. And again as the ending showed, Naruto supports the ninja system which apparently is the root cause of everything makes the moral message even more garbage. 

Oh that's an idea! Yeah I feel that writing and drawing manga continuously at this point will take an even heavier toll on him so yeah he could probably leave the heavy lifting to his assistants and team to draw and he drafts the plot

"Hot" individual's actions are always excused. That is a trend I always notice in fictional works. Not the right mindset, I know but Sasuke has always had his choices and deeds defended because he is a handsome pretty boy.

Oh god found a video on how fans reacted to the new dragon ball z budokai tenkaichi 4 game, and in many, they take the piss out of how Naruto fans still haven't got a new game. All they have is Connections.
 
I've just found the video it is funny.